Has anybody tried the new Berger 85.5 .224 Hybrids?

[forrestgump01]

Oh god!!! 25.5gr, that's soooooo over pressure. How did you not just blow yourself up?


I'm just joking.....I had similar results with no pressure signs got flamed. Looks like you have a shooter!

?I've had someone tell me that already. some guys don't understand 25.5 grns in my gun ain't the same as yours . I had been using the same charge with 80.5 bergers. Started a grain lower and keep bumping up the charge looking to see where pressure signs start but you start a compressed load before that happens.

 

[cro789]

Thats what I did on mine as well. I got to 24.5 and getting 2856

 

[702lineman]

So looks like 2830-2860 fps is the node

 

[Dthomas3523]

?I've had someone tell me that already. some guys don't understand 25.5 grns in my gun ain't the same as yours . I had been using the same charge with 80.5 bergers. Started a grain lower and keep bumping up the charge looking to see where pressure signs start but you start a compressed load before that happens.

Just because you don’t see pressure signs doesn’t mean it’s not there.

Keep running it, but don’t be fooled.

 

[forrestgump01]

Just because you don’t see pressure signs doesn’t mean it’s not there.

Keep running it, but don’t be fooled.

Thank you mommy , I will keep that in mind . I've been reloading for 25 yrs and knock on wood I havnt had a major fuck up YET. Am I capable of a fuck up ... ABSOLUTELY.
Can you please explain to me how the pressure is there but I can't see it . Is there some kind of overpressure bunny that going to hop into my rifle when I'm not looking.
Just so you know Jr, All reloading Manuals are printed 10 to 20 % lower than there actual numbers thanks to all the little lawyers around. So just as an example , say Sierra's manuels shows 50 grns of x powder with y bullet is max . The actual max pressure would be 55 - 60 grns . working up to max isnt a death sentence if it's done correctly and it's not a time bomb if you use common sense........That would mean not working up a load in 50 deg weather and then shooting it when its 100 degrees , or setting your ammo out in the sun or letting moisture on the round or chamber .......you know , common sense. Watching what you doing when your reloading is more important than running a hot load .

 

[Dthomas3523]

Thank you mommy , I will keep that in mind . I've been reloading for 25 yrs and knock on wood I havnt had a major fuck up YET. Am I capable of a fuck up ... ABSOLUTELY.
Can you please explain to me how the pressure is there but I can't see it . Is there some kind of overpressure bunny that going to hop into my rifle when I'm not looking.
Just so you know Jr, All reloading Manuals are printed 10 to 20 % lower than there actual numbers thanks to all the little lawyers around. So just as an example , say Sierra's manuels shows 50 grns of x powder with y bullet is max . The actual max pressure would be 55 - 60 grns . working up to max isnt a death sentence if it's done correctly and it's not a time bomb if you use common sense........That would mean not working up a load in 50 deg weather and then shooting it when its 100 degrees , or setting your ammo out in the sun or letting moisture on the round or chamber .......you know , common sense. Watching what you doing when your reloading is more important than running a hot load .

I didn’t say it was absolutely there. I said it can be there without signs.

Pressure signs are just that, signs. They are not always present when pressure is there and there is not always pressure when the signs are there (such as ejector swipes not always being present).

25yrs experience doesn’t make you educated.

 

[forrestgump01]

I didn’t say it was absolutely there. I said it can be there without signs.

Pressure signs are just that, signs. They are not always present when pressure is there and there is not always pressure when the signs are there (such as ejector swipes not always being present).

25yrs experience doesn’t make you educated.

Thank you for clearing that up . So there can be pressure when there isn't signs and there can be signs when there isn't pressure.
So if I over pressure my air compressor it may not show signs and if I drain the air it may show signs and blow up . I'm not sure about this cause I'm not very edumacated ....... forgive me cause i graduated from Alabama pubic schools.
Okay ........now I need a drink.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Thank you for clearing that up . So there can be pressure when there isn't signs and there can be signs when there isn't pressure.
So if I over pressure my air compressor it may not show signs and if I drain the air it may show signs and blow up . I'm not sure about this cause I'm not very edumacated ....... forgive me cause i graduated from Alabama pubic schools.
Okay ........now I need a drink.

You don’t know what you don’t know.

Just like you have no idea what the pressure is in that rifle without properly testing it. Could be 50k, could be 70k. Could be running it just under catastrophic and something in the system or the environment changes. Then you have a problem.

On the other hand, you could have ejector swipes because of the polish or finish on the brass (alpha is a prime example. You could have flat primers because of excessive headspace and not actual pressure.

Again, you don’t know what you don’t know.

@THEIS

 

[forrestgump01]

Your right , I don't know . I came on here to share what works well in my rifle and here you come like a fucking hall monitor looking to scold someone and turn them in to the principal for not following your guidelines . Well if actual hands on experience doesn't count for anything, then im glad im not educated according to you Mr Professor .

 

[Dthomas3523]

Your right , I don't know . I came on here to share what works well in my rifle and here you come like a fucking hall monitor looking to scold someone and turn them in to the principal for not following your guidelines . Well if actual hands on experience doesn't count for anything, then im glad im not educated according to you Mr Professor .

I actually just made the post in case someone else who doesn’t know saw your post and thought they can make an absolute determination of pressure just based on signs that may or may not show up immediately or ever.

I won’t even go into why your air compressor example is not a good one.

Sometimes experience is valuable and other times not as much. Was not scolding at all.

When we think we know too much and can’t learn anything, that’s when bad things happen.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Also, cause it’s comical, it’s “you’re” not “your.”

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

YES there can be pressure, even excessive pressure with no signs.

Even more so with some of the modern brass....petersen, rcc, etc.....they mask elevated pressures well; by design so to speak.
So by the time you actually "see" a sign it could be past safe for your rifle.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[forrestgump01]

Also, cause it’s comical, it’s “you’re” not “your.”

I bet you walked the halls in elementary school with your HM badge on your arm like a little snitch bitch , wish i could have been there. I would've gave you a weggie and stuffed your ass in a locker!

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

Case in point....

.22 Creedmoor: Peterson Produces Casings With Harder Heads

One of our development goals was for the .22 Creedmoor casings to have really hard heads which would allow our customers the highest number of reloads. Through tooling and material design, we were able to achieve it.

www.petersoncartridge.com

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Dthomas3523]

I bet you walked the halls in elementary school with your HM badge on your arm like a little snitch bitch , wish i could have been there. I would've gave you a weggie and stuffed your ass in a locker!

 

[forrestgump01]

 

[Dthomas3523]

Says the guy that thinks he can gauge pressure by looking at a piece of brass.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Another lifetime/career ago, I was introduced to dry sprinkler systems where the lines are filled with air. If a head breaks, the air bleeds out and releases the water. This is typically for systems where there is a potential for the water to freeze if it sits in the lines.

There is a flapper the air presses down on keeping the water back

At the stand valve there were two gauges. One showing the air pressure above. Another showing the water pressure below. Both in psi.

The air pressure was about 10 and the water was 80.

I asked the sprinkler fitter who what been on the job over 20 years “How does less air hold down more water psi?”

The 20+ year experienced sprinkler fitter answered confidently “1lb of air is the same as 8lb of water pressure.”

True story

 

[Dthomas3523]

 

[THEIS]

View attachment 7246774

Hi,

And would anyone care to guess what the "Proof" round pressures are for the 22CM?
Well, I do not guess, so the answer is: Certified proof ammo operates at about 1.5x the SAAMI operating pressures.

And would anyone care to guess what a firearms manufacturer does to "Proof" their design in regards to pressures capabilities?
The answer is: 2 shoots of certified proof ammo. That is IT!!!

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[cro789]

So you are saying the test ammo pressure is 93000 and the the gun pressure is 124000 psi?

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

I haven't said anything about gun pressure for the OP.

Where did you pull that number from?

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[brianf]

i can see the 93000..
thats 62000 (max sammi) X 1.5 for proof testing = 93000
124000 is 62000 x 2...not sure where that came from

 

[forrestgump01]

Says the guy that thinks he can gauge pressure by looking at a piece of brass.

So tell me what I should go by if I can't use "SIGNS"
You do realize how hard calculating chamber pressures is , don't you?
The copper crusher method, Piezo-transducers and strain gauges are the best actual measuring methods we have so far, BUT.....any instrument engineer that's worth his weight will tell you it's a WAG

Even the sophisticated programs like QuickLoad are only an educated guess as there are so many variables and the input has to be exactly correct or "garbage in, garbage out".

Metallic Cartridge Chamber Pressure Measurement

This is from a article Terry Hart wrote, (I'm sure you would tell him he doesn't know what he doesn't know ) I will also put a link . It's goes into a lot more detail about chamber pressures

No method of measuring chamber pressure is 100% accurate. If you measure 100 rounds of exactly the same load, in exactly the same gun, with exactly the same test equipment using the crusher method the measurements will typically vary plus or minus 5% from round to round. Some rounds may be off from the average for that group by 10% or more. A small portion of those variations is caused by actual differences from one round to the next, but most of it results from errors, or variations, inherent in the crusher measuring method itself. This is not a perfect science.

You could use the equations for a solid rocket motor theory but you would have to add the calculations for the twist ,heat transfer to bbl & expansion of bbl.
Oh, don't forget the non linear acceleration rate, which a burning gas doesn't have.

 

[cro789]

May have miss read the article when it said creedmore family. Sorry my bad.

 

[Dthomas3523]

So tell me what I should go by if I can't use "SIGNS"
You do realize how hard calculating chamber pressures is , don't you?
The copper crusher method, Piezo-transducers and strain gauges are the best actual measuring methods we have so far, BUT.....any instrument engineer that's worth his weight will tell you it's a WAG

Even the sophisticated programs like QuickLoad are only an educated guess as there are so many variables and the input has to be exactly correct or "garbage in, garbage out".

Metallic Cartridge Chamber Pressure Measurement

This is from a article Terry Hart wrote, (I'm sure you would tell him he doesn't know what he doesn't know ) I will also put a link . It's goes into a lot more detail about chamber pressures

No method of measuring chamber pressure is 100% accurate. If you measure 100 rounds of exactly the same load, in exactly the same gun, with exactly the same test equipment using the crusher method the measurements will typically vary plus or minus 5% from round to round. Some rounds may be off from the average for that group by 10% or more. A small portion of those variations is caused by actual differences from one round to the next, but most of it results from errors, or variations, inherent in the crusher measuring method itself. This is not a perfect science.

You could use the equations for a solid rocket motor theory but you would have to add the calculations for the twist ,heat transfer to bbl & expansion of bbl.
Oh, don't forget the non linear acceleration rate, which a burning gas doesn't have.

It’s quite easy with modern equipment. But quite expensive.

Also, if you’re running at close to catastrophic pressure, you’re barking up the wrong tree arguing about a 5-10% variance fr round to round.

What you *should* be doing is staying well under where pressure should be at. And if you want to push a bullet faster, move to an appropriate cartridge.

What you *shouldn’t* be doing is using the lack of pressure signs as a confirmation that you are within a safe pressure area.

You’ve decided to get pissy when you’ve people more educated on the subject spoke up to keep others from continuing to believe and old wive’s tale being passed on by “experience” rather than fact.

 

[forrestgump01]

It’s quite easy with modern equipment. But quite expensive.

Also, if you’re running at close to catastrophic pressure, you’re barking up the wrong tree arguing about a 5-10% variance fr round to round.

What you *should* be doing is staying well under where pressure should be at. And if you want to push a bullet faster, move to an appropriate cartridge.

What you *shouldn’t* be doing is using the lack of pressure signs as a confirmation that you are within a safe pressure area.

You’ve decided to get pissy when you’ve people more educated on the subject spoke up to keep others from continuing to believe and old wive’s tale being passed on by “experience” rather than fact.

Holy shit dude, what are you . The fucking reloading police
First of all , How the fuck do you know I'm running a catastrophic load . There is more to it than the 5 to 10% variance . Powder has a variance from lot to lot , every component you use is a factor. primers, brass , seating depth, the rifle , the environment , ect and so on . All that matters in the equation and no it is not that easy , at the end of the day it's still a DAM GUESS !
And as far as what I should be or shouldn't be doing is for me to decide . You don't get to tell anyone on here what they should do.
And last of all signs aren't the only meathod I use to determine what is safe , and you are the last person I need to educate me.

 

[trophyhunter]

Try the water test, that’ll tell you if you’re in pressures. I do that on all my loads.

fill a Mag with ammo, pour water to fill up mag, (don’t shake off) load in rifle and start shooting. It’ll tell you real quick if you’re up there.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

Nice article but rather old (15 years or such).

Pressure testing has advanced greatly from those days. Conformal ballistic pressure sensors along with their calibration techniques, their mounting techniques, etc etc have progressed past a point of what Hart could have imagined decades ago.

The timing of me being tagged into this thread is rather ironic; as I just had a meeting yesterday with NTS engineers on this very exact subject because of some testing I am having them do for me.

Here is a highlight of what/how they do thing:
For SAAMI pressure testing, a conformal sensor (conformal, in that the face of the sensor is curved to match the contour of the cartridge being measured) is used to measure the pressure near the mid-point of the cartridge. The sensor is a piezoelectric transducer; we use this coupled with a voltage peak meter to measure the pressure during each firing event. The pressure is measured to the single psi unit for most tests.

There are variations from cartridge to cartridge as you pointed out. SAAMI attempts to negate these variations in 2 ways:

1. Each time a new lot of brass is introduced to the testing process, the transducer is calibrated with that brass using an oil calibration system. This allows the transducer to be ‘calibrated’ for each unique lot of brass that is used.
2. At the start of each test day, SAAMI requires that reference ammunition be fired, of the same type being tested that day. This allows for corrections to be made to the velocity/pressure measurements that are actually obtained, and are based on published ‘nominal’ values that are periodically released by SAAMI, for each caliber.

For some light bathroom reading on this subject from within the last 2 years.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[forrestgump01]

Hi,

Nice article but rather old (15 years or such).

Pressure testing has advanced greatly from those days. Conformal ballistic pressure sensors along with their calibration techniques, their mounting techniques, etc etc have progressed past a point of what Hart could have imagined decades ago.

The timing of me being tagged into this thread is rather ironic; as I just had a meeting yesterday with NTS engineers on this very exact subject because of some testing I am having them do for me.

Here is a highlight of what/how they do thing:
For SAAMI pressure testing, a conformal sensor (conformal, in that the face of the sensor is curved to match the contour of the cartridge being measured) is used to measure the pressure near the mid-point of the cartridge. The sensor is a piezoelectric transducer; we use this coupled with a voltage peak meter to measure the pressure during each firing event. The pressure is measured to the single psi unit for most tests.

There are variations from cartridge to cartridge as you pointed out. SAAMI attempts to negate these variations in 2 ways:

1. Each time a new lot of brass is introduced to the testing process, the transducer is calibrated with that brass using an oil calibration system. This allows the transducer to be ‘calibrated’ for each unique lot of brass that is used.
2. At the start of each test day, SAAMI requires that reference ammunition be fired, of the same type being tested that day. This allows for corrections to be made to the velocity/pressure measurements that are actually obtained, and are based on published ‘nominal’ values that are periodically released by SAAMI, for each caliber.

For some light bathroom reading on this subject from within the last 2 years.

Sincerely,
Theis

Thank you for the information. When I get time later to sit down and read the attachment ,I will.
And thank you for not insinuating that I'm just some reckless idiot trying to get someone hurt ,like someone else in this thread.

Wouldn't you agree at the end of the day when it comes to knowing what pressures your rifle and the particular load your shooting , the average shooter is pretty limited in methods to obtain that.
Let's face it , most shooters do not have the time or resources to have the rifle and load pressure tested. And your certainly not gonna do it every time you change a component in the ammo (which is going to change the pressure)
Your basically left to 2 methods , using load manuels and working the load up and checking for signs of overpressure. Maybe there is overpressure that you don't see , but I'm not drilling a hole in my chamber so we can do a copper crusher test to find out.
As far as load manuels go , most are printed 10-20% below what is actual , so by doing a little math , lets say sierra calls 22grns a max load with 85 grn bullet . And lets use 10 % , which is 2.2 grns . So if I post saying that im running 24 grns in my load , technically I'm still under max.
Now someone my look at that and say "oh my God, your over max and your going to blow yourself up" when your not.
My point is you can fanagle the numbers in a load Manuel a little bit and still be fine.
Now , lets take into account that numbers in load manuels and pressure test are for the rifle they are doing the test with and really don't do me or you any good if we are shooting a totally different rifle, so now we are back to starting our load at a safe number and working our way up looking to see if we might be getting any signs of overpressure, and if there is any overpressure you can't see , well there isn't anything you can do other than have it tested , which most aren't going to do .
So here we are going in circles.

Using COMMON SENSE ,load manuels ,and the method of looking for signs is all most of us have and has worked out just fine for me. I Have yet to get hurt or hurt anyone else with my reloading methods.

 

[E. Bryant]

As far as load manuels go , most are printed 10-20% below what is actual , so by doing a little math , lets say sierra calls 22grns a max load with 85 grn bullet . And lets use 10 % , which is 2.2 grns . So if I post saying that im running 24 grns in my load , technically I'm still under max.

You are stacking multiple poor assumption atop one another, which is why others in this thread are questioning your practices and procedures.

Be careful, and always remember: "It ain’t what you don’t know that gets you into trouble. It’s what you know for sure that just ain’t so."

 

[supercorndogs]

Hornady lists max charge of H4350 with a 140 at 40.9 for the 6.5 Creed add 10-20% to that. Umm, no. Or is anyone loading 45-49 grains of H4350 behind a 140 in the Creed?

 

[lash]

Hornady lists max charge of H4350 with a 140 at 40.9 for the 6.5 Creed add 10-20% to that. Umm, no. Or is anyone loading 45-49 grains of H4350 behind a 140 in the Creed?

No, but I know a guy at our range who took his rifle back twice to the smith to “fix the chamber” because he kept get .260 cases stuck in so bad he couldn’t open the action at all. Seems that since his previous chambering had been a 6.5-284, he needed 49.5 grains of H4350 to get the speed he expected from the .260. Wouldn’t listen to the Smith when told he should be somewhere around 42-43 g.

Same guy showed up at the benches one day with a 7mm he was developing a load for. Sat down next to me and after watching him beat the bolt handle to get the first two test load cases out, I got up and went prone safely away from him. He left his cases in the brass bucket when he left and I checked them out. Primers blown out very bad and melted brass at the flash hole along with bent rims from the extractor. Fine reloading work there.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Thank you for the information. When I get time later to sit down and read the attachment ,I will.
And thank you for not insinuating that I'm just some reckless idiot trying to get someone hurt ,like someone else in this thread.

Wouldn't you agree at the end of the day when it comes to knowing what pressures your rifle and the particular load your shooting , the average shooter is pretty limited in methods to obtain that.
Let's face it , most shooters do not have the time or resources to have the rifle and load pressure tested. And your certainly not gonna do it every time you change a component in the ammo (which is going to change the pressure)
Your basically left to 2 methods , using load manuels and working the load up and checking for signs of overpressure. Maybe there is overpressure that you don't see , but I'm not drilling a hole in my chamber so we can do a copper crusher test to find out.
As far as load manuels go , most are printed 10-20% below what is actual , so by doing a little math , lets say sierra calls 22grns a max load with 85 grn bullet . And lets use 10 % , which is 2.2 grns . So if I post saying that im running 24 grns in my load , technically I'm still under max.
Now someone my look at that and say "oh my God, your over max and your going to blow yourself up" when your not.
My point is you can fanagle the numbers in a load Manuel a little bit and still be fine.
Now , lets take into account that numbers in load manuels and pressure test are for the rifle they are doing the test with and really don't do me or you any good if we are shooting a totally different rifle, so now we are back to starting our load at a safe number and working our way up looking to see if we might be getting any signs of overpressure, and if there is any overpressure you can't see , well there isn't anything you can do other than have it tested , which most aren't going to do .
So here we are going in circles.

Using COMMON SENSE ,load manuels ,and the method of looking for signs is all most of us have and has worked out just fine for me. I Have yet to get hurt or hurt anyone else with my reloading methods.

If making a statement like “remember, pressure signs don’t always show up when there’s pressure” makes you feel like you’re being insulted......

I suggest looking around the reloading room floor or online for thicker skin.

 

[Dthomas3523]

 

[Dthomas3523]

Also, keep in mind that “common sense” is different for everyone. And is based on a totality of your education and experience.

Common sense to me is “I don’t know what my pressure is without the proper testing and equipment, so I’m not going to push my luck. I’ll just get a more appropriate cartridge.”

Common sense to others may be “I don’t see pressure signs so I must be operating at a safe pressure.”

“Common sense” is another wives tail. It’s not that common at all most times as people’s education and experience vary wildly. That common sense someone doesn’t have can be developed over time. Which negates the term common.

Interestingly enough, most people who like to toss around that term usually also toss around how many years experience they have without being able to produce any concrete facts on subjects. This is a general observation and not directed at anyone specifically.

 

[forrestgump01]

Hornady lists max charge of H4350 with a 140 at 40.9 for the 6.5 Creed add 10-20% to that. Umm, no. Or is anyone loading 45-49 grains of H4350 behind a 140 in the Creed?

Actually if you go to the 6.5 creedmore load thread , there are several running way over 40.9

have 3565 down for 25.8 of 8208 with a 53 v max in LC brass, from a factory 700 26" 1 in 9. My chromo is broken, so I can't reconfirm that, it seems really fast, but it would have come from my magneto speed. 3 MIL in a prairie dog town puts me, at what i
would guess is about 500y. I have never confirmed the dope in calculator on it. When I get to my ammo cabinet, I can a a coal.

Wow, looky there Mr hypocrite. your running .4 grns over max according to hornadys load data, Better watch out , you never know when them pressures are gonna get ya.!

I have possed the question " If signs aren't a viable method of reading pressure , then what is. ", And the only answer I got was You don't know what you don't know and we do. Glad to know my practices are wrong and yours are infalable.
At this point I could care less what you guys think of my methods or practices . Please get the stick out of your eye before you worry about the splinter in mine.

Other than the post that Theis made there has been no discussion on methods or how we should determine pressure for the load were using.

Although I have learned one thing and that is I have a sudden craving for a corn dog from SONIC drive thru.

 

[Dthomas3523]

 

[cro789]

Dan Newberry's OCW Load Recipes...
The following load recipes have proven to work well in various rifles. Do not go directly to these charges, but work up from at least 5% below these levels.
This load data assumes standard Winchester brass. Adjust your powder charges DOWN by approximately four tenths percent (.4%) for Lapua and Remington cases. I don't recommend any of these loads for Federal brass cases, as they are heavy and soft, and not really fit to reload in my opinion.
.223 Remington, using W748 powder:
40 grain bullet, 28.0 grains
50 grain bullet, 27.1 grains.
55 grain bullet, 26.6 grains
(a good milder load is 26.0 grains of W748 with a 55 grain bullets)
22-250 Remington using IMR 4064
55 grain bullet, 36.5 grains
22-250 with IMR 4895
55 grain bullet, use 34.0 grains for a good moderate power load
try 35.5 grains for max load, but work up to that from 34 grains
22-250 Remington using IMR 4350
55 grain bullet, 39.0 grains
.243 Winchester, using IMR 3031
58 to 60 grain bullet, 39.8 grains
75 grain bullet, 39.0 grains

270 Winchester using IMR 4350
130 grain bullet, 55.0 grains

.270 Winchester using H4831
130 grain bullet, 60.0 grains (O'Conner's load)

.270 Winchester using IMR 4350
150 grain bullet, 52.5 grains

 

[supercorndogs]

Actually if you go to the 6.5 creedmore load thread , there are several running way over 40.9

Wow, looky there Mr hypocrite. your running .4 grns over max according to hornadys load data, Better watch out , you never know when them pressures are gonna get ya.!

I have possed the question " If signs aren't a viable method of reading pressure , then what is. ", And the only answer I got was You don't know what you don't know and we do. Glad to know my practices are wrong and yours are infalable.
At this point I could care less what you guys think of my methods or practices . Please get the stick out of your eye before you worry about the splinter in mine.

Other than the post that Theis made there has been no discussion on methods or how we should determine pressure for the load were using.

Although I have learned one thing and that is I have a sudden craving for a corn dog from SONIC drive thru.

What should I worry about, I am inside your 20% window......./ ? ? ?

Mostly all you have done in this thread is act like an obstinate cunt. Who when spoon fed actual facts doubles down on his stupid shit, and demands more. If you didn't know you could be over safe pressures without seeing signs, then now you do. Stupid is as stupid does.

 

[trophyhunter]

i know people that been driving or walking their whole life that fall or crash all the time.

Many people confuse repetition for competency.

 

[supercorndogs]

No, but I know a guy at our range who took his rifle back twice to the smith to “fix the chamber” because he kept get .260 cases stuck in so bad he couldn’t open the action at all. Seems that since his previous chambering had been a 6.5-284, he needed 49.5 grains of H4350 to get the speed he expected from the .260. Wouldn’t listen to the Smith when told he should be somewhere around 42-43 g.

Same guy showed up at the benches one day with a 7mm he was developing a load for. Sat down next to me and after watching him beat the bolt handle to get the first two test load cases out, I got up and went prone safely away from him. He left his cases in the brass bucket when he left and I checked them out. Primers blown out very bad and melted brass at the flash hole along with bent rims from the extractor. Fine reloading work there.

I have found his spirit brothers brass at the range here also. Same kind of guy that would blow up his gun, then argue with you all day, it wasn't his reloads. Or another that makes me laugh, "Hornady brass is only good for 1-2 reloads." Sure is, at 70k PSI.

My Dad and I have a running joke, any time he asks what powder charge I start at, I tell him "10% over max and work up from there." ?

 

[Dthomas3523]

Still missing the point.

No one has told anyone here not to run their pet load. No one has told anyone they are running over pressure (because we don’t know if you are or not).

It was just a simple correction that not seeing pressure signs doesn’t mean you are running in a safe pressure zone.

That’s it. Nothing else. Just a simple correction to make sure some bad info wasn’t passed along to unsuspecting current or future reloaders.

Run the load you want. Just don’t let something that may or may not be indicative of safe pressure give you a false sense of security.

 

[forrestgump01]

What should I worry about, I am inside your 20% window......./ ? ? ?

Mostly all you have done in this thread is be an obstinate cunt. Who when spoon fed actual facts doubles down on his stupid shit, and demands more. If you didn't know you could be over safe pressures without seeing signs, then now you do. Stupid is as stupid does.

Obstinate ........ya , maybe.
A cunt ......No.
And that's a name you wouldn't call me to my face.

You were flaming me for what I stated about max load data . And yet you shoot a load that's over max . Practice what you preach , ? not really. And no I won't run !! What do I have to run from.

 

[supercorndogs]

Obstinate ........ya , maybe.
A cunt ......No.
And that's a name you wouldn't call me to my face.

You were flaming me for what I stated about max load data . And yet you shoot a load that's over max . Practice what you preach , ? not really. And no I won't run !! What do I have to run from.

I didn't call you any name. What you see there is called simile. It compares the way you're acting in a literal sense, to non-literal meanings of the words, using the carrier "like" or "as".

Flaming you. ? ? ? I did math, I know you hate facts, but thats all I did. You started quoting me. With what has to be the stupidest assertion in this thread.

So, lets break this down. Are you saying that because my load is my load is 2% over listed max, all load data is 10-20% below max. Of course not, that would be retarded. So, drop what was obviously a stupid claim.

Whats really funny is that I never said anything about your load. You're just like a scared dog, running in circles, with its tail tucked between its legs, and biting at everyone. {Again a simile not calling you a scared dog, I wouldn't want you to get even more internet tough guy on me. Then I might have to sue you, if I can't sleep tonight. Emotional stress, and what have you...}

What do you have to run from? Yourself, you seem to be your own worst enemy. RUN Forrest RUNN!!!!

 

[forrestgump01]

Still missing the point.

No one has told anyone here not to run their pet load. No one has told anyone they are running over pressure (because we don’t know if you are or not).

It was just a simple correction that not seeing pressure signs doesn’t mean you are running in a safe pressure zone.

That’s it. Nothing else. Just a simple correction to make sure some bad info wasn’t passed along to unsuspecting current or future reloaders.

Run the load you want. Just don’t let something that may or may not be indicative of safe pressure give you a false sense of security.

Look, I DON'T have a problem believing that you can be over pressure without signs. And I never said you could have overpressure without signs .I did ask a viable question that nobody is willing to answer but I'm not going to waste anymore time with it.

Maybe I took your post as trying to be a nanny and scold someone ,we all perceive things differently and maybe I perceived it the wrong way.
There are a lot of guys on here who think they are intellectually superior to everyone and like to show it in the way they come across .

Now I have no idea if you ever ran a hot load or not , but there are guys on here that not only do it but then turn around and scold someone on here for doing it . They have the "do as I say and not as I do" mentality and if I think someone is coming across to me like that I can get pissy.

So let's just agree on this , I have my practices and you have yours . It's not my place to tell you your wrong or right and it's not the place of others to tell me my practices are wrong when they don't even know 100% what my practices are.


I will also say this and it's not for the purpose of arguement, but just so you know . You stated that a more suitable caliber would be in order rather than run a hot load. Well yes, but there are exceptions. Lets say I shoot a match that is 223 cal only . well if your limited to that specific cartridge then you are going to want to get the most you can out of that round .
Let's face it, if prs held a match that was 308 only , I guarantee most of the guys would be running a hot load that was questionable. It doesn't mean it will get you a win against a better shooter , but a flatter load is can advantage ..... PERIOD.

 

[supercorndogs]

 

[forrestgump01]

I didn't call you any name. What you see there is called simile. It compares the way you're acting in a literal sense, to non-literal meanings of the words, using the carrier "like" or "as".

Flaming you. ? ? ? I did math, I know you hate facts, but thats all I did. You started quoting me. With what has to be the stupidest assertion in this thread.

So, lets break this down. Are you saying that because my load is my load is 2% over listed max, all load data is 10-20% below max. Of course not, that would be retarded. So, drop what was obviously a stupid claim.

Whats really funny is that I never said anything about your load. You're just like a scared dog, running in circles, with its tail tucked between its legs, and biting at everyone. {Again a simile not calling you a scared dog, I wouldn't want you to get even more internet tough guy on me. Then I might have to sue you, if I can't sleep tonight. Emotional stress, and what have you...}

What do you have to run from? Yourself, you seem to be your own worst enemy. RUN Forrest RUNN!!!!

What was that you said,.......blah ,blah something.......emotional stress.....blah.......you can't sleep cause your rainbow brite night light won't work............blah blah , Something, blah , blah.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Look, I DON'T have a problem believing that you can be over pressure without signs. And I never said you could have overpressure without signs .I did ask a viable question that nobody is willing to answer but I'm not going to waste anymore time with it.

Maybe I took your post as trying to be a nanny and scold someone ,we all perceive things differently and maybe I perceived it the wrong way.
There are a lot of guys on here who think they are intellectually superior to everyone and like to show it in the way they come across .

Now I have no idea if you ever ran a hot load or not , but there are guys on here that not only do it but then turn around and scold someone on here for doing it . They have the "do as I say and not as I do" mentality and if I think someone is coming across to me like that I can get pissy.

So let's just agree on this , I have my practices and you have yours . It's not my place to tell you your wrong or right and it's not the place of others to tell me my practices are wrong when they don't even know 100% what my practices are.


I will also say this and it's not for the purpose of arguement, but just so you know . You stated that a more suitable caliber would be in order rather than run a hot load. Well yes, but there are exceptions. Lets say I shoot a match that is 223 cal only . well if your limited to that specific cartridge then you are going to want to get the most you can out of that round .
Let's face it, if prs held a match that was 308 only , I guarantee most of the guys would be running a hot load that was questionable. It doesn't mean it will get you a win against a better shooter , but a flatter load is can advantage ..... PERIOD.

You absolutely said your pressure was good. And you absolutely argued that pressure signs are always present.

You got your dick slapped when you did. Move along.

 

[forrestgump01]

You absolutely said your pressure was good. And you absolutely argued that pressure signs are always present.

You got your dick slapped when you did. Move along.

show me where I said pressure signs are Always present , dickslapped by a LIE. Laughable.