Ruger SFAR small frame 308, 6.8 pounds

[doubloon]

My point

Nothing I mentioned required any of these tools or any advanced knowledge of firearm design and tolerances.

Whatchu even talkin bout Willis?

You imagineered all that skilz stuff into a post where it didn't exist in the first place just to create a situation for yourself to look smart while putting down someone for cleaning a gun before taking it shooting the first time after buying it.

I already conceded you're right, as usual.

If you got something to prove don't feel like you have to do it for me, I don't need it.

But if you just got more chest thumping to do then get on with it and I'll leave you be.

 

[Cr1775]

Well for under 1000 spent on my out of the box SFAR , its been beter than alot of my put togethers that i spent alot more on. Christ i spent almost that on parts that i had to send back.

 

[Southernspeed]

Sure, more participants means more data to validate or invalidate the perceived trend. I'm still negative because of the reviews/opinions outside the Hide that also point to a flawed SFAR. For a $1,050 street price maybe Ruger produced exactly what they wanted. A low cost, lightweight, hard hitting self defense AR meant for short range engagements and not meant for long range shooting where sub-MOA is a must and reusable brass is a money saver for those who reload.

There’s no way I’d rely on mine for self defence. Even after all the work I’ve done on it. This and my M&P 10mm are both last in line for self defence, even though they both seem to be ‘ok’ now! Shame, really had high hopes for both.

 

[TJefferson]

So is the overall consensus just it's "hit or miss" depending on luck? I have had my 16inch version for just over 2 years and I've only had one malfunction in the last 550+ rounds. It was my fault as I turned the gas up, by mistake, when I mounted the suppressor. I don't shoot it a lot but I feel its been very reliable so far. It's had a strict diet of Federal 168 GMM and Federal 168 Tactical Tipped Matchking, with 90+% suppressed with a Sig 762SRD can. Both shoot well.
First picture was my 50 yard zero confirmation with 5 rounds of 168 GMM. The second and third are 200 yard groups with Federal 168 Tipped Matchking. At the price point, I've been very impressed. I've since pulled the Leupold Mk4 off and I'm currently running a 1-6 LVPO and using it as general purpose carbine.

 

[maximini14]

Ruger sfar 20" in 308...shoots 3/4" groups with my handloads with Hornady 150 gr SSTs...rough on brass with bent rims on #2 setting...and after 5 reloads had some primers pop back ...not unusual for full length sized brass. Will load some this week and try #1 setting and see if it will run without ripping up rims

 

[LRRPF52]

Ruger sfar 20" in 308...shoots 3/4" groups with my handloads with Hornady 150 gr SSTs...rough on brass with bent rims on #2 setting...and after 5 reloads had some primers pop back ...not unusual for full length sized brass. Will load some this week and try #1 setting and see if it will run without ripping up rims

You can try adding action spring weight to tame the cyclic rate, and therefore the timing when extraction happens. Also use harder brass from Lapua, LC, Winchester. Hard to preserve the brass though at .308 pressures in a lightweight gas gun. It’s hard enough to do it in a large frame heavy gun after you’ve established reliability and accuracy.

 

[maximini14]

You can try adding action spring weight to tame the cyclic rate, and therefore the timing when extraction happens. Also use harder brass from Lapua, LC, Winchester. Hard to preserve the brass though at .308 pressures in a lightweight gas gun. It’s hard enough to do it in a large frame heavy gun after you’ve established reliability and accuracy.

I was curious about that....my first ar.
Where do you look for springs...and how much more tension is reasonable

 

[LRRPF52]

I was curious about that....my first ar.
Where do you look for springs...and how much more tension is reasonable

SpringCo has different weight AR-15/AR-10 action springs with color-coding.

For AR-10 and the SFAR, it’s best to start with an A5 length RET, which I’ve heard the SFAR has a similar length but not exactly.

AR-10s with A5/ArmaLite RET length uses AR-10 Rifle action springs typically, which is a good place to be.

Measure the length of your current action spring before moving forward with any parts changes.

 

[maximini14]

SpringCo has different weight AR-15/AR-10 action springs with color-coding.

For AR-10 and the SFAR, it’s best to start with an A5 length RET, which I’ve heard the SFAR has a similar length but not exactly.

AR-10s with A5/ArmaLite RET length uses AR-10 Rifle action springs typically, which is a good place to be.

Measure the length of your current action spring before moving forward with any parts changes.

Thnx, will ck that out

 

[AXMC]

Thnx, will ck that out

If springs and running on Setting 1 don't work, I'd highly recommend replacing the gas block...the Ruger one doesn't have fine enough adjustments typically....and the gas port is huge. After that I'd also look at a heavier buffer. I'm running a H2 with the original spring and a superlative gas block and have just slight ejector smears and none of the other issues you describe.

 

[BCP]

If it's handloads he could always load on the lighter side to preserve his brass.

 

[Charmingmander]

Anyone with a few hundred rounds down range seeing concerning wear on the bolt yet?

Strongly considering getting one in 6.5cm and having the barrel cut back to 16in. Throw on a riflesneed and a not-garbage rail.

Don't think I've seen anyone address it either but has anyone successfully swapped out the buffer system for an A5? My understanding is the tube is A5 length but the buffer is a carbine length and using a longer spring? IIRC older large frame gas guns used similar buffer set ups. Just curious if swapping to an A5 setup will impede BCG travel.

 

[AXMC]

Anyone with a few hundred rounds down range seeing concerning wear on the bolt yet?

Strongly considering getting one in 6.5cm and having the barrel cut back to 16in. Throw on a riflesneed and a not-garbage rail.

Don't think I've seen anyone address it either but has anyone successfully swapped out the buffer system for an A5? My understanding is the tube is A5 length but the buffer is a carbine length and using a longer spring? IIRC older large frame gas guns used similar buffer set ups. Just curious if swapping to an A5 setup will impede BCG travel.

1. No concerning bolt wear.
2. You're going to have very little material for a shoulder if you cut it back. You may have to have your smith create a false shoulder like you would on a sporter barrel.
3. The tube just shorter than A5 length. You could switch it for an A5 with a small spacer, but you're not going to be able to run an A5 buffer, since the BCG needs the extra distance to clear the back of the mag. If you really want an A5 buffer for some reason, you're going to need an even longer tube. Something like this may work, but not sure on internals.

Extended Reach -7 Position Receiver Extension, Carbine - SMF Tactical Exclusive

7 Position Carbine Buffer Tube for People with Extra Long Arms

www.smftactical.com

 

[Charmingmander]

1. No concerning bolt wear.
2. You're going to have very little material for a shoulder if you cut it back. You may have to have your smith create a false shoulder like you would on a sporter barrel.
3. The tube just shorter than A5 length. You could switch it for an A5 with a small spacer, but you're not going to be able to run an A5 buffer, since the BCG needs the extra distance to clear the back of the mag. If you really want an A5 buffer for some reason, you're going to need an even longer tube. Something like this may work, but not sure on internals.

Extended Reach -7 Position Receiver Extension, Carbine - SMF Tactical Exclusive

7 Position Carbine Buffer Tube for People with Extra Long Arms

www.smftactical.com

Others have cut theirs back so I don't see it as a serious issue. Hopefully a barrel maker will be able to spin up barrels for them eventually like D Wilson has been able to do with the LMTs.

I figured as much on carrier travel. I suppose then it's probably best to leave it alone and focus on the gas block then.

 

[S_R]

First wood walk

Ok it been a while owning rifles. Few hundreds rounds most of it magtech 150 ball ammo. Ran few local 2 gun matches with it. I learned that accuracy it’s not consistent because gas block handguard interference, and consistent problem with Magpul 10rd mag. No visible bad wear and tear on bcg. Rifle run reliably with OSS supressor on setting 2 till last range trip. Started expecting FTF with factory ammo bullets weight 168-175 grain. I tried Magpul or Lancer 20rd mags, seems now it only functions with ball ammo.

 

[Not_A_Llama]

I’m pretty comfortable concluding that most of the issues with the SFAR are because of the shitty gasblock. Replace it with a Superlative so that it doesn’t leak, lock, or bang against the handguard. My gun went from 3 MOA to 3/4 MOA by swapping the block.

Also, nobody mentioned, but the stock gastube is some proprietary micro pinned monstrosity.

As for brass getting beat up - I think we just need longer gas systems, but it’s also the nature of the platform. I know Craddock is spinning up some replacement barrels.

Other things to do: Tubb Springs are a universal answer. JP AR15 gas rings are a help, too.

 

[doubloon]

concluding that most

I would go with that for most.

I still haven't been back to the range after polishing the chamber to see if it fixes my extraction issues at least to the point where I don't have to carry a cleaning rod everywhere I go to hammer out the 25th round.

Mine is a 20", If I can get it to cycle reliably 100 rounds in a row I plan to shorten the barrel ~2" which should reduce the dwell time and change a few things ... hopefully for the better.

 

[Midpack]

I can confirm that Craddock is willing to do barrels. I sent in my original barrel for them to reuse the extension. I'm about 4 months into my wait and can't wait to get it in hand. That said I also swapped the handguard and the gas block and the gun was a solid 3/4 gun with my old 130eldm load

 

[S_R]

I’m pretty comfortable concluding that most of the issues with the SFAR are because of the shitty gasblock. Replace it with a Superlative so that it doesn’t leak, lock, or bang against the handguard. My gun went from 3 MOA to 3/4 MOA by swapping the block.

Also, nobody mentioned, but the stock gastube is some proprietary micro pinned monstrosity.

As for brass getting beat up - I think we just need longer gas systems, but it’s also the nature of the platform. I know Craddock is spinning up some replacement barrels.

Other things to do: Tubb Springs are a universal answer. JP AR15 gas rings are a help, too.

Thanks for shearing information. I do like SFAR and start hated same time. I was thinking to replace og gas block to rifle speed, and og handguard to HB industries SFAR handguard. Doesn’t seems rational to trow 500$ towards 900$ rifle. I’ll try to go your route

 

[doubloon]

sent in my original barrel for them to reuse the extension. I'm about 4 months into my wait

Following

FWIW, I get very good accuracy with different loads out of my SFAR ... just shite reliability.

 

[doubloon]

HB industries SFAR handguard

Does this handguard provide more clearance around the gas block or same profile?

 

[Midpack]

Does this handguard provide more clearance around the gas block or same profile?

Can't speak for that one but most any other handguard you put on will have more clearance. The sfar handguard is one of the smallest /tightest I.D. Handguards I've personally dealt with

 

[AXMC]

Does this handguard provide more clearance around the gas block or same profile?

Also, if you replace the GB with a properly designed one (such as a superlative) that isn't giant on top like the Ruger, it doesn't matter as much....

 

[S_R]

Does this handguard provide more clearance around the gas block or same profile?

Same profile, more than enough space to fit rifle speed gas block.

 

[AXMC]

I can confirm that Craddock is willing to do barrels. I sent in my original barrel for them to reuse the extension. I'm about 4 months into my wait and can't wait to get it in hand. That said I also swapped the handguard and the gas block and the gun was a solid 3/4 gun with my old 130eldm load

What caliber/length of barrel/length of gas, size of gas port etc did you go with? Bartlein or another brand?
Thanks

 

[Midpack]

What caliber/length of barrel/length of gas, size of gas port etc did you go with? Bartlein or another brand?
Thanks

I am going heavy with it to play gas gun class locally. It's a 6gt 24" +2 gas .936 gas journal. I went with a rock creek since they had a the blank I wanted on hand vs the wait for a bartlien.

 

[AXMC]

I am going heavy with it to play gas gun class locally. It's a 6gt 24" +2 gas .936 gas journal. I went with a rock creek since they had a the black I wanted on hand vs the wait for a bartlien.

Who's doing the reassembly? If you, are you planning to bed/shim?
Thanks

 

[doubloon]

The sfar handguard is one of the smallest /tightest I.D. Handguards I've personally dealt with

Also, if you replace the GB with a properly designed one (such as a superlative) that isn't giant on top like the Ruger, it doesn't matter as much....

Si.

I own a SFAR, replaced the gas block with a superlative a long time ago. Clearance is still very tight, knocking down the internal barbs in the handguard around the block with a file buy you an extra 1/8" or so clearance.

Also, shimming the barrel in the receiver helps reduce the boiioiiooing of the barrel ... more accuracy, less handguard contact

 

[Midpack]

Who's doing the reassembly? If you, are you planning to bed/shim?
Thanks

I will be and I bed/shim all my gasser barrels

 

[LRRPF52]

You can have cheap, you can have reliable, you can have accurate, and you can have lightweight.

Pick 2 of those for 5.56 and Intermediate cartridge chambering in the AR-15.

You’re lucky to get 2 of those shooting .308, with some that exclude others.

 

[maximini14]

Thanks for shearing information. I do like SFAR and start hated same time. I was thinking to replace og gas block to rifle speed, and og handguard to HB industries SFAR handguard. Doesn’t seems rational to trow 500$ towards 900$ rifle. I’ll try to go your route

Just ordered the Superlative GB for my sfar this morning and a new gas tube...hopefully this will help get me closer to my goal of 0.5 groups.
Just loaded some seating test loads with Sierra 150 GKs and imr3031...

 

[S_R]

SFAR does run reliably on 3 with conventional supressor. Huxwrx finicky supressor makes SFAR run weird. Unsupressed runs on setting 1, and setting 2 is anemic. Accuracy as I stated before depends on where handguard position. Likes 175 & 168 for sure.

 

[Didodadday]

Been having problems with my .308 pistol running poorly with a suppressor and one person said I needed a heavier bullet. Not sure how a heavier bullet would help. I have been using a 147 grain.

 

[Av8radam]

SFAR does run reliably on 3 with conventional supressor. Huxwrx finicky supressor makes SFAR run weird. Unsupressed runs on setting 1, and setting 2 is anemic. Accuracy as I stated before depends on where handguard position. Likes 175 & 168 for sure.

I thought setting one was for suppressed use, setting to for general use and setting three is full gas.

 

[sparky702]

I thought setting one was for suppressed use, setting to for general use and setting three is full gas.

you are correct .setting 1 for suppressed ,setting 2 for normal use and setting 3 for weak ammo and adverse condition's

 

[S_R]

I thought setting one was for suppressed use, setting to for general use and setting three is full gas.

Looking through manual you are correct. But it works opposite on my rifle. So, is my gas block messed up from factory…

 

[S_R]

To replace gas block, do I need clamp on or set screw Superlative GB?

 

[doubloon]

To replace gas block, do I need clamp on or set screw Superlative GB?

I went the set screw route after trying a clamp on and not being happy with the guard clearance all the way around.

ETA: To be fair, I think that was before I shimmed the barrel in the receiver. Shimming the barrel tightened up my groups with every brand of ammo and probably dampened the barrel movement quite a bit. Shimming didn't solve my sticky chamber issues though.

 

[Bendigo78]

Been having problems with my .308 pistol running poorly with a suppressor and one person said I needed a heavier bullet. Not sure how a heavier bullet would help. I have been using a 147 grain.

Buffer. Heavier buffer is what you need. Also if your suppressor allows, go to a larger caliber endcap. Or dial down the gas.

 

[Jmccracken1214]

Are the newer rifles still chewing up brass? I’ve had 2 so far that were complete pieces of shit. Shot 4-5” groups, 1 shot better after changing gas block but still 2-3”. But they chewed up the brass so bad, some of it wouldn’t even slide in the shell holder on my press

 

[doubloon]

Shot 4-5” groups, 1 shot better after changing gas block but still 2-3”.

For the group sizes you might see improvement if you shim the barrel extension in the receiver. If it wasn't 2lb+ lighter than my DPMS I wouldn't have bothered but the lightness is intoxicating.

I saw improvement on mine across all brands/loads of ammo I have on hand. Before shimming, with the barrel nut loosened, the extension rattled around in the receiver enough to move the muzzle a couple inches. Obviously not 2" with the barrel nut tightened but it doesn't take much wiggle to make buckshot groups.

Jury is still out for me if chamber polishing fixes my trashed brass problem.

 

[wade2big]

Has anyone picked one of these up in 6.5 creedmoor?

 

[Charmingmander]

For the group sizes you might see improvement if you shim the barrel extension in the receiver. If it wasn't 2lb+ lighter than my DPMS I wouldn't have bothered but the lightness is intoxicating.

I saw improvement on mine across all brands/loads of ammo I have on hand. Before shimming, with the barrel nut loosened, the extension rattled around in the receiver enough to move the muzzle a couple inches. Obviously not 2" with the barrel nut tightened but it doesn't take much wiggle to make buckshot groups.

Jury is still out for me if chamber polishing fixes my trashed brass problem.

Got a link/guide to the barrel shimming you do? Haven't seen this mentioned with gassers until your posts in this thread (maybe I just haven't been paying attention).

 

[doubloon]

Got a link/guide to the barrel shimming you do? Haven't seen this mentioned with gassers until your posts in this thread (maybe I just haven't been paying attention).

No link, I winged it after Bendigo78 talked about it but I did a quick search and found an article (linked at the bottom of this post) with pictures that show basically the process I went through.

I was initially leary of his claims but out of options so I tried it. After trying it he gets an A+ rating from me.

I bought this pack of shims and more or less did the same thing as what Bendingo described. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0BVLXG5JK

I put a caliper on a few places around the outside of the barrel extension and the inside of the receiver to get an idea just how big the difference was to know how much shim to start with and have an "ultimate" goal. The machining inside the receiver is likely not perfect to any measurements around the opening will not be identical all the way to the back of the hole.

A couple of the posts on it are linked below that lead to other links in the discussion, I don't recall if bendigo or I posted pictures of the wrapped extension but the description of the process is similar from both of us ... fully encircle the extension with a cutout or hole to fit it around the index pin.

Bendigo put some lotite on his shims, I dry fitted mine.

Final fit was .0025" (.001" + .0015") fully around the extension and the fully covered from the flange to the scallops.

By half pieces, I meant half way around the barrel extension and I was going around the bottom of the extension (the half without ports).
On normal extensions I do a full wrap with a notch cut to go around the extension pin.
For depth, I try to cover as much of the extension as possible without being able to see it inside the receiver or having to worry about it bunching up between the extension and receiver face.

I also put a few drops of loc tite green on the extension and receiver. Just to hold it all together.

I did a search and found a link with a picture that looks similar to what I did except the shim in this picture stops at the index pin and mine had a slot cut to go around the pin.

I did not do any of the flange lapping described in the article. I tried to smooth a couple rough spots inside the receiver hole to keep the shim material from getting hung up and torn.

I also didn't heat the upper before the fit, if I had I might have been able to fit a 0.003" sheet around the extension for an even tighter fit. My results were at least as good (most better) as the results in the article for every brand/load of ammo I tried.

Barrel Bedding for the Precision AR-15: A How To Guide - The New Rifleman

Everyone has heard of bedding a bolt action rifle, but can you bed an AR15? Is it worth it. Yes and yes. Author Richard gives us the run down to enhance AR15 accuracy.

thenewrifleman.com

 

[Charmingmander]

-SNIP-

Awesome write up brother.

Ill bookmark that article link and those shims. Seems simple enough. Very good info to have.