I'm ready to buy my first piece of night vision gear and am having a hell of a time deciding what direction to go. Primary use would be night time varmint hunting. I like the versatility of the PVS, but by the time I get it all set up with a high quality head mount and IR laser I will have well over $4500 in the setup, and still have an inferior platform for targeting critters. On the other side, scanning for incoming varmints will be much easier than with a weapons mounted 740. Ideally I would have a 740 on my AR and a thermal monocular for scanning but that's just not in the budget right now. Any suggestions?
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Night Vision PVS 14 vs D740
- Thread starter glock63
- Start date
An inferior platform? It depends on how far you going shoot. 300+ yards I'd say yes to the d740 cause of the magnification. But again it sucks scanning through your scope, and prolly not the safest either. But what I've found out in my situations is that very few of my shots are over 200 yards because of the areas I hunt. So I decided to go helmet mounted PVS, and a Dbal, which is far from an inferior platform. Get a density filter for the laser and it's very precise. If you scratch around you could get set up for around $4,000 which is the price of a d740. Here's what I've found out about night time predator hunting, those lil suckers come flying in from all directions so scanning with a scope could be done, but because of the FOV, and getting tired from swinging your gun around I think you'd miss out on some critters. Guys usually have a helmet, or a hand held thermal to scan with then when something is seen go to laser or go to the scope. Go to your hunting land and look around, how far are the shots are gonna be? Good luck on your decision!
Loggers inn is right on. I will add there is far more versatility in a 14 I that's the only nvd you have. I realize guys are picky and paranoid about their money but a bad ass speced 14 can be had for well less than $3000. 2 just sold here a few days ago for $1500 each with brand new mx11769uv omni 7 tubes in them. That's still about as good as it gets. Tube life on a gen3 device is 10,000 hrs and its highly unlikely many will ever use one up.
As for accuracy and giving something up to a dedicated scope. Not much until after 250-300yds. I run a 3x magnafier on my 14 so precise shooting is there. My recommendation would be a 14 over any other device if you can only have one.
As for accuracy and giving something up to a dedicated scope. Not much until after 250-300yds. I run a 3x magnafier on my 14 so precise shooting is there. My recommendation would be a 14 over any other device if you can only have one.
Well having owned several NV scopes including two D-740's, to many PVS-14s to count and used NV for around 20 years now. My favorite rig for a do it all setup is a PVS-14,3X lens in my pocket (snap on when needed), Ops core Helmet, INVG mount, D2 class 1 laser/IR Illum. With this combo I can do everything and its like having a heads-up display when it comes to targeting your always ready to shot if you are walking down a trail and a wild hog steps out in front of you. 200 yards with the 3X lens snap on aren't a issue for me with this setup. With the 740 you can't walk around scanning around you all the time so you will miss targets running through your FOV when you are walking with the scope powered off. Now a 740 for shooting and say a FLIR PS24/32 for scanning used as a combo thats a wicked combo in itself the best of both worlds for scanning and targeting. Don't forget you can buy extras down the road as you have the money, most guys here don't have $6000 to buy a complete setup at once so they buy extras one at a time until hey have a full setup.
it really depends on what your hunting and how? hogs off a feeder? or walk and stalk hogs? two different set ups are ideal, in a stand or off a tripod scanning on the gun is not a problem at all and your on the gun when you need to be (the moment you locate game) walk and stalk hogs it will get old scanning off the gun in less than hour and not helpful for navigating.
calling coyotes is a different game, scanning with a PVS on Helmet then putting it on the gun while a hard charging coyote is coming is a difficult thing to do unseen, quickly or quietly in the dark, and will require some amount of adjustment after its mounted, that's where a good laser would come in handy $$$ but even with a 3x making positive ID at 2-300 will be a challenge if there is not a great contrast in target and surroundings? Do not shoot at eyes with out a positive ID!, to many times I have had small deer respond to a distress sound or a ranchers dog
There are pros and cons to both systems and more reason to have both LOL. I have a d760 that I use most of the time with a LS64, and I have a PVS14 that mounts behind my Aimpoint on a CAR-15. it really depends on what I'm doing as to which one I reach for. if I jump on the bike and run down to the river before dark for some calling I grab the car-15, get some daylight calling and stalking in then slap on the 14 and keep hunting into the night, if heading out after dark I grab the D760.
you really need to look at how you hunt and the landscape and also consider a D760 6x over the 4x its nice when making that positive ID or that head shot when that's all you have
calling coyotes is a different game, scanning with a PVS on Helmet then putting it on the gun while a hard charging coyote is coming is a difficult thing to do unseen, quickly or quietly in the dark, and will require some amount of adjustment after its mounted, that's where a good laser would come in handy $$$ but even with a 3x making positive ID at 2-300 will be a challenge if there is not a great contrast in target and surroundings? Do not shoot at eyes with out a positive ID!, to many times I have had small deer respond to a distress sound or a ranchers dog
There are pros and cons to both systems and more reason to have both LOL. I have a d760 that I use most of the time with a LS64, and I have a PVS14 that mounts behind my Aimpoint on a CAR-15. it really depends on what I'm doing as to which one I reach for. if I jump on the bike and run down to the river before dark for some calling I grab the car-15, get some daylight calling and stalking in then slap on the 14 and keep hunting into the night, if heading out after dark I grab the D760.
you really need to look at how you hunt and the landscape and also consider a D760 6x over the 4x its nice when making that positive ID or that head shot when that's all you have
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No brainer go with the PVS14 and an IR laser.
Scanning with a NV scope sucks, been there done that.
I have spent significantly more time this year hunting with NV then in the last couple combined and I have come to the conclusion that dual PVS14's or a Binocular system would be so much better.
Nothing beats the IR laser for up close and quick shots.
My FLIR T-50 has not been used once this year and a thermal monocular would be so much more useful. Of course a fused system would be killer.
My hunting is all woods hunting with very few open areas. I usually transition from day to night time predator hunting and that is where I find the biggest problems. I like the 740 but trying to use it in the day time with the lens cap is not real practical. I use the Aurora 2-10 Day/Night and as quick as the transition takes place the sight picture is no 740. I am starting to wonder if one of those flip out PVS14 mounts would not be better but than you run into caliber limitations. Hell there are days I wonder if a PVS 10 is not the ultimate solution. Always wonder why they did not try to make it smaller.
Scanning with a NV scope sucks, been there done that.
I have spent significantly more time this year hunting with NV then in the last couple combined and I have come to the conclusion that dual PVS14's or a Binocular system would be so much better.
Nothing beats the IR laser for up close and quick shots.
My FLIR T-50 has not been used once this year and a thermal monocular would be so much more useful. Of course a fused system would be killer.
My hunting is all woods hunting with very few open areas. I usually transition from day to night time predator hunting and that is where I find the biggest problems. I like the 740 but trying to use it in the day time with the lens cap is not real practical. I use the Aurora 2-10 Day/Night and as quick as the transition takes place the sight picture is no 740. I am starting to wonder if one of those flip out PVS14 mounts would not be better but than you run into caliber limitations. Hell there are days I wonder if a PVS 10 is not the ultimate solution. Always wonder why they did not try to make it smaller.
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Really? Why aren't you using your T-50? Is it the whole scanning while pointing a weapon around?
And to the OP for A first night vision device, go with a 14 you will be much happier with it!
PVS-14 and a laser... The only way to go, man.
Can't land nav with a weapon mounted NVG setup.
Best all purpose NV setup, imo (14/laser). White light capable with your firing eye exposed, non firing is looking through the NOD, best of all worlds. Light, rugged.
Obviously you can run a 15 or ANVIS, etc,etc but a tad more tricky if wanna use you white light real quick. Actually one piece of equipment the Army got right the first time(pvs-14/pvs-18).
Zero your laser at 200, works well for me. shooter preference, tho
Can't land nav with a weapon mounted NVG setup.
Best all purpose NV setup, imo (14/laser). White light capable with your firing eye exposed, non firing is looking through the NOD, best of all worlds. Light, rugged.
Obviously you can run a 15 or ANVIS, etc,etc but a tad more tricky if wanna use you white light real quick. Actually one piece of equipment the Army got right the first time(pvs-14/pvs-18).
Zero your laser at 200, works well for me. shooter preference, tho
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I was comin back to point out a 3x adaptor lens for more magnification if needed, but it has been it on.
Solid head mounted quality 14's with a properly zeroed and mounted IR laser is not inferior. We banged targets out to 300m with 'em, and that was just showing SDM's how to make the most of them.
I went with hand select ITT night enforcers, OMNI7 contract in padded case w/o skullcrusher acc. This is THE best 14 currently on the market with regards to overall quality and control and made 100% by the manufacturer (there are 2: ITT or L3). They're made in a clean room to YOUR spec, which if you get hand select and stick with high numbers, WILL be higher quality than milspec. That's a fact. Omni7 is the older, but more strict contract (more got rejected compared to newer Omni8) and ITT NE hand select models, last I checked at TNVC, were Omni7.
Having used military mounts and hating them, I opted to go with the Norotos INVG and dual dovetail along with the VAS shroud and couldn't be happier. With a carbon fiber helmet that fits well and the little bungee cord and retractable retention cord, my 14's DO NOT MOVE and are fully adj. Stable as a rock and flip up vertically and fold to the side.
I'll eventually get a clip on NV and/or thermal unit one day myself, but I still consider the 14 and IR laser as the basic staple unit.
TNVC was my dealer and they're a supporter on here. They answered my questions, no sales, good prices. Turns out most staff are vets, some still active. Stellar CS, they've taken care of me like no other company, period. I can't recommend them highly enough, regardless of the model you go with.
I went with hand select ITT night enforcers, OMNI7 contract in padded case w/o skullcrusher acc. This is THE best 14 currently on the market with regards to overall quality and control and made 100% by the manufacturer (there are 2: ITT or L3). They're made in a clean room to YOUR spec, which if you get hand select and stick with high numbers, WILL be higher quality than milspec. That's a fact. Omni7 is the older, but more strict contract (more got rejected compared to newer Omni8) and ITT NE hand select models, last I checked at TNVC, were Omni7.
Having used military mounts and hating them, I opted to go with the Norotos INVG and dual dovetail along with the VAS shroud and couldn't be happier. With a carbon fiber helmet that fits well and the little bungee cord and retractable retention cord, my 14's DO NOT MOVE and are fully adj. Stable as a rock and flip up vertically and fold to the side.
I'll eventually get a clip on NV and/or thermal unit one day myself, but I still consider the 14 and IR laser as the basic staple unit.
TNVC was my dealer and they're a supporter on here. They answered my questions, no sales, good prices. Turns out most staff are vets, some still active. Stellar CS, they've taken care of me like no other company, period. I can't recommend them highly enough, regardless of the model you go with.
three powers are awesome, definitely a nice piece of kit to have. i forgot about those
I've got three FLIR thermal weapons scopes that I use all the time once I get to where I am going, but to get there and annihilate all the way out, I use a Wendy's EXFIL helmet mounted ITT Night Enforcer Pinnacle PVS-14 on Nortoros INVG to VAS shroud with a DBAL-D2 on the front top rail of my rifles.
I shot a coon on my feeder at 175 yards with the PVS-14 on the helmet and the 0.7mW IR laser from the DBAL, and numerous coyotes and hogs out to that range. Works simply excellent for all around situational awareness and fast action response.
I shot a coon on my feeder at 175 yards with the PVS-14 on the helmet and the 0.7mW IR laser from the DBAL, and numerous coyotes and hogs out to that range. Works simply excellent for all around situational awareness and fast action response.
740's are cool but the 14 is where it is at!
Lol at the Swiss army helmet! I couldn't wear that thing out of the house before my neck would give up!
Lol at the Swiss army helmet! I couldn't wear that thing out of the house before my neck would give up!
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When you are five or six miles out hiking in the boonies at night, that helmet has everything you need except for a cup of hot coffee...
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Thanks for the input gentlemen. I jumped on the TNVC christmas sale, ordering the PVS 14 L3 Gen 3 Omni 8, and the LDI Dbal class one laser. Gonna research mounts a little, but am leaning towards the Wilcox L4 G70 system.
The Wilcox G70 is the best mounting system. Especially when you become hooked and decide you need another PVS-14!
No safety issue for me as I hunt alone and there is no one around. I just find that in my area everything is glowing, every tree, every rock and it makes picking out the 4 legged critters difficult. I think I have come to the conclusion that thermal works best for flat landers over large open areas.
Gock63
consider this if your in a budget 4k + or - look at a PS32 and M845 gen3 this will give you thermal for scanning (far better than any PVS14 for locating game)and a 2.5x 2 moa dot on gen3 for shooting, not unlike a PVS14 with 3x behind another red dot,,,, that needs to be NV capable,,,, and had better capabilities than a laser at long range, no problems with washout on brush between you and your target and a cleaner image than a pvs mounted behind other optics
I would not put to much in to navigation with a PVS14, its still tuff and harder than a cheap red led on a head mount or ball cap. coyotes and hogs are not going to spook from a red led light 2-300 yards away, they don't seem to mind a Vis laser at 20 yards! and plenty of people use a red LED to call and make kills at their feet, the noise you make and your scent if not walking into the wind will spook them more, and with a monocular PVS14 your still going to bump in the night. its one thing to walk up to with in 30 yards on a hog from down wind and completely another to do it on a coyote at night,
and when you get really hooked you will end up selling the 32 and up grade to a 64 then a D760 or Aquila 6x and a PVS14 for you buddy when you don't use it for nav while driving or behind a scope for a friend. That's what I did with a M845gen2+ with a torchpro I was making hits at 300 all night long and killed lots with it
this is an option your going to want to end up with (as stated in your OP) if your serious about predator or varmint hunting, thermal to locate, gen3 to ID and shoot
consider this if your in a budget 4k + or - look at a PS32 and M845 gen3 this will give you thermal for scanning (far better than any PVS14 for locating game)and a 2.5x 2 moa dot on gen3 for shooting, not unlike a PVS14 with 3x behind another red dot,,,, that needs to be NV capable,,,, and had better capabilities than a laser at long range, no problems with washout on brush between you and your target and a cleaner image than a pvs mounted behind other optics
I would not put to much in to navigation with a PVS14, its still tuff and harder than a cheap red led on a head mount or ball cap. coyotes and hogs are not going to spook from a red led light 2-300 yards away, they don't seem to mind a Vis laser at 20 yards! and plenty of people use a red LED to call and make kills at their feet, the noise you make and your scent if not walking into the wind will spook them more, and with a monocular PVS14 your still going to bump in the night. its one thing to walk up to with in 30 yards on a hog from down wind and completely another to do it on a coyote at night,
and when you get really hooked you will end up selling the 32 and up grade to a 64 then a D760 or Aquila 6x and a PVS14 for you buddy when you don't use it for nav while driving or behind a scope for a friend. That's what I did with a M845gen2+ with a torchpro I was making hits at 300 all night long and killed lots with it
this is an option your going to want to end up with (as stated in your OP) if your serious about predator or varmint hunting, thermal to locate, gen3 to ID and shoot
this was taken a few hours after my last post,, jumped on the bike drove down with the PVS lights out, got to the property walked in with PVS & Thermal, (needed the red LED to open gates ) set the call 50 yards out and up wind, gave it rabbit distress pup distress and rodent for 35 minutes then stopped calling and scanned with LS 64 for 10 minutes, my decoy dog was bedded up under the stand after she had been mousing in the field around the call for 30 minutes.
coyote came in from behind within 35 yards of the stand, and as soon as he got down wind of the dog, he hung up, spotted him in the ls64 went to the D760 DRT 49 yards 60gr V-max , no problems with 6x at 50 yards no need for IR as it is almost 1/2 moon only used the PVS14 to drive lights out.
Thermal to locate gen3 to ID and shoot!
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Only difference is that Franken gun has not ever hunted anything, whilst mine bring home bacon nightly....
If I am not mistaken their is an AR rail that rotates and you can have four different optic systems mounted on it at a time and just rotate the rail 360* around to choose which one you are going to use, not that I plan on getting one to use....lol
Awesome Phil....I hope you did not get any blood on your KLR.....lol
You have quite the setup skypup. Someday I will make the journey down south to hunt hogs. Looks like a blast!
this was taken a few hours after my last post,, jumped on the bike drove down with the PVS lights out, got to the property walked in with PVS & Thermal, (needed the red LED to open gates ) set the call 50 yards out and up wind, gave it rabbit distress pup distress and rodent for 35 minutes then stopped calling and scanned with LS 64 for 10 minutes, my decoy dog was bedded up under the stand after she had been mousing in the field around the call for 30 minutes.
coyote came in from behind within 35 yards of the stand, and as soon as he got down wind of the dog, he hung up, spotted him in the ls64 went to the D760 DRT 49 yards 60gr V-max , no problems with 6x at 50 yards no need for IR as it is almost 1/2 moon only used the PVS14 to drive lights out.
Thermal to locate gen3 to ID and shoot!
F'N' Mad Max Dirt Bike!!!! I Love it! If you ever want to sell it, let me know! lol I want to make my 3 wheeler look like that.
