Help with new load. .308

[dmiller369]

I own a savage .308 1-10 twist and 22 inch barrel.

before i started reloading i was shooting moa to sub moa at 100 yards.

I developed my first 100 rounds of 178 amax with imr 4895 and cci br-2 primers and was very disappointed with the results. the reason i switch to 178 amax was b/c i was told to shoot them instead for there ability to shoot out to a 1000 and remain stable.well after developing the amax i was shooting about 2 moa, terrible i know.

So now im going back to the sierra 168gr. i have imr 4895 and federal 210 primers.at the current moment im not concerned with shooting 1000 yards, im only concerned with punching the tightest holes possible 100-600 yards away and dropping coyotes.

is my current gun barrel/bullet weight/powder/primer combo where it needs to be in order to obtain better results than with factory federal ammo assuming i am capable of doing the work necessary to develop the load?

Im working on a lee beginner kit. this time around i bought a better case trimmer and scale so i have better means of achieving consistency.Ill also be weighing my bullets and case this time around.

I have only loaded 100 rounds total. any thing that comes to your mind when reading this please note. I am not going to be offended by criticism as long as its not a grammar or spelling comment.also if your shooting the same thing as me what does your rifle prefer.

I'm going to find the best powder weight first then work on bullet seating depth.

 

[ProImaging]

Re: Help with new load. .308

ive been using 45 grains of varget with my 175's on one of my savage's. i can put 5 in the space of a 50 cent piece at 600 yards. my new one with a mcmillan stock i just got back today from having the stock pillar bedded. will update when i start working up the load. best it would do was a inch and a half at 100 with 168's, 175's or 208's

 

[insight3b]

Re: Help with new load. .308

All 4 of my .308's have loved:
168gr SMK
41.5gr IMR 4895
LC or FC brass
any standard LR primer
COL of 2.82(max length for my M1A mag)
Sorry I don't have a Savage
This is a very accurate load and will meet all your needs

If the instructions for your sizer die tell you to raise the ram and screw the die in until it touches the shell holder STOP with the die instructions right there and back your seated die off the shellholder 1/2 turn. Don't let anyone shoot your ammo.

 

[YAOG]

Re: Help with new load. .308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: savage168USAF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I own a savage .308 1-10 twist and 22 inch barrel.

before i started reloading i was shooting moa to sub moa at 100 yards.

I developed my first 100 rounds of 178 amax with imr 4895 and cci br-2 primers and was very disappointed with the results. the reason i switch to 178 amax was b/c i was told to shoot them instead for there ability to shoot out to a 1000 and remain stable.well after developing the amax i was shooting about 2 moa, terrible i know.

So now im going back to the sierra 168gr. i have imr 4895 and federal 210 primers.at the current moment im not concerned with shooting 1000 yards, im only concerned with punching the tightest holes possible 100-600 yards away and dropping coyotes.

is my current gun barrel/bullet weight/powder/primer combo where it needs to be in order to obtain better results than with factory federal ammo assuming i am capable of doing the work necessary to develop the load?

Im working on a lee beginner kit. this time around i bought a better case trimmer and scale so i have better means of achieving consistency.Ill also be weighing my bullets and case this time around.

I have only loaded 100 rounds total. any thing that comes to your mind when reading this please note. I am not going to be offended by criticism as long as its not a grammar or spelling comment.also if your shooting the same thing as me what does your rifle prefer.

I'm going to find the best powder weight first then work on bullet seating depth.</div></div>
Do you know the phrase "horse for courses?" If you are mainly shooting paper or steel inside 600 yards I highly recommend trying the Hornady 168g A-MAX bullets over the 168g SMKs. For a .308Win bolt gun inside 600 yards this projectile has better ballistics than a 175g SMK. The 168g A-MAX is an excellent shooting bullet that is very consistent and even reasonably priced.

I suggest finding an experienced shooter and reloader in your area to help you with your reloading. Sounds wrong but I suggest that you try a lighter charge weight load giving you about 2,590fps with your 22" barrel to get you close to finding an OBT load for your weapon. Don't worry about the 100fps velocity loss over a standard 168g load as this is not a game load. The high BC of the 168g A-MAX combined with the advantage an OBT load gives you is more important for consistently smaller groups than a flatter shooting load especially at shorter ranges. I don't know what brass you are using but using IMR4895 under a 168g A-MAX you might consider a final charge weight in the range of 43.0g to 43.5g to get you close to your OBT load. This is a light load but you should still work up rather than down.

HTH!

 

[Temp9]

Re: Help with new load. .308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ProImaging</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ive been using 45 grains of varget with my 175's on one of my savage's. <span style="font-weight: bold">i can put 5 in the space of a 50 cent piece at 600 yards.</span> my new one with a mcmillan stock i just got back today from having the stock pillar bedded. will update when i start working up the load. best it would do was a inch and a half at 100 with 168's, 175's or 208's</div></div>

Haha.



To the OP, that combo, with just about any good quality bullets, should be able to get you better than factory ammo. AMAX's are secant ogive bullets, meaning they will be more sensitive to seating depth than tangent ogive bullets (SMK's). They usually like to be seated into or close to the lands.

Bullet weighing is a waste of time, especially at 600 yards and in. Also, very few people and guns can shoot well enough gain benefits from weight sorting decent brass, and most of those people/guns are in the benchrest game. Spend this time working with your powder charge and seating depth, and most importantly, SHOOTING! No amount of time on the reloading bench can teach you to shoot.

 

[dmiller369]

Re: Help with new load. .308

considering i had a bad experience with amax i don't think ill be using them again.

How much tighter did your groups get when you measured the lands and used a oal gauge to get it perfect.

Also how in the HELL are you shooting 5 shots 1.2 inches at 600 yards? not to call you a liar but i think your a liar.

 

[dmiller369]

Re: Help with new load. .308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Temp9</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Spend this time working with your powder charge and seating depth, and most importantly, SHOOTING! No amount of time on the reloading bench can teach you to shoot.</div></div>

this i understand as i scored expert in in the military and have been shooting for years. although i cant shoot 1.2 inches 600 yards i have proven to my self and my employer i can shoot.

that being said once i find my best powder measure and i start to work on bullet depth could my best measure change or will it remain the same no matter the depth?

 

[culater]

Re: Help with new load. .308

What kind of brass are do you have? I use lapua and never look back and also if you can find a range that has a loading press at the range you can work up a load their instead of running back and forth to test your loads.Ask a friend for a Chronograph to wacth your speed and shoot at 100yds groups at the same time.Once you find your sweet spot for your rifle, have fun shooting.Be sure when you buy new powder to get and 8 lb if you can afford it. If not get as many 1 lbs of the same lot. You will have test your load again for speed changes, and ajust your load up or down to macth your Chronograph speed that your rifle likes. And soot the best group.
Also buy the way 1.2 in at 600 yards is great. My best 10 shot group is 8 in at 1000 yd with my .308 with 168 SMK but still need to get better on windy days. Windy days will seperate the men from the boys.

 

[culater]

Re: Help with new load. .308

What kind of brass are do you have? I use lapua and never look back and also if you can find a range that has a loading press at the range you can work up a load their instead of running back and forth to test your loads.Ask a friend for a Chronograph to wacth your speed and shoot at 100yds groups at the same time.Once you find your sweet spot for your rifle, have fun shooting.Be sure when you buy new powder to get and 8 lb if you can afford it. If not get as many 1 lbs of the same lot. You will have test your load again for speed changes, and ajust your load up or down to macth your Chronograph speed that your rifle likes. And shoots the best group.
Also buy the way 1.2 in at 600 yards is great. My best 10 shot group is 8 in at 1000 yd with my .308 with 168 SMK but still need to get better on windy days. Windy days will seperate the men from the boys.

 

[dmiller369]

Re: Help with new load. .308

i wasn't saying i can shoot that just to make sure we are clear.

i have been using a federal brass from factory smk rounds i use to buy and saved up.

also have you ever tried the ladder test?

 

[Eznutz]

Re: Help with new load. .308

Try this method for determining your load and developement. Its got some substance to it more than the tradtional ladder test and after you find your load then play with seating depths.

http://optimalchargeweight.embarqspace.com/#

I've found it to be very productive with minimal load developement and the "round robin" style tests allows for more consistent results.

 

[Vantastic]

Re: Help with new load. .308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: savage168USAF</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Temp9</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Spend this time working with your powder charge and seating depth, and most importantly, SHOOTING! No amount of time on the reloading bench can teach you to shoot.</div></div>

this i understand as i scored expert in in the military and have been shooting for years. although i cant shoot 1.2 inches 600 yards i have proven to my self and my employer i can shoot.

that being said once i find my best powder measure and i start to work on bullet depth could my best measure change or will it remain the same no matter the depth? </div></div>


1.2 inches at 600 yards is not unheard of. With the right tool(equip and shooter), time, practice, and load development. I started at 300 yards getting 1.5 inch group and worked up to 500 yards. It took time, practice and a very calm day. Which is really rare in South Dakota.

Read this: http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...673#Post3442673

Come out to South Dakota sometime if you dont believe me.

 

[usmc02xx]

Re: Help with new load. .308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ProImaging</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ive been using 45 grains of varget with my 175's on one of my savage's. i can put 5 in the space of a 50 cent piece at 600 yards. my new one with a mcmillan stock i just got back today from having the stock pillar bedded. will update when i start working up the load. best it would do was a inch and a half at 100 with 168's, 175's or 208's</div></div>

pics or it didnt happen

im betting you just need to work on max oal. I think i read someone else already said the max's were touchy to ogive measurements. SMK's arent so touchy. I cant see a reason why 168 smk's properly loaded wont give you the accuracy you are looking for easily. Especially if you are just talking 600yd max. I wouldnt even divide brass for that kind of range.

 

[Deadshot2]

Re: Help with new load. .308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: savage168USAF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Also how in the HELL are you shooting 5 shots 1.2 inches at 600 yards? not to call you a liar but i think your a liar. </div></div>

I think you ought to go back and re-think your statement.

1.2" at 600 yards is just under 1/4 MOA. There are many people out there, as well as rifles, that are capable of that on a regular basis.

It all depends on the Rifle, the load, the shooter, and the conditions. In theory, if all the conditions are right, anyone who can put them in one hole at 100 yards, can make a 1.2" group look big at 600 yards.

 

[George63]

Re: Help with new load. .308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Deadshot2</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: savage168USAF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Also how in the HELL are you shooting 5 shots 1.2 inches at 600 yards? not to call you a liar but i think your a liar. </div></div>

I think you ought to go back and re-think your statement.

1.2" at 600 yards is just under 1/4 MOA. There are many people out there, as well as rifles, that are capable of that on a regular basis.

It all depends on the Rifle, the load, the shooter, and the conditions. In theory, if all the conditions are right, anyone who can put them in one hole at 100 yards, can make a 1.2" group look big at 600 yards.

</div></div>

sure there are lots of them - until it is time to put the wallet where the key pad is

lets say use the general outline of the 30 rd 6 group contest that is posted here:

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3645312&page=1

and the average of all groups has to be 1.2 inches at 600 yds - still think this is common?

how about a 10K wager on this witnessed event, with the requirement that it happen in a 3 hour appointment made 2 weeks out - no sighters once the firing for record begins - now the internet commandos who can do this sort of thing "all day any day" crawl back in their mommies basement

apparently they are all independently wealthy and have no use for the $$

or they are just full of shit

 

[George63]

Re: Help with new load. .308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ProImaging</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> i can put 5 in the space of a 50 cent piece at 600 yards. </div></div>

so when would you like to make an appointment to demonstrate/ be compensated for your excellent abilities?

or do you fit in to one of the above categories?

 

[dmiller369]

Re: Help with new load. .308

Indiana must be a terrible shot. cause when i go to the range i hold my own but i guess the rest of the states are way ahead of us Indiana boys.