Any other runners here suffer from tendonitis in your patellor tendon? Got any suggestions on dealing with it/preventing it. It disappears if I stop running, but comes back when I start again. I never had an issue until the last couple of years, and now it's a reoccurring problem. I'm trying to focus on my form and run more mid-foot/front foot and that seems to help. For years I was told to run heel to toe. Now I'm learning that's not correct form.
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Runners and Knees
- Thread starter sierra2
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Re: Runners and Knees
I use Vibram five fingers after too many years of rugby, running, and jumping out of planes. Heel-to-toe doesn't work for me at all anymore. Still, gradually work into toe running or you'll hurt yourself.
I use Vibram five fingers after too many years of rugby, running, and jumping out of planes. Heel-to-toe doesn't work for me at all anymore. Still, gradually work into toe running or you'll hurt yourself.
Re: Runners and Knees
I totally agree on vibram five fingers. I have jogged of and on over the years and it has always been grueling right from the first step. Barefoot running is unbelievable. light, springy, effortless. I can go for months without running and just up and go, and feel great the whole distance. you may have some sore foot muscles and lower legs due to different muscles being used. Look into the science and technique and I think you will be impressed. I am almost 6'3 and 270-280, so if I find it easy at my size it should say something. good luck
I totally agree on vibram five fingers. I have jogged of and on over the years and it has always been grueling right from the first step. Barefoot running is unbelievable. light, springy, effortless. I can go for months without running and just up and go, and feel great the whole distance. you may have some sore foot muscles and lower legs due to different muscles being used. Look into the science and technique and I think you will be impressed. I am almost 6'3 and 270-280, so if I find it easy at my size it should say something. good luck
Re: Runners and Knees
I have a buddy who uses them and swears by them also. I was seriously considering them myself.
I have a buddy who uses them and swears by them also. I was seriously considering them myself.
Re: Runners and Knees
What surfaces are you running on? I have the same issue and do my best to avoid running on streets or sidewalks. Now I hit the new highschool track, can run for miles and the surface feels great, even better is running on the field turf.
What surfaces are you running on? I have the same issue and do my best to avoid running on streets or sidewalks. Now I hit the new highschool track, can run for miles and the surface feels great, even better is running on the field turf.
Re: Runners and Knees
I've got Osgood Slaughters, chondromalacia and patellar tendonitis in both knees. Makes running a nightmare. I've used braces but dont like the restrictive feel. Ive used patellar tendon straps but find that my knees usually hurt worse after I take them off.
I can feel calcium deposits under my knee caps that feel like chunks of gravel, and the bumpy nobs below the knee cap have hurt for almost 22 years. (Dr.s told me they would stop hurting when i stopped growing)
If you find a fix, let me know, The only thing I have heard to fix my issues is surgery, that I can't afford and my insurance says is not necessary.
I've got Osgood Slaughters, chondromalacia and patellar tendonitis in both knees. Makes running a nightmare. I've used braces but dont like the restrictive feel. Ive used patellar tendon straps but find that my knees usually hurt worse after I take them off.
I can feel calcium deposits under my knee caps that feel like chunks of gravel, and the bumpy nobs below the knee cap have hurt for almost 22 years. (Dr.s told me they would stop hurting when i stopped growing)
If you find a fix, let me know, The only thing I have heard to fix my issues is surgery, that I can't afford and my insurance says is not necessary.
Re: Runners and Knees
I'll third the Vibram five fingers comments. Look into POSE running methods or similar fore foot running methods. It will improve your knee pain and allow you to run longer with less chance of injury. Work into it SLOWLY. Jump rope with the Vibram five fingers on. I was a little to vigorous initially and had to slow it down when I got two stress fractures in my forefoot.
Josh
I'll third the Vibram five fingers comments. Look into POSE running methods or similar fore foot running methods. It will improve your knee pain and allow you to run longer with less chance of injury. Work into it SLOWLY. Jump rope with the Vibram five fingers on. I was a little to vigorous initially and had to slow it down when I got two stress fractures in my forefoot.
Josh
Re: Runners and Knees
I have Patellar Tendonosis in both knees and have had it for 20yrs or so, nothing has worked yet. I am going to try PRP injections in each knee to see if they help, if not I'll have to really think about surgery.
For those who don't know about PRP (Platlet Rich Plasma) injections, they take a sample of your own blood spin out the plasma and re-inject that into the tendon. The plasma will then start to naturally repair the tendon. This is what athletes use to get better quicker with injuries. The benifits are that your using your own blood, so you really don't have to worry about infection or rejection.
I have Patellar Tendonosis in both knees and have had it for 20yrs or so, nothing has worked yet. I am going to try PRP injections in each knee to see if they help, if not I'll have to really think about surgery.
For those who don't know about PRP (Platlet Rich Plasma) injections, they take a sample of your own blood spin out the plasma and re-inject that into the tendon. The plasma will then start to naturally repair the tendon. This is what athletes use to get better quicker with injuries. The benifits are that your using your own blood, so you really don't have to worry about infection or rejection.
Re: Runners and Knees
Yes, running on the streets...asphalt. Joints feel fine, but at times the tendonitis is so bad it hurts to even touch the base of my kneecaps where the tendon attaches. I'm working on more flexibility in my quads, and it does seem to help when I focus on not running heel first, which begs the question...why are running shoes built with so much heel cushioning, which makes it nearly impossible to run not striking heel first?
Yes, running on the streets...asphalt. Joints feel fine, but at times the tendonitis is so bad it hurts to even touch the base of my kneecaps where the tendon attaches. I'm working on more flexibility in my quads, and it does seem to help when I focus on not running heel first, which begs the question...why are running shoes built with so much heel cushioning, which makes it nearly impossible to run not striking heel first?
Re: Runners and Knees
Get a pair of the vibrams. You can't run on your heels with them. Make sure you go try them on to get the right fit. They come in European sizes to get a better fit (half centimeter increments).
Get a pair of the vibrams. You can't run on your heels with them. Make sure you go try them on to get the right fit. They come in European sizes to get a better fit (half centimeter increments).
Re: Runners and Knees
on the vibram fives-you can't start slow enough. Love mine but you can really hurt your feet.
on the vibram fives-you can't start slow enough. Love mine but you can really hurt your feet.
Re: Runners and Knees
I quit wearing shoes 2 months ago when I got laid off.
Man it feels great. I go barefoot everywhere, 41 degrees and raining...barefoot.
I have to wear flip flops or something into stores but otherwise barefoot.
Might try those fives...
I quit wearing shoes 2 months ago when I got laid off.
Man it feels great. I go barefoot everywhere, 41 degrees and raining...barefoot.
I have to wear flip flops or something into stores but otherwise barefoot.
Might try those fives...
Re: Runners and Knees
Brooks. Great shoe, for me at least.
In about 8 months time this year I did: 5 5k's, 2 10k's 2 half marathons and a full marathon...and still stayed around 205 lbs. I'm considered "heavy" for that much running but Brooks running shoes really worked. No shin splints.....and knees still holdin up.
I also lift 5-6x a week and run in the evenings so am doing 2x day workouts...and I think that really helped keep things in shape....
Brooks. Great shoe, for me at least.
In about 8 months time this year I did: 5 5k's, 2 10k's 2 half marathons and a full marathon...and still stayed around 205 lbs. I'm considered "heavy" for that much running but Brooks running shoes really worked. No shin splints.....and knees still holdin up.
I also lift 5-6x a week and run in the evenings so am doing 2x day workouts...and I think that really helped keep things in shape....
Re: Runners and Knees
Get Jason Robillard's book on barefoot running. It has information on exactly how to work into barefoot running without injury.
Get Jason Robillard's book on barefoot running. It has information on exactly how to work into barefoot running without injury.
Re: Runners and Knees
will be trying Vibram five fingers . I have been dealing with tendonitis since senior year of high school. That was quite some time ago.
will be trying Vibram five fingers . I have been dealing with tendonitis since senior year of high school. That was quite some time ago.
Re: Runners and Knees
Try walking on a treadmill backwards on the highest angle it will go up to. A lot of patellar tendonitis is because there is an imbalance in the muscular structure in the leg. Walking backwards uphill strengthens those muscles that aren't used as much while running.
Try walking on a treadmill backwards on the highest angle it will go up to. A lot of patellar tendonitis is because there is an imbalance in the muscular structure in the leg. Walking backwards uphill strengthens those muscles that aren't used as much while running.
G
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Re: Runners and Knees
I've been doing the Five Finger/minimalist/bare foot running technique for over a week now. Here are some of my findings:
- Start out slow (pace and distance) as you will be sore even after a short run on your first time out.
- Assuming I don't over-do it by violating the above, I can easily get a run in every day. I don't have major problems with hips and knees, but I certainly would feel a long run in my joints and would need 1 or 2 days before my next run.
- My legs don't get as "fatigued" as with traditional running. That coupled with less pain makes for a better cardio workout.
- Getting your stepping down is a little awkward at first. However, it's fairly apparent once you do.
- As always, run on a surface with good integrity and some give. Running on concrete is unpleasant not mater how you do it.
I've been doing the Five Finger/minimalist/bare foot running technique for over a week now. Here are some of my findings:
- Start out slow (pace and distance) as you will be sore even after a short run on your first time out.
- Assuming I don't over-do it by violating the above, I can easily get a run in every day. I don't have major problems with hips and knees, but I certainly would feel a long run in my joints and would need 1 or 2 days before my next run.
- My legs don't get as "fatigued" as with traditional running. That coupled with less pain makes for a better cardio workout.
- Getting your stepping down is a little awkward at first. However, it's fairly apparent once you do.
- As always, run on a surface with good integrity and some give. Running on concrete is unpleasant not mater how you do it.
Re: Runners and Knees
PS to answer your original question - stop running on pavement, go ot your local Jr High or High School and run on the rubberized track.
My knees hurt the last 2 years in the military, about 1-2 years after I got out they subsided.
ALSO - Lay off the Dairy products, if you are A+ blood type dairy will hurt your joints.
PS to answer your original question - stop running on pavement, go ot your local Jr High or High School and run on the rubberized track.
My knees hurt the last 2 years in the military, about 1-2 years after I got out they subsided.
ALSO - Lay off the Dairy products, if you are A+ blood type dairy will hurt your joints.
Re: Runners and Knees
If youre thinking of going the minimalist route, make sure you take your time transitioning. One thing that most on here fail to recognize or explain is that you can injure yourself just as bad if you dont let your body adapt to what it is youre throwing at it. Forefoot/barefoot style of running isnt injury free either, just a different set of injuries. So if you tend to overtrain regardless its a pick your poison type scenario.
If youre thinking of going the minimalist route, make sure you take your time transitioning. One thing that most on here fail to recognize or explain is that you can injure yourself just as bad if you dont let your body adapt to what it is youre throwing at it. Forefoot/barefoot style of running isnt injury free either, just a different set of injuries. So if you tend to overtrain regardless its a pick your poison type scenario.
Re: Runners and Knees
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArcticLight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
ALSO - Lay off the Dairy products, if you are A+ blood type dairy will hurt your joints.
</div></div>
Can you expand on this?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArcticLight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
ALSO - Lay off the Dairy products, if you are A+ blood type dairy will hurt your joints.
</div></div>
Can you expand on this?
Re: Runners and Knees
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smithc6</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArcticLight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
ALSO - Lay off the Dairy products, if you are A+ blood type dairy will hurt your joints.
</div></div>
Can you expand on this?</div></div>
It's based on the blood type diet.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_type_diet
Not exactly a highly accepted idea.
Dairy in large quantities should be avoided anyway as it leaves you susceptible to over production of mucus.
* I am just assuming this is where Articlight is drawing the conclusion. Perhaps he has other resources aside from the blood type diet to expound on it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smithc6</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArcticLight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
ALSO - Lay off the Dairy products, if you are A+ blood type dairy will hurt your joints.
</div></div>
Can you expand on this?</div></div>
It's based on the blood type diet.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_type_diet
Not exactly a highly accepted idea.
Dairy in large quantities should be avoided anyway as it leaves you susceptible to over production of mucus.
* I am just assuming this is where Articlight is drawing the conclusion. Perhaps he has other resources aside from the blood type diet to expound on it.
Re: Runners and Knees
While this is not the answer to all running problems, finding good running shoes that work for you is a great start. Also, don't wait too long to buy a new pair as they can and do break down and start causing problems. I replace my shoes after 6-12 months depending on my training, race schedule and mileage. I never entered a running race until my mid-30s, then I got hooked as I find it adds some variety and motivation/goals to my running. I've been running races (10k and half-marathons) for about the past 15 plus years now and plan to keep going for as long as I can. I find ASICS shoes work well for me, fit like a glove right out of the box. I've also had to shift types of shoes as I've gotten older, now I'm using more cushioned soles to ease some aching joint problems. I find running helps not only with physical fitness but also with overall mental well being. So, hang in there and don't be afraid to try a few different approaches to your running problems to find what works for you and to keep you going.
While this is not the answer to all running problems, finding good running shoes that work for you is a great start. Also, don't wait too long to buy a new pair as they can and do break down and start causing problems. I replace my shoes after 6-12 months depending on my training, race schedule and mileage. I never entered a running race until my mid-30s, then I got hooked as I find it adds some variety and motivation/goals to my running. I've been running races (10k and half-marathons) for about the past 15 plus years now and plan to keep going for as long as I can. I find ASICS shoes work well for me, fit like a glove right out of the box. I've also had to shift types of shoes as I've gotten older, now I'm using more cushioned soles to ease some aching joint problems. I find running helps not only with physical fitness but also with overall mental well being. So, hang in there and don't be afraid to try a few different approaches to your running problems to find what works for you and to keep you going.
Re: Runners and Knees
I have tendenitis on my patellor tendon and have a small tear in it. I still run on it like an idiot but I don't want to be out on injury time and can still function and pass the PT tests. I train mostly on the treadmill now to avoid the hard road surfaces. It seems to help minimize the reoccurrence. We also have a lot of tracks and running trails with rubberized surfaces that help with shock. Also proper fitted shoes. Running shoes are all different. The soles have different curves for the various ways people run. IIRC...pronate, supinate and another. Do a search on it and map out how your foot contacts the ground when you run. I'll have to look into the PRP...think a gallon or two fill go into my knee?
I have tendenitis on my patellor tendon and have a small tear in it. I still run on it like an idiot but I don't want to be out on injury time and can still function and pass the PT tests. I train mostly on the treadmill now to avoid the hard road surfaces. It seems to help minimize the reoccurrence. We also have a lot of tracks and running trails with rubberized surfaces that help with shock. Also proper fitted shoes. Running shoes are all different. The soles have different curves for the various ways people run. IIRC...pronate, supinate and another. Do a search on it and map out how your foot contacts the ground when you run. I'll have to look into the PRP...think a gallon or two fill go into my knee?
Re: Runners and Knees
Correct running shoes, orthotics if you over/under pronate.....duh.
Do not start running by RUNNING! Running is a high impact activity, start by walking & working out your legs. Get them strong FIRST, then work your way into running.....slowly.
I'm 47 and can still run a full marathon and do at least a 70.3 Ironman every year; I realized a bunch of years ago I was not 20 and do the "no pain no gain" routine. No leg problems and no knee problems, watch your weight, if you get heavy you're too heavy to run. Work it off, walk, get your legs strong enough to carry your mass, THEN run some in addition to your walking.
Works for me.
Correct running shoes, orthotics if you over/under pronate.....duh.
Do not start running by RUNNING! Running is a high impact activity, start by walking & working out your legs. Get them strong FIRST, then work your way into running.....slowly.
I'm 47 and can still run a full marathon and do at least a 70.3 Ironman every year; I realized a bunch of years ago I was not 20 and do the "no pain no gain" routine. No leg problems and no knee problems, watch your weight, if you get heavy you're too heavy to run. Work it off, walk, get your legs strong enough to carry your mass, THEN run some in addition to your walking.
Works for me.
Re: Runners and Knees
My solution was to quit ruunning.
In alaska my knees hurt so bad I thought I would be permanently disabled.
That running on pavement thing? BAD for you.
Running on rubberized track- GOOD for you.
Hiking in mountain boots - BAD for you.
Hiking with proper footwear NOT on pavement - good for you.
It honestly took about 2 years to heal up completely before I rarely felt any pain.
I do Karate 3-5 times a week and RARELY have knee pain. Can't say the same for the lower back however.
My solution was to quit ruunning.
In alaska my knees hurt so bad I thought I would be permanently disabled.
That running on pavement thing? BAD for you.
Running on rubberized track- GOOD for you.
Hiking in mountain boots - BAD for you.
Hiking with proper footwear NOT on pavement - good for you.
It honestly took about 2 years to heal up completely before I rarely felt any pain.
I do Karate 3-5 times a week and RARELY have knee pain. Can't say the same for the lower back however.
Re: Runners and Knees
I suggest to not only run. Run maybe once or twice a week and fill in the rest with swimming or some other cardio event.
I suggest to not only run. Run maybe once or twice a week and fill in the rest with swimming or some other cardio event.
Re: Runners and Knees
My new Vibrams that I got today... my god they are expensive in this country! Anyways...
When I first started out running, I used to get serious pains in my knees mainly from where my quads connect with my knee. A good way to sort it out is to find a place with a decent hill and run up the hill to build up your quads.
I find that bad form also promotes sore knees. Smashing down hard on the pavement isnt good.
Time to break these vibrams in
My new Vibrams that I got today... my god they are expensive in this country! Anyways...
When I first started out running, I used to get serious pains in my knees mainly from where my quads connect with my knee. A good way to sort it out is to find a place with a decent hill and run up the hill to build up your quads.
I find that bad form also promotes sore knees. Smashing down hard on the pavement isnt good.
Time to break these vibrams in
