POF and my Incredibly Disappointing Experience......

#154
Sorry about your experience. The only POF i have is a 415 in 300BLK. It has been great, reliable and accurate with a variety of ammo which is tough to do with 300BLK. When I had questions about the adjustable gas block settings the POF rep graciously talked me through each one, and talked me through/waited while I disassembled the piston system so I could learn how to clean it properly. I havent had this rifle long so maybe they are taking your criticism to heart.
 
#155
To my fellow Snipers Hide members and to POF......

I was finally able to get out and shoot the 6.8 SPC (2) rifle returned by POF. I wanted to reach out and personally thank everyone that assisted me with this endeavor. I also wanted to thank Mr. Frank Desomma and the people at POF. In the final analysis, Mr. Desomma did step up and for that I believe I owe him a thank you.

Everyone makes mistakes but I also believe that in the majority of instances we deserve a second chance. I hated bringing this to the Hide but I knew my fellow shooters would have my back as I was on the side of truth.. For that you have my sincerest gratitude and thanks.

POF and Mr. Frank Desomma also deserve praise for stepping forward (albeit initially begrudgingly) and replacing the faulty barrel with one that doesn’t have me scratching my head. This rifle now will flat out shoot and I would publicly like to thank Mr. and Mrs. Desomma for doing the right thing.

Thank u to the Snipers Hide folks as your great people. Thank you POF for following through on your commitments.

cheers!

Doc David

PS the best group of the day was the bottom. When hunting with 6.8 SPC (2), I only use the Hornady 120 Grain SST (which is a ferocious load INSIDE of 100 yards) .....not further.....
 
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#157
Im really glad it worked out for you. I would say the term "stepping up" is misused here. That's for people who make things right the first time. Not begrudgingly after months of trying to screw you over.
 
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#159
That’s how this fiasco started because I bought the rifle NIB assuming it was as stated and turned out to be a nightmare. That’s on me because I should have test fired my 2000 plus rifle before I threw it in the safe.....

Doctors are notorious bad business people. Im a good example and this is why. I place a lot of trust and faith that the system is going to do as its suppoSee.

man I’ve been screwed before lol....

I would like to assume I’m wiser but I think I’m just an idiot waiting for the next woman to take advantage of me lol....
 
#163
I was never out of shooting it’s just that I had invested a lot in the 6.8 SPC (2) because it’s such an excellent caliber if you want to carry something in the field versus a 308......

the ballistics of 6.8 SPC(2) are about 80% of 308 out to 300; it’s a great joy carrying an 8 lbs AR Versus a 12 lbs ar..(I stick within 100)....

thank you and cheers
 
#164
Glad to hear! I recently picked up a POF Rev DI in 6.5 C and so far I've been impressed with it. Its a blast to shoot, still looking for the load it likes best, but so far I'm kinda surprised to see its performing well with Hornady American Gunner 140gr. I'm having some grouping issues at present, but I'm about certain it is the glass at this point. I rolled the dice on a Riton RT-S Mod 7 4-32, jury is still out at this point, but I'm afraid it is going to turn into buyers remorse....
 
#165
I wish you the best. Do a tall tArget tracking test while using a spuhr Mount and bubble level. I’f your SERIOUS about precision shooting, get your money back on that Riton and save ur money for a Nightforce NXS or if that’s out of reach at least bare minimum a vortex PST 2; POF at one one time was really great. I hope you get your optics worked out. My feeling is that you should spend double (up to a point) on your optic in relation to ur rifle. After this experience I won’t ever buy another POF but the old ones i have (I have two heavier 308’s back when they used fluted rock creek barrels and Geissele triggers) Which to this day those shoot as good as my knights or LMT rifles. Now that’s not stating that back in the day they were LMT Or knights battle quality but they put a lot of effort and quality into their rifles.
However I’m of the opinion that they while being extremely innovative went cheap on product which is why they have become mostly a rifle that spurts a premium price but often doesn’t deliver the goods (just my experiences in talking with many POF CUSTOMERS )....
I’ve heard since they went to a lighter format some people have had reliability and accuracy issues but I not going to knock them. They put me through heck but they also fixed the problem. Green mountain barrels are not rock creek barrels but my rifle IS A GOOD example OF YOU CANNOT JUDGE A BARREL SIMPLY ON A NAME. When I started shooting if the barrel wasn’t a blank manufactured by BartLien, Krieger, Shillen, Criterion etc I would scoff. I now know it’s more about the shooter Unless ur way past my level......and I shoot 3-4 times a week....
best of luck and leT me know if you have any questions.....
 
#167
Well, they actually sold you a 6.5 creed moor upper instead of the 308. They are one of POF's largest distributors. They should exchange it no questions asked. That's a mistake which while inexcusable is not surprising considering the insanity of what is ongoing on the gun business right now. If God forbid they don't take care of you 110%, I have two like new POF E2 308's with fluted barrels from 2016 that I've shot less than 4 times total (both of them). One is Bronze and the other is titanium. One has a Geissele SSA-E trigger the other has the upgraded single state POF. I'm moving away from gas guns FYI should you perhaps be interested. They really should take care of you though.
 
#170
I'd be very careful with Central Florida Gun, purchased a POF through them and cancelled the same day (long story). Going through my card statements I noticed they decided to "hold on" to $120 of my hard-earned money for a product that never shipped. An email response basically said they'd filled out a bunch of paperwork and had it ready to go. Both I know were not true as I contacted my local FFL and they had not received anything and they told me flat out it would not come in from the warehouse until Monday (ordered on the prior Thursday). Smarmy business practice to say the least. Had I not read my statement, I never would have come across the charge. Needless to say, they lost any future business they may have had from me.
 
#171

I hate this kind of business. I see it all the time, both local and online. Non-refundable this or that, non-negotiable re-stocking fees, convenience fees, and other nonsense on purchases that clearly don't require any restocking if cancelled prior to order prep/shipping. I attribute a lot of it to the drop-ship model a lot of these places, but there's a lot of business owners that just won't budge with the times. The firearms industry is decades behind everyone else, which is baffling.

Even if they filled out paperwork, there's not $120 in time, even with a large profit margin budgeted in. Nobody should be offended in paying for the transaction fee on the CC (some are not refunded, depending on the merchant agreement/processing company), or even a little to cover time, but $120 is silly. The highest processing fee on a credit card I've ever seen is 3.5%, 1.7% the lowest, and even at 3.5% you'd have to have purchased a $3428 rifle to have it come out to $120 - and that's assuming the processing company isn't refunding any of it to the business owner.

One could make an argument that you shouldn't need refunds, don't make mistaken orders, etc. Nothing is perfect, but the penalty shouldn't be inordinate with the error. Reasonable fees to cover the cost and time make sense, but that's just outright scummy business.
 
#174
I wanted to chime in and report my extremely positive experience with CFL and also with POF.

I have purchased a POF P308 , 6.5 Edge and P415 in 6.8 all from CFL and needed quite a bit of support from both CFL and POF which has always been superb.

On the 308 I wanted another barrel in 20" and CFL ordered one and gave me quite a bit of tech support. Then when my Thunderbeast did not operate well with the rifle in suppressed mode, POF had me ship it to them and they created another setting just for the Thunderbeast, their communication was top notch, they had excellent follow-up, did not charge me return shipping and made it work perfect - all for free.

The p308 is getting 2578 fps with the 20 in barrel and Hornady factory 178 ELD-X, which surprised me as Hornady lists the velocity as 2600 with a barrel 4 inches longer (24). From earlier parts of this thread I assume the 20 in non fluted barrel is Green Mountain, and the fluted 16.5 that came with the gun is Rock Creek, both shoot extremely well.

On the 6.5 I got a smoking deal from CFL and they also set me up with a 20" barrel for a good price.

Both of these guns are 1MOA guns and I have had Zero problems.

Finally on my 6.8 SPC it was not grouping well and POF is replacing the barrel with no drama. (They have had to special order it)

I also have a 5.56 from LWRC I got for my son and it is also a fine gun - the POF is at least it's equal and perhaps even a slight bit more accurate.

I would like to have an H&K some day, but they are awful heavy and I cannot justify the extra $1000 so I can run it over in my Humvee :)

My favorite of all three will be the 6.8 when it shoots, which I am confident it will.
 
#176
No - I am going to keep it - I was happy with it until my son wanted to take the 308 on our annual Elk hunt and I really wanted the extra velocity as I consider the 308 marginal at the long shots we have to take in the mountains.

Someday it will go back to the 16.5 for deer and hogs as it is much lighter with both the shorter length and fluting, besides I also had to buy a different piston as they are not interchangeable like they are on the 6.5
 
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#177

Sounds like you have a few great POF's! Interesting info on the barrels. I know the Revolution DI is a fluted 5R 416R stainless nitrided barrel which is what Rock Creek lists on their site. I'm currently looking for a stripped Gen4 223 lower so both my AR's have similar controls and layout. I really like the Gen4 lower's ergonomics, function and looks. But in this climate, I haven't been able to find a single one other than Gunbroker at three times MSRP.

The credit card company ruled in my favor and I did get the money back from CFL. I'm sure it would have been a good experience had I gone through with the purchase as it looked like they would have shipped it within two business days. But just the fact they didn't even mention the administrative charge to me, literally stumbling across it on my credit card statement, speaks volumes about their true mentality.
 
#178
Glad things worked out in the end - too bad you had to endure all the aggravation.

Although it must have been satisfying that the CC company backed you - I also sometimes dig in on principle.

It surprises me that CFL behaved in that manor - I always deal with Jason and find him to be extremely helpful and reliable. He even let me exchange an upper when I changed my mind.
 
#179
I'd have to go back and see who I was dealing with but Jason's name sounds familiar. Yeah I was a bit incredulous. If they'd just apologized, taken the charges off or even been up front about it, no harm no foul. But they didn't have the authority to charge my card like that, hence the charge being reversed. In all my years using credit, I've never had to dispute a single charge until this year and it's all been with firearms-related businesses. Go figure.
 
#180
I just picked up a NEW / PRE-OWNED Renegade+ 556 pistol and after reading this, though a "happy ending," I still find myself second guessing my choice.

I've called for customer service, a few times, asking general new owner questions, that google couldn't answer, and the times that no one answered, I left a message, which all went unanswered; as for the few times when someone did answer, they were quite short and abrupt with me. Now granted, my purchased of the Renegade+, was just after Frank's death, plus with the bullshit going on with Covid, I figured that a lot of chaos and restructuring, was going on, but after reading this and knowing that poor customer service is an on going issue, and especially knowing that it was happening prior to Frank's death, is very disconcerting.

Another thing that I'm a bit upset about, is that they are not currently offering the 14.5" for the Renegade+. They had it listed, right before I purchased my rig, but since the revamp of the website, it's no longer an option. I called about it, and they said they they are not putting in orders for the 14.5" right now and they don't know when they will. I have no issue with that, it just sucks, because they were offering it, while I was still actively looking for a rig... Because of that, I'm now looking into a PROOF or BSF CF barrel or the Dracos barrel. I was told by Central Florida Gun, that if I do pick up a new barrel, and if I send it to POF, that they will mod it to work with the E² system. But again, after reading this, will they?

Now I'm debating on if I should sell the POF and pick up a Hodges Defense, Cobalt Kinetics, Nemor or Falcor.

So far I haven't had the chance to take the Renegade to the range, because all I have left are M855 and of course you can't shoot that in an indoor range.

Current Mods (already installed by previous owner):
  • JP Enterprises JPSCS2-15H2
  • Magpul AFG

My mods:
  • Diamondhead D-45 off set BUIS
  • Future planed trigger mod - JP Enterprises Rolling Pin Trigger - JPFC-MR
  • CQB build
  • NV
  • Suppressed
 
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#181
I know they're busy and trying to keep up. I sent an email with a question and had a response within a few hours. I'm sure with all the new gun owners, they're flooded with calls on basic stuff and I'm sure that can wear them thin. They may not have a dedicated full-time technically trained phone staff where that's all they do. You may be speaking with those who are actively designing and/or building the rifles and are trying to keep their heads above water for the time being. I'm assuming you're asking questions on modifying their weapons and need input on what you technically can and can't do?

If you're able to pick up a box or two of ammo that you can shoot indoors, I'd try it out first and go from there. If you love it, stick with it and I'm sure POF will be able to help if you switch barrels down the road. From my conversation, it sounded like they'd be catching up around the end of November to mid December.
 
#182
Voyager1, I have put in SSA-Es in four ARs. I recently purchased a POF Revolution 308 AR pistol that has a drop in trigger. Will an SSA-E work in its place? I have never installed or removed or used a drop in trigger so am not familiar with compatibility. Thanks
 
#184
I replaced the POF drop in trigger with a Geissele SSA-E in my 415 POF without a problem a few years ago. I just replied my POF 308 with a Trigger Tech 2-5 pound adjustable trigger which is a drop in trigger. Simple to install. I like it even more the the SSA-E which I have in 10 other AR's. The Geissele hammer trigger can be difficult to install. So it ws a pleasure to install the TT which took < 30 minutes to install, Brownells has them on sale for $169.99. Linkbelow


You Tube Review below
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It's just an older review only the color has changed from black to green and curved. Otherthan that it's identical.
 
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