I inherited a number of NFA items several months ago..........one is a MP5...........I don't know a lot about it, and so far google searches have provided little info.............anyone know a Guru that can tell me what it is/was............4 digit S/N, so it may be an early one...........thanks in advance for any help........
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MP5
- Thread starter Marinevet1
- Start date
SP5 is semi-auto and can be bought right now without any additional paperwork... MP5 is full-auto, therefore NFA item.
No, It’s a pistol for importation laws (922r), unless you convert it to a rifle, then it becomes an SBR. I have one. I put a brace on it, so it’s still a registered pistol, not an SBR.
Top of receiver marked MP5, stamp paperwork identifies it as an MP5............a semi auto MP5 with a stock is an NFA item............SBR..........
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Is there a two-letter date code on the receiver? If so, that will identify the year of manufacture.
Not sure what your questions are but I have owned the full auto MP5 and MP5K.
You can PM me if you would like
Safety Harbor Firearms rear section, with a GearHead Works brace. Not a cheap setup by any means, but it's nice. And solid as a rock.
EDIT
I looked at my records and photos and on my MP5 the date code is on the top rail near the proof marks and the SN.
I had a 5-digit SN though. If yours was a 4-digit SN, there may be a date after the SN. The format is number of the month/last 2 digits of the year (4/72 for example).
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What’s listed on the Form 4 or Form 1? Lots of possible info there. If you want to share please conceal your info and previous owner if Form 4.
What is the date of the form 4 or 1? Perhaps it was posted earlier if this is a Short barrel rifle or machine gun? Model can be listed as anything and in the past this could get crazy. ATF is cleaning this up now but don’t yet know the last transfer date.
listed where? a Schedule A to a trust? or actual Tax Stamp? that will tell us if FA or semi auto SBR.
also will tell if it's a factory SBR or a Form 1
Both........Schedule A on a trust, and on my brothers form 4, with a tax stamp. Also on my returned copy of the form 5. He purchased it in November of 2008.
There is no question that it is a semi auto, SBR............as stated in post #8...........just trying to find out a few details
thats an interesting possibility. remarks of the hk94 are something ive never understood. Especially since no 94s were imported after the 80s.
It likely may become one of your favorite things to shoot...
A remarked 94 sounds likely- IIRC it was around that time/earlier that the CA
Dept of Corrections or ?? dumped a decent number of 94's into the secondary market. There were quite a few that passed through the pages of Sturmgewehr/Gunbroker for sure.
The way I saw the remarking thing was at the time there were few "clones" available, and the ones that were somewhat affordable had questionable people or parts/practices behind them (Coharie/Vector/etc) and if you remarked a 94, it would still say "Made in Germany"- an important qualifier of provenance.
A remarked 94 sounds likely- IIRC it was around that time/earlier that the CA
Dept of Corrections or ?? dumped a decent number of 94's into the secondary market. There were quite a few that passed through the pages of Sturmgewehr/Gunbroker for sure.
The way I saw the remarking thing was at the time there were few "clones" available, and the ones that were somewhat affordable had questionable people or parts/practices behind them (Coharie/Vector/etc) and if you remarked a 94, it would still say "Made in Germany"- an important qualifier of provenance.
Does it say “Made in W Germany” on the right side of the magazine well?
Date code should be stamped on top of the receiver and you can look those codes up.
My brother’s was a 1985 import Hk94, for example. Very cool little gun at the time. They used to go for $892 if I recall when sold in the late 1980s. Easily sell for $5k now.
Date code should be stamped on top of the receiver and you can look those codes up.
My brother’s was a 1985 import Hk94, for example. Very cool little gun at the time. They used to go for $892 if I recall when sold in the late 1980s. Easily sell for $5k now.
Its possible (would be a small chance) that it is a flat that was folded to look like a clone and then registered as an SBR. If you want to IM or post pictures I could tell for sure.
With Made in W Germany, that makes it an Hk94 since the wall came down in 1989. Hk94s were only imported for a few select years in the 1980s in batches, not every year as some standard import.
Look at the top of the receiver for the 2-letter code, then reference the codes from Hk
No, in the Hk system, the 2 letters are the date code.
Letter | Corresponding digit |
A | 0 |
B | 1 |
C | 2 |
D | 3 |
E | 4 |
F | 5 |
G | 6 |
H | 7 |
I | 8 |
J/K | 9 (J used for mags, K for firearms) |
For example, my brothers “I F" was 1985.
I = 8
F= 5
"I E" would be 1984
The serial number is just the serial number. It’s not every day you come across a firearm made in West Germany and marked as such, since West Germany only existed as a political entity for only 41 years, and the Hk 91s and 93s were marked “Made in Germany”, while Hk94s were marked “Made in W Germany”.
Very cool, collectible pieces of history that also make great shooters in high volume at the range, have very high quality, extremely durable coatings and metallurgy for semi auto.
Ok, I get it now. I just thought that was a just an import mark or something. It is also marked IF.
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Man, it's hard to beat this site for first hand useful information. Even after being a member for many years, I'm still impressed.
Exactly
Not sure it would be converted. An HK94 that was remade into an MP5 would carry the marks of the company that did the conversion. What does the trigger group pictograms look like?
This is not a fully automatic HK. That is a semi-auto trigger pack
This must be an HK 94 converted to an MP5
Still a valuable piece but not a fully automatic MP5
This must be an HK 94 converted to an MP5
Still a valuable piece but not a fully automatic MP5
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Ok, once again I will refer to post #8...........I never claimed it was a full auto.........
Does a MP5 stamp always designate a full auto gun?..............
MP5SF Semi-automatic variant of the MP5 intended for the law enforcement and military markets, introduced in 1986 to meet a Federal Bureau of Investigation request for a "9mm semi-automatic carbine". Unlike the HK94, the semi-automatic MP5 variant for the civilian market, the MP5SF retains its standard 8.9-inch barrel. It has two variants: the MP5SFA2 with a fixed stock, and the MP5SFA3 with a retractable stock. It uses the "0-1" trigger group, but since 1991, it has been delivered with select-fire bolt carriers that make it capable of automatic fire if paired with an appropriate trigger group.
Didn't mean anything by it.
MP5 stamp does not imply it is full auto. It only means that it has the correct length barrel, a specific type of trigger housing relative to how it attaches to the receiver and a paddle magazine release
I told you what it is
It is an HK 94 converted to an MP5 clone. It is either an SBR or a machine gun. The classification depends on what other features it includes. So does its value. Distinguishing characteristics that help to define its classification include:
- Is there a stock attached? Any stock would make it an SBR governed by NFA rules.
- How does the trigger housing attach to the receiver? If it is a push-pin receiver, then it is considered a machine gun versus an SBR. The method of attachment is the sole defining characteristic that the BATF uses to determine if an HK receiver is classified as a machine gun receiver. A push-pin receiver can accept a factory full auto trigger pack. A semi-auto receiver cannot. A semi-auto receiver that can function as a fully automatic MP5 requires a semi-auto pack that has been converted to allow the inclusion of the auto sear or a catch. I doubt that it is a push-pin type of receiver as it would have had to be imported before 1968 (for the most part).
- Does it have a flapper type of magazine release?
Based on what I have seen and read, you have an HK 94 conversion to an MP5. The tax stamp tells you nothing beyond the fact that it is an NFA item. Since it has a semi-auto pack, it is an SBR.
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An MP5 SF is considered a machinegun by ATF because it is “readily convertible” to full auto.
Ho Ho Ho now you don't have a machinegun
It is because the presence of a front push pin on the receiver (Without a denial in the receiver like on MKE guns) makes the gun a machinegun irrespective of a semi auto only trigger pack because in 30 seconds you can put an MG pack on it.
Some semi auto trigger housings mimic a full auto setup (in looks only, of course). They are called “clipped and pinned”.
See link and pics below.
However if you take the housing off the gun you’ll see if there is a hole in the metal for a pin or not. Apparently, if I understand what others are saying, hole = full auto/select fire.
See link and pics below.
However if you take the housing off the gun you’ll see if there is a hole in the metal for a pin or not. Apparently, if I understand what others are saying, hole = full auto/select fire.
@carbonbased
Correct. The push-pin housings have holes as shown. The clip-on housings also have holes but they are blocked and decorative only.
Clip-on-type trigger housings are designed to work with a Title 1 semi-auto receiver like those found on the HK 94/SP 89 firearms. The clip-on ledge was a feature of the HK semi-auto receivers designed to prevent them from integrating with the HK push-pin type of machine gun trigger pack. It prevented the easy conversion of a semi to a full auto weapon.
Several domestic manufacturers became adept at modifying trigger packs to incorporate an auto sear and lever into a semi-auto trigger pack that mounts to a clip-on type of receiver. The other option was to modify a push-pin machine gun trigger pack to mount in a clip-on receiver. This was not easy. Converted packs using a registered sear had sear pivot pin mounting holes in slightly different locations which affected the cyclic rate of fire and required careful timing of the components if it were to work properly.
These conversions were not as desirable as registered receiver conversions that could use standard push-pin types of trigger packs.
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