Rifle Scopes newbie question on zero stop(Vortex Razor 2)

Walter Haas

San Francisco MAGA fan
Banned !
Minuteman
Dec 20, 2019
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San Francisco, CA
Guys, I'm confused by something someone next to me at the range said regarding the zero stop. He said you have to add .5 mrad for zero stop to the black dial adjustment as well as to whatever adjustment it takes to zero your groups.

I'm following these steps:
  • set outer main turret to zero
  • remove the cap and expose the black dial
  • loosen the three set screws
  • keep shooting and turning the black dial until your groups are centered on the reticle zero
  • tighten set screws
The .5mrad zero stop doesn't need to be factored in to the black dial, right? Because no matter where I turn the black dial, once the set screws are tightened the zero stop is still going to automatically be .5mrad below that.

The guy next to me said I need to add the .5 mrad to the black dial, too. Yet if I just dial in the zero and tighten the set screws the outer turret still only goes .5mrad below zero, so what he says doesn't seem true.

Can anyone clear this up, please.

Thanks in advance.
 
Walter,
I have three of these scopes and have set them up the same as you listed. I have not "added" any additional .5 mil in to this. As you said, once it is set, there is the .5 available under "zero" set. I am no pro shooter, but have had no issues with setting it the same as you. Hope that helps.
Chris
 
Walter,
I have three of these scopes and have set them up the same as you listed. I have not "added" any additional .5 mil in to this. As you said, once it is set, there is the .5 available under "zero" set. I am no pro shooter, but have had no issues with setting it the same as you. Hope that helps.
Chris
Thanks, Chris. I have another question, too, if you don't mind. If the average shooter zeroes their rifle for 100 yards and I then look at their turrets, will the turrets say 0(elevation) and 0(elevation)? Or would the turrets say a nonzero number like 1.3(elevation) and .4(windage)? I mean, is the goal of zeroing to have the turrets say 0/0 while the bullets are landing at the reticle zero/zero? Or is the goal to just have the bullets landing at the reticle zero/zero but the turrets saying whatever they need to be turned to to get you there? If its the second way then how do you remember what it was set to for 100 yard zero after shooting all kinds of distances all day long?
 
Walter,
So if im reading your question correctly it should be as follows...you start the whole process by making sure you have the turrets settled in at their "0". Once you have the small 3 set screws loose, you can change the inside metal colored dial with the screwdriver slot ( cap off already ) to make adjustments to find your zero. Once you have done that with both elevation and windage, and tighten down your set screws, your "outer dial" should still be set at the "0"s.
So to sum it up, when making sight in corrections with the set screws loose, you are changing the reticle to match your desired impact spot. Once that is done and you tighten the set screws, and your rifle is zeroed at 100 yards, the indicator on your dials should be at zero. Now when you want to shoot 200 yards and you know how many mil you need, you dial it up to that spot ( rough example you know you need .4 mil, then you dial up four clicks so your dial reads .4). When done shooting at 200, to reset it back to 100 yards you just dial down to 0 again. Hope I got that all correct, i dont have my manual, im at work. If different than that for some reason I will correct it in here tomorrow morning when i get home.
Chris
Ps...definitely different from the Viper models which I have also and they are all different.
 
And to more specifically answer your question, you can do whatever you like. Don't look at other peoples turrets and try and guess what kind of system they are doing. Lord only knows what system they have. Some shooters zero at 200 so if you are shooting next to them their turret may not say "0". Or sometimes they are tweaking somethin and have not reset their dial zero stop. See what I mean?? Just pick a spot YOU will remember for YOUR system and stick with it. I personally set all of mine to be on the "zeros" at 100 yards. I have many rifles and it is the only way to keep it all straight because some dont get used as often as others.
 
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Your first mistake is to listen to anyone at a gun range.

Your second mistake is overthinking the zero.

People do all kinds of stupid shit and believe all kinds of stupid shit. Good for you to ask here but......hell see my next post.
 
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Thanks, Chris. I have another question, too, if you don't mind. If the average shooter zeroes their rifle for 100 yards and I then look at their turrets, will the turrets say 0(elevation) and 0(elevation)? Or would the turrets say a nonzero number like 1.3(elevation) and .4(windage)? I mean, is the goal of zeroing to have the turrets say 0/0 while the bullets are landing at the reticle zero/zero? Or is the goal to just have the bullets landing at the reticle zero/zero but the turrets saying whatever they need to be turned to to get you there? If its the second way then how do you remember what it was set to for 100 yard zero after shooting all kinds of distances all day long?

What do you think makes the most sense? Do that.

1580724372498.png
 
The guy next to me said I need to add the .5 mrad to the black dial, too.

To explain why (some) un-informed people say this: They don't understand why a zero-stop allows the dial to rotate several tenth mils "under" zero to provide for adjustment of impact due to ammunition, elevation, or atmospheric changes. They expect the zero stop to go "exactly" at zero and try to bypass the design feature.
 
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Turrets should be set to zero. That is the whole idea behind zeroing...
What's the reason for the locking mechanism on the turrets, then? I mean, your software is telling you the come ups, and you know you're zeroed at 100 yards, so why the locking turrets? I was taking the lock to imply that there's another way to zero, by turning the turrets until you zero the reticle at 100 yards and then locking the turrets and then just adding your come ups to whatever the 100 yard value is. A little faster than getting out three tools to properly calibrate the zero/zero on the turret. I'm not trying to be dense, I'm just trying to understand.
 
What's the reason for the locking mechanism on the turrets, then? I mean, your software is telling you the come ups, and you know you're zeroed at 100 yards, so why the locking turrets? I was taking the lock to imply that there's another way to zero, by turning the turrets until you zero the reticle at 100 yards and then locking the turrets and then just adding your come ups to whatever the 100 yard value is. A little faster than getting out three tools to properly calibrate the zero/zero on the turret. I'm not trying to be dense, I'm just trying to understand.

Locking turrets exist for one obvious reason: to prevent inadvertent or accidental movement that would change the dope you put on the rifle without you realizing it.

Brah, I know you're new and curious. You're obviously very intelligent and observant. But remember Occam's razor whenever you wonder about why something is done a certain way or why something exists/was invented.

You zero the rifle, slip the turret knobs to 0 elevation/0 windage, then tighten the knobs on the shafts so that they re-engage the erector tube. THEN then apply your dope for distance wind when you shoot.

Knob lock serve a completely different function than the zero stop and the mechanism that allows you to slip the knobs when setting zero.
 
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I pm’ed him early this morning offering to talk to him on the phone if he still is having trouble understanding. Crickets. Not even an acknowledgement. My feelings are hurt and my offer is withdrawn ?

It didn’t have to be this way @Walter Haas. ?
 
Locking turrets exist for one obvious reason: to prevent inadvertent or accidental movement that would change the dope you put on the rifle without you realizing it.

Brah, I know you're new and curious. You're obviously very intelligent and observant. But remember Occam's razor whenever you wonder about why something is done a certain way or why something exists/was invented.

You zero the rifle, slip the turret knobs to 0 elevation/0 windage, then tighten the knobs on the shafts so that they re-engage the erector tube. THEN then apply your dope for distance wind when you shoot.

Knob lock serve a completely different function than the zero stop and the mechanism that allows you to slip the knobs when setting zero.
Thanks. I know--I'm "overthinking it". :)
 
I pm’ed him early this morning offering to talk to him on the phone if he still is having trouble understanding. Crickets. Not even an acknowledgement. My feelings are hurt and my offer is withdrawn ?

It didn’t have to be this way @Walter Haas. ?
I'm sorry, man, it was on my radar to thank you for the offer. My bad. No disrespect intended. Truthfully I'm still a little confused about how this forum works because I'm having trouble keeping the whole picture. But please don't think I don't appreciate your offer of personal help. I fucked that up. I apologize.
 
I'm sorry, man, it was on my radar to thank you for the offer. My bad. No disrespect intended. Truthfully I'm still a little confused about how this forum works because I'm having trouble keeping the whole picture. But please don't think I don't appreciate your offer of personal help. I fucked that up. I apologize.
I was making fun and not calling you out. No worries on my side at all so no need to worry on yours. If you really needed help down the road I would be available.
 
I was making fun and not calling you out. No worries on my side at all so no need to worry on yours. If you really needed help down the road I would be available.
Oh, thanks. I thought you were serious. I really appreciate the help I get on this forum but being from San Francisco and the Niners in the superbowl yesterday leading to partying at my brother's house yesterday and then bringing my elderly friend to the hospital today I'm not on my game and it seemed like you had a legitimate beef.
 
Guys, I'm confused by something someone next to me at the range said regarding the zero stop. He said you have to add .5 mrad for zero stop to the black dial adjustment as well as to whatever adjustment it takes to zero your groups.

I'm following these steps:
  • set outer main turret to zero
  • remove the cap and expose the black dial
  • loosen the three set screws
  • keep shooting and turning the black dial until your groups are centered on the reticle zero
  • tighten set screws
The .5mrad zero stop doesn't need to be factored in to the black dial, right? Because no matter where I turn the black dial, once the set screws are tightened the zero stop is still going to automatically be .5mrad below that.

The guy next to me said I need to add the .5 mrad to the black dial, too. Yet if I just dial in the zero and tighten the set screws the outer turret still only goes .5mrad below zero, so what he says doesn't seem true.

Can anyone clear this up, please.

Thanks in advance.
Stop listening to the guy beside you
And follow vortex's
Directions
 
Walter I have the razor scope as well and want to go over a few things really quickly so hopefully you understand exactly what it is we are doing and why.

First like others have said sight in at 100 yards by putting your knobs both at zero then turning the inside knobs to adjust your reticle to your bullet hole.
After this is done and you have tightened the set screws and put the big screw caps back on your ready to go.

Now let’s say you want to shoot 300 yards you pull up on the elevation knob to unlock it you turn it to 3.6moa or 1 mill or whatever your bullet drop is from 100 to 300 yards. You now push down on the knob to lock it in place. Now your zero is for 300 yards..

you leave it there till you need to shoot a different range say 500 yards for me that’s 10moa so I pull up on the knob and turn it to 10 and push it back down to lock it so it doesn’t get bumped.

you get the picture.
 
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The reason for the locking turrets is lets say you work downtown SF and you walk to work and just about everyday at the same spot you slip on some bums shit on the sidewalk at the exact same spot. You get to your office on say the 20th floor and you can see that spot from your office window you range it with your rangefinder and its 676 yds you set your elevation turret for 676 yds. You wait.....your ready to give that bum a reason to shit on the sidewalk. Now you want to lock in your dope so you push down on the turret so you don't inadvertently change it. (reason for the locking turrets) You finally see the bum he puts down his 40oz to drop his pants....you know it's up to you to put a end to this shit.......you take careful aim.......BAM the bums 40oz explodes in his face and he never shits there again. Now you can enjoy your walk to work all because you remembered to lock your turrets........:)
 
Palmetto, I do believe that is by far the best example i have heard in a long time. Laughed my ass off! What a great way to start the day. Thanks!!!
Chris
The reason for the locking turrets is lets say you work downtown SF and you walk to work and just about everyday at the same spot you slip on some bums shit on the sidewalk at the exact same spot. You get to your office on say the 20th floor and you can see that spot from your office window you range it with your rangefinder and its 676 yds you set your elevation turret for 676 yds. You wait.....your ready to give that bum a reason to shit on the sidewalk. Now you want to lock in your dope so you push down on the turret so you don't inadvertently change it. (reason for the locking turrets) You finally see the bum he puts down his 40oz to drop his pants....you know it's up to you to put a end to this shit.......you take careful aim.......BAM the bums 40oz explodes in his face and he never shits there again. Now you can enjoy your walk to work all because you remembered to lock your turrets........:)

This is so unrealistic.... what bum ever sets down his 40oz lol ;)