Standard load in my 308 target 30" 8 twist is 200 gr SMK .715 BC at 2856 fps...I haven't tried 215s, but 225 at 2675 fps and 230gr Atips at 2620 Atips fps are used...so these older cartridges can benefit from new components and be more competitive.
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Recommend the most American made 30-06 for an elk hunt
- Thread starter teddy12b
- Start date
Solid copy Captain Skippy (your Squirrel Mafia rank?).
To hell with your savings account. You can't take that shit with you! Make the man in the mirror happy. Tomorrow is not guaranteed for any of us!
That being said, Bell killed the fuck out of African elephant with a 7x57 and solids but you wouldn't find my inbred white cracker ass in Africa with anything that tiny!
PS: I saw an old Win 70 in .375 H&H somewhere in that list. Geezus. . . I'm still moist. That would wreck a Bullwinkle!
./
For years I have been searching to find one of the 51 Model 70’s in a specific serial number range that coincides with the day my late grandfather was born, I found one in .375 H&H but it was a touch to rich for my blood.
.300 H&H & .375 H&H Super Grade Special Order Twins
We love researching the rare, famous, or otherwise special model 70s, especially when all the pieces fall into place. We spotted a couple rifles being sold at auction and a bit of research turned up the fact they were a very special matched pair of special order guns. The rifles are desirable in...
pre64win.com
Also my grandfather was a frugal man and had I bought it he probably would have crawled out of his grave to beat my ass for spending that much on something commemorate him.
Jesus! Those two are spectacular.
Your grandfather was probably frugal because he had to be back in the day.
He might bitch at you just to make a show ( because you know, it is expected of him after all ) but it would make him feel good on the inside that you thought enough of him to do such a thing in his memory.
Tying such memories to something tangible is a strong way we keep our past love ones alive in our hearts and even to the great grandkids that may not have been blessed to know them first hand.
Did I mention that those are spectacular!?
.
Modern day 30-06, bet it shoots anything into tiny little groups.
www.gaprecision.net
Non-Typical -- .30-06 SPR -- B&C Templar Sporter -- Tan w/ Black
Non-Typical -- .30-06 SPR -- B&C Templar Sporter -- Tan w/ Black GA Precision Templar Hunter (Talley 2 Piece Base, Templar .250 Recoil Lug) Trigger Tech Primary @ 2.5lbs Bartlein Stainless 5R Barrel, 25", GAP#3 Contour, 1-10.5" Twist Rate 6 Straight
www.gaprecision.net
Used the 30-06 Rem 721 as a kid open sights no scope. It killed deer, so did the old lever 30-30. Never had to be super accurate. My brother came back from Vietnam in 69 and bought a new Rem 700 ADL in 30-06, for $98. Put a 3-9× Leupold killed deer and elk until agent orange finally killed him. I used a 7 mag, with 3-9x, traded it for a Ruger 77 338 Win Mag for better dump em on the spot, with a 2-7x and finally a 350 mag model 7, the last 2 pillar bedded but stock factory with walnut. And always had a real factory 16" Win lever 30-30 with 170 gr. handloads...for special occasions. Never needed a custom rifle or super accuracy for hunting, the target is large and the ranges were close to fairly close...and if a horse falls on your rifle ya aren't out much...a tool for workin.
Then a famous old Alaskan guide used a Win model 70 in 30-06 to go in the brush after wounded coatal Grizzly loaded with Nosler 220 gr bullets...but sometimes he completely unloaded the 5 rds available. He was an old Vietnam combat vet used to working in close quarters..so there's that...and you might choose something larger for that endevor.
Then a famous old Alaskan guide used a Win model 70 in 30-06 to go in the brush after wounded coatal Grizzly loaded with Nosler 220 gr bullets...but sometimes he completely unloaded the 5 rds available. He was an old Vietnam combat vet used to working in close quarters..so there's that...and you might choose something larger for that endevor.
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This thread has been really fun. So many great rifles have been recommended. As far as your OP goes; the pre ‘64 Winchester 70 is the most right answer.
You are in luck because lock stock and barrel is selling quite a few of them on gunbroker.
For me personally, I grew up shooting a Remington 760 gamemaster pump 30-06 carbine. I come from a family of LH Pennsylvania hunters, we all carried them. Remington’s good enough cheapness is in my blue collar blood. My first rifle I bought myself was a LH LSS in 300 RUM. If it was my rifle it would probably be a LH 700 KS.
No it wouldn’t. I just thought of one I missed. It’d be an OG ULA. That’s what I’d buy. One of Morgantown’s finest, an OG Forbes.
You are in luck because lock stock and barrel is selling quite a few of them on gunbroker.
For me personally, I grew up shooting a Remington 760 gamemaster pump 30-06 carbine. I come from a family of LH Pennsylvania hunters, we all carried them. Remington’s good enough cheapness is in my blue collar blood. My first rifle I bought myself was a LH LSS in 300 RUM. If it was my rifle it would probably be a LH 700 KS.
No it wouldn’t. I just thought of one I missed. It’d be an OG ULA. That’s what I’d buy. One of Morgantown’s finest, an OG Forbes.
Circa Summer of 1974. Cape Lisburne, home for a year my Uncle sent me to keep an eye on Ivan on the other side of the Straight.
No fancy camo, no signature boots, just Chuck Taylors and wool socks.. when warm enough on our hikes down the damp tundra of the Caribou Valley, or the beach of the Arctic, the CTs are near perfect. No Gore-Tex lined hikers.
30-06 with irons. Nanuqs roam the area, optics are no go.
The Arctic Ocean in the background.
No fancy camo, no signature boots, just Chuck Taylors and wool socks.. when warm enough on our hikes down the damp tundra of the Caribou Valley, or the beach of the Arctic, the CTs are near perfect. No Gore-Tex lined hikers.
30-06 with irons. Nanuqs roam the area, optics are no go.
The Arctic Ocean in the background.
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What's a realistic expectation for a pre '64 winchester 70 in 30-06? I love that's what is being recommended so much, but is that an MOA gun? I know so much of the answer to that will vary from gun to gun and how it's been getting treated for the last 59 or more years. It's such a variable to me about getting an old classic that I wonder if I just need to get over it and pick out a new winchester 70.
When I realized how well my 300 H&H could shoot, I had a couple of older rifle gods say "They could make really good barrels back then but not always good bullets." I'm sure that factory production barrels are still a crap shoot even on older guns but they can be surprisingly good.
I guess we should not discount the fact that those rifles were built during a period where people actually still had pride in fitting and workmanship.
I bought mine from an estate sale in Bend, OR. Original owner used the heck out of it so it had a lot of bluing and wood wear. Functionally it was excellent and the bore was perfect so he took pains to properly care for the rifle after shooting and hunting. There was zero information to be had regarding what I was getting. The rifle shot all 3 loads tried fairly well as delivered (100% stock). Certainly well enough to hunt with. I did a couple of tweaks that were cosmetically invisible and tweaked one of the loads which resulted in the old gun shooting as well as any custom I could have bought or built.
I would say you should be able to get a solid MOA out of such a rifle in 30-06 if it is in good shape, you test ammo and you can drive a light weight, moderate recoiling rifle consistently off of a bench.
./
For years I have been searching to find one of the 51 Model 70’s in a specific serial number range that coincides with the day my late grandfather was born, I found one in .375 H&H but it was a touch to rich for my blood.
.300 H&H & .375 H&H Super Grade Special Order Twins
We love researching the rare, famous, or otherwise special model 70s, especially when all the pieces fall into place. We spotted a couple rifles being sold at auction and a bit of research turned up the fact they were a very special matched pair of special order guns. The rifles are desirable in...
Also my grandfather was a frugal man and had I bought it he probably would have crawled out of his grave to beat my ass for spending that much on something commemorate him.
Um. We gonna need tissues if you post rifles like that….
As to them being accurate, I have a ‘52 in .308, featherweight. Been used clearly, but good shape.
Shoots around .8” groups with 3 kinds of ammo (factory) and better with handloads.
Fortunately it shoots Fed HE with 180gr partitions darn well and I have a couple boxes.
Would snag more if I saw em.
Shoots hard and accurate.
First Stop Guns in Rapid City, SD has a Remington custom shop 375 H&H for I think $1500.Solid copy Captain Skippy (your Squirrel Mafia rank?).
To hell with your savings account. You can't take that shit with you! Make the man in the mirror happy. Tomorrow is not guaranteed for any of us!
That being said, Bell killed the fuck out of African elephant with a 7x57 and solids but you wouldn't find my inbred white cracker ass in Africa with anything that tiny!
PS: I saw an old Win 70 in .375 H&H somewhere in that list. Geezus. . . I'm still moist. That would wreck a Bullwinkle!
./
Let me confirm.
BRB.
Yep, here it is.
Remington Custom Shop M700 375H+H : 995931783
Buy a Remington 700 <p>Remington Custom Shop Model 700 375H+H,24 barrel with sights,excellent condition,shot very little for sale by First Stop Gun on GunsAmerica.com the best online marketplace for buying and selling semi auto pistols, firearms, accessories, and collectibles : 995931783
www.gunsamerica.com
He also carries a bunch of nice old guns, new customs, Kimber, Parkwest, Cooper and a bunch more.
Call 605-341-5211 and talk to Mark.
Custom LRI Long Rifles Inc 325WSM : 904524146
Buy a <p>Custom LRI Long Rifles Inc 325WSM,22 stainless fluted barrel with muzzlebreak,M70 CRF action,waln for sale by First Stop Gun on GunsAmerica.com the best online marketplace for buying and selling semi auto pistols, firearms, accessories, and collectibles : 904524146
www.gunsamerica.com
That's the problem, isn't it? What do I do for a high-quality, traditional American made bolt gun if I don't want to go to a smith? What's my factory option that looks as good as a Super Grade and shoots/functions as well as a Tikka?
Cooper, Kimber, Nesika/Dakota Arms, Ruger Hawkeye, Seekins, Proof Research, Weatherby.
Any rifle builder worth a shit, is a smith. Gunsmiths build rifles.
What you are asking for doesn't exist. I want a super grade but reliability of a tikka. They only place to get something like that is a custom rifle builder, be it in the US, Germany, UK, ect.
I know it's not wood stocked, but the Nosler 48 long range carbon uses a Mack Bros custom action (I believe) timney trigger, manners stock and proof research barrel.
Sounds pretty fuckin' 'MURICA to me
The action is not the same as the EVO
Weatherby Euromark Mark V. My Japanese made one circa 1986 is a thing to behold. A laser with 150 Nosler Ball. Tips with Lapua brass.
@DeathBeforeDismount - my point in mentioning the M70 was that such a thing DID exist and could still if they were produced with decent barrels and still made stateside. I think it's a little ridiculous that the market seems to gap between "race to the bottom" and low volume, high end guns. Hell, the Tikka T3 (or Bergara) would be (the Euro version of) that gun if they made it with a decent wood stock and actual bottom metal and charged you CTR money (was that the 595?).
I think the Seekins PH2 is a great rifle. I think the Weatherby Mk5 could be a great rifle if they would drop the damn Monte Carlo stock (which I think they're starting to get the memo on) and realize that some of us are adult enough to carry a rifle that weighs more than a large sandwich. @fdkay - didn't realize the Nosler 48 was on a Mack, thought I'd heard differently, looks good!
I think the Seekins PH2 is a great rifle. I think the Weatherby Mk5 could be a great rifle if they would drop the damn Monte Carlo stock (which I think they're starting to get the memo on) and realize that some of us are adult enough to carry a rifle that weighs more than a large sandwich. @fdkay - didn't realize the Nosler 48 was on a Mack, thought I'd heard differently, looks good!
Cool rant. Feel free to start a company and fill this obviously massive gap in the market. I am sure VC will be lined up to throw money at this amazing venture as you meet the unmet demand of 5 fudds who are too poor to buy a modern American rifle.
Look at skilled labor rates from back then and today. Go look at how much a $1000 rifle was back in 1964. Spain and Finland are both MUCH cheaper to manufacture in, with a skilled workforce. Neither Bergera or Tikka are premium offerings. Ruger American is basically a tikka t3 knockoff and Bergera rifles are dogshit unless you get into their custom guns that are no fucking different than the 25 other semi custom guns you can buy.
If you want classic american steel and wood, go buy it. There are millions out there and you can get whatever you want from gunbroker, gun stores, arms lists or forums like this. No one is stopping you from buying a Pre-64 Winny or old ass Remington 7 or 700.
@DeathBeforeDismount - why would I do that when I can just buy an already existing product? The fact that it's not made in U.S. is a bummer, but wouldn't stop me from owning a Winchester, Tikka, Bergara, Howa, Weatherby or something else entirely if that's what I wanted. I couldn't say what the demand signal is, but I guess it's enough that multiple companies are already in the space to serve that market segment. Good enough for me.
I apologize in advance.
but
I
have
to.
but
I
have
to.
1970 Browning High Power Medallion Grade in .30-06:
Now that’s an extractor! So Sorry … made in Belgium
Now that’s an extractor! So Sorry … made in Belgium
^^^^^^^
that's a real beauty right there, the Belgium Brownings to me were unmatched in quality and workmanship dollar for dollar. I still have my first .22 takedown from ~1968. Love the old Brownings!!!
that's a real beauty right there, the Belgium Brownings to me were unmatched in quality and workmanship dollar for dollar. I still have my first .22 takedown from ~1968. Love the old Brownings!!!
As luck would have it I had a chance to handle a Ruger Hawkeye guide gun in 30-06, and a Winchester featherweight in 25-06. Between the two, the Winchester had a much smoother action, but the Ruger had a better trigger. The fit and finish on the Winchester was a step above the Ruger. I have no clue how they would have compared being shot next to each other, but that always comes down to ammo selection anyway. The featherweight is listed at 7# and the Ruger at 8# and holding the two I would say that was correct. I didn't care for the look of the funky colored laminate ruger stock, but I would assume if I swapped that out there could be a weight savings there. I also liked the idea of fixed iron sights on the gun just in case something would happen to the scope during a hunt. The hunt for the right rifle continues.
Consider adding the MCARBO trigger springs if getting a Model 70
Winchester Model 70 Trigger Spring Kit
Trigger Spring Kit for the Winchester model 70 featherweight and all other Model 70 variations with the standard Winchester Model 70 Trigger Pre-2008 production. Compatible with all calibers to include the Winchester model 70 30-06 and Winchester...
www.mcarbo.com
Here you go.
www.longrangehunting.com
For Sale - Kimber 84L Classic 30-06
Kimber 84: Classic 30-06 w/Leupold Bases and 1" low rings $1000 Shipped or FTF in Eastern North Carolina Bought in 2016, Finish on wood and metal are in great shape, treated once a year with Renaissance Wax Round count is 148 Shot factory Nosler Trophy Grade 168 AB's and Winchester Deer Season...
Thanks for all the help everyone, I genuinely appreciate it. After a lot of debate and mental turmoil I've decided on a new Winchester 70 featherweight in 30-06. Now.... the issue becomes..... What optic?
I have a Vortex Viper 2.5-10x32 that's a discontinued model with capped turrets and a FFP and Christmas tree reticle that I like. If that were available to buy today I would.
I have a Vortex Viper 2.5-10x32 that's a discontinued model with capped turrets and a FFP and Christmas tree reticle that I like. If that were available to buy today I would.
So, use the Viper on this rifle and find something else for whatever platform it’s on now. Or, since it’s likely that this will have only a specific use for long hints and won’t get used much outside of that, just share.
The M70 Featherweight is never a bad choice. The Portuguese rifles are very nice as are the SC BACO guns. Also, the H&R Model 330/340 are very underated rifles built on a commercial FN98 action high quality walnut stock and a douglass barrel. This one is chambered in .300WM and a shooter.
They bring $500-$700 when you can find them and on par with the JC Higgins 50's/51's.
TM6
If I lived i the USA I would get a pre owned Champlin&Haskins rifle in an Elk kaliber like 7mm Rem for my bucket list hunt.
The action on these are, subjectively, by far the best action on any hunting rifle ever. When the bolt closes on these you feel that you can load 64gr of plutonium behind the 7mm Barnes 168gr LRX bullet.
The lockup on this action is insane. The second row of locking lugs have the length of the election port , and locks perfectly on the rear bridge. It is a 60 deg action.
The action on these are, subjectively, by far the best action on any hunting rifle ever. When the bolt closes on these you feel that you can load 64gr of plutonium behind the 7mm Barnes 168gr LRX bullet.
The lockup on this action is insane. The second row of locking lugs have the length of the election port , and locks perfectly on the rear bridge. It is a 60 deg action.
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So, wait a tick, you want an American made rifle, but are putting an Asian made scope on it?
Seems to me that the Vortex AMG, Greeley made Steiner or Burris or a Leupold should be your only considerations.
Fair point. I didn't even think of that aspect of it, but yeah I am. I'm a big fan of Vortex for all they do for the PRS sport and especially their support of the Guardian matches. If there was a comparable scope out there for the size, reticle, and weight of the one I've got I'd consider it.
The one rifle I would never part with is a pre 1939 model 70 in 30-06. Original with usage wear on the finish and blueing and still a shooter. It's done exactly what it's supposed to do for nearly a century and three generations of family so far. There is a post 1939 model 70 in .270, not quite as old and all original too. The current loads were developed many years ago for both and neither fires more than 20 rounds in a year, they are not used for general plinking, just to confirm zero and hunt.
Classics are classic for a reason and it doesn't get much more classic.
Classics are classic for a reason and it doesn't get much more classic.
My go to 30-06 is an older pushfeed Win M70 Featherweight that came from the factory in a McMillan stock. Those in that era were made in New Haven Connecticut. I recently purchased a new Remarms 700 ADL 7mm RM which is made in the US. I put it in a KRG stock and without scope it's in the 8 lb 14 oz range. I think you could shave off some weight using a Boyd's laminate or sticking with the factory stock. IMO Remington has really stepped up the quality control, although I've made the poorly made bankruptcy 700's shoot well. Here's a group from my Rem 700 shooting off a backpack that kept settling on each shot. It was so low that I could even fit a rear bag in lol. I'm still in load developement with only 30 rounds down the tube at this point.
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20” 30-06 getting it done in the PA rifle season on what is now my largest buck to date with the 178gr ELD-X at 2800 fps.
Rifle is built on an M7 Mausingfield with a Carbon 6 Barrel, Manners stock and Hawkins bottom metal, only non American part is the Triggertech but since Canada is America’s hat I’ll let it slide.
The action must be lucky as it’s the same one I used to kill my bear a few years back though every other part has been changed.
Rifle is built on an M7 Mausingfield with a Carbon 6 Barrel, Manners stock and Hawkins bottom metal, only non American part is the Triggertech but since Canada is America’s hat I’ll let it slide.
The action must be lucky as it’s the same one I used to kill my bear a few years back though every other part has been changed.
Well, the rifle I selected got to go on a warm up hunt. I went to Texas with a friend from church to a family member of his ranch. I'd never hunted in Texas, and I'd never hunted hogs. This was all over feeders so certainly not a tough hunt and certainly not a long shot. Most blinds to feeders distances were around 65 yards. This particular pig was the largest in the group and when I hit it broadside with a 168gr Barnes Tipped Triple Shock it barely reacted to the extent my buddy thought I may have missed. As it ran I fired a second shot while it was moving and that's the shot far back in the gut. I was hoping the follow up shot would anchor the animal, but it didn't go another 10 into the brush and the first shot had clearly done its job. I didn't get a picture from the other side, but the results were very effective. Since the hunt, the rifle went to a stock gunsmith for a full bedding job. I'm waiting on some type S Redding dies to work up a load since my old dies were decent but I wanted better going forward. The rifle will be ready an elk hunt the fall of 2024. It was a nice rifle to should, carry and shoot. I don't have any complaints and I look forward to seeing what it can do for accuracy with a quality hunting bullet.
Thanks again for all the advice I received here. I've kept a leather bound journal for this rifle that'll be passed down with it and some day my son or grandchildren will have the gun and the stories that go with it.
168 TTSX have done nothing but kill every elk I have shot with them, including a bull at 518. I have only recovered two of the bullets, the rest went on their way. One was a frontal shot; it was in the back ham. The other was 414 on a big bull and it poked through a rib on the way in, blew through the off side humorous ball and was up against the hide. One lost 12 grains ( one petal) and the other lost 20 grains (2 petals). Love that bullet.
Seat them .050 off the lands and do a powder charge test. 50.4gns varget/ cci 200 has been a very accurate load in 3 different browning '06 rifles. It doesnt show any pressure signs in any of the 3 but obviously work up.
Seat them .050 off the lands and do a powder charge test. 50.4gns varget/ cci 200 has been a very accurate load in 3 different browning '06 rifles. It doesnt show any pressure signs in any of the 3 but obviously work up.
Ruger 1A marked "Made in the 200th Year of American Liberty"
cal. . 30-06. Like new condition very decent walnut, I'll have to get some pictures up.
cal. . 30-06. Like new condition very decent walnut, I'll have to get some pictures up.
Pre-64 M70 all the way. .270, .30-06, .300H&H, your choice although the former two are more affordable and easier to acquire. Several years ago I found my “forever rifle” at a pawn shop in the form of a 1956 M70 fwt. 30-06. All original and in good condition, 2018 price too!
It wore a Lyman All-American 4x, although cool in its own right, utter garbage by today’s standard just as @Terry Cross said. I re-torqued everything, cleaned the barrel, and checked the headspace before loading up some 150gr softpoints and shooting them into 1.5” off a bag with the Lyman and original aluminum buttplate…ouch. Into the back of the safe it went.
Fast forward a few years, hunting/target rifles have come and gone, but the pre64 has always stayed. I was unsure of what to do with it until I found a pre-inlet stock for it in McMillan’s bargain bin. Buying this stock jump started my mental build up. Full teardown, ultrasonic cleaning, packed the wood FWT stock away, assembled with parts bin mounts, and a Burris FFII 3-9x40. When I stepped back from the bench I said “Holy shit. This is it”.
The McMillan and scope upgrade took the same 1.5” load to an inch, and is a hell of a lot easier on the bum shoulder. The rifle is just under 8lb all up, and the 150s are tame in this setup. I’ll get Chad at LRI to bed it, and tune the trigger before working up a load with 168gr TTSXs. I’d like to go on an elk hunt at least once in the next 10yrs, and hopefully an African plains game trip when I retire, one certainty is this rifle will go with me if these wishes come true.
There are several solid choices presented in this thread that meet your criteria. I’ve made my case for the pre64, so has Terry, and several others. Whether you keep it original, go full custom, or just upgrade the ergos and fine tune like I am… you can’t do wrong with the Rifleman’s Rifle.
It wore a Lyman All-American 4x, although cool in its own right, utter garbage by today’s standard just as @Terry Cross said. I re-torqued everything, cleaned the barrel, and checked the headspace before loading up some 150gr softpoints and shooting them into 1.5” off a bag with the Lyman and original aluminum buttplate…ouch. Into the back of the safe it went.
Fast forward a few years, hunting/target rifles have come and gone, but the pre64 has always stayed. I was unsure of what to do with it until I found a pre-inlet stock for it in McMillan’s bargain bin. Buying this stock jump started my mental build up. Full teardown, ultrasonic cleaning, packed the wood FWT stock away, assembled with parts bin mounts, and a Burris FFII 3-9x40. When I stepped back from the bench I said “Holy shit. This is it”.
The McMillan and scope upgrade took the same 1.5” load to an inch, and is a hell of a lot easier on the bum shoulder. The rifle is just under 8lb all up, and the 150s are tame in this setup. I’ll get Chad at LRI to bed it, and tune the trigger before working up a load with 168gr TTSXs. I’d like to go on an elk hunt at least once in the next 10yrs, and hopefully an African plains game trip when I retire, one certainty is this rifle will go with me if these wishes come true.
There are several solid choices presented in this thread that meet your criteria. I’ve made my case for the pre64, so has Terry, and several others. Whether you keep it original, go full custom, or just upgrade the ergos and fine tune like I am… you can’t do wrong with the Rifleman’s Rifle.
Excellent thread. I have a 1954 era Winchester M70 in 30-06 with a Canjar single set trigger. I upgraded the 4x scope to a Nightforce NXS 2.5-10x32. Going to do some load development with 168 gr TTSX as soon as I get my bench back together. Have a Wyoming hunt booked in 2025…
