Range Report Help me pick a 6mm. BR, BRA, GT, XC

[Safety_3rd]

In order or priority:
Accuracy
Ability to reload (ideally not fire form)
velocity
magazine feeding

Help me pick please! I want to re-barrel my bighorn.
Thanks guys

 

[Olen_4504]

paper shooting?

max distance?

compition? prs?

id say 6BR or 6GT without knowing the answers to those questions.

i wouldn't bother with the 6BRa personally

 

[MTETM]

GT, XT, or BR. Simple to load. No FF. Many proven loads. With the right mags all will feed.
Lots of good brass and dies available. Decide which powder you want to use and then buy brass.
Just Pick One. We shoot all 3. We load the first 2 to the same lower velocity. The BR is about 150 slower, but it works great.
Powders we use: RE16 and 4831 for the GT and XC, Varget for the BR.

 

[47guy]

if you want stupid accurate easy to load for with no fire forming 6BR...if you want stupid accurate easy to load for and velocity 6BRA....but youll have to fire form...the 6GT has done nothing to impress me as of yet.

fire forming is not a big deal you can go shoot a match with fire forming loads plus you should have a 100 or so rounds through the barrel be for you start load development anyway...the BRA is an AI case which means no jamming bullets or any of the nonsense.

 

[mmlook]

if you want stupid accurate easy to load for with no fire forming 6BR...if you want stupid accurate easy to load for and velocity 6BRA....but youll have to fire form...the 6GT has done nothing to impress me as of yet.

fire forming is not a big deal you can go shoot a match with fire forming loads plus you should have a 100 or so rounds through the barrel be for you start load development anyway...the BRA is an AI case which means no jamming bullets or any of the nonsense.

this

for steel shooting my choices would be
6bra
6br

if you want more velocity with heavy bullets or are shooting paper
6x47
6 creedmoor

basically you want something with Lapua brass
for consistency

 

[cdeiglmeier]

6 Dasher now that factory brass is available through Alpha Brass.

 

[Lesco Brandon]

.243 AI. I push the 110 A-tips @ 3400 FPS

 

[OLD308]

Been debating this for 2 years. Broke this morning and ordered 04 barrels to be chambered in 6XC.
It just checks all the boxes for me better than the others. Not saying it’s better, just better for me.

I think the real difference between all the calibers is more preference than preformance.

Buy or reload
Powder preference
Case work
Mag modification
Barrel life (highly debatable)
Cool guys
Etc

Good luck!

 

[mmlook]

Been debating this for 2 years. Broke this morning and ordered 04 barrels to be chambered in 6XC.
It just checks all the boxes for me better than the others. Not saying it’s better, just better for me.

I think the real difference between all the calibers is more preference than preformance.

Buy or reload
Powder preference
Case work
Mag modification
Barrel life (highly debatable)
Cool guys
Etc

Good luck!

don’t forget brass

no lapua brass for 6xc and the GT

brass plays a pretty big factor on a cartridge performance.

 

[Dthomas3523]

I have just switched back to dasher from 6gt.

IMO, 6br based cartridges are still king. Close your eyes and pick one. Most of the 6br variants all do the same thing.

6bra is probably the easiest to fireform. Brx/dasher.....pick the one the appeals to you more based on its characteristics. But I doubt you’ll be able to tell a difference on paper.

 

[47guy]

.243 AI. I push the 110 A-tips @ 3400 FPS

oh that’s a fun ride for sure and if I had lotto kinda money all I’d run is a 6creed 105 hybrid at 3300.

 

[Dthomas3523]

So far, I have found Peterson brass to be on par with lapua.

 

[sleeplz]

I've been running the gt for the past 6 months while my buddy runs 6br. 6br is the better choice in my eyes. Better brass, longer barrel life, dope was almost the same.

 

[47guy]

So far, I have found Peterson brass to be on par with lapua.

takes more pressure than lapua as well

 

[DDoug]

takes more pressure than lapua as well

Has anybody made dasher brass from Peterson brass.

 

[47guy]

Has anybody made dasher brass from Peterson brass.

ive never ran a dasher but I shot several BRX barrels and shot Peterson in the last one and Peterson is all I’ve ran in my BRA...last batch went 16 loads.

 

[FatBoy]

Don’t discount the 6 Norma Dasher. I have two. Both run 105/107s at 3000 with ease.
I have burned down 2 x 6BRs, I have 2 x 6 Dasher N and am working on a new 6XC. No question the 6 BR is the easiest to load, basically plug and play with VarGet and RL15. 6 Dasher N right on it’s tail and also has no fire forming required. The 6XC has been pretty good with the 115s but it’s no 6BR.

 

[OLD308]

don’t forget brass

no lapua brass for 6xc and the GT

brass plays a pretty big factor on a cartridge performance.

I agree Lapua is King, I use it in everything applicable. I don’t feel Peterson is lacking in this application.

 

[kthomas]

If you don't need the velocity, it's hard to go wrong with a straight 6BR.

If you want a bit more velocity, the 6BRA is awesome. Fireforming is easy as hell - no jamming bullets or false shoulders, and they are essentially 6BR loads pre-fire formed. Accurate as hell too fire forming, had some of my best groups FF'ing 6BRA rounds.

Here's 5 shots at 100 yards, I have shot more then a few FF groups that replicate this accuracy:

 

[Kadams1563]

6BR, 6GT, 6 Creed

any if those and that order depending on what velocity you want.

I run a 6GT and I am happy with it for now. After I wear this brass out I’m going 6BR maybe.

 

[PAYDIRT]

6 Dasher now that factory brass is available through Alpha Brass.

I've only seen it in stock a couple times, better buy the brass before barrel.

 

[Changed]

6BR, 6GT, 6 Creed

any if those and that order depending on what velocity you want.

I run a 6GT and I am happy with it for now. After I wear this brass out I’m going 6BR maybe.

Would you mind expounding on your rational?

What steers you away from the GT?

 

[blbennett1288]

I have just switched back to dasher from 6gt.

IMO, 6br based cartridges are still king. Close your eyes and pick one. Most of the 6br variants all do the same thing.

6bra is probably the easiest to fireform. Brx/dasher.....pick the one the appeals to you more based on its characteristics. But I doubt you’ll be able to tell a difference on paper.

@Dthomas3523 can you elaborate on why you switched back to Dasher from 6GT?

 

[BLKWLFK9]

27-28" BR/105's/varget = done

 

[BLKWLFK9]

@Dthomas3523 can you elaborate on why you switched back to Dasher from 6GT?

i can answer that for you.. brass.

 

[Changed]

i can answer that for you.. brass.

Yes, with the BR you get lapua brass straight out of the box. I too have been considering a straight BR for practice.

I have a GT barrel on the way, and have come to the conclusion, without firing a shot, that the major issue with the GT is that folks think it should run at 3000+ FPS. This causes pressure issues.

Personally, the GT is an experiment that will allow speeds of about 2950, with a 105, all the while allowing for the use of quality, but inexpensive, brass.

While I can, at my altitude, run a 105 at significantly faster speeds, the cartridge was not designed for that.

 

[Feesh]

I’m in the process of making the switch to 6BR. Accuracy, barrel and brass life, and ease of load development attracted me to it. Also availability of brass with no fire forming, great bullet selection, and very pleasant recoil.

 

[BLKWLFK9]

My biggest issues with the GT isn't the speeds. I have a 27" dasher barrel that i run anywhere from 2930-2960. It can go way faster than that but i choose not to. My biggest issue with the GT is the advertised "no mag kit needed" and almost everyone that i personally know and shoot with have to run a mag kit for their GT's to feed properly. If i could get a GT to run 2950, same or close amount of recoil as a dasher, and ran 100% without a mag kit, i'd probably have one.

 

[blbennett1288]

My biggest issues with the GT isn't the speeds. I have a 27" dasher barrel that i run anywhere from 2930-2960. It can go way faster than that but i choose not to. My biggest issue with the GT is the advertised "no mag kit needed" and almost everyone that i personally know and shoot with have to run a mag kit for their GT's to feed properly. If i could get a GT to run 2950, same or close amount of recoil as a dasher, and ran 100% without a mag kit, i'd probably have one.

No mag kit is called 6XC

 

[BLKWLFK9]

No mag kit is called 6XC

i have a 6CM for that speed realm. The XC is going to have more powder, faster speed, more recoil, shorter barrel life. All the reasons people go to the BR family to begin with. I know a lot of dudes that shoot XC and love them. I personally have no first hand experience with the XC. The 6x47L appeals more to me. I just dont love reloading and from everything ive seen from the 6x47, its more of a hassle in load development.

 

[Milo 2.5]

My vote would be 6x47 Lapua, or 6BRA.
I know you said you'd just as soon not FF brass, but the BRA has to be the easiest case I know of to FF. To me it would depend on how many pcs of brass I would put into service, I'll FF 300 cases, but not 500. To me, cartridge efficiency equals accuracy, or going off your op, ease of achieving accuracy, and the BRA has to be one of the best.
Plus, you can buy hydroformed Lapua Dasher brass from a number of sources, so if alpha or norma brass doesn't appeal to you, does not get much easier.

 

[Changed]

David, I totally agree with you about the magazine. My shooting partner did some sort of witchcraft to combine an MDT follower and an Accurate mag shell. Then he added a +2 base plate. We have both had the same argument. Ultimately, I have heard positive results with AICS, Magpul AICS, and Accurate mag. That lead me to give it a test.

I'll never shoot dasher, as I am not competitive enough that it will benefit me. I'd consider BRA or BRX. But, for my first 6MM the GT was a solid gamble.

 

[47guy]

David, I totally agree with you about the magazine. My shooting partner did some sort of witchcraft to combine an MDT follower and an Accurate mag shell. Then he added a +2 base plate. We have both had the same argument. Ultimately, I have heard positive results with AICS, Magpul AICS, and Accurate mag. That lead me to give it a test.

I'll never shoot dasher, as I am not competitive enough that it will benefit me. I'd consider BRA or BRX. But, for my first 6MM the GT was a solid gamble.

keep in mind the BRX is a PITA fire forming i dont care what anyone says about how easy it is...if you go BRX pay the extra and get hydro formed brass.

 

[Safety_3rd]

Damn so much good info.... but now so many more questions. Initially I thought I wanted something over the 3000 fps range to help with wind as much as possible. At what point do I have to worry about burning a barrel out and are the fps worth it? And I dont really know how much drift I save from a 105-115gr round between 2800 and 3200 (a few inches at 300 yards is a lot though right). Admittedly I haven't looked any of this up. I dont think I'll shoot a full series or anything but a few matches a year for fun.
Here's what I've got so far (pulled a lot of this data from the precision rifle blog):

Case	Capacity	105 grain	115 grain	SD (PRB numbers)	brass	notes
6br	39.5	2890		5.1	Lap, Pet
6bra	40	2925		3.8	Lap (fire form)
dasher	41.6	2950	2835	5.2	Alpha	shorter neck than BR
gt	45?	2900-3000	2900 (hot?)	??	Alpha
xc	50.2	3049	2975	6.4	Alpha, Peterson
6 creed	51.9	3075	2995	6.5	Lap, Alp, Pet

 

[verdugo60]

I am not doubting others here but so far the 6GT is shaping up to be my favorite 6mm easily. It has fed just fine from AICS standard mags in a Bighorn Origin.

I literally did zero load development on the pictured load, 35.5 grains H4350 pushing a 109 Hybrid. Barrel break-in is done, I’m getting 2901 FPS avg on the dot with both once fired and virgin Hornady brass that costs 70 cents per. I didn’t chamfer, de-burr or mess with primer pockets. Literally load and shoot.

I pulled that one in the pictured group(16mph winds) but this thing has shot in the .2’s and .3’s since I built it. Maybe I just got a great barrel.

The chrono numbers are phenomenal too, from two chargemasters no less.

 

[Safety_3rd]

@verdugo60 thats bad ass..where did you get your barrel? I have a bighorn as well.

 

[verdugo60]

Damn so much good info.... but now so many more questions. Initially I thought I wanted something over the 3000 fps range to help with wind as much as possible. At what point do I have to worry about burning a barrel out and are the fps worth it? And I dont really know how much drift I save from a 105-115gr round between 2800 and 3200 (a few inches at 300 yards is a lot though right). Admittedly I haven't looked any of this up. I dont think I'll shoot a full series or anything but a few matches a year for fun.
Here's what I've got so far (pulled a lot of this data from the precision rifle blog):

Case	Capacity	105 grain	115 grain	SD (PRB numbers)	brass	notes
6br	39.5	2890		5.1	Lap, Pet
6bra	40	2925		3.8	Lap (fire form)
dasher	41.6	2950	2835	5.2	Alpha	shorter neck than BR
gt	45?	2900-3000	2900 (hot?)	??	Alpha
xc	50.2	3049	2975	6.4	Alpha, Peterson
6 creed	51.9	3075	2995	6.5	Lap, Alp, Pet

A lot of these questions have been beat to death ad-nauseam. I’m gonna be that guy and say “use the search function” or google.

To summarize though, the 6BR’s and variants rule the roost currently. They seem to be very easy to tune and are consistent across barrel lifeESPECIALLY when run low and slow velocity and pressure-wise.
Downside is fire forming brass and magkits for feeding.

6 Creed has been good to a lot of people but it trashes barrels when taking advantage of its velocity capability. A 6creed 105 hybrid running 3150 FPS will knock a few tenths off your wind hold over a BR variant but you can kill a barrel in 800 rounds and it might die in the middle of a match and drop 100 FPS. People are tending to go away from this unless they are hunters or occasional match shooters that don’t worry about barrel life due to low round counts.

6GT was suppose to split the difference and take all the pro’s of each without the cons. Factory brass so no fire forming, no magkits but the capacity to run decent speeds with low pressure and the accuracy of the BR variants. For me so far it is living up to the hype, for others not so much. Time will tell I suppose.

 

[verdugo60]

@verdugo60 thats bad ass..where did you get your barrel? I have a bighorn as well.

Yeah man, it’s been fun!

Keystone Accuracy did my GT pre-fit on a Krieger blank. It is hammering as you can see.

Patriot Valley Arms is doing Origin pre-fits too, their wait times are supposedly low right now but they have had issues with delivery times to put it mildly. Hopefully that is resolved because they seem to build really accurate guns.

Long Rifles Inc has done good for me too but they don’t always answer emails, I have gone elsewhere several times because my email asking to start an order has gone unanswered.

Preferred Barrel Blanks has done good by me too as far as pre-fits but their lead times are extending due to demand and Covid.

 

[MakeSawdust]

Damn so much good info.... but now so many more questions. Initially I thought I wanted something over the 3000 fps range to help with wind as much as possible. At what point do I have to worry about burning a barrel out and are the fps worth it? And I dont really know how much drift I save from a 105-115gr round between 2800 and 3200 (a few inches at 300 yards is a lot though right). Admittedly I haven't looked any of this up. I dont think I'll shoot a full series or anything but a few matches a year for fun.
Here's what I've got so far (pulled a lot of this data from the precision rifle blog):

Case	Capacity	105 grain	115 grain	SD (PRB numbers)	brass	notes
6br	39.5	2890		5.1	Lap, Pet
6bra	40	2925		3.8	Lap (fire form)
dasher	41.6	2950	2835	5.2	Alpha	shorter neck than BR
gt	45?	2900-3000	2900 (hot?)	??	Alpha
xc	50.2	3049	2975	6.4	Alpha, Peterson
6 creed	51.9	3075	2995	6.5	Lap, Alp, Pet

Range Report - 6GT Project/Range Report

After reading through this, seems the only common item is Varget and H4350. I could be way off base, but that's what I'm seeing. I've had great success with RL16. Started with 109s and initial load was 3005 w/o any pressure. After a 2 day match and the expected speed jump, velocity was 3085 with...

www.snipershide.com

I have explored this. The reality is consistency trumps velocity. Post #813. My $0.02

 

[CShooter92]

My vote is Dasher. 105's at 2900-2940 and stupid easy to load for. Fireforming isn't really that bad. I bought 500 pieces of brass and did them this spring. Used them all as practice rounds since they still shot 1/2MOA.

I did load development last night for my dasher and I see what all the hype about BR cartridges is. I shot a ladder from 31.8 to 32.5gr and every single load had an SD of <6 and a max ES of 11.

 

[Krob95]

I’ll advocate for straight BR. 105’s running 2885 in a 27” barrel and low single digit SD’s every time I’ve ran them over a chrono. I have no reason to go through the hassle of fire forming brass with the excellent results I’ve seen from my BR. Attached is the chrono data I got last night.
30gr varget with 105 hybrids. Zero effort in reloading

 

[Meety Peety]

I run a 6BRA at 6BR speeds. If I want to speed up I can, if I not that's fine too. It shoots lights out and super consistent. I chased speed for a while with 6 creed, I much prefer consistency and accuracy over the speed. The 6CM ran pretty hot and shot very well for like 800 rounds and then it uh.. didnt. Lol.

 

[Dthomas3523]

I run a 6BRA at 6BR speeds. If I want to speed up I can, if I not that's fine too. It shoots lights out and super consistent. I chased speed for a while with 6 creed, I much prefer consistency and accuracy over the speed. The 6CM ran pretty hot and shot very well for like 800 rounds and then it uh.. didnt. Lol.

Same. Dasher at 2800 or so. I know I’ll never have a pressure issue with the extra capacity and I can jump to 2950 if I want.

Don’t get me started in 6cm barrel life.

 

[darth_ritis]

Top of my list is 6x47L with either neck-sized Lapua brass or Petersen 6x47 brass. If you care to have the option of factory ammo, 6mm Creedmoor, or perhaps XC or GT if you find a source like Unknown Munitions or Prime Ammo.

Fireforming isn't for me, and I like the option of factory ammo. The other cartridges seem to have some issue or other that I just would rather not deal with, but that's just my preference and reasoning.

 

[Forward543]

I run the BRA @2925 with 105s. Creed is kickass, until it is not (one barrel at 900, one at 1500) .243 went 1600. On my second BRA first one pulled at 2200, was shooting good, just did not want to lose it mid match. Fireforming is not an issue, shoot club matches with it, and it will not be the reason you miss. GT is appealing, but not until Lapua/ Peterson brass, and functionality reports come out.

 

[JustSendit]

GT is pretty friendly to me. 34.6 varget 3020avg FPS, jumping 30thou. Single digit SDs.

AICS mags, MPA BA chassis, and MPA Matrix.

No feeding issues but I 100% wish Lupua made GT brass.

 

[Mormegil87]

Gt has been super accurate for me but has been frustratingly slow. 37gr of H4350 is getting me 2850 and 34gr of Varget is only getting me 2860 both with 110 Atips at 0.060". Im not sure its frustrating enough to want to switch since I'm essentially running BR speeds without the need to use a mag kit.

 

[HousePlant]

6mm in necked 50 cal brass. Send it. Call it the 6mm-WTF...

 

[Steel head]

I run a 6BRA at 6BR speeds. If I want to speed up I can, if I not that's fine too. It shoots lights out and super consistent. I chased speed for a while with 6 creed, I much prefer consistency and accuracy over the speed. The 6CM ran pretty hot and shot very well for like 800 rounds and then it uh.. didnt. Lol.

Same. Dasher at 2800 or so. I know I’ll never have a pressure issue with the extra capacity and I can jump to 2950 if I want.

Don’t get me started in 6cm barrel life.

Smart approach
Moderate pressures ensures no drama will happen.

 

[j741]

I've got a 6GT using a Keystone barrel on an Origin action in an MDT ACC chassis. Feeds just fine from an MDT polymer mag for the roughly 70 rounds I have through it. Only issue I have it heavy bolt close which is unrelated to the cartridge and just trigger related. I'm a total newb to reloading. I started with loading up hornady brass with 34 grains varget & 105s just to get through first 100 rounds before doing chrono & load development. Even with that, the setup just plain shoots well. mostly .3 to .4 groups so far.

Definitely recommend Keystone. John will take good care of you, communicates well, and gives you accurate delivery timeframe.