Replace AICS Spigot with Rail

[Yerman]

For the record, I’m interested in both. Would like to see you come out with the Arca version, but would buy the rail version if you ended up not machining the new design. Anything is better than what I have now.

 

[Rangemaster]

Put me on the list for another one when you get ready to order some.

 

[carnageasada]

It extends 4.5" from the edge of the chassis and yes I mount my Seb Joypod bipod all the way at the end to help minimize muzzle jump and maintain site picture when shooting in LR matches

I weighed my BDS spigot at ~9.2oz (making the delta ~7oz from your pic version, more if his scale's better!) and I put my Atlas PSR as far forward as possible when shooting way out. Do you think you could push the pic version a little farther forward?

 

[samb300]

I weighed my BDS spigot at ~9.2oz (making the delta ~7oz from your pic version, more if his scale's better!) and I put my Atlas PSR as far forward as possible when shooting way out. Do you think you could push the pic version a little farther forward?

Honestly, the picatinny version is pretty much locked in, I designed it mindfully to have 5 picantinny slots to cover everything from the Atlas to the Harris, without being too long.

I don’t know if you’d notice the difference to having the bipod 1.5” closer than with the Big Dog, but maybe it does help. The Arca version will be about an inch longer than the picatinny version so maybe that would be what you’d want?

 

[carnageasada]

Honestly, the picatinny version is pretty much locked in, I designed it mindfully to have 5 picantinny slots to cover everything from the Atlas to the Harris, without being too long.

I don’t know if you’d notice the difference to having the bipod 1.5” closer than with the Big Dog, but maybe it does help. The Arca version will be about an inch longer than the picatinny version so maybe that would be what you’d want?

Understood and perhaps you're right, the AS might be the way I want to go. Just not certain due to the fact that the rail on that version takes the bipod contact out of the plane of the bottom of the stock, but it does bring it closer to the bore, which is a good thing I suppose...

Curious, in your posted drawing of the AS version, why did you decide to move the rail up towards the barrel, to get it closer to the bore? Asking because if you kept it close to in-plane with the bottom of the stock you could add extra material above the AS rail to absorb any minute flex in the AS portion hanging out like a cantilever in front, like you did with the pic version. At this point I'm probably steering towards wrought over-engineering, but just a thought... I'm pretty sold either way.

 

[MarinePMI]

Following....

 

[jlficken]

How do you guys reach the bipod to make adjustments on these really long rails?

I am 6'6" with long arms and I can barely reach my Atlas on the picatinny version of his mount without breaking my position. There's no way I would want anything longer on the front of my AIAT.

 

[carnageasada]

How do you guys reach the bipod to make adjustments on these really long rails?

I am 6'6" with long arms and I can barely reach my Atlas on the picatinny version of his mount without breaking my position. There's no way I would want anything longer on the front of my AIAT.

Only for ELR, I will put it all the way forward on the Big Dog and leave it, think PRS or maybe F-Class. Otherwise I completely agree with you and the bipod stays on the rail under the stock for access/speed.

 

[ballisticdaddy]

How do you guys reach the bipod to make adjustments on these really long rails?

I am 6'6" with long arms and I can barely reach my Atlas on the picatinny version of his mount without breaking my position. There's no way I would want anything longer on the front of my AIAT.

My bipod has a joystick for micro adjustment once you are behind the rifle...see attached

 

[samb300]

How do you guys reach the bipod to make adjustments on these really long rails?

I am 6'6" with long arms and I can barely reach my Atlas on the picatinny version of his mount without breaking my position. There's no way I would want anything longer on the front of my AIAT.

I agree. I actually don't even run the bipod all the way to the end of the handguard tube on my AX for that reason - if I set up on a prone stage I can't reach it past that point. Turns out I run my bipod on my AX in almost the exact same position as on the AT with my mount.

The Arca-Swiss design just happens to be longer to facilitate two full MLok slots. Any shorter and I'd have to compromise that functionality.

 

[jlficken]

I agree. I actually don't even run the bipod all the way to the end of the handguard tube on my AX for that reason - if I set up on a prone stage I can't reach it past that point. Turns out I run my bipod on my AX in almost the exact same position as on the AT with my mount.

The Arca-Swiss design just happens to be longer to facilitate two full MLok slots. Any shorter and I'd have to compromise that functionality.

Here's where I run my Atlas. Any further out is too far for me.

 

[samb300]

Understood and perhaps you're right, the AS might be the way I want to go. Just not certain due to the fact that the rail on that version takes the bipod contact out of the plane of the bottom of the stock, but it does bring it closer to the bore, which is a good thing I suppose...

Curious, in your posted drawing of the AS version, why did you decide to move the rail up towards the barrel, to get it closer to the bore? Asking because if you kept it close to in-plane with the bottom of the stock you could add extra material above the AS rail to absorb any minute flex in the AS portion hanging out like a cantilever in front, like you did with the pic version. At this point I'm probably steering towards wrought over-engineering, but just a thought... I'm pretty sold either way.

That was exactly my reasoning - trying to move the bipod mount as close to the bore as possible. That's one thing I didn't like about running the AT with the factory pic rail under the forend, it raised the COG of the rifle so high it felt much more unstable/tippy.

I definitely could move the Arca rail to the bottom, and have it be on the same plane as the picatinny version. However, another reason I have it mounted higher is because I figured anyone that wanted an Arca-Swiss rail at the same level as the bottom of the forend could just run a longer version of the HRD rail and have it stick out a couple inches.

 

[samb300]

There really seem to be 3 schools of thought for people that are interested in these mounts:

1) Original picatinny - no desire to use the Arca-Swiss bipod mount, and will likely leave the forend as-is.

2) Arca-Swiss (high version) - Want to run an Arca-Swiss bipod mount, OR want the option to have an MLok picatinny rail that's higher up towards the bore axis. May or may not run an HRD Arca rail on the forend.

3) Arca-Swiss (low version) - More driven by having the ability to run all bipod variants, whether it's mounted on an Arca rail or picatinny.

I'll be honest, options 1 and 2 are designed, though I don't have a formal quote for the Arca version. Option 3 is totally possible from a design standpoint, it's simply a matter of me not having my own CNC and being at the mercy of machining another version and having inventory when I don't know how many people want.

 

[THEIS]

Cost of AE/AT picatinny mounts were $160 shipped (US only due to ITAR).

Hi Samb300,

I am not sure you are aware of this BUT it may help you out

ITAR exemption:
123.17A22 CFR 123.17 (a) Components and parts for Category I (a) firearms not exceeding $100 wholesale.

It is $500 wholesale if going to Canada.
123.16B222 CFR 123.16 (b) (2) Components or spare parts less than $500.


Feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[carnageasada]

That was exactly my reasoning - trying to move the bipod mount as close to the bore as possible. That's one thing I didn't like about running the AT with the factory pic rail under the forend, it raised the COG of the rifle so high it felt much more unstable/tippy.

I definitely could move the Arca rail to the bottom, and have it be on the same plane as the picatinny version. However, another reason I have it mounted higher is because I figured anyone that wanted an Arca-Swiss rail at the same level as the bottom of the forend could just run a longer version of the HRD rail and have it stick out a couple inches.

Totally reasonable approach, I'd do the 2) option from your follow-on post then as I am running the 8.8" HRD rail on my AT. Thanks again for answering all my questions as they kept coming!

EDIT: Just realized, this would almost be like having a 5-H bipod on a spigot with the added benefit of arca, I definitely am on-board for the high-AS version!

 

[kRcu]

There really seem to be 3 schools of thought for people that are interested in these mounts:

1) Original picatinny - no desire to use the Arca-Swiss bipod mount, and will likely leave the forend as-is.

2) Arca-Swiss (high version) - Want to run an Arca-Swiss bipod mount, OR want the option to have an MLok picatinny rail that's higher up towards the bore axis. May or may not run an HRD Arca rail on the forend.

3) Arca-Swiss (low version) - More driven by having the ability to run all bipod variants, whether it's mounted on an Arca rail or picatinny.

I'll be honest, options 1 and 2 are designed, though I don't have a formal quote for the Arca version. Option 3 is totally possible from a design standpoint, it's simply a matter of me not having my own CNC and being at the mercy of machining another version and having inventory when I don't know how many people want.

My school of thought is I like the looks of it (the original) and want it whether something is attached to it or not. I guess that could be option 4?

 

[Fig]

I know you can add a pic rail to Arca-Swiss. Does anyone make Arca-Swiss on a pic rail? To me the Arca-Swiss gives you the most options, and is the most flexible.

 

[carnageasada]

I know you can add a pic rail to Arca-Swiss. Does anyone make Arca-Swiss on a pic rail? To me the Arca-Swiss gives you the most options, and is the most flexible.

I believe this is what you seek?

http://www.reallyrightstuff.com/NATO-DVTL

 

[Fig]

Then either way.

 

[samb300]

I need to model up the Arca-Swiss bipod block, with an MLok picatinny rail attached to it, THEN with the RRS picatinny-to-Arca adapter bolted to that.

Arca-Swiss-ception!!!

 

[Yerman]

Hey samb300, just checking in to see if you have made any decisions yet?

 

[samb300]

Hey guys, sorry I haven't been posting much this past week! I haven't gotten a quote back yet from the machine shop, I'm still waiting to hear back from them on some other items too.

After thinking about it, I'm leaning towards offering two choices:
1) The "classic" picatinny mount that I have made in the past
2) The "high" Arca-Swiss mount that puts the mount closer to the bore axis, but may limit the ability to use certain bipods (mostly Harris)

Doing a third option with a "low" Arca-Swiss mount doesn't make a lot of sense to make, since anyone wanting that setup could run the long HRD rail and have a full Arca rail on their entire forend that sticks out an inch or two off the front. Unfortunately without having my own CNC, it will likely be cost prohibitive to have that third option unless there was a large amount of people wanting it.

Otherwise, I will keep you guys posted. I really wish I had everything ironed out and ready by now, but please be patient as I get things going.

I also have been working on another accessory for the AI platform that people may be interested in, but I'm going to wait to share it until I do some more testing on it and get the prototype finalized.

 

[huang]

I'm interested

 

[Forrest84]

I’m in for one for sure

 

[Forrest84]

A 1913 rail that is

 

[03psd]

I’m in for a regular classic pic rail mount please.

 

[Fitz]

I’m in for either one.

 

[SLG]

Any updates? I'd like the high Arca Swiss option. I have no intention of ever putting a Harris on a gun if I have a better choice, and I also won't use M lok, so what about a shorter version of the Arca that doesn't put the bipod out too far? Just an idea for my needs.

BTW, I really like the factory spigot, and currently run a versapod adaptor in mine, with an RPS bipod on the end. The wiggle doesn't bother me at all, and the stability is fantastic. My interest in the arca version is not to deal with any perceived shortcomings of the factory spigot, just that it would allow me to standardize on my attachments for bipod and tripod, plus the ability to run the bipod back by the action for short rests like barrels and stuff.

 

[yakstone]

I would be in for one

 

[tmzphoto]

If it's not too late, I’m in for a regular classic pic rail mount please!

 

[Sogan]

following. May be in for a pic rail version

 

[carnageasada]

At his point, my interest may have switched back to the pic version as well to see what all this elite iron action is all about!

 

[tj10ring]

To late to get in on the rail version? Also was a price mentioned?

Thanks

 

[Tree]

I am curious if these are still available as well. Looking for the pic version.

 

[03psd]

Me thinks this is Unobtanium. Unfortunetly.

 

[samb300]

Hey guys, sorry for the lack of communication on getting these things made again. To be honest I’ve been focusing on getting the AT/AX thumb rests made, and that has taken more time than expected.

The picatinny version of the bipod mount is unchanged and can be made again in another run. The Arca Swiss (RRS rail) version hasn’t been made in a machined prototype yet, and I don’t want to take orders on those for something that’s untested. I want to do a run of both versions together (machining/prep/anodize) rather than one at a time just because the batch costs are so high for the small quantities I’ll be doing.

I apologize again for the delay. The thumb rests are very close to being done, and after that I can focus back up on getting the Arca bipod mount made and another batch of these going.

Thanks,

Sam

 

[03psd]

Hey guys, sorry for the lack of communication on getting these things made again. To be honest I’ve been focusing on getting the AT/AX thumb rests made, and that has taken more time than expected.

The picatinny version of the bipod mount is unchanged and can be made again in another run. The Arca Swiss (RRS rail) version hasn’t been made in a machined prototype yet, and I don’t want to take orders on those for something that’s untested. I want to do a run of both versions together (machining/prep/anodize) rather than one at a time just because the batch costs are so high for the small quantities I’ll be doing.

I apologize again for the delay. The thumb rests are very close to being done, and after that I can focus back up on getting the Arca bipod mount made and another batch of these going.

Thanks,

Sam

Thank you very much for the update SAM. I am in for a AT thumb rest as well as the Pic rail block when they are done. Is there a way to get on your "list" of do you have an order portal? Thanks!

 

[htowncoog]

I’m in for a pic rail.

 

[Fitz]

Am in for both versions.

 

[samb300]

Just a heads up for everyone...The first batch of the production thumb rests are being printed as I type this. I will update that separate thread and create a group buy thread as well.

Now that those are moving forward, I have some more time to focus back on the bipod mounts. I know some of you may be wanting them now or getting a little impatient. I can't give any details, but I can tell you that I'm in talks with a company who is interested in the mounts. Whether that turns into a partnership or not is yet to be seen, but I will know more over the next couple of months. In the meantime I will be refining the prototype of the Arca-Swiss/RRS version, and if I have time doing some prototypes of a few other ideas I have. I'm confident that one way or another I will be bringing these back into production, unfortunately I can't promise when that will be.

Thanks,

Sam

 

[impactaddict]

will the thumb rests be available for AT and AX?

 

[samb300]

will the thumb rests be available for AT and AX?

Yup. Folding AT and all AX variants, both LH and RH.

 

[impactaddict]

I am in!

 

[reich10]

I am in as well

 

[bpd131]

I am interested in the AT thumb rest and the high version spigot arca rail.

 

[texag0842]

Mark me down for two of the original style (1913 rail)

Ran the Arca Swiss this weekend but think I prefer the older rail set-up.

 

[Breacher]

Mark me down for one of the original style 1913 rail too please.

 

[samb300]

In case anyone missed it, the thumb rests are for sale and the Group Buy can be found HERE.

I'll be out of town the rest of the week, I'm visiting a manufacturer interested in potentially partnering with me on the bipod mounts and possibly some other projects. So stayed tuned, hopefully there are some good updates coming soon!

Thanks everyone,

Sam

 

[Starbuck]

In case anyone missed it, the thumb rests are for sale and the Group Buy can be found HERE.

I'll be out of town the rest of the week, I'm visiting a manufacturer interested in potentially partnering with me on the bipod mounts and possibly some other projects. So stayed tuned, hopefully there are some good updates coming soon!

Thanks everyone,

Sam

I'm in for the AICS/AIAT Arca Swiss spigot mount. Good luck on your business trip!

 

[NateVA]

Got my thumbrests and now just patiently waiting for a run of the spigot mounts.