Range berm

[Scratchthejeepguy]

Im setting up a long range shooting lane on my property. I live at the top of a large hill and will be shooting into the hill from the bottom of it. Not toward my house, kind of across the property at the bottom. Right now, I have a very nice 100 yard plus range, at the bottom of the hill, shooting into it. But I've found that if I move my starting position back even further, like another 100 yards through the trees, then move the target further up the hill, I can probably get about a 300 yard range.

The only problem, is that the target would be right on the edge, of my property, and my neighbors. Now his house is kind of at the top of this large hill but on the other side, and is in another direction anyways, but I still don't like the idea of any bullets landing in his property.
We get along great, so I'm not too worried about the shooting. I already have a nice pistol range setup and like I said, a 100 yard range too, so he hears us do alot of shooting as it is, but I'd like to build a berm to shoot into so the bullets wouldn't go into his property at all. As it is, if I were to set up a target on the edge of my property line, and shoot into it from the starting location, the bullet would pass through the paper, then go about 5-10 feet more into his property until it hit the dirt going up the hill. The hill slowly goes up hill another maybe...50-60 feet vertical, stretched over another 100 150 yards or so until it would crest the hill. Of course that's all on his property, and I'd rather not have any of my bullets go onto his land at all.

My question is how high and wide should I make this berm. My brother who lives on the other side of me, (actually the starting location is on HIS property) has a skid loader so making the berm won't be hard, I just don't know how high I should build it. I know technically all I need is a 2 foot high berm maybe 5 feet wide or so and as long as I'm a good shot, I should be fine, but I want to be extra safe.

What do you think?

 

[Changed]

I would advise against shooting anywhere near another person's property line. It sounds like you need to rethink your plans. If a bullet could "land" on his property it could kill someone. I would rather pay for a range membership than those legal fees.

 

[unrepentant]

What the Count said. NRA recommendation is that a berm be a minimum height of 15 feet assuming the firing position is ON LEVEL GROUND with the target.

If I understand your situation, you're considering shooting up (no matter the minimum uphill angle) towards a berm planed in a manner that would aid ricochets towards the direction of your neighbor's land... what if he's out strolling on his property? If his structures aren't at least 90 degrees to your firing position, it'd be an unacceptable layout for NRA-affiliated firing ranges. His structures and any possible moving (human) targets on his property have to be a LONG ways off for you to ignore the 180 rule.

 

[Scratchthejeepguy]

I'm not shooting up, it's a level shot, or at least very close to level (under 5 degrees probably) and actually a little downhill. I could easily do a 15 foot C shaped berm, and like I said, there's still alot of vertical hill above that for it to try to get over. I'd have to shoot at least 50 feet high before it would go over the hill, if it made it though the trees. I think there might be a farm or something, probably a mile or so somewhere past that, but there's more woods, fields and hills between... I'll have to look on Google Earth.

I can see an issue if he was out strolling in his woods though... Maybe I'll try looking for another location, I have 20 acres to deal with.

 

[hlee]

If you and your neighbor get along great then there shouldn't be any problem in getting his input on your proposed range layout. He and you are the principles in this, and the only ones with first hand knowledge of the lay if the land. If you feel uncomfortable asking him about the layout then you may already have your answer...

 

[Scratchthejeepguy]

Great idea, not sure why I didn't think of that, I know his land butts up against another huge hill, I might be able to use part of his land too, and get a longer range! We've both been here for at least 15 years, and I know he doesn't use it for anything.

 

[qkieler]

I'm with hlee talk to your neighbor before u build anything use the NRA standard or close to it and go over it with him so he's on the same page. Try to think of the worst situation like not remembering to come down a revolution and sending one over the berm and he's out checking his property

 

[pawprint2]

God forbid, he ever "finds" a bullet hole in anything on his property! Regardless of who "put" it there, when it was fired, it won't really matter-you'll be the guy paying for the damage. Yes, you can hire a lawyer, or even several lawyers etc., but in the end, 99 out of a 100, you'll be paying, not just for the lawyers, but for the "damage". just saying....

 

[winterhorse290]

i built a 250yd range behind my barn using a spoil bank for the backstop. nothing downrange to hit for 2 miles. my problem has been that every time i pop of a few(hundred) rounds, i get a visit form the local popo. they are responding to a report of gunfire. when i tell them it was me, they say fine, have a nice day and be careful. seems the "locals" who moved from the city(new orleans) to the country think every sound of gunfire has to be a drive by or murder. it,s going to get harder to have your own range and best just get used to the fact that you need to find a range, pay the fee so you can shoot with a visit from the law. i drive 45 minute to one. funny part is, there is one 10 minute from me but they charge 18$ AN HOUR there. the one i go to is 18 a day.
sure was nice when i moved out here 30 years ago. my kitchen table doubled as my shooting bench. only had to leave the house to pull targets.

 

[Changed]

I'll tell you what. Why don't you have your wife or child walk to the top of the hill you are shooting into. Stand at the edge of the property line, and have your brother fire a few shots at the target area. Do they feel safe? Would you feel safe? Would your neighbor feel safe? If so, then continue on with your plans. At a minimum I would want a 15-20ft berm to shoot into. I would want it to be 20-30ft across at the bottom. I would also extend the berm in a "U" shape. This provide protection from ricochets.

Remember, when you have a personal range, everyone in your family will want to shoot at it. From the oldest to the youngest. If there is anyway a youngster or adult could fire and errant shot, and endanger your neighbor (or anyone else) then you need to shelve your plans.

Being a gun enthusiast is like being a Christian. When someone knows you are a Christian the look at everything you do, and scrutinize your every move. When they find fault they are quick to judge. You should hold yourself to a higher standard, and be the safest gun owner you can be. That includes your safety and that of your neighbors.

Chip

 

[Changed]

i built a 250yd range behind my barn using a spoil bank for the backstop. nothing downrange to hit for 2 miles. my problem has been that every time i pop of a few(hundred) rounds, i get a visit form the local popo. they are responding to a report of gunfire. when i tell them it was me, they say fine, have a nice day and be careful. seems the "locals" who moved from the city(new orleans) to the country think every sound of gunfire has to be a drive by or murder. it,s going to get harder to have your own range and best just get used to the fact that you need to find a range, pay the fee so you can shoot with a visit from the law. i drive 45 minute to one. funny part is, there is one 10 minute from me but they charge 18$ AN HOUR there. the one i go to is 18 a day.
sure was nice when i moved out here 30 years ago. my kitchen table doubled as my shooting bench. only had to leave the house to pull targets.

I find your comment interesting on several levels. I have been saying for years that liberals hate guns, because they are, typically, only exposed to them through violence. Therefore, they equate all guns with violence. I have always thought it would be a great idea to start inner city skeet leagues, air gun leagues, small bore comp. leagues. If the NRA would do this in NYC, LA, Chicago, and a handful of other major (gun free) cities, we could turn the tide on the gun banners within a generation. Instead of taking the fight to the streets they continue to play by DC's rules.

 

[Maggot]

i built a 250yd range behind my barn using a spoil bank for the backstop. nothing downrange to hit for 2 miles. my problem has been that every time i pop of a few(hundred) rounds, i get a visit form the local popo. they are responding to a report of gunfire. when i tell them it was me, they say fine, have a nice day and be careful. seems the "locals" who moved from the city(new orleans) to the country think every sound of gunfire has to be a drive by or murder. it,s going to get harder to have your own range and best just get used to the fact that you need to find a range, pay the fee so you can shoot with a visit from the law. i drive 45 minute to one. funny part is, there is one 10 minute from me but they charge 18$ AN HOUR there. the one i go to is 18 a day.
sure was nice when i moved out here 30 years ago. my kitchen table doubled as my shooting bench. only had to leave the house to pull targets.

Be neighborly...invite them over for a BBQ and some shooting...maybe youll make a conversion.

 

[Former0302]

I'd include the neighbor in the planning...and be open to him saying no. If he does, then honor it and don't bitch about it. But, it sounds like you may end up being able to make an even better range if he agrees. Does he shoot?

 

[Scratchthejeepguy]

I will include the neighbors input for sure, he doesn't shoot, but I know he at least owns a shotgun. We're good friends so Im sure he wont care, in fact with his 20 acres, the range could be even longer and with his other hill, even safer. He's used to the sound of gunfire. We live out in the country and hear it often. Like I said, I have a pistol range, and a 100 yard range right now, and we do alot of shooting. I've even had the local swat team out here and they've done some sniper training as well. They offered to help with the clearing for the longer range, so I've gotten their input as well.

I don't think I'd let anyone stand at the top of the hill while shooting, but I'd feel very comfortable (with the layout of the land) to let someone stand over the crest of the hill... The hill is pretty big, and its a long ways up and beyond.
Either way, I still plan on making a C shaped berm on my land, and it looks like 15 feet high and maybe 20 feet across is the measurement I want.
Thanks.

 

[Changed]

I don't think I'd let anyone stand at the top of the hill while shooting, but I'd feel very comfortable (with the layout of the land) to let someone stand over the crest of the hill... The hill is pretty big, and its a long ways up and beyond.
Either way, I still plan on making a C shaped berm on my land, and it looks like 15 feet high and maybe 20 feet across is the measurement I want.
Thanks.

Yea, you just have to have confidence in the safety. I see idiots all the time sending ricochets over the pistol bay at my local range. I have been standing out at 300 and heard a bullet tumbling through the trees on my right. That berm is 30ft high. I have gone over more than once to have them adjust their fire.

Sounds like you've got things figured out.

 

[Phil1]

I will include the neighbors input for sure, he doesn't shoot, but I know he at least owns a shotgun. We're good friends so Im sure he wont care, in fact with his 20 acres, the range could be even longer and with his other hill, even safer. He's used to the sound of gunfire. We live out in the country and hear it often. Like I said, I have a pistol range, and a 100 yard range right now, and we do alot of shooting. I've even had the local swat team out here and they've done some sniper training as well. They offered to help with the clearing for the longer range, so I've gotten their input as well.

I don't think I'd let anyone stand at the top of the hill while shooting, but I'd feel very comfortable (with the layout of the land) to let someone stand over the crest of the hill... The hill is pretty big, and its a long ways up and beyond.
Either way, I still plan on making a C shaped berm on my land, and it looks like 15 feet high and maybe 20 feet across is the measurement I want.
Thanks.

Keep in mind that big magnums are quite noisy and not the same as a smaller rifle. If a shorter range like 250 yards works better its not like 300 yds is a must.

A free hamburger and beer goes a long ways. i.e. invite him over for a BBQ to discuss.

 

[Scratchthejeepguy]

Keep in mind that big magnums are quite noisy and not the same as a smaller rifle. If a shorter range like 250 yards works better its not like 300 yds is a must.

A free hamburger and beer goes a long ways. i.e. invite him over for a BBQ to discuss.

What better reason to grill some burgers!

 

[boltstop101]

I would advise against shooting anywhere near another person's property line. It sounds like you need to rethink your plans. If a bullet could "land" on his property it could kill someone. I would rather pay for a range membership than those legal fees.

I agree with the Count and you answered your own question with the first sentance in your second paragraph . Always error on the side of caution

 

[TN-MadDog]

I don't really have much to add except...

I have been to a few shoots where there were a lot of tracer rounds fired. It was a real eye opener to see how many rounds ricocheted over berms and even over trees.

You might look into an umbrella liability policy for your home owners insurance if you don't already have one.

 

[Speedgoat]

Almost sounds like something such as a gabion style basket could be used to create the nesecary berm with cutting down on its size. Never heard of these being used on a shooting backstop - berm but I've always been curious and thought that they'd be slick. Anyone have experience using these? Possibly even line the basket with fabric and use a clay fill in front of some filled with rock?

 

[Scratchthejeepguy]

Never heard of a gabion basket until now. Looks like a wire basket filled with rocks. I don't think I'd want to shoot into that for sure. I understand where you said line it with fabric then fill with sand, but I'd still not want to use it for a backstop, I could see for the sides of a C shaped berm maybe, but if I were going to do that, I'd rather make a wall of tires filled with sand instead of that, probably make a good backstop too.

Where I was planning on putting it though, I could just as easily have a couple dump trucks of sand delivered, and pile it with our skid loader.
I have a new location for it now and will be shooting directly into the side of an even larger hill, not quite 300 yards but close enough for me, and much safer.

Thanks for all the advice everyone.