Re: It's not a $#*&@^#$ sniper rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ToddM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you buy a built huge rock crawling jeep, but you just drive it to work and around town and someone says "Hey nice rock crawler" are you going to get pissed at them and tell them it's just a "car" it's not a "rock crawler" because you just drive it around town? The same is true here, shooters may not like other people thinking of these guns as sniper rifles, but frankly, that's their intended use, accept it, and get over it.</div></div>
Great comparison, but you veered off at the end.
If the Jeep was built and designed to crawl over rocks, then indeed it should be referred to as a "rock crawler". The description is correct as to the purpose of the vehicle no matter if that purpose is unrealized.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">These rifles, the 700P included, were/are designed and build for law enforcement/military use</div></div>
Actually VERY FEW of these rifles are designed and built for LE/Mil use. The vast majority of the high dollar custom rifles on this board are built for glorified target shooting. This can be seen when you really stop and look at the features and the marketing versus what a professional Sniper actually needs.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">so are most of the picatinny accessories, mildot scopes, matte black toys, etc. etc. we all love.</div></div>
Most of the accessories you mention are also made as "toys". When something that was designed for warfighters hit's the market you generally hear a massive amount of bitching about how much it costs and doesn't sell real well until a "cheap" version appears. For verification on that you just have to look at the volume of copies from China sold here.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can't blame someone for calling it a sniper rifle when that was the intended purpose and marketing for it.</div></div>
It's simple ignorance. The intended purpose of 90% of what I see called "Sniper Rifles" are toys that are intended to resemble them. A good example would be a Mossberg ATR Nighttrain. It was desinged and intended to look like a Sniper rifle. If anyone involved in it's development actually intended an American to carry that POS to war, they should be hung. However it gets called a "Sniper Rifle" in every gunshop it appears in.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can use it hunting rabbits and shooting competition all you want, but you don't see the remington 700P, AIAW, TRG etc. etc. marketed as a hunting rifle or a competition rifle, I don't see any ads from remington trying to sell the 700P as a target gun, nothing on the sako page about using the TRG for target shooting. </div></div>
The 700 has been a hunting rifle for long before it was used to hunt humans. The 700P is the "tactical" version of it and marketed as being specifically designed for hunting humans. As well as the fact that they ARE specifically used across the country for hunting humans by SNIPERS. Hence in every aspect of the definition, it is a Sniper Rifle.
All of AI's rifles were designed from the ground up with the express purpose of being used by professionals to hunt humans. Hence they qualify as a Sniper Rifle.
I don't know a whole lot about the TRG line and exactly what the development process was. I do believe they also were designed specifically with Military purposes in mind.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you don't want people thinking of you and your gear as tactical/sniper gear then don't buy all the gear that's specifically designed and marketed for that purpose, simple.
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If it was specifically designed as such, I have no problem with it. However most of the time that is simply not the case.
My definition is simple. It's a Sniper Rifle if it was:
a. Designed and manufactured with the intended purpose of being used by Military or Law Enforcement Professionals for hunting people.
b. Pressed into service by a professional Sniper.
I.E. the Winchester Model 70 was not designed as a Sniper Rifle. However I don't think anyone would argue that the rifle carried by GySgt. Carlos Hathcock USMC in Vietnam doesn't qualify as a Sniper Rifle (because it's a Sniper's Rifle). In the converse sense, Joe the Accountant can go to Bud's Guns and buy a brand new Accuracy International AW. The rifle was designed for one purpose and one purpose only. Even though Joe will only kill paper with it, it's still a Sniper Rifle. (it's just not a Sniper's Rifle)
In the end, call it what you want. That doesn't preclude me from calling you a Dumbass if you use the wrong terminology.
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I'd append your post to my signature line, but I think Frank would have a fit.
As you said earlier, there's better things in life to worry about than names. People who hate guns will always hate them even if Remington undergoes a complete rebranding process and changes them to the "Remington M700 Celebratory Noisemaker". Changing the name just means it takes them a few extra moments to catch on.
