I'm with you on this have not bought anything since Wa. passed 594, don't really need anything except ammo and have a pretty good stash for everything I have.
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Political environment keeping you from buying AR15?
- Thread starter Redvanes
- Start date
- Nov 3, 2010
- 9,701
- 20,393
The list is long and would take too long to list. I have invested my time, money, travel into the cause of 2A. I have also gone to great lengths to NOT support companies that crap on us, as well as gone to great lengths to support companies that support 2A, fully. Not just enough to take our money. Have I done enough? NO. Am I disillusioned by our side’s state of affairs? YES.
If you see my post regarding the OP as anything other than a call to action and a shaming of everyone supposedly fighting for 2A, including myself, you are missing the point.
We are squandering our birthright. Something my Father and his brothers shed blood for. They gave up their youth to fight for us. My Uncle gave his life. He is among countless in history who paid the ultimate price for what we are letting slip threw our fingers.
We have the models for this fight. We have seen Gays (the Spartans of political and cultural warfare) fight and win. There are many groups that fight and win. Look at the marijuana battle for christ sake. Even folks here in Wyoming are warming up to legalized marijuana. Agree with these groups or not, there is no doubt THEY WIN.
Conversely our cause is riddled with profiteers and con people. In most cases we give these folks a pass. Look at the NRA, who I supported until recently. How is Wayne still there for Christ sake?
We are at war. A political war of attrition. People who can’t even show up for a rally or write a congressman are sitting around talking about shooting it out. Folks that can’t hunt but half a day but they have to get home to their wife's teet. People have 9-5 and new truck and kids. We are not Antifa living in mom’s basement. We have actual stuff to lose.
In my opinion the great untold story of 2016 and Trump’s win was the “gun vote”. But fast forward and Bumpstocks was so typical. After Trump promising the “long assault on your 2A rights is over!!”. Most of the gun owning Trump-Jesus folks gave him a pass. Now the ATF is using that very precedent on pistol braces. They seem to feel they have carte blanch to create laws on the fly now. And still, the Trump-Jesus folks give him a pass.
Then their was his support for red flag laws. What a freakin mess. While Trump had the Senate & the House how many items on our wish list got push through??? What a freakin joke.
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Trump NEVER had the senate and house.
The House was run by Paul Ryan the piece of shit RINO who blocked just about every Trump Initiative and it was for 2 years 2016-2018. He was such a piece of shit he was run out of town, but that was his job, to Stiffle Trump, and now hes on the Board of Directors over at FoxNews continuing his never Trumper anti american ways with the rest of the cucks.
Some of you need to go back to 4th grade and learn civics. The President Can't sign Bills into law that don't come across his desk
The House was run by Paul Ryan the piece of shit RINO who blocked just about every Trump Initiative and it was for 2 years 2016-2018. He was such a piece of shit he was run out of town, but that was his job, to Stiffle Trump, and now hes on the Board of Directors over at FoxNews continuing his never Trumper anti american ways with the rest of the cucks.
Some of you need to go back to 4th grade and learn civics. The President Can't sign Bills into law that don't come across his desk
The best reason to buy one is because they don’t want you to
The fight should have started after what just happened in stealing the election, I'm afraid it's going to be too late later. What's the avg joe with property, a job, and kids going to do when they impose mandatory minimums for ownership of semiautos and let some rapists out of jail to make room for him?
lol...noCurious if any of you going through this predicament?
I think it’s an honest question considering the lefts views on “weapons of war”
I’m thinking of another AR build but I wonder if bolt action might be the smart move right now.
can't ban them ever again per SC
Out of my call to action THAT is what you got? You might what to hit 3rd grade and brush up on reading comprehension.
If my last paragraph is your sticking point, you have more than made my point. YOU, and gun owners like you, are the problem. Playing victim doesn’t make you smart, just boring.......
This hits the nail on the commie head. When life in the USA turns into a 2-way range, the only ROE is to survive.
We seem to have taken a left turn here (or maybe a right turn) but I think it's a turn worth taking. One of the things I worry about is that there is such a disconnect between the left and the right on this issue and, from my perspective, the left just doesn't get it. I spent nearly all of my adult life on the east coast, first in NY and then for 35 years in Boston. Most of my family and probably 95% of the people I know fall into one of two categories - they are either anti-gun or rabidly anti-gun. And most of the people they know - their friends, their family, their co-workers feel exactly the same way they do. Trying to have an intelligent conversation with them was like trying to talk to a parrot - they just kept repeating the phrases "no civilian needs a weapon of war" and "but ... the children".
Most of these people know nothing about guns and are terrified of them. They think AR15's are machine guns, the .223/5.56 round has magical properties and will kill you instantly and has super-special ballistics that make it far more deadly than a .308, 30.06, 300 Winmag, etc. That a gun that's black, has a pistol grip and a flash hider is obviously far more dangerous than a gun with a wooden stock and a muzzle brake. In the past this stupidity was somewhat helpful in that it resulted in a federal AWB that was relatively easy to work around. Unfortunately, although it has taken 20+ years, they are a little smarter now and the next AWB will probably effectively kill off the future sales of new AR's.
However, even more dangerous than their ignorance about the guns themselves is their ignorance about the people that own them. On the one hand, the media has convinced them that anyone who owns an "assault weapon" is poor, uneducated, ignorant and probably a neo-Nazi, white supremacist, paranoid social outcast. On the other hand they fail to understand that there are many people who believe that the second amendment isn't just some historical oddity - it is what differentiates us from many other so-called democracies and is in fact what safeguards our other rights under the Constitution. Even more importantly because they don't know, much less speak with and listen to, people who own guns, they don't understand that a not insignificant portion of those people are not going to willingly surrender their guns - regardless of what laws Congress passes. Some of those people are going to actively resist these laws and any effort to enforce them will result in far more bloodshed than any of the mass shootings so rapturously covered by the media.
The fear is that, in passing a law that makes them feel good about themselves (the confiscation of millions of AR15's, AK's, etc.) the liberals will create far more violence than they will prevent - all because of their cluelessness and disdain for gun owners. Although I don't know the exact figures, millions of law abiding Americans legally own what liberals characterize as "assault weapons". Regardless of what laws are passed, a significant percentage of these gun owning individuals won't surrender these guns and a smaller, but still significant portion will violently resist any efforts to seize their guns. Anyone who doubts that otherwise law-abiding citizens will ignore laws they think are stupid and unconstitutional should speak to someone who lives in a state that imposes restrictions on magazine capacity. Personally, I lived in MA for 35 years and currently live in CO, both of which impose restrictions on rifle and pistol magazines. I will tell you as someone who shoots fairly regularly, I have seen fellow shooters with high cap magazines more than once ... a lot more than once - i.e. like almost every time I go to the range.
Most of these people know nothing about guns and are terrified of them. They think AR15's are machine guns, the .223/5.56 round has magical properties and will kill you instantly and has super-special ballistics that make it far more deadly than a .308, 30.06, 300 Winmag, etc. That a gun that's black, has a pistol grip and a flash hider is obviously far more dangerous than a gun with a wooden stock and a muzzle brake. In the past this stupidity was somewhat helpful in that it resulted in a federal AWB that was relatively easy to work around. Unfortunately, although it has taken 20+ years, they are a little smarter now and the next AWB will probably effectively kill off the future sales of new AR's.
However, even more dangerous than their ignorance about the guns themselves is their ignorance about the people that own them. On the one hand, the media has convinced them that anyone who owns an "assault weapon" is poor, uneducated, ignorant and probably a neo-Nazi, white supremacist, paranoid social outcast. On the other hand they fail to understand that there are many people who believe that the second amendment isn't just some historical oddity - it is what differentiates us from many other so-called democracies and is in fact what safeguards our other rights under the Constitution. Even more importantly because they don't know, much less speak with and listen to, people who own guns, they don't understand that a not insignificant portion of those people are not going to willingly surrender their guns - regardless of what laws Congress passes. Some of those people are going to actively resist these laws and any effort to enforce them will result in far more bloodshed than any of the mass shootings so rapturously covered by the media.
The fear is that, in passing a law that makes them feel good about themselves (the confiscation of millions of AR15's, AK's, etc.) the liberals will create far more violence than they will prevent - all because of their cluelessness and disdain for gun owners. Although I don't know the exact figures, millions of law abiding Americans legally own what liberals characterize as "assault weapons". Regardless of what laws are passed, a significant percentage of these gun owning individuals won't surrender these guns and a smaller, but still significant portion will violently resist any efforts to seize their guns. Anyone who doubts that otherwise law-abiding citizens will ignore laws they think are stupid and unconstitutional should speak to someone who lives in a state that imposes restrictions on magazine capacity. Personally, I lived in MA for 35 years and currently live in CO, both of which impose restrictions on rifle and pistol magazines. I will tell you as someone who shoots fairly regularly, I have seen fellow shooters with high cap magazines more than once ... a lot more than once - i.e. like almost every time I go to the range.
The fight should have happened at the first use of unconstitutional red flag law.
thats quite an apologist view. Trump did more damage to the 2A than Obama - not disputable.
Just out of curiosity...
How many AR15s does a person need to have before it’s seen as a “problem”?
Asking for a friend.
How many AR15s does a person need to have before it’s seen as a “problem”?
Asking for a friend.
LOL...... Sorry you don't like facts.
Always 1 more... just like free beer tomorrow
Trump actually has the right to be president.. he was born here.
well this should be fun. Tell me how im wrong with your "facts"....
Ill get you started on my side of the debate: Bump stocks, Regina Lombardo, “Take the guns first. Go through due process second, I like taking the guns early”.
Ill wait for your rebuttle
That's not the discussion. Furthermore, it's that antiquated illogical rationale that put us in this partisan hell.
No! But that is not the point really is it. Republicans basically assume they will get our vote no matter what, because of that logic.
There are two problems with that logic
1) Turnout is key in elections. The gun vote may not vote against you, but will they show up to vote at all? In 2016 they did. I am not so sure this time around.
2) Gun owners tend to go to sleep when a Republican is POTUS. Just look what Trump got away with during his first term with Bump Stocks and supporting red flag.
Trump was NEVER a 2A supporter or a Republican until recently. His history was Democrat through and through. I personally wonder how dangerous he would have been, with sleeping gun voters and him not needing us for another term. If he’s Trump-Jesus no matter what he does, why does he give a shit.
Remember it was Reagan who all but banned machine guns. Before that he banned open carry in California for fuck sake. He was on record supporting a ban on so called assault rifles as was his VP and future potus Bush Senior.
I was a never -Trumper, who turned to favor him based on a lot of his policies. Especially with China and illegal immigration. But I was not afraid to hold his feet to the fire over Bumpstocks (never so much as seen one in person) and his stance on red flag laws. We gun owning voters can have two thoughts in our head at one time. Take my word on that.
Oh my bump stocks... ya know banning something that if were being honest here, does the same function that ATF had already banned many similar items... In such a grey area.............and after the largest mass shooting in American History where everyone including the right was calling for "common sense gun control".....the only thing we lost was bump stocks. It was a token compromise on something that the ATF would have ended up doing on their own. I could care less what trump says about red flag laws, did he sign any bills? He says what he needs to say. Its called politics.
Tactical loss, Strategic victory. Look at the big picture. There was no ammo ban, mag ban or Assualt Weapon ban as we had in the past.
That's what is really funny here, you people take this absolutist position without considering all the factors. No one person really has that much control and power.
If you want to be mad at someone or some group be mad at the Cuck Republicans who prevented most of Trumps initiatives in the first 2 years. It is them who did no overturn Obama Care, Fund the Wall, Push for Chinese restrictions and fair trade and about 100 other issues that are way more important than banning something that is a defacto machine gun, that is already illegal. Blame the NRA for being in the pocket of the left and taking hundreds of millions if no Billions and pissing it away. Blame Paul Ryan for being a RINO cuck and working for the left and globalists instead of supporting American Interests. I can go on and on.
The truth is our country is dying and there are hundreds of more important things to address than protecting bump stocks. Some of you jokers are complaining about bump stocks and p80 when we literately have an invasion on our front step and our entire way of life is at stake.
The Ship is sinking and these morons are complaing that the galley is only serving 2 types of protein for Lunch.
Wow you drank the koolaid down to the last drop didn't you? Perhaps you haven't seen what the ATF has been doing the past several weeks in regards to braces and P80? Who do you think has empowered those actions? (and please, save the "its only..." argument. You'll "its only" yourself into Australia)
What "strategic victory" did we have? No national carry, no HPA. An emboldened ATF? not a win.
And if you "could care less" what a politician says, why does biden scare you? He's a poster child for status quo....
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Some smart soul pointed out today is the day of the Boston tea party in 1773.
If our founding fathers had internet do you think the birthing pains of America would have took as long?
If the British outlawed flintlock pistols because you don’t need a pistol to hunt, and “no citizen needs to be able to fit a flintlock under their girdle” and “it’s to easy to sneak past the troops” and “think about the children” And only one steak knife for family and no more than 1lb lead per household do you think they woulda let it get that far?
The constitution and God are the only laws I follow.
I’m not saying I’m gonna get into a shootout over a piece of plastic.. but I’m saying I reserve that right.. and I’m saying I have the final say over what is and ain’t my right. The FF warned us of this day. They did everything they could. It’s our turn now. Meanwhile most people haven’t even noticed their sitting in boiling water.
If our founding fathers had internet do you think the birthing pains of America would have took as long?
If the British outlawed flintlock pistols because you don’t need a pistol to hunt, and “no citizen needs to be able to fit a flintlock under their girdle” and “it’s to easy to sneak past the troops” and “think about the children” And only one steak knife for family and no more than 1lb lead per household do you think they woulda let it get that far?
The constitution and God are the only laws I follow.
I’m not saying I’m gonna get into a shootout over a piece of plastic.. but I’m saying I reserve that right.. and I’m saying I have the final say over what is and ain’t my right. The FF warned us of this day. They did everything they could. It’s our turn now. Meanwhile most people haven’t even noticed their sitting in boiling water.
Nothing I’ve seen in the last 20-30 years would led me to believe that even 10% of the pension monkeys would do anything other than act as goon squad.
except how heroically they fought antifa this summer and how’s they’ve mopped up illegal cartel members and held them for deportation-WAIT neither of those things happened ever, not once.
He is a big part of “our side”. One dimensional, anti-intellectually honest thinking is a disease rotting us from the inside out. People like him pretend the US is just having a natural well intended discussion about gun policy. No one really wants all our guns. That’s just a conspiracy theory.
When you can’t even get a large part of the gun community to recognize that we are in an existential battle for the 2nd Amendment, we have a real problem. They can’t fathom that this is a political & cultural war. A war of attrition being fought by absolutists engaging in incrementalism.
They actually believe that because Obama never did much on guns he never wanted to. Not that he was clever and simply chose his battles. These same people think Trump-Jesus really cared about our gun rights when in reality we all know he would throw us under the bus in a heartbeat if it served him.
Furthermore, they pretend that the ATF did not say for YEARS that Bumpstocks were legal. That the Bumpstocks u-turn was as much about property rights as it ever was about 2A. Folks bought these after the atf ruled them legal. Then the ATF just changed their mind. They are about to do the same with Braces. What other property will we see arbitrarily stolen from us in the future and look back to Bumpstocks as the precedent that gave the executive branch this power.
My best friend (read brother) is a cop. I so hate to agree with you, but you are right. Fortunately my best friend respects that I am a civil libertarian and I respect that he is a cop . We have great discussions. What went on this year was a sad state of affairs.
Curious if any of you going through this predicament?
I think it’s an honest question considering the lefts views on “weapons of war”
I’m thinking of another AR build but I wonder if bolt action might be the smart move right now.
If anything you should by not just one but 3 new ARs or AKs and several thousand rounds .
I don't even really like AR's but because they want to take it makes me want to buy another.
Your post is so full of non truths it’s embarrassing to even read it . Let’s start with your lie that Trump had the house and Senate . No, he did not , not even close . You have literally no idea whatsoever what you are talking about . None as in zero . Not about the bump stock stuff either . My god go back in your moms basement
You can't win playinig Biden's game or any other democrat's for that matter; he'll come for your guns, your money, then your ass. Your AR15 gives you an edge on the last one! Don't ever give it up. Imagine how pumped up the gun-grabber movement will get if citizens in any numbers give up their weapons without a fight!
There are trillons of ammo rounds all over the country, some buried, some stashed, some loaded. So are the weapons. Millions of them. Most of those belong to ex LEO's, MP's, rangers, socom, seal, etc, who are most likely 2A supporters, as they all took an oath, and take that oath seriously.Curious if any of you going through this predicament?
I think it’s an honest question considering the lefts views on “weapons of war”
I’m thinking of another AR build but I wonder if bolt action might be the smart move right now.
Once the shoe drops, the current police and guard will have their hands full in the large cities keeping the animals at bay.
That leaves about 74 million pissed off ex marines et al in the suburbs to contend with. Many with armor and zeroed ELR magazine fed sniper rifles. Many of those would be 7mm, 338LM, 50BMG, etc.
Those folks also most likely have comms, and know tactics.
The left can think what they want. God has other plans.
its getting difficult to get parts now. Everything is sold out. If you want a longer barrel, they are out there, but the cab stuff is scarce. I'd say Do it now you may need it.Curious if any of you going through this predicament?
I think it’s an honest question considering the lefts views on “weapons of war”
I’m thinking of another AR build but I wonder if bolt action might be the smart move right now.
241-194 seat majority in the house, 52-46-2 seat majority in the senate.
Now, go ahead with your "RHINO" rant so we can all see you make a fool of yourself, and get on with the discussion.
I have 1 AR10 in a 6.5 cm and 6 AR15 rifles. I made a mistake. I have 6 to many. You can only shoot 1 at a time. Save your money and buy more ammo and spend your time on learning to shoot real long distance. Demo‘s will take them from me or tax me so Much I can not keep them. MD
I’ll bet you a ar I can shoot at least 2 at a time. And haven’t you ever watched treasure island? You shoot one then hand it to the women and kids to reload while shooting the next. At least till there like 3 and can shoot their own.
