I ordered a long action two piece bolt about 2 months ago and received it in about a month. A few weeks back I ordered one of their economy reamers (no-custom 9.3x62) and received it yesterday. I went with the economy because I will probably only cut one barrel with it, looking at it the only difference I can see between the econ reamer and regular is it has a c-clip insted of a screw retaining the pilot.
-
Having trouble using the site?
Contact support
No disrespect taken , I understand our worlds are very different , we pump out thousands of barrels every week that fit into a specified tolerance and most of you guys are gun smiths ( Which I'm not , I know my roll ) and work within a much tighter tolerance . I didn't come here to defend anyone nor did I come here to sway anyone's thought process . I only have my own experience with PTG to relate to . Now do I get more attention because of the revenue I bring to the table ,yes I'm sure I do . And yes Ive had relationships with vendors in the past that have been smooth as silk then, BOOM it all goes to shit in one day and can not be salvaged . Maybe he needs to stop even trying to sale to the general public and concentrate only on big corps, or maybe set up a separate division to only handle the skilled gunsmithing world , I don't know , not my company nor my decisions . I appreciate everyone sharing their stories with me . I'm glad I stumbled upon this sight and Ill be asking questions in the future I'm sure, I dont offend very easily and I'm 100 % ok with being corrected if I'm wrong . The one question that I do have is that If Dave came from Ptg some time in the 2000s who started PTG in 1957??
Dave left JGS and went to work for PTG, then bought out the previous owner/founder. That's my simplified understanding anyway.
You know, I'd like to offer a suggestion/something to think about;
If you are receiving good service/quality parts from PTG, don't jeopardize that/your relationship by bringing any of this up with them. I don't see any upside in it for you and the conversation could just piss Kiff off.
Why risk it ? It's not like he hasn't heard it many times from many other customers before.
I may have known at some time a long time ago, but if so, I've forgotten.
One of the things that actually saddens me about PTG now is that when Kiff went to work for PTG, he was really good, really helpful. I had had a problem with a JGS reamer that I wasn't happy with how they handled the situation, but it wasn't so bad that I was pissed off. I somehow found out that Kiff went to PTG and I followed him there. He was a breath of fresh air and he was a guy that you wanted to root for him to succeed. I don't want to see him fail, but his fate is in his own hands.
Last edited:
Point taken ! I just know that if it was my company that I would want to know and I'm a firm believer that you don't bite the hand that feeds you . I would want to make it rite regardless of price or trouble because I was raised that a mans word is the only thing he has and once that's lost so is everything else . You make a very valid point though about mentioning it to him .I will heed your wisdom. Sounds like they may need a customer rep to handle issues and make things rite !
From all appearances, it is an ownership problem. It also appears that they go through CSR's as fast as any other expendable employee.
these sort of businesses need to go away. The numb nuts that runs such businesses will never change.
PTG will always be ran how it is because Dave is there, 7 days a week, micromanaging everyone. He is solely responsible for all the downfalls that it has. He'll tell people he "has to go run a grinder or CNC machine". He hasn't ran a machine since working for JGS. If anyone knew Dave 10+ years ago and has seen him in the last few years, big change in appearance huh? It didn't happen through diet and exercise. And to the people who say to get PTG's tooling through Midway, there's a saying at PTG about a questionable part. It goes like this, "it's good enough for Midway". The new "tool makers" he hired will be inexperienced because the machines he has to make them and the type of tooling they make are niche. They are felon friendly not because Dave wants to give people a second chance but because they are easily exploited. The reality is, the people who place a $200 order aren't the ones keeping the lights on. It's the big manufactures who are. PTG grew too big, too fast. They still have recovered from their expansion years ago. Unless Dave let's go of the reigns PTG will always be how it is. Some people will swear by them (obviously it's the ones who have personally dealt with Dave because he takes care of them) and most will avoid them like the plague.
If not by diet and exercise then how has he changed ? Just curious ? I've only known him for like 4yrs ,and I understand that he takes care of us because of the revenue but I'm curious of how he used to be vs how he is ? I mean at the end of the day $199 vs $900k I don't know that anyone could blame him ? We all want to take care of our families , regardless !
Sounds like a lot of people are blaming him as to why their tools aren't out in time. When you say you've known him is that through phone conversations? Have you seen him in person? He's lot a lot of weight is what I was talking about when I said it wasn't because of diet and exercise. I hope you can put 2 and 2 together on that. He's always been the same person. He hasn't changed. The only thing that has changed is people are finding out about all the BS because of sites like this. PTG has a revolving door for their employees. I think Carley has the longest seniority there in sales and that's only like 2 years. He's has only a few machinists who have been there longer than 10 years. Parts go out wrong or get delayed because they have to get restarted due to scrap is from the inexperienced tool and cutter grinder that are there. I know the ins and outs of that shop like the back of my hand. If you've had good experiences with PTG, then count yourself blessed and I would recommend keep buying from them.
I'm not putting 2 and 2 together buddy ! So you say carly has the most seniority with two years but you say he has machinist whom have been there 10 yrs ? Last time I checked salesmen or sales women weren't tool makers ?? Correct me if I'm wrong ! Now I know salesmen or sales women are contact points but at the end of the day the tool makers and the tools are the proof of the pudding ! And yes,I hsve met him in person most recently about 8 months ago ? I fail to see your reasoning . Please educate me , no disrespect intended , just trying to educate my self as well as others . Respectfully
I don't recall saying sales people and machinist are on the same category, hence why I said Carley in SALES. So maybe 5 MACHINISTS out of 80+ people running machines who have been there over 10 years. I was talking about the lack of experience in sales to show why there's usually a hiccup with orders. Nevermind my comment about the way he looks. I shouldn't have gone there and I'm not going to spill his personal demons out there
@1972gunmaker
Just stop defending PTG, you come on here acting like we all have no clue.
They are a company with shit customer service, and couldn't care less so why even buy from them? There is at least 1 rifle builder here that gave the owner the finger after delays, shit tools, etc. His business lives and dies by his reputation.
Did you only join this forum to schill for PTG?
You say you work for a major gun manufacturer, who is it? Remington, DPMS, or Steyr?
Just stop defending PTG, you come on here acting like we all have no clue.
They are a company with shit customer service, and couldn't care less so why even buy from them? There is at least 1 rifle builder here that gave the owner the finger after delays, shit tools, etc. His business lives and dies by his reputation.
Did you only join this forum to schill for PTG?
You say you work for a major gun manufacturer, who is it? Remington, DPMS, or Steyr?
Merry Christmas Mr .Glasgow , I am the one whom has said more than once that I'm the one asking the questions and that I know gunsmithing is very different from the side of gun manufacturing that I live on . I have also said that I'm not defending anyone that I was looking up something online about PTG and stumbled across this very post and started asking questions . I could really care less who you or anyone else buys tools from . I simply believe in all situations there is always at least two sides . You state they have shit service in your experience and I have stated I've always had awesome service , plain and simple . As for who I work for and whom I have worked for , Yes I have chambered and contoured barrels for Remington ( whom no longer exists),DPMS ,Marlin, AAC, Panther Arms , Dakota , and my current employer whom I will not name due to our Social Network policy . So as far as saying I act like you don't have a clue Mr. Glasgow, Id venture to say that you have as bout as much clue about my side of the fence as I do the gunsmithing side . You have had shitty service and stated it, I've had awesome service and stated it . This is the only forum I have ever been on , and the only person I'm defending is my self. As far as PTG , don't like there service don't use them.
You aren't defending anyone yet all you've done here is defend them....K. Like I said, go schill for someone else.
There are many more sides to this story. From an internal perspective, most employees want to do the right thing by the customer, the system is in the way though and a lot just give up. Some give up with a lot less effort than others though. The ones that really care eventually get the hell out of dodge. There are two types of employees at ptg, the ones who are there to just collect a paycheck with minimum effort, and those who really care about the job they are doing. That last group is getting very small, as the chaos makes it hard to function if you actually give a shit. You find ex employees all over town, and for the most part that group rises fast in position, pay and responsibility after they leave PTG so it's not really them that are holding the company back once they get into an environment that allows people to function, learn and grow with a company. The business systems of PTG themselves are lacking structure. You cant run a business of that size like you did when they were 1/4 of the employees. The worst one is if someone messes up on machining an order their best chance of saving their job and feeding their family is to disappear the job card and the product. It's a QC problem where things need to be checked after each operation so mistakes don't multiply and a big tracking problem. Nothing is tracked well. So when management can't find the product they have no choice but to restart the order from step one. At times there will be a very late order and no one can find the product and then the job miraculously shows up, finished three times or more, that's how the clearance section got so big. Doing a custom job multiple times uses up valuable material and manpower, pushing everyone's order back. NATO jobs or other huge orders also get delayed because material is low and then smaller customers get pushed back because the big orders are late so everyone is upset. The disorganization affects everyone, from the owner, to the new employees, to the smallest order. I was the website developer for a few years. Don't blame me, yes there were quantities made into the website, but someone has to actually count them accurately, then keep an accurate count for it all to work. I think now you have to call to find out if there is a product or not. I have not been involved for many years and don't even use the website as a reference anymore. It's so trashed by following employees that is more of a huge liability rather than help for other website jobs. I don't wish anyone bad luck, they were all nice for the most part and many are still friends. It's the chaos of day to day operations and the systems that are in place. Manufacturing consultants got brought in several times and they gave very good advice.... that was completely ignored. There is a common theme among management, everyone says that if they could get organized and keep happy customers, sales would increase drastically and it would be a win, win situation. I think if they can get a handle on things it would be a great comeback story, but the reputation damage will take ten years or more to repair even if 2021 gets the bugs worked out of the process. I really hope that happens, there are a lot of good people there who need a lot less daily stress, the loyal customers are great too. The ones that are left, put up with it and expect problems, but I could tell when an order went out quickly and without problems they were very surprised.
Thank you , that's a dam good insight ! Thank you for sharing ! I agree without traceability of a order or quality checks throughout any process there will be problems !!
Well here's something you wont hear every day.
I placed and order with PTG a while ago for an in stock item.
3 weeks after I placed that order, I put in an order with Optics Planet for something that was OUT OF STOCK. We all know that OP is a slow shipper with in stock items let alone when its listed as OOS. Well, I received my OP order and I'm still waiting on PTG.
I really didn't think you could get slower than OP, but it turns out that you can.
I placed and order with PTG a while ago for an in stock item.
3 weeks after I placed that order, I put in an order with Optics Planet for something that was OUT OF STOCK. We all know that OP is a slow shipper with in stock items let alone when its listed as OOS. Well, I received my OP order and I'm still waiting on PTG.
I really didn't think you could get slower than OP, but it turns out that you can.
sounds like they have lost the passion of suppling the gunsmith to the greed of the all mighty dollar of caproate America, sad story but so many companies built by the small mans business have taken this rout .
No one can beat my 14months wait on a reamer from PTG, then sent the wrong one (it was a 338 lapua Ackley imp, I got a tight neck 338 lapua.)
They wanted me to return the old one or pay shipping on the new one. I did neither, and 3 months after that, I got a 338lap imp.
They wanted me to return the old one or pay shipping on the new one. I did neither, and 3 months after that, I got a 338lap imp.
I can:
Almost the same exact shit happened to us here spanning an 18 or so-month timeline. At least 3x I sent it back. Finally, I gave up. Now they send me invoices for it every month or two. Lol.
I think the next time they do I'm gonna rub my nuts all over the paperwork and then mail it back. -Then send a follow-up letter telling them a day or two later.
Reference post:
Fuck that place. Never again.
Attachments
Last edited:
I bit the bullet and ordered a couple more reamers from PTG. Couldn't get the .243 LBC from Manson or JGS without a drawing so I just took the easy route and ordered it and a .221 Fireball from PTG. I'll know in a couple of months I guess.
They do that shit all the time and they usually charge your card at the time you order. Then 3 or 4 months go by and when you get pissed and cancel your order, you have to fight to get your money back. I have learned my lesson a long time ago, never again.. Place is a joke!
My old gunsmith (RIP Lee) was a fan of PTG, so I ordered a custom reamer and gauges from them probably 12 years ago. That all went to plan, and everything came out great.
Jump forward to early 2020, and I decided to build another rifle. I wanted to try a Model 7 and found the PTG page where they offered a blueprinted action with some nice options for a good price. I placed my order and waited. They went over the time estimate, but it eventually arrived. I noticed that they sent the wrong trigger, it was factory Xmark, not the Timney I paid for. I called and they hemmed and hawed, took a few weeks and they ultimately refunded the Timney upgrade cost, and told me to find my own trigger.
I also discovered that there was a hole in the receiver for a bolt stop/release, but no bolt stop in it (obviously factory Model 7s don't have receiver mounted bolt releases). They asked for me to send it back and they'd fix it. Took numerous calls and over a month to get it back, this was after I spoke to Dave and he said it would be fixed in a day. The gunsmith got the receiver, and found that the bolt stop/release would not allow the bolt to come back far enough to pick up a round, and they blind pinned the damn thing in so it was a major problem. I gave up there and demanded my money back. I'm still out sales tax, transfer costs, and a ton of time.
Over this whole fiasco, I was told that they would call me back easily 20 times, and never once did they call. Action only happened when I called.
Jump forward to early 2020, and I decided to build another rifle. I wanted to try a Model 7 and found the PTG page where they offered a blueprinted action with some nice options for a good price. I placed my order and waited. They went over the time estimate, but it eventually arrived. I noticed that they sent the wrong trigger, it was factory Xmark, not the Timney I paid for. I called and they hemmed and hawed, took a few weeks and they ultimately refunded the Timney upgrade cost, and told me to find my own trigger.
I also discovered that there was a hole in the receiver for a bolt stop/release, but no bolt stop in it (obviously factory Model 7s don't have receiver mounted bolt releases). They asked for me to send it back and they'd fix it. Took numerous calls and over a month to get it back, this was after I spoke to Dave and he said it would be fixed in a day. The gunsmith got the receiver, and found that the bolt stop/release would not allow the bolt to come back far enough to pick up a round, and they blind pinned the damn thing in so it was a major problem. I gave up there and demanded my money back. I'm still out sales tax, transfer costs, and a ton of time.
Over this whole fiasco, I was told that they would call me back easily 20 times, and never once did they call. Action only happened when I called.
For the life me I can’t figure why anyone would gamble on them knowing their reputation. My local smith built me a rifle about 6 years ago and he seemed to think highly of Dave. He called them for a custom reamer for my build and he had it in two weeks. I was worried about it because of all the bad reports I read about here. Maybe it was because of their connection or maybe it was luck but it wasn’t my money being gambled, either way I won’t deal with them.
If you are a regular customer, and have been for 10 years, but parts every quarter and ring up and say "yeah hi (person answering phone), how ya doin ? Yeah I'm fine. Really enjoyed (insert hunting trip or match here), but I'm looking to change it up for a client, he/she wants (insert reamer here). Do you have one one that shelf ?, Yeah sure I'll hold.......
10 mins later
Oh you do ? Awesome. Love your work. Can you get that out to me express, I can give you a CC right now. Thanks a ton.!!"
If they don't have it on the shelf, too bad. Also, get a confirmation email with bill of sale, and then REPLY to it saying "just confirming it was in stock and coming to me express, as spoken on the phone with (insert person's name) 5kins ago".
That's the only way to deal with ptg.
10 mins later
Oh you do ? Awesome. Love your work. Can you get that out to me express, I can give you a CC right now. Thanks a ton.!!"
If they don't have it on the shelf, too bad. Also, get a confirmation email with bill of sale, and then REPLY to it saying "just confirming it was in stock and coming to me express, as spoken on the phone with (insert person's name) 5kins ago".
That's the only way to deal with ptg.
I had to dispute my order with CC, 4+ weeks no comms, no reply back to my voicemails for an in stock item. They will be hit with a $12 chargeback fee (what happens when you call your bank and dispute a charge - it encourages the business to resolve without bank being involved). Never ordering from them again.
Dang, i've had nothing but your average good customer service and products have all been within spec. Well come to think of it some years back I had a breech tool that had a bad grind, Sent it back and new one came before they got mine. Ive talked to Dave at least a dozen times on production and set-up. I run his carbide roughing reamers on some of our chambers. For finish its been JGS and DM coated.
I ordered a 6.5 SLR finisher in Dec 20. Despite confirming twice via email that I required the 6.5 SLR reamer, on the 06 Mar 21 I received a 6 SLR reamer. I’ve contacted them via email and surprise surprise silence no response. I really dislike writing off anyone’s business but I also detest people getting hosed
Buyer beware
Buyer beware
I just had my experience with them. Ordered some gauges that were supposed to be in stock. Months went by, and was told "it would be sent out in a few weeks" when they finally replied to my email. I didn't think they'd ever come but they finally did. Won't do that again.
same thing happened to me about 2 years ago. I emailed requesting a quote and never ordered. Several months later PTG mailed me a reamer THAT I DID NOT ORDER. Must have used a CC from one of my previous orders to charge me. When I contacted them several times about the error by phone and email they never refunded my order. After about a month or two of trying to get a refund I just stopped wasting my time. I will never do business with them again for ANY reason. I don’t care if they are giving their product away.
I wish better luck to others in the future.
-T
I called last week, after about 4 rings a guy answers and says please hold! After 10 minutes I hung up and called back again. This time a guy named Pete answers and is less than helpful with my questions about ordering a chamber reamer. I got the feeling real quick he'd rather be doing something else than making sure I got the correct reamer for my needs. He finally transfers me to a sales person to see if it's in stock or if they need to make one. That person also sounded like they'd rather be doing something else besides helping me.
After I hung up I found an online review page of hundreds of complaints by both customers and employees about them. Then reading this thread made me decide to shop elsewhere...
After I hung up I found an online review page of hundreds of complaints by both customers and employees about them. Then reading this thread made me decide to shop elsewhere...
JGS if looking for carbide. Manson or Clymer if you need a HSS.
I am a new victim of PT&G horrible customer service. I feel sorry for the guy who answers the phone. EMAIL to them bounces. They must have disabled it. Sent from a few addresses. They have a Rem 700 (from their “blueprinted”) action I bought bolt for months. Said they never received it. Gave them the tracking number. Said they lost it. Won’t come to the phone.
Similar threads
