Help identifying a rifle powder

[jlgrizz]

Bought some cheap custom loaded ammo from a guy to break in my new rifle in. Thought it would save me some time loading and it wold give me the bullet and brass I was wanting to use to get me shooting. To my surprise they shoot great out of my gun.

So I got curious as to what the load and possible powder he used so I pulled a bullet and this is what I found. It's small balls/BB's? It's not flakes...
Weighs 42.8 grains and pushes 155's 2,700fps out of 308Win.
Any references/guesses to a powder that looks like this would be appreciated.
I've not used a lot of different powders but all of my rifle powder is cylinder type.

 

[Bill Larson]

Boy................... Be careful........!!!!!.....

 

[jlgrizz]

Lol yeah I understand that!
Just never seen a rifle powder that looks like that...
After more searching I think it's winchester ball

 

[High Binder]

Looks like W760/748.

Why not just ask the guy what he used?

 

[roggom]

My guess is H335 load data from Hodgdons 155 gn Sierra start 41.0 / 2646 fps - 43.5 / 2779 fps

 

[mtrmn]

I have WC844, H335, Acc2230, TAC. Every one of them looks exactly like your pics. You will never positively ID this by appearance.

 

[P7id10t]

Cubic zirconium or glass can look just like diamond.
Suggest getting all the powders motor man (mtrmn) identified, do some workups and see what you get.
If you are near Portland OR I'll give you some AA2230 to try.

 

[jlgrizz]

Think I might have found it. All the winchester powders didn't show the fps vs the powder charge I have.
Hogden BL-C2 weighed up and equaled with my chrono. Luckily I had a half pound of the stuff and never used it. To be honest I had it with my pistol powder because of its appearance.

Loading it up for a ladder test tomorrow morning..
I hate it when I ask a question before exhausting all my efforts close to me..
Makes me feel like a DA. Thanks for all the replies....

 

[turbo54]

My guess is 748. I would have guessed H355, but I'd expect higher velocity from that much H355.

Take this *guess* for what you paid for it...nothing.

 

[KYpatriot]

My guess is TAC, but really no way to know for sure without asking.

 

[Dan Newberry]

BL-c(2) is going to be too slow, I would think, and it's below Hodgdon's minimum, which is a "no-no"... but if your numbers match, good on you. I would think H335 is the most likely powder. You can use H335 data and work up to that same charge. That's how you sleuth a load... you work up using a known powder and *known* data--and in so doing you'll be safe.

TAC is too fast... 748 is too slow... H335 would seem "just right"...

Dan

 

[ksthomas]

jlgrizz,

Either ask the loader what he used (and take that with a grain of salt just due to record-keeping errors, memory lapses, etc.) or write this project off and simply start from scratch. There's no shortage of suitable powders for this application, just choose one. When it comes from a sealed, manufacturers can, and goes directly into your powder measure and then cases, there's no question about what the powder is, period. NEVER try to identify a powder by appearance, especially when dealing with factory ammunition. Tons of powders out there available to OEM loaders that aren't available in canister grade versions, so you can never be certain of the identification. Not an area to be taken lightly or messed with without a full understanding of what you're dealing with.

 

[jlgrizz]

Thanks for all the help. I will look at H335 and see how it weighs up. I'm not loading anything without know specs to start with. The guy wouldn't tell me what he used and I'm certain I would be leary if he did.
I wanted to find a ball powder that weighed up the same as the reloads with the same fps in hopes to find what was used.
The blc fit the specs shot ok with about 100fps less than the reloads but it's not the one.
Going to try H335 next.

 

[Dan Newberry]

Just be sure to go off of H335 published data, ideally from the Hodgdon site. Work up from starting loads, and you'll do just fine.

 

[jlgrizz]

Will do Dan. Thanks again for the help.

 

[was21]

jlgrizz,

Either ask the loader what he used (and take that with a grain of salt just due to record-keeping errors, memory lapses, etc.) or write this project off and simply start from scratch. There's no shortage of suitable powders for this application, just choose one. When it comes from a sealed, manufacturers can, and goes directly into your powder measure and then cases, there's no question about what the powder is, period. NEVER try to identify a powder by appearance, especially when dealing with factory ammunition. Tons of powders out there available to OEM loaders that aren't available in canister grade versions, so you can never be certain of the identification. Not an area to be taken lightly or messed with without a full understanding of what you're dealing with.

+100 !
If you could see the # of firearms that come in to the shop blown up from what you are trying to do you might change your mind.
Oh well...everyone learns in their own way.

 

[jsthntn247]

If it's Winchester ammo, its 748

 

[ksthomas]

jsthntn247,

Is it 748? Or is it WC-750? This is the sort of thing that I'm talking about here when I mentioned non-canister grade propellants. These are similar, but distinctly different propellants, and the data for them IS NOT interchangeable. The stuff used by OEM manufacturers is often not available to handloaders, and trying to match some factory velocities will get you into some serious troubles.

You're making a dangerous assumption here.

 

[Dan Newberry]

Kevin is right, regarding not trying to match factory ammo velocities with a "suspected" powder. The most you can do is work up a load with a known, canister powder, using trustworthy data--just like you normally would work up any load.

If you find, after getting that load to work, that accuracy and velocity match the factory load--even then you still can't say that the factory used that powder. But by this time you're not worried about that anyway, as you've got a good load.

Keep us posted.

Dan