In what ways is the 300 WM superior to the 7mm?

[Winny94]

I've got an itch to put together a LA magnum rifle. I know there are superior cartridges to both, but I want the ability to buy off the shelf ammo.
intended uses are:
700-1400 yard steel ringing
deer & elk hunting

is there any reason to go with the 300 over the 7? Like I said, I will use factory ammo, but I also do reload, so I have some ability to accentuate strengths.

 

[Sniperwannabee]

Cheaper and will reach out to 1400 no problem

 

[GASSR20]

I'm assuming you're comparing it to the 7mm Rem Mag. The main difference is energy at distance as is the case with most caliber comparisons of similar case capacity. 300WM will have more factory options and the typical 1:10 twist will adequately stabilize anything you throw down the tube.

7mm Rem Mag is great too. The 7mm is a bit of a work smarter not harder approach since you can achieve relatively high BC in a 180 grain VLD style projectile. This is the same reason people step down to the 6/6.5 mm's. The lower recoil in this case is something to consider, although not huge in this case. I'd go faster twist than most factory barrels however since most are 1:9.25 or slower; slower for a 7mm that is.

Both have plenty of factory hunting loads, however for factory match grade/long range loads, I'd look to the 300.

So, in summary, for energy and factory options go 300 WM. For high BC in a lower weight, and less recoil, go 7mm Rem Mag. You just have to rely more on your reloading.

 

[ZeroMOA]

I was making the decision about a year ago, went for 300 win mag purely for the more readily available factory ammo options. Testing out Hornady 200gr ELD precision hunter loads currently....here's my rifle...

 

[Mossyoak44]

I did this same thing last year, both will do what you want easily but I went 7mm mag. I think you will be happy either way you go.

 

[SRPowah]

Part of me wishes I went 7mm Rem Mag over .300WM just for recoil alone, but man do I love the sound of a 200gr pill hitting steel at 900 yards. Either one would allow you to harvest game with confidence.

 

[BurnOut]

I'm going the other direction... .338 WM. Looks like I'll be able to run a 250 gr Berger w/ a g7 bc of .351 at 2800-2900 (out of a 26" barrel). Less than 8 mils of elevation to 1000, and about 1400 ft/lb at that same distance.

Compared to 300 WM, factory ammo is pretty scarce, but it's still there. I haven't run the numbers past 1000, but I'm betting that it falls off pretty quick.

 

[-Time-]

Don’t forget about the heavy .30cals in the 300 if you reload. I’m launching a 225gr ELD-M at ~2800fps from a 26” barrel, with a Doppler G7 bc of 0.367. The 212 eld-x is ~0.336,

 

[brianf]

first is the availability of factory match ammo of a 300wm is only surpassed by availability of 308 ammo. and most match ammo for both 300wm and 308 are better than 90% of the guys who reload their own.
dont know how many guys ive seen who cant hit crap with their pet loads and then we give them some factory stuff and magically were on steel.
1400 yards is well with in the envelope of a WM, its actually just getting started.
usually the first caliber of a new bullet that is produced is a 30 cal so you will always have the availability of "newest and hottest", if you start reloading.

now i may get flagged for this, but FT/LBS is not the end all be all of ballistics when talking about hunting.
my personal experience and the experiences of friends that have been there...bigger bullet bigger hole.

example (numbers by the charts):
a 22-250 has almost the exact same amount of FT/LBS of energy that a 45-70 does when using the same bullets.
there is no debate what round has a better chance of stopping a angry brown bear.

the only down side is recoil, but that is why they make brakes.

 

[Forward543]

Close with either, but i would take the 7mm. I think it packs energy better, and stays supersonic farther, but they are so close. Its really a preference thing, i dont think you will get much more than theoretical advantages either way.

 

[fdkay]

I have never seen an ammo shelf that didn't have 7RM ammo.
Everyone that makes ammo for the .300 WM makes ammo for the 7RM.
I happen to be a big 7 fan, but even I will readily admit that many of the 7RM loads are stupidly wanting.
It is an excellent long range cartridge, but the majority of your factory loads run between 145 to 150 grains.
it seems they intentionally handicap it with the lowest BC bullets they can find.
7RM loads should start in the 160 range and go up from there, but alas, very few do.
No one loads match ammo for the 7 either, while there are several, though not many, match loads for the .300.

Hornady has finally started to load some decent bullets in the 7.

As much as it pains me to say it, if you are western hunting and your shots may be long and you do not handload, then .300WM is probably your best answer.

 

[myronman3]

good Lord....handload, people. then the factory offerings can kiss your ass. none of my rifles shoot factory ammo. homemade cooking only. get the most out of your caliber....roll your own.

 

[myronman3]

to answer. your question....without looking and just going off the top of my head....under 500ish yards, the wm is going to have more power. you start getting past that, and the higher bc's of the 7mm take over. so if you want to retain the utemost in power way out there....without stepping above the 30 caliber...the RM is your animal.

but as others have noted...factory offerings suck. definately NOT riflemen deciding what loadings they are going to offer. i honestly would lose my shit if i had to rely of factory ammo due to the bullet weights offered in given calibers.

 

[tylerw02]

Before going 7mm Rem or .300 Win, I'd go 7-300 Winchester. I don't care so much about factory ammunition.


If choosing one of the two, I would go .300 because of the heavy Bergers, barrel life, and energy. The 7mm just doesn't seem to have the capacity for the EOL.

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[Jedi]

Best solution is roll your own, big fan of 7mm imho perfect cal. The 7 mm version of any 30 cal will always be superior ie 708 vs 308 etc
7/300 norma if rolling your own
28 nosler for cots solution

 

[myronman3]

i was recently looking over numbers on some stuff. i have a 300wsm, and was comparing the load i shoot in it to that of a 7mm-08 that i am considering getting for my boy. i was surprised to see that once you are over a certain distance (600 yards i believe-but going off memory so i could be wrong) that the 7mm-08 have more punch than the 300wsm. so then i compared the 7RM to the 300, and the wsm was overtaken by the RM at like 200 yards.....it was an eye opener for me.

now...i am sure that out there somewhere, there is a uber-premium bullet for the 30 calibers that have super high BC....but, i'm a working man on a limited income and shoot was a working man can afford. $2 per bullet just isnt going to happen for this guy. so in real-ville, for a guy like me, the 7mm is going to offer the most punch at distance. up close, the 300mags have more.

 

[CMH]

Looks like I'll be able to run a 250 gr Berger w/ a g7 bc of .351 at 2800-2900 (out of a 26" barrel).

That looks awful fast for this combo. Are you actually able to achieve those velocities?

 

[BurnOut]

That looks awful fast for this combo. Are you actually able to achieve those velocities?

I'll let you know, hahaha... I am going based on Nosler's online load data: https://load-data.nosler.com/load-data/338-winchester-magnum/

 

[-Time-]

i was recently looking over numbers on some stuff. i have a 300wsm, and was comparing the load i shoot in it to that of a 7mm-08 that i am considering getting for my boy. i was surprised to see that once you are over a certain distance (600 yards i believe-but going off memory so i could be wrong) that the 7mm-08 have more punch than the 300wsm. so then i compared the 7RM to the 300, and the wsm was overtaken by the RM at like 200 yards.....it was an eye opener for me.

now...i am sure that out there somewhere, there is a uber-premium bullet for the 30 calibers that have super high BC....but, i'm a working man on a limited income and shoot was a working man can afford. $2 per bullet just isnt going to happen for this guy. so in real-ville, for a guy like me, the 7mm is going to offer the most punch at distance. up close, the 300mags have more.

The higher weight 7mm bergers have bc’s in the .330-.340, the higher weight .30cal bergers and hornadys are in the .340-.360s. What are you using that’s getting smoked by a 7mmRM, much less the 7mm-08?

 

[FishDr]

Superior???
Recoil. Blast. Powder burned. Weight.
It has some military support going for it, so there's that.

 

[2bits]

The higher weight 7mm bergers have bc’s in the .330-.340, the higher weight .30cal bergers and hornadys are in the .340-.360s. What are you using that’s getting smoked by a 7mmRM, much less the 7mm-08?

It's not just about BC. Velocity plays a part too. 7mm is faster than the .30 heavies, and that compensates for the small differences in BC. Keep in mind, the differences are so small that it's an academic discussion. Anyone actually firing these rounds (7mm vs heavy .30) will never see the ballistic differences.

The deciding factors are lower 7mm recoil versus better killing power of 300wm. The latter is relevant to sub-optimal shot placement. If you never miss the kill zone, then 7mm is your cartridge. For us mortals, kill effectiveness is a consideration.

300wm has better kill power because of things like higher sectional area (read: bigger hole) and mass (read: momentum). Both translate to better energy dump on your target.

 

[Centurion123]

A 7mm RM will launch a 195 gr Berger (0.387 BC) as fast or faster than a 300WM will launch a 230 Berger (.368). Faster + higher BC equals better ballistics, simple. And a 7mm RM is more than enough to launch the 195s, it will go about 2850 fps (26" barrel). When Berger releases their 245 30 cal bullet the ballistics may be washed out.

 

[JePhyllis]

I prefer 7mm. High BC, low recoil. I am not interested in factory ammo. They are relatively expensive and inaccurate. With handloading, you have more options and combinations in bullet and powder. Most of them outperform any factory ammo you can get from the market.

 

[myronman3]

Time....

look at hornady's bullets. AMAX and match bullets more specifically. the 7mm bullets BC is one helluva lot higher than .340 and .360.

 

[myronman3]

,796 for the ELD match in 180 in 7mm. and .777 for the 225 308...which i hadnt seen before. a bit too heavy for the wsm; but i bet the wm would handle it well.

 

[tylerw02]

Time....

look at hornady's bullets. AMAX and match bullets more specifically. the 7mm bullets BC is one helluva lot higher than .340 and .360.

You're not comparing apples to apples. G1 vs G7


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[myronman3]

looking at bullets i can use in the wsm, i havent seen any with a BC higher than .6. i try hard to be fair in my comparisons; thus the comparison of hornady eLD bullets in each given caliber.

 

[myronman3]

i am constantly learning, in the last 20 years my primary focus has been the 270 win and various handgun cartridges. it is only recently that i started looking at the 7mm's and other calibers.

when you look at all the bullet weights, powder type/charge, and other variables available to a person in each caliber, a person could spend a lifetime and still have more to learn. the more you learn, the more you realize how much you have yet to learn.

 

[ALShooter]

Quality brass isn't as easy to find for the 7mm RM as it is the 300wm. I love my 7mm with 180 Bergers stuffed over retumbo.

 

[-Time-]

,796 for the ELD match in 180 in 7mm. and .777 for the 225 308...which i hadnt seen before. a bit too heavy for the wsm; but i bet the wm would handle it well.

The 225 has worked well in my 300wm. Do you happen to have G7 BCs for the 180eld? I notice the g1 for my 225gr ELD load has me supersonic out to over 1900, where the G7 numbers have me supersonic out to 1661. Quite a bit of discrepancy there.

ultimately OP I’d say if you can find good quality, heavy factory ammo for the 7mmRM you’d do well taking advantage of the less recoil and extra 100yards of supersonic performance when reloading. If you plan on mostly running factory stuff I’d go 300 as it’s more plentiful around here, and you won’t really see the extra performance, just less recoil. Comparing the highest BC factory 7mm I could find (hsm 180gr Berger VLD) to the highest 300wm I could find (Hornady 200gr ELD-X Precision hunter) they’re both within 40 yards of supersonic range, the 7mm only has 1/20th less drop at 500 than the 300, and only 0.33 less at 1000.

most importantly have fun with whatever you pick!

 

[6point5CM]

A 7mm RM will launch a 195 gr Berger (0.387 BC) as fast or faster than a 300WM will launch a 230 Berger (.368). Faster + higher BC equals better ballistics, simple. And a 7mm RM is more than enough to launch the 195s, it will go about 2850 fps (26" barrel). When Berger releases their 245 30 cal bullet the ballistics may be washed out.

I think 215's are the magic bullet for the WM.

A 7RM launching the Berger 195's at 2850 at 1k will give you 24.6 MOA of elevation needed, and 1310.4 ft/lb of energy in Applied Ballistics. A .300 WM running the Berger 215's at 3005 fps (that's my load) will give me 21.9 MOA drop and 1536.6 ft/lb of energy (all atmospherics being equal). Although close, with 215's and the numbers given above with a 2850 fps load from a 7RM, the WM is superior.

The bottom line is neither are going to hinder anyone from wrecking anything in their path, and with most 25MOA turrets these days, both are one revolution easy to 1K.

For me, 7RM=180's and 300WM=215's. Anything heavier in either and I'm stepping up to a 28Nosler w/ 195's or.300 RUM. w/ 230's.

 

[stwcattle]

300WM and ABM 215 Hybrids is the combination your looking for

 

[Whiskeywater1]

300WM and ABM 215 Hybrids is the combination your looking for

I'm very interested in this thread, as I've just started dipping my toes in using the 300WM in longer ranges (1300+ yards). What is your take on the ABM 230 Hybrids? Any additional insight on this would be greatly appreciated.

 

[jda2631]

I have a 300WM and love the 225 ELD's with 78.5gr retumbo. I'm getting 2860fps with that combo and it's super accurate. I originally shot the 230 Berger's, and they shot good, don't think I ever got them quite as accurate as I have the ELD's, but I bought the ELD's to try mainly because they were half the cost of the Berger's and now I won't go back.

But just a fun fact, this combo of the 225 ELD at 2860 fps has about 50% more energy at 1 mile than a 45 ACP +P has at the muzzle.

 

[Centurion123]

I think 215's are the magic bullet for the WM.

A 7RM launching the Berger 195's at 2850 at 1k will give you 24.6 MOA of elevation needed, and 1310.4 ft/lb of energy in Applied Ballistics. A .300 WM running the Berger 215's at 3005 fps (that's my load) will give me 21.9 MOA drop and 1536.6 ft/lb of energy (all atmospherics being equal). Although close, with 215's and the numbers given above with a 2850 fps load from a 7RM, the WM is superior.

The bottom line is neither are going to hinder anyone from wrecking anything in their path, and with most 25MOA turrets these days, both are one revolution easy to 1K.

For me, 7RM=180's and 300WM=215's. Anything heavier in either and I'm stepping up to a 28Nosler w/ 195's or.300 RUM. w/ 230's.

I agree, I should have used 215s for the 300WM. But although it will drop a bit less and have more energy, the 195 will have less wind drift. And the further the distance the better the 195 looks compared to both 180s in a 7mm and 215/230 in a 300WM.

I have a 300WM myself and love it, but if I were to choose again I might have went 7RM. Simply because it recoils less, even suppressed.