-
Having trouble using the site?
Contact support
I Really Did Like the Really Right Stuff Tripods
- Thread starter AP2020
- Start date
Broad generalizations like that make you sound incredibly ignorant. Unless that is your personal feelings after dealing individually with all 1.4 billion people that live there.
Well their government sanctions the actions of every thing over there. The statement refers to their government and their corruption not necessarily of the citizens themselves.
Perhaps, but when governments around the world not only do absolutely nothing about it, but actually encourage it under "environmental protection" policies, what do you think you are going to do?
A country with a policy of steeling tech and IP from anywhere they can. Yes, all 1.4 billion of them, the government that represents them, and the companies they work for. If you don't see that then there is indeed some indiscernible ignorance on this thread.
Country would be nothing without stolen US technology. Business and militarily.
I have some Chinese friends and we adopted a Chinese female orphan who was abandoned because of their culture and ignorance (she's brilliant and wonderful). Between two separate trips I've spent five weeks there and have seen a wide cross section of the country.
Bribery and corruption is normal and universal throughout China. Less so in Taiwan and Hong Kong but under Communist rule corruption is the rule.
Frankly we should have maintained a civil relationship with China after Nixon triangulated with them against the USSR. But we never should have allowed our multinational corporations to build plants or transfer technology. And we should deport all Chinese nationals, especially those in our colleges, post haste. Then we should cut internet links to the mainland and firewall the entire country. Smile and wave, be nice, but keep our countries separate please.
Fat chance of this changing until it's too late.
Those Chinese friends, who are American citizens? Their families were murdered and tortured by the Commies and they appreciate being here. But still, after all that, if the Commies said jump I fear they still would be more loyal to China than to the USA. At least our daughter is immune as she's seen how crappy it was and that they basically wanted to kill her.
So while I have plenty of Chinese made stuff in our home I go out of my way to avoid buying it when I can.
Now please tell me that I'm ignorant for generalizing about China?
Bribery and corruption is normal and universal throughout China. Less so in Taiwan and Hong Kong but under Communist rule corruption is the rule.
Frankly we should have maintained a civil relationship with China after Nixon triangulated with them against the USSR. But we never should have allowed our multinational corporations to build plants or transfer technology. And we should deport all Chinese nationals, especially those in our colleges, post haste. Then we should cut internet links to the mainland and firewall the entire country. Smile and wave, be nice, but keep our countries separate please.
Fat chance of this changing until it's too late.
Those Chinese friends, who are American citizens? Their families were murdered and tortured by the Commies and they appreciate being here. But still, after all that, if the Commies said jump I fear they still would be more loyal to China than to the USA. At least our daughter is immune as she's seen how crappy it was and that they basically wanted to kill her.
So while I have plenty of Chinese made stuff in our home I go out of my way to avoid buying it when I can.
Now please tell me that I'm ignorant for generalizing about China?
I'll stir the pot a bit here......I have used both the RRS and the Leofoto 364 many times in multiple matches. Both PRS and other various field matches. Money is not a factor to me when it comes to buying what I want. After using both setups many times, I decided to buy the Leo 364C and a RRS TA-3-LC. I saw no reason to pay that much more for the RRS legs. At a match earlier this year, we had my tripod setup side by side with a RRS tripod, same heads on both. None of the shooters there could distinguish any difference in stability or mobility between the two.
RRS tripods are awesome, no question about it, but we all know that the price is ridiculous. However, people keep buying them so there is no reason not to charge as much as they possibly can.
RRS tripods are awesome, no question about it, but we all know that the price is ridiculous. However, people keep buying them so there is no reason not to charge as much as they possibly can.
I have a leofoto 364c as well.
It seems as stable as RRS, which I’ve had a lot of time on as well.
But it’s not as light as am RRS. I had to make a conscious decision. Pay more for less weight with the limited amount of utility I need it for, or get the leofoto for now and spend the money elsewhere.
I chose to buy the leofoto.
As @diverdon mentioned, you get all the checkboxes with an RRS. For less money you get less checkboxes.
I chose to buy two AI’s, two zcomps, reloading components, and leofoto. With the money I saved vs the RRS, I paid for a two day class, and two clinics at RO.
So, it’s all relative. And I’ll probably buy an RRS at some point. But it’s at the bottom of the list for now.
It seems as stable as RRS, which I’ve had a lot of time on as well.
But it’s not as light as am RRS. I had to make a conscious decision. Pay more for less weight with the limited amount of utility I need it for, or get the leofoto for now and spend the money elsewhere.
I chose to buy the leofoto.
As @diverdon mentioned, you get all the checkboxes with an RRS. For less money you get less checkboxes.
I chose to buy two AI’s, two zcomps, reloading components, and leofoto. With the money I saved vs the RRS, I paid for a two day class, and two clinics at RO.
So, it’s all relative. And I’ll probably buy an RRS at some point. But it’s at the bottom of the list for now.
Ha— everyone keeps calling me @diverdon but I am @Diver160651 ~ make sure you don’t flame him for my opinions
That is a fair and good information.. wish more people would add and acknowledge what they give up. In the case of the RRS, it is money and everyone seems to focus on that aspect only.
By the way, I have seen at least two shooters use The Leophoto tripod without ahead of any kind at matches to save weight.
A game changer or a fortune cookie on top with no head is extremely stable for most situations.
If I get flamed for your opnion I'll consider it a complement.Ha— everyone keeps calling me @diverdon but I am @Diver160651 ~ make sure you don’t flame him for my opinions
That is a fair and good information.. wish more people would add and acknowledge what they give up. In the case of the RRS, it is money and everyone seems to focus on that aspect only.
By the way, I have seen at least two shooters use The Leophoto tripod without ahead of any kind at matches to save weight.
When RRS was in California, how many considered that the high taxes paid on RRS products supported the the California politicians who all lead the charge to take away your second amendment? I applaud RRS for moving, but has anyone considered that? Any California residents here? How are those gun laws working out for you? Remember, California overwhelmingly voted for Regan in 1984, and look where they are now.
Bang
Bang
You cannot say that your Leofoto is ag good as a RRS. You will offend some of the snowflakes here.
Bang
Post probably needs to go to bear pit. No real need for it here.
You cannot say that your Leofoto is as good as a RRS. You will offend some of the snowflakes here.
Bang
All I am going to say is this: I've seen plenty of gear from RRS on prize tables at PRS matches. Shit, the only reason I own a RRS tripod is because I won one.
The only time I have seen a Leofoto on a prize table was when a dealer put it up there - not the manufacturer.
The only time I have seen a Leofoto on a prize table was when a dealer put it up there - not the manufacturer.
Well when your margins are as high as RRS, you can afford to give more stuff away.
Or when the dominant % of your revenue comes from photography since you are the recognized gold standard, it is easy to take some profit and re-invest to grow a new market segment
Not sure where you are going with this - So the off shore company doesn't know or hasn't invested in PRS/NRL, a US company invest in man power to develop a bunch of shooting aids that changed the shooting community. That doesn't mean that the US company has overly aggressive margins.. But certainly the cost of R&D and supporting the shooting community comes from somewhere. I do business with China the'll copy your DNA and kill your child if you let them..
OK here you go... I'll take the Feisol 3372 over the almost 2Xs heaver Leofoto any day... for hunting or match use. Yes, I have an TV-33 and Feisol 3372, had a couple Getzo series 5, Manfroto, Miller and used the Leofoto amongst many others.
I am not offended by your stupid remarks.. It only shows what you know, nobody is butt hurt because you don't own a RRS -- Hell I can careless if you use a 50lbs benchrest - just don't get on your high horse and tell me it works just as good off a tank trap and only Snow Flakes think it isn't the best.
FYI - copied the first part from my RRS & Feisol tripod and head review found here: https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...-tvc-33-feisol-3372-anvil-30-comment.6570549/
I figure it you look at the huge amount of shake with the fuzzy image from the thermal, including the huge center dot, in POST 1 and compare it to the video below, where I purposely was inducing shake; you can appreciate some either truly amazing AR shots or maybe extremely lucky ones.
Look below at a test were I was purposely forcefully mounted and un-mounted the gun, as well as banging sideways on the vary rear of the stock 2 times in a row. The differences is obvious and this was at 14X at 350 yards to capture the shake better (create more shake in the RRS) -- Note this is with my PCP; my match gun is way better balanced and heavier so it is much damper - less shaky.
My only point is to provide real info, you guys get whatever you want.. I have a shit load of heads and tripods I'll unload
INSERTED TEXT:
I used the "old Gold Standard Manfrotto" without the extra stabilizing stuff like a sling and the same with the RRS and Anvil 30.
Just a dirty non-scientific look thru my night vision on my pest control PCP. Shown to show the difference in stability 350 yards at 14x NOTE that my match gun is way better balanced, heavier and way less shaky in general.
I purposely mounted the gun and unmounted without much technique to show how the vibration, the time it takes to settle or how wind might vibrate the gun. (remember wind causes a lot of issues with vibration.)
I ran 9 steps to show instability, both the same (times below are only for the RRS video 1 of 3)
I figure it you look at the huge amount of shake with the fuzzy image from the thermal, including the huge center dot, in POST 1 and compare it to the video below, where I purposely was inducing shake; you can appreciate some either truly amazing AR shots or maybe extremely lucky ones.
Look below at a test were I was purposely forcefully mounted and un-mounted the gun, as well as banging sideways on the vary rear of the stock 2 times in a row. The differences is obvious and this was at 14X at 350 yards to capture the shake better (create more shake in the RRS) -- Note this is with my PCP; my match gun is way better balanced and heavier so it is much damper - less shaky.
My only point is to provide real info, you guys get whatever you want.. I have a shit load of heads and tripods I'll unload
INSERTED TEXT:
I used the "old Gold Standard Manfrotto" without the extra stabilizing stuff like a sling and the same with the RRS and Anvil 30.
Just a dirty non-scientific look thru my night vision on my pest control PCP. Shown to show the difference in stability 350 yards at 14x NOTE that my match gun is way better balanced, heavier and way less shaky in general.
I purposely mounted the gun and unmounted without much technique to show how the vibration, the time it takes to settle or how wind might vibrate the gun. (remember wind causes a lot of issues with vibration.)
I ran 9 steps to show instability, both the same (times below are only for the RRS video 1 of 3)
1. Turned on to see how much vibration takes to settle
2. Mounting gun, getting comfortable with NPA. 0:12 –o:15
3a Moving to target - holding the tripod loaded on the target (note you can free recoil and be dead still on the target but I was purposely trying to show realistic shake if your loading the gun) 0:16-0:20
3b Deciding on target 0:21-023
3c Holding target 0:34-0:26
4. On mounting the gun 0:27-0:29
5. 1st of 2 Tapping HARD on the Butt stock sideways to show how long it takes to settle 0:30
6 2nd of 2 Tapping HARD on the Butt stock sideways to show how long it takes to settle 0:36
7 Mounting the Gun 0:40
8a Moving to a new Target 0:41-0:46
8b Setting on Target 0:47
9. Un-mounting the gun 0:50
RRS with Anvil 30 stability 1 of 3 comparing Manfrotto Takes :50 to complete even taking extra time, not sure what I was really planning on doing. Also going super slow even though the gun settled.RRS Anvil test
Last edited:
I did not direct the comment at you. Read earlier posts about how people react to things other than RRS.
Bang
How do you know what their margins are? Cost of doing business, especially manufacturing, is significantly higher in the US than it is in China. Labor costs are higher, material costs for US-sourced materials are higher, overhead costs (land/facility, power, taxes, lawyers, etc) are higher, and on and on. Just because the US made product is more expensive doesn't mean their margins are automatically higher. Even if they are somewhat higher, that margin is going to be (at least in part) funneled back into R&D, whereas many products coming out of China are direct (and cheaper) copies of other products. Look at the cost of a POS GreenBlob vs a real Atlas as a perfect example.
See my comment above on margins.
I get the pricing issue, but if someone's in the market, it's worth considering that RRS is the only tripod company that's gone out of their way to support the shooting sports. They have not only donated rather significantly to prize tables, but also developed products around this community and how we implement tripods. If someone decides they still can't justify the cost of a RRS, I get it - hell, I couldn't justify it either, since I rarely use a tripod for anything other than holding up my spotter or binos. It doesn't change the fact, at least in my eyes, it's at least worth TRYING to support the company that's actively supporting the community.
Got it ya, Mike is on here too.
We are saying the same thing. The guy complains about the margin tossed me for a loop.
If it wasn’t for RRS’ $$ investment in R&D to bring innovation, he’d still be using a Manfrotto Center Column 555, hand grip with a funky as attachment - spending 4 months and about the cost of a RRS in ammo learning to use his sling to shoot almost as well as we can today because of RRS; or not using a tripod at all.
Been there, done that, and it sucked. The RRS is leaps and bounds better than my old Manfrotto, but I still don't shoot from a tripod very often.
Yes, the Gamechanger and 6mm kinda did a number on tripod use in matches..
But I still take mine to matches.. I don’t practice much anymore using one because the RRS has helped there too.. But I do hunt with it.
I take one because I always want to have glass (usually 15x binos) available for looking at targets, mirage, and trace. Even at the Altus match last weekend, I elected to use bipod leg extensions instead of a tripod on a stage where 90+% of the shooters used a tripod (and sometimes 2 of them) because I was more familiar and comfortable with the long bipod.
When I get some upgrades in for my TFC-33 (Versa apex, leveling base, and eventually Anvil), I am actually going to start practicing with a tripod so I can use it as effectively as the long bipod legs.
I did not read every post. I will share my experience.
I used a Manfrotto with Hog Saddle for years. No real complaints. Was worth what I paid at least.
A friend told me about the RRS set up. I laughed. No way I was paying that.
Wigwamitis (great guy) from this site made a journey to my place to generously show me some cool varmint hunting items.
I fooled with the RRS tripod/anvil 30 on a very dark night. Next day I was researching options and ordered one from MHS. It is really a great tool for what I do. (Take kids and wounded warriors hunting)
If you have need and funds for one try it.
I used a Manfrotto with Hog Saddle for years. No real complaints. Was worth what I paid at least.
A friend told me about the RRS set up. I laughed. No way I was paying that.
Wigwamitis (great guy) from this site made a journey to my place to generously show me some cool varmint hunting items.
I fooled with the RRS tripod/anvil 30 on a very dark night. Next day I was researching options and ordered one from MHS. It is really a great tool for what I do. (Take kids and wounded warriors hunting)
If you have need and funds for one try it.
I wasn’t complaining about the margins, I was just pointing out that a company that sells tripods for over $1000 is more than likely going to have greater ability to donatethings than a company that sells tripods of similar manufacture for less than $400. RRS is not going in the red by donating to the community, that would be a stupid business practice.
Of course I don’t know what their exact margins are but I can guarentee you that their tripod doesn’t cost anywhere close to $1000 to manufacture. I’m sure they make a top notch product. Is it best in the business? Maybe, I don’t know. But I do know that RRS is proud of their work and that’s ok.
Guaranteed based on what? Your experience in carbon fiber manufacturing or the high end tripod industry in the United States?
You have no idea what their margins or production costs are, let's leave it at that. Bottom line, it's a US company supporting a US sport, in the US.
China and the like produce products cheaper because they use cheap labor, in poor conditions, with sloppy tolerances, and poor manufacturing processes. Their products are advertised as cheap and replaceable.
It's not because they have a magic wand and make everything to the same standards we do for magically half the money.
The reason cars made in the USA ain't what they used to be is they've had to slash costs everywhere possible to be competitive with "buy it for half the price and replace if it breaks" marketing.
If I'm buying a phone that's going to be replaced in two years or less I'll buy it from an Asian company, anything I would prefer to last... I'll stick with made in USA.
Am I missing something? There is a ton of talk about China and copies while also discussing the Leofoto tripod. Best I can tell, it is a Japanese made product.
Much discussion on this forum about how good typical high end scopes are when made in Japan, versus other countries. Not sure if that translates to tripods.
Also, fwiw, my poor ass does not own a decent tripod and would be happy to take either off of the prize table. I’ve only ever shot off of the Leofoto, and that only once, so I have no opinion on which is better. I don’t doubt that the RRS really is as good as people say. It seems to me that everything coming from them aimed at precision rifle market is well engineered and manufactured.
Much discussion on this forum about how good typical high end scopes are when made in Japan, versus other countries. Not sure if that translates to tripods.
Also, fwiw, my poor ass does not own a decent tripod and would be happy to take either off of the prize table. I’ve only ever shot off of the Leofoto, and that only once, so I have no opinion on which is better. I don’t doubt that the RRS really is as good as people say. It seems to me that everything coming from them aimed at precision rifle market is well engineered and manufactured.
Their corporate website is a Chinese domain. I'm almost positive they're made in China, not Japan.
Yup! You are right. I’m apparently confused. I looked them up the other day when this thread started and obviously got it wrong.
Carry on. ?
Ok I'll bite. I can guarantee based on my experience as an aerospace engineer who has experience with the manufacture of both aluminum alloys as well as varying composites. Turns out carbon composites are something that's been used in the aerospace industry for a couple of minutes now, LONG before it became popular in the shooting or camera tripod world. Turns out a lot of shit lately is being used from the aerospace industry.
I've been to plants that have autoclaves big enough to fit trucks in. I'm very familiar with how composites are made and how much they cost to produce. I have been working the last 10 years with products that include not only just carbon composite, but also spectra and kevlar composites. I'm familiar with tooling costs for molds and the scale necessary to make it worth the investment. It's what I do for a living.
Look dude, you can have a hard on for 'Merica, that's ok. But these statements show you have no fucking clue what your talking about.
Please show me just ONE U.S. cell phone manufacturer where things are designed, manufactured, and assembled in the U.S. They don't make cell phone components in this country and they haven't for some time. Buying shit from Asia and assembling it in California doesn't make it "made in the U.S.A". You are just lying to yourself.
And American cars aren't what they used to be because the engineering got lazy, and manufacturing and reliability went to shit. The american automakers were overrun by unions and the companies became more about benefits and salary and much less about making cars. Europe and Asia didn't have the same issues and it showed in the quality of their products. Americans chose to buy quality over the shit Detroit was pumping out.
That's fantastic, so what's the real hard cost of a RRS tripod? We're dying to know.
Okay now it’s your turn in the barrel. If American cars are so unreliable, how come it used to be that a car that had 100,000 miles on it was worn out and you had to change spark plugs every 30,000-50,000 miles? Now every car, no matter where it is made can easily rack up 200,000 miles with nothing more than regular maintenance and will run reliably for 100,000-125,000 miles on the first set of spark plugs.
I owned a ‘69 Camero and had great fun with it. I my wife now has a 2013 Camero and I can tell you that, as much as I liked the classic look of the older car, the 2013 betters the 1969 in every category (aesthetics aside). The ‘69 was pretty much falling apart by the time it had 110,000 miles on it and by design and function was a death trap compared to today’s car. The 6-cylinder 2013 will blow away the 8-cylinder ‘69 in every performance category and will run 200,000 miles before I have to even consider any major maintenance or repair items.
Anyone that says American cars today are less reliable than those from earlier decades is just being nastalgic and not realistic.
I buy Chinese tripods to support American dock workers that feed their families by unloading container ships from China. Think of the dock workers you bastards!
I have been watching this thread and I will chime in briefly.
-We do not an have overwhelming profit margin for one, the fact that someone can say that without knowing us or being in the company is laughable.
-Most of our profits do come from photography, we basically come up even on the shooting side with our R&D and giveaways. Why, because it is enjoyable and a hobby.
-The owner enjoys shooting, so when I met him and explained the opportunity to make something specifically for shooting he jumped on board.
-To make this work, I am still the only person who works there on the shooting industry side. As a hobbyist in different shooting series for the past 8 years and a veteran working on the long range side, he lets me give back to the community at an incredible level.
-I give away products so much because we are proud of our gear and want to give back to you. Most of you guys have helped us and you appreciate the amount of detail we put into our products. Some of you do not know this, I give away products on here secretly to some people who I think are deserving and I enjoy their posts. I do the same at the events I attend, not all products are given away on the table
-Unlike the international companies you can actually PM me, email me, or call me and get a response (typically quick and without a translator needed).
-We do not steal people ideas, we try to come up with innovative products that help you guys and some times they sell about as good as a 2 round magazine, it costs a lot trying to make all of you happy but I am still going to try and do it.
- I work my tail off to try and help out with any issues that occur with our products. (If man can make it man can break it)
- Load ratings a extremely varied with how everyone comes up with their numbers. We will say 50lbs on a tripod that can hold 3 people underneath for a specific reason.
- Moving to Utah was really expensive but yes we are happy and trying to get back to better than where we were before.
- Hit me up if you are in the Utah region after May, I would love to show you around the shop and/or go shoot with you.
- I try and get as much stuff made that can go on other people tripods because not everybody can afford ours and we understand that.
- People who compare our products, shoot off of them and say they feel stable as another, understood. Most likely they are not putting force perpendicular into the joints or leg sections and comparing the flex or if they were to crack how do they fail (complete fail or still able to be used. They also aren't looking at if they can get that simple piece fixed next day air. Are you looking at the vibration dampening aspect when you shoot or use it as a spotter. Do they check how durable the twist lock material is or how much force it takes to lock in comparison to the load ability. There are a lot of factors besides just how does it react with a rifle on top in a perfect situation.
- Whenever we have blemishes used, or demos; SnipersHide is the only place I have advertised or let products go for a huge discount or any discount for that matter. Nowhere else has that been done even on the photography side.
- One day I may start a thread just talking about our gear and answering questions if people want to and the mods allow it.
- I am a loud mouth, cussing fool, who talks and acts like the rest of you because I am one of you, Hider since 2009 with a different name. I may not be like that when using this profile but hit me up on the side and bs with me
- Did i miss anything that you guys would like to know that I'd be willing to spout on about?
-We do not an have overwhelming profit margin for one, the fact that someone can say that without knowing us or being in the company is laughable.
-Most of our profits do come from photography, we basically come up even on the shooting side with our R&D and giveaways. Why, because it is enjoyable and a hobby.
-The owner enjoys shooting, so when I met him and explained the opportunity to make something specifically for shooting he jumped on board.
-To make this work, I am still the only person who works there on the shooting industry side. As a hobbyist in different shooting series for the past 8 years and a veteran working on the long range side, he lets me give back to the community at an incredible level.
-I give away products so much because we are proud of our gear and want to give back to you. Most of you guys have helped us and you appreciate the amount of detail we put into our products. Some of you do not know this, I give away products on here secretly to some people who I think are deserving and I enjoy their posts. I do the same at the events I attend, not all products are given away on the table
-Unlike the international companies you can actually PM me, email me, or call me and get a response (typically quick and without a translator needed).
-We do not steal people ideas, we try to come up with innovative products that help you guys and some times they sell about as good as a 2 round magazine, it costs a lot trying to make all of you happy but I am still going to try and do it.
- I work my tail off to try and help out with any issues that occur with our products. (If man can make it man can break it)
- Load ratings a extremely varied with how everyone comes up with their numbers. We will say 50lbs on a tripod that can hold 3 people underneath for a specific reason.
- Moving to Utah was really expensive but yes we are happy and trying to get back to better than where we were before.
- Hit me up if you are in the Utah region after May, I would love to show you around the shop and/or go shoot with you.
- I try and get as much stuff made that can go on other people tripods because not everybody can afford ours and we understand that.
- People who compare our products, shoot off of them and say they feel stable as another, understood. Most likely they are not putting force perpendicular into the joints or leg sections and comparing the flex or if they were to crack how do they fail (complete fail or still able to be used. They also aren't looking at if they can get that simple piece fixed next day air. Are you looking at the vibration dampening aspect when you shoot or use it as a spotter. Do they check how durable the twist lock material is or how much force it takes to lock in comparison to the load ability. There are a lot of factors besides just how does it react with a rifle on top in a perfect situation.
- Whenever we have blemishes used, or demos; SnipersHide is the only place I have advertised or let products go for a huge discount or any discount for that matter. Nowhere else has that been done even on the photography side.
- One day I may start a thread just talking about our gear and answering questions if people want to and the mods allow it.
- I am a loud mouth, cussing fool, who talks and acts like the rest of you because I am one of you, Hider since 2009 with a different name. I may not be like that when using this profile but hit me up on the side and bs with me
- Did i miss anything that you guys would like to know that I'd be willing to spout on about?
Similar threads
