PTR91

[B3owulf]

This is a quick write up of my new PTR 91. This is just going to be general observations/pictures. I will not comment on accuracy or reliability, I have only owned it for 3 days and fired 60 rounds of cheap ammo. Manual says 200-300 rounds for break in so I will wait until that is up to comment.

Short version: good rifle, fun to shoot. Not ideal as a sniper platform but a great battle rifle.

Likes:
Ergonomics were great for me, first time picking up it pointed right where I wanted and felt just as "right" as an AR. That said, I am 6'05" so perfect ergonomics for me is probably too big for most people. I have a picture below next to my PRI MK12 so you can see a general size comparison.

Action feels super solid. Feels like an M240, just a big chunk of metal moving back and forth smoothly. Very satisfying.

Iron Sights are great. I was just as accurate as with my AR. Matching a much more familiar gun first time on the system is saying a lot. The rotating drum was easy, intuitive, and the gradients matched the bullet drop well.

Size/weight: everyone complains about size and weight of these things, really didn't think it was that bad. It was heavy but the balance was great. I would have no issue taking this on a long ruck march. I think the steel construction is worth the extra weight, particularly in a gun launching a 7.62.

Dislikes:
Not optics friendly (see pictures). Giant German(ish) rifle needs a giant German scope right? wrong. I mounted my Steiner 4-16 on it and jumped on the struggle bus. The charging handle almost comes in contact with the objective lens which really makes working the action tough. Also the welded on iron sights mean you need very high scope rings making consistent head position difficult. An ACOG would probably be about perfect though.

The high scope positioning would also probably be a concealment issue for an actual sniper. Not really a problem because if you are an actual sniper you will use the gun your unit gave you

Controls/manual of arms: no bolt hold open. Knew this going in but it bothers me more than I thought it would. Slows reload a bit (trainable) but also means the last round does not have a distinctly different cycle sound cuing you to reload. That said the "HK Slap" was incredibly satisfying.

Action: unlocking the bold requires a very hard pull of the charging handle. All the EIB graders out there will be happy to know a palm up charging technique helped a lot.

Forend: Ergos are fine but it heated up very quick and the material felt cheap. Feels like the same material those green plastic tough boxes are made of. Plenty of aftermarket options though.

Ejection: cases depart the chamber and embark on a wild, wacky adventure before landing 20ish feet away. The cases you can find look like they have lived a long exciting life. I cant tell you if they are reloadable as I have never reloaded a round in my life. However, as a member of the "going to start reloading some day" club it is a bit bothersome. If you are a real sniper you might also be annoyed by shiny bits of metal launching away from your hide.

Overall:
Great gun I do not regret buying. This could be a great platform for a DMR. I am looking forward to doing some work on it and getting some range time with foreign (for me) weapon system.

 

[silentwoods]

Lol "wacky and wild trip ..20' away"

Yes, I love my b code 91. It has every single bell and whistle HK offered, even the heavy bipod, rather than the regular front mounted light version.

I just love a roller lock HK.

 

[silentwoods]

That's a very nice looking rifle btw.

I'd love an ACOG on mine, but the wonky mounts will always jack up the stock check weld.

Mine does have the hensoldt scope, claw mount and hard case. It actually works very well.

Not exactly a Nightforce , but works nonetheless.

 

[B3owulf]

That's a very nice looking rifle btw.

I'd love an ACOG on mine, but the wonky mounts will always jack up the stock check weld.

Mine does have the hensoldt scope, claw mount and hard case. It actually works very well.

Not exactly a Nightforce , but works nonetheless.

Yeah I am trying to figure out how to approach the optics. I kinda just want to accept I wont get good cheek weld and just go to a collapsing stock and somethingth with a forgiving eyebox.

 

[thehun]

Love roller locks but just couldn’t do it with the HK91 style...much prefer the FAL platform over it.

Source an MSG stock with built in cheek riser...

Glad you like it...

 

[308ftWIN]

I've tried time and again to set mine up in a way that suits me and never could. Everything it does beyond an HK slap, my M&P10 does better. If anyone in KS is interested I'm ready to move on from it.

 

[B3owulf]

I've tried time and again to set mine up in a way that suits me and never could. Everything it does beyond an HK slap, my M&P10 does better. If anyone in KS is interested I'm ready to move on from it.

dang...about a week ago I would have been very interested. But hey, stimulus check is here, it is a sellers market!

An M&P 10 looks like good gun, just with everyone and their cousin buying ARs right now I wanted something a bit off the beaten path.

 

[Mudburner]

Nice looking rifle, indeed.

The PTR guns enjoy a much better reputation than the Century made CETME's or C-308s.

In my opinion, with proper build and tuning, they make a very satisfying mbr. Please allow me to offer some observations and other comments?

The 200-300 round break in comes from the need for the bolt carrier & inside of the receiver to "wear in" slightly, (ie to reduce/remove friction) which seems to be a common problem with these receivers made from bent flats. People often sit and work the action a thousand times and the more you do it, the smoother it gets.

In my opinion, the welded picatinny rail is the best option for optics. The typical HK claw mount can cause problems: with these stampings, the bumps are often not very pronounced and sort of shallow. So, when a guy mounts the claw, he maybe has to tighten it up pretty tight or it will shift with recoil, or if it's very tight, he can actually pinch the receiver enough to hinder the movement of the bolt carrier and jam the rifle. Adding a cheek piece will move your head up high enough, easy fix.

The rifle should not be hard to unlock, or cock. Period. It's a bit heavy, but shouldn't ever be "hard". That indicates a possible problem with bolt gap and cocking tube gap, which is a VERY common issue with this (style of) rifle. Century built many, many of these guns with this issue but PTR has a good reputation. Basically, moving the cocking lever out should unlock the bolt head, and so you only have to overcome the recoil spring to cock it. If it is difficult, it isnt unlocking properly. Some guys have to mortar it or hammer the cocking lever to cock it. Symptom of improper build/bad bolt gap.

Its easy to check the bolt gap and cocking tube gap. (see videos) and with proper gap, the rifle will be easy to cock. These have a very heavy locking spring in the bolt carrier and that may be replaced (APEX parts sells one that is lighter than the original) for instant easier cocking, if all else measures good. Friction between the bolt carrier & receiver will also make for hard charging, so lube it well. You can see where it rubs cuz the finish will wear off the bolt carrier or there will be rub marks inside the receiver. You can isolate exactly where the binding/problem is very easily. With every gun I've had, I had to slightly "tweak" the receiver in order to get the bolt carrier to slide freely and it doesn't take much to bind. Another issue with hard charging may be the trigger pack causing hindrance. Often, these trigger packs (the parts inside the trigger housing) are surplus and not lubed at all and so hard to move. Enough to hinder the bolt carrier. The ejector lever sometimes binds the bolt carrier. With the trigger pack removed, the bolt carrier should slide freely & lock inside the trunnion easily. The bolt carrier should slide freely with the trigger pack INSTALLED as well, obviously. The trigger pack parts are all in a little cage inside the trigger pack (the "lower") which pops right out when you remove the safety/selector lever. These parts should be inspected, cleaned & lubed so they move freely & operate smoothely. The pins fall out easy, so be careful. Its easy to stone/jeweler's file the contact surfaces on the hammer/trigger/disconnector to remove gritty creep & promote a nicer trigger feel. But the trigger is adequate.

The plastic furniture is known to heat up fast. Wood (CETME C) parts are better here IMO. Some guys dremel out the little oval holes for better cooling.

These rifles eject very forcefully and slow motion footage shows that they hit the receiver 2x before ending up in the next zip code. The ejector flips em into the rear edge of the port, where they get the dent/crease midway down the case, but they continue to spin and hit the receiver AGAIN and this caves in the case mouth. The stripes are mostly carbon and wash off but soft brass can actually deform into the chamber flutes, get stuck, and rip in half. This is why you should not fire commercial .308 (thinner that 7.62 NATO) brass ammo in these guns. Sooner or later you will get a case-head separation. A broken shell extractor will easily remove it. But be aware that these were designed for heavier/thicker NATO brass ammo, and steel case should be fine. I have reloaded CETME C cases 5-6 times (using ex-mil brass) until the necks crack, so reloading is no big deal. Just set up a brass stop (cardboard box on its side) or use a brass catcher. Ihave great success and surprising accuracy using Lake City brass, 38.5 grains of Benchmark, cheap CCI primers, & Sierra 175 gr BTHP Match bullets. For bulk ammo, 145-147 gr fmj will do. YMMV.

OK, let's review:
-check bolt gap
-check cocking tube gap
-rack the action 10,000x
-use a cheek piece on the stock
-never shoot commercial .308 ammo (it'll shoot, but sooner or later...)
-get a broken shell extractor, just because
-cant really tell from the pix, but if it has a muzzle brake, that mf'er is just pure LOUD & doesn't do anything but make it LOUD. Flash hider is all you really need. Recoil on a gun with proper bolt gap & cocking tube gap is VERY MILD!! If any gun kicks hard, it is not adjusted properly. These are VERY MILD RECOIL guns!

 

[B3owulf]

Mudburner thank you very much for the input! I will get started!

 

[Merle]

I have an aluminum mlok handguard and a Choate folding stock that I removed from a PTR I recently sold if you are interested.

 

[Constructor]

I have had several HKs and PTRs, I like them but they are not sniper rifles so IMO no need for a big scope. 30mm red dot or a lighter weight 1-6x or similar is what I like on them just to keep the overall weight down. A 100 rnd drum weighs 10lbs...EMPTY

 

[B3owulf]

I started on the "cylcle it 10,000x" path to smooth out the action but apparently my wife believes the baby sleeping is more important than my rifle so we will have to find a different path.

 

[Asiparks]

I started on the "cylcle it 10,000x" path to smooth out the action but apparently my wife believes the baby sleeping is more important than my rifle so we will have to find a different path.

This is why I have a garage.
Didn't even take 5 mins to move the crib down there.

 

[Mudburner]

Just shoot it! If the baby can learn to sleep through that, he'll be right! (just kidding!) If it functions correctly, don't worry about it. It'll loosen up and be easier to charge afterwhile. These are really fun guns.

 

[GhostFace]

I’m a fan of the HK style MBRs, I too am 6’05” so they fit me well. Ive had a Springer, G3s, a kit gun built from a FMP parts kit and now the PTR. I bought my PTR from a member on Arfcom, he did a lot of mods to it that I would do. Heavy buffer, trigger job, carry handle and i added the rail and port buffer. She is fun to shoot, it’s a great MBR only second to the AR-10. Accurate, reliable and mild recoil. The only harsh recoiling ones I fired had the bolt gap out of spec and a standard buffer. The the only thing I really dislike about it is the lack of a BHO but that’s an American thing I guess...

 

[Asiparks]

because I'm the poor, mine is one of the $700 Century c308's.
That said its been a good shooter for the 120 or so rounds of mil surp nonsense I've put through it.
GRSC 1-6 on top works well with a jaw weld....

Plastic furniture feels like shite though....

 

[Strykervet]

I got one of those Century rifles, not with the aluminum upper but still junk... Was built on old parts they didn't even bother to clean, let alone refinish. I think I had it a week.

I heard the PTR's are nice along with a few others. Guy at the gun store popped out a full auto MP5 w/4 position lower last week --not something you see in WA too often. It's a dealer sample of course. Anyway, he knew all about the HK clone mfg.'s.

I think PTR and some place in Turkey and Pakistan actually got the HK tooling, I don't know much about 'em myself. I just know when I was playing with that MP5 I kinda wanted one.

because I'm the poor, mine is one of the $700 Century c308's.
That said its been a good shooter for the 120 or so rounds of mil surp nonsense I've put through it.
GRSC 1-6 on top works well with a jaw weld....

View attachment 7582208

View attachment 7582209

Plastic furniture feels like shite though....

I didn't know you could put the bipod on with those rails. I just sold an FAL last November for enough to fund a SCAR 17 and 10 mags and some left over I guess. It was a nice FAL with a lot of shit though.

Century was hit or miss. Not all of 'em were shit. More or less depends on the quality of the kit they used I think.

 

[Asiparks]

the bipod was part of the original funiture that came with it and it's mounted to the barrel, so that's not ideal....still fine as a shits and giggles gun, as is the C308.
POF in Pakistan and MKE/Zenith in Turkey make MP5 clones - can't remember if Zenith is the maker and MKE the importer or vice versa... Century is importing and selling a version under it's brand, but it's a single pin lower and pricey- The POF's have shitty paint for a finish, but are, by all counts mechanically solid. POF and the old Zenith have proper 2 pin lowers.

 

[Yondering]

Just shoot it! If the baby can learn to sleep through that, he'll be right! (just kidding!) If it functions correctly, don't worry about it. It'll loosen up and be easier to charge afterwhile. These are really fun guns.

Ours did. (Seriously; I shoot in the back yard.) The wife never did learn that though and I still wake her up once in a while by accident.

On topic- I did enjoy my PTR 91 for several years, going so far as to weld on an optic rail (before PTR sold them that way) and work the trigger. That ejected brass is a secondary projectile and has the potential to core sample somebody. BTW yes you definitely can reload the brass multiple times as long as you can find it, regardless what some claim.

For something to use as a giant hole puncher and blaster it was great, but I eventually moved on to large frame ARs and don’t regret it at all. Better accuracy by far, better ergonomics and less recoil, and options for everything. Only things the 91 really does better is style and reliability in really extreme conditions, and of course the cool factor.