Savage Rifle Build Dillema

[Cat64]

A few days back I posted a question regarding finding a tack driver rifle which will allow me to shoot anywhere from 600 yards to 1000 yards. I said then, I wanted to stay away from higher calibers guns and was looking at a 6 mm Dasher or BR or a 308 (since I own one already)….I understand the wind factor and such…
Well, I know you can end up paying big bucks on building a very sophisticated rifle but the honest question is how much extra I will pay for how much added accuracy (I know perhaps as many people read this as many different answers). I am considering getting a factory rifle which will give me a decent group (if there is such a thing) at those distances and later perhaps accessorize that. I was reading on Savage Model 12 rifles. I am looking at the 12 BR models (either 308, 6 Norma BR, or the 6.5x284 Norma), at the 12 F Class (6 Norma BR, or the 6.5x284 Norma), the 12 F/TR (308) or the 308 Palma. Are these platforms as is, good enough (of course after adding a decent glass) to achieve what I want before much changes are done? Which are better? I would appreciate some information on which rate of twist is better, which barrel lengths are more appropriate, etc. Also I learned that if your rifle is chambered for a Norma case using a Lapua case would be a problem...is that correct and if true what options I have here? And then what do I need to change for how much money to make it perform better? Are there any places out there you guys are aware of who could help me without braking the bank put all these together?
Many people suggested a 6X47 Lapua?

Thank you,

Kat

 

[DGD6MM]

Kat, there is a fella over on AccurateShooter.com is name is Mark Schronce, he is the 6br. king. Google him he shoots mid and longrange, he is also familar with the Savage rifles. I have a Savage here with a Krieger 1-8 twist 26" that I bought of of the forum over on AccurateShooter, have not shot it yet, but know it's a hummer out to 800 yards. Factory barrels with your loads normally shoot around .5moa. This rifle I bought was the deal of the month, Low-Boy stock, Target action, Krieger barrel, 20 moa base, 800 rounds bown barrel - $1200.00 shipped.

 

[lawofsavage]

The LRP's are also the target action and come factory with a HS Precision stock that is mag fed so if you do accessorize at least you can sell the stock for a decent price.

 

[jbjh]

The Savage model 12's are a good platform to build off of. Mostly what needs to happen with the factory rifle is getting it to fit you right. Normally this involves a new stock or chassis, but as long as you can adjust length of pull and cheek height, you should be good to go.

When it comes to caliber, you are going to have to decide whether to follow the known benchrest guys in 6 mm, or the tac guys with their newer 6.5 mm. Both will get you there, and the great thing about the Savage is you can change the barrel to whatever your heart and wallet desire.

Anecdotally, from reading the classifieds on different forums, it seems like 6.5x284 is on its way out from a combination, perceived or real, of brass availability and throat erosion.

The Lapua x47's look like Europe' answer to the AI-class of cartridges, but with factory support (not that it makes it any cheaper).

 

[Cat64]

Does the 6.5X284 cartrtidge have better ballistics than the 6mm BR or Dasher? And which one is easier to reload for? (i.e. availability, varioation, etc)

 

[Tyler Kemp]

While it won't offer the best ballistics, I have 223 and 308 Savage F/TR rifles and they're crazy accurate. 1/2 moa all day every day if I'm not an idiot. The 308 once shot several groups in a row in the .1's at 100, witnessed.

 

[BoilerUP]

Does the 6.5X284 cartrtidge have better ballistics than the 6mm BR or Dasher? And which one is easier to reload for? (i.e. availability, varioation, etc)

Yes...at the expense of recoil, barrel life, more expensive brass/bullets, etc.

A 26" 6BR pushing 105 Hybrids will beat most any 308's ballistics at 1000yd and have substantially less recoil doing so.

You can buy a factory Savage (LRPV, F-Class, BR) or build one yourself; I'd recommend a 26" 1:8 Criterion barrel if you go that route.

 

[Cat64]

You can buy a factory Savage (LRPV, F-Class, BR) or build one yourself; I'd recommend a 26" 1:8 Criterion barrel if you go that route.

You always have good and knowledgeable answers. Thank you. Some people have suggested a longer barrel (28-30 inches) would increase accuracy. I am curious as to the veracity of that statement.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

If you can't get the Savage 12 F-T/R (308) to shoot well enough to dazzle you all the way 'out there'; my guess is it ain't the gun that's at fault.

...And curiosity is fine, but all I can offer is an absolute certainty that if I could push enough of my pennies together to get one, I'd have one. I've watched one blow my doors off every FV-250 match I've shot in for the past three months.

BTW, it mounts a 30" barrel.

I also have a Savage Short Action custom with a 28" 1:8" SS L-W barrel chambered for .260 Rem and contoured to match the Savage Varmint Contour that I campaigned in F Open 1Kyd for three years that pleased me greatly. These days it wears a 22" 1:10" .30BR barrel for F Open FV-250.

Greg

 

[Ring]

the only issue i have seen with 6mm at long range is spotting hits... small and light dont kick up much dirt

 

[Cat64]

Which one is more economical/effective to do: A. buy a new gun and then change stock and accessorize, or B. look into buying parts and putting it together. Either way which are some sites/locations I might research for acquiring parts at a decent price. Thank you.
Kat

 

[BoilerUP]

Which one is more economical/effective to do: A. buy a new gun and then change stock and accessorize, or B. look into buying parts and putting it together. Either way which are some sites/locations I might research for acquiring parts at a decent price. Thank you.
Kat

Just depends on how you want the rifle spec'd out. If you don't mind used gear and are patient watching forum classifieds here & elsewhere, you can save a substantial amount of money building, but if you are content with a longer/heavier barrel buying a factory rifle and shooting it for a while, then upgrading the stock and/or trigger based on what you find works for you is smart.

For example: this is a 20" 260 Remington on a Savage 10FP action. I bought the action and stock used, the scope base from EGW's bargain bin, and the barrel/recoil lug/DBM new.

I have less than $1200 in this rifle sans rings/optic, which is about what one would pay for a 10FCP McMillan. Except my rifle uses AICS magazines and the barrel is the length/contour/caliber ***I*** wanted.

 

[Cat64]

EGW's bargain bin, and the barrel/recoil lug/DBM new.

What is the EGW and what is DBM? Would you be so kind of telling me your name? We have intersected paths here numerous times and I appreciate your input and knowledge. I am Kat...short for Catalin. Also what are some places I can research for buying new gun/parts. As I look at the situation now I would like perhaps the barrel and action new, at this point in time I think I would be Ok with the Accutrigger Savage offers and a nice used stock. However if I get the 308 I would like a muzzle break. I mounted one on my Tikka T3 and I love it. I am still not sure if I want another 308 (I don't know what is the accuracy maximum capability of my Tikka) or I want another caliber like the 6BR

 

[BoilerUP]

Catalin,

The name is Paul. I spend a lot of time sitting in airports, hence a lot of time in the middle of the work day on the Hide

EGW is Evolution Gun Works, and makes the 25MOA scope base I have on my rifle.

DBM is detachable magazine bottom metal, and my rifle has a DBM made by CDI Precision that utilizes AICS-pattern 308 magazines.

 

[Cat64]

Nice to finally make your acquaintance Paul. How long have you been around shooting and rifles?

 

[tomcatfan]

Cat, if your stuck on buying a rifle thats ready to go, than you can't go wrong with the 12LRP rifles. But if you want, you can build a rifle that is exactly what you want for pretty cheap. Whats nice about savages is that you don't need to be a gun smith to build one. I've built 2 now and I love em. There is plenty of info on this website to get you going if you decide to build. Jim at northland shooters supply is going to be your best friend if you go that route. He is an awesome guy and extremely helpful. Good luck.

 

[Cat64]

But if you want, you can build a rifle that is exactly what you want for pretty cheap... Jim at northland shooters supply is going to be your best friend if you go that route. He is an awesome guy and extremely helpful. Good luck.[/QUOTE]

Can you please guide me throught the process and where to find the parts maybe. Where do I find Jim? Thank you

 

[Cat64]

Ok. If I want to go the rout of building my own rifle. I will need the barrel, the action (is this comming with the trigger and guard), the stock,...what else I need?

 

[Ring]

Depends, I have built 5 or 6 savage's now for me and friends, stripped actions are much harder to find because Savage is no longer making Stevens 200 anymore.

The Stevens 200 Actions use to cost 225 to 250, now if you're lucky you might find a complete Stevens 200 on Gunbroker for 300 bucks plus shipping and FFL fees.

Best thing to do is price what is going to cost to build, then start looking in the for sale section of the forum and see if anybody's got any great deals used that would already have most of what you want on it..

Also keep in mind due to the fact you can't find actions as cheap anymore, you can pretty much build a Remington custom yourself just like a savage for the same price using the ReM-age barrel kits that are offered by about 4 different barrel manufacturers for Remington and use the savage style barrel nut.. so you can head space it yourself at home, the cheapest way to get a Remington action is picking up a Walmart special for $400 or less tearing of the original barrel and putting on the new one at home

Being that I have built both I can confidently say I'd rather build it off of Remington and Savage the gun will be less problematic and require less tweaking to make it good rifle...

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

 

[BoilerUP]

Depends, I have built 5 or 6 savage's now for me and friends, stripped actions are much harder to find because Savage is no longer making Stevens 200 anymore.

Savage has not discontinued the Stevens 200.

 

[Ring]

Savage has not discontinued the Stevens 200.

they haven't sold 200 actions for well over a year

Savage Actions |

when 200 action were 225$, it was worth building a savage to save money...

now... not so much... building a rem-age and building a new savage will cost the same...

not much of a reason to build the savage anymore...

 

[BoilerUP]

Jim may not be selling Stevens 200 actions anymore, but Savage is still producing Stevens 200 rifles. There's also still plenty of used Savage actions floating around out there, still selling at a discount compared to 700 actions.

Your point about a Rem-Age is noted though and I have seriously considered one; did you have your 700 action notched for a pinned recoil lug and if so, who did it?

 

[Cat64]

Paul, I looked at the link above (northland shooters) as you suggested and I added another dilemma as a result. What are those numbers representing and which do I need? I was looking to find the savage 12 ftr barrel but it appears they don't have the 12 twist as the factory model.

 

[Ring]

Jim may not be selling Stevens 200 actions anymore, but Savage is still producing Stevens 200 rifles. There's also still plenty of used Savage actions floating around out there, still selling at a discount compared to 700 actions.

Your point about a Rem-Age is noted though and I have seriously considered one; did you have your 700 action notched for a pinned recoil lug and if so, who did it?

Dan over at Darkeagle Custom, Inc. Trued receiver lugs, face of receiver – cleaned gunk out of threads and chased with a tap, faced nut, and cut notch in receiver to lock recoil lug
it was 75$ at the time i had it done

my build...
part 1
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/snipers-hide-bolt-action-rifles/142018-new-project-build.html

part 2

http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...finished-my-rem-age-700-260-blacknitride.html

 

[Ring]

Paul, I looked at the link above (northland shooters) as you suggested and I added another dilemma as a result. What are those numbers representing and which do I need? I was looking to find the savage 12 ftr barrel but it appears they don't have the 12 twist as the factory model.

build a 260 -6.5cm

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Dan at Darkeagle Custom has always done my Smith work, and he did the truing/blueprinting for the original SH Ghost Dancer project rifles. He has also done some production on higher capacity magazines for some of the Savage DBM rifles.

The Savage 12 FT/R uses the Savage Target Action, which is a single shot, uses three action screws, and has the lighter pull weight Target Accu-Trigger. Target actions include: Bolt assembly, trigger group assembly, barrel locknut, recoil lug and trigger guard.

My Ghost Dancer is built on a Savage 10FP short action (from 2002), uses a Sharpshooter Supply trigger, McMillan A3 Tactical stock, Ken Farrel 20MOA Sloped Scope Base, and campaigned for 3 years in 1Kyd F Open class at Bodines equipped with a 28" 1:8" Lothar Walther LW-50 stainless barrel SAAMI chambered for .260 Rem; Custom ordered then, now an identical spec production item. This barrel likes 140A-Max/142SMK's and H-4350.

This same rifle is now mounted with a 22" 1:10", 'no turn' (.344" neck) chambered .30BR barrel for FV-250 club matches. I am just about closed in on a match load for the SRA 125gr Pro-Hunter SPFB projectile and IMR-4198. PT&G makes some very nice Savage replacement bolts heads which can be swapped fairly easily by the user to change cartridge base/bolt face diameters.

Greg

 

[BoilerUP]

Thanks Ring; I have exchanged emails with Dan in the past and he'd be my "go-to" for a Rem-Age conversion.

 

[BoilerUP]

Paul, I looked at the link above (northland shooters) as you suggested and I added another dilemma as a result. What are those numbers representing and which do I need? I was looking to find the savage 12 ftr barrel but it appears they don't have the 12 twist as the factory model.

The numbers on the NSS page represent bolt face sizes; .378 is a 223-based bolt head, .473 is a 308-based bolt head. Of course, a Savage bolt head can be changed in less than 15 minutes from one size to another.

Two-digit model numbers are short actions, three-digit model numbers are long actions.

As for what you "need", it all depends on what you want. You can buy a Stevens 200 in a 308-based caliber (22-250, 243, 308) and sell the factory barrel to help finance your build, get an older Model 11 package gun (or newer 11 Hunter XP, NOT the 11 Trophy Hunter XP) and do the same thing. Or you can buy an action new or used and use that as the basis of your build...

Really, there's LOTS of ways to skin a cat with a Savage.

At this point, I might recommend figuring out EXACTLY what specifications you want your rifle to have. Then buy the factory rifle closest to that, shoot it a while to see what does and does not work, and THEN down the road start making the changes to suit you.

A build will get you there quicker and for less money, but you'll need to spend some time doing research here and over at SavageShooters if you don't want to spend money and time unnecessarily.

 

[Cat64]

"buy a Stevens 200 in a 308-based caliber (22-250, 243, 308) and sell the factory barrel to help finance your build, get an older Model 11 package gun (or newer 11 Hunter XP, NOT the 11 Trophy Hunter XP) and do the same thing. Or you can buy an action new or used and use that as the basis of your build..."

So, please correct me if I am wrong, you suggest buying either a Stevens 200 or a an 11 Hunter XP, sell the barrel, keep the action, buy the FTR barrel I want elsewhere and then put on the stock I want. Is that combo going to have an action comparable to the one the factory FTR model would have including the trigger?

 

[Cat64]

Is the combination of a Stevens 200 or an 11 Hunter XP action + the 30" barrel (which goes with the factory F/TR) going to be same/better than buying the Model 12 F/TR? If that is a possibility would I need to mess with the trigger? I would than find the stock I want. Just a thought based on above data.

 

[Cat64]

OK. I think I collected most of the facts I need. My remaining dilemma (here is that word again) is choosing between the F/TR in a 308 or go with the F-Class (6BR Norma) or the BR (6BR Norma). I am mostly looking at barrel life and what they each offer. Since I already have a 308 for variety I was considering the 6BR and it appears most people here believe that longer distance the 6BR will outperform the 308.

Thoughts...comments...

 

[GONE BAD]

Cat, you are on the right track with the Savage model 12 with the target series action. The model 12 LRP is the way I would go. 6's are nice for the tactical games but the 6.5's are good for everything. 260, 6.5 cm or 6.5x47. I just had Savage build a custom for me in a 260 (because I have all the loading stuff for it) it is built on a model 12 target action with CDI bottom metal for the 10 round magazines. It is a shooter! Savage will build you anything! One other question about the Tikka ? Why not build off of it? I think its an excellent rifle. Or are you just wanting to try something else?

 

[Cat64]

Cat, you are on the right track with the Savage model 12 with the target series action. The model 12 LRP is the way I would go. 6's are nice for the tactical games but the 6.5's are good for everything. 260, 6.5 cm or 6.5x47. I just had Savage build a custom for me in a 260 (because I have all the loading stuff for it) it is built on a model 12 target action with CDI bottom metal for the 10 round magazines. It is a shooter! Savage will build you anything! One other question about the Tikka ? Why not build off of it? I think its an excellent rifle. Or are you just wanting to try something else?

Well...all very legitimate points. First like yourself I wanted to stick with the 308 because I have all the reloading stuff and info for it. Second I guess I keep on hearing about the 260 and I am becoming curious. Perhaps you can give some more tips on that platform. Third for some reason I just felt the 6BR has a flair of "sexiness" if you wish around the whole concept and I was intrigued. Fourth my Tikka is a great rifle but components are not very readily found and I didn't know where to start first.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Catlin;

I just saw your WTB for the Savage Standard Bolt Head Target Action and F T/R Stock in the WTB section.

First, they are available direct from Savage for somewhere in the area of $600-$650-ish, and come with everything you'll need but the stock screws. I suspect you can get them from Savage too if you order direct. Somewhere along the line, it might make sense to disable the ejector so it doesn't send your fired brass far and wide, but rather leaves it lying nice and docile/clean inside the receiver, where it can be easily plucked out. At first thought, it may appear more expensive (or not) to purchase direct from Savage, but doing so gives you something significant which isn't available anywhere else, factory warrantee service. You might find having that option worth the (maybe) extra buckage.

Second, buying the factory F T/R stock (regardless of the source) will not be cheap (I think they are very, perhaps overly, pricey), and when it arrives, it will be without any adjustability option. I think a better plan would be for the McMillan F-Class Stock. I favor it for its parallel bottom surface on both forend and buttstock. Nothing will ride bags better than such a configuration; and all the adjustability features are available with the Mac. This could also get pricey, but the advantages clearly favor the Mac.

Personally I don't like the .308, and suggest the 6BR and an F Open role for the rifle, which will get you off the bipod and onto the bags.

If you intend F Class at 1000yd, you would do well with a chambering that's got more oomph than either 6BR or .308; I suggest the .280 Rem because the ballistics are better (functionally it can be thought of as a 7mm-'06), and it may not be the barrel burner the 6.5-284 most definitely is. You could get the long action (and I really don't see any practical disadvantage with a single shot action like the Savage Target). You could even get the Short one, and since there is no magazine, there is also no need for any consideration beyond hand feeding, and the extraction only becomes an issue with unfired rounds. For them, simply releasing the bolt so it can travel further resolves that issue in the few instances where you are dealing with such cartridges. I have already demonstrated to myself that a fired .30-'06 (operationally identical to a .280 Rem) case will clear the ejection port with normal bolt operation in a regular 10FP Short Action.

For a barrel, I suggest a Lothar Walther LW-50 Stainless barrel, SAMMI chambered in .280 Rem, finished with at least a 26" length; and the .280 can significantly benefit from even up to a 32" length. With the SAAMI chamber, standard two-die sets get the job done. Popular lore suggests that for a 'standard' .280 Rem chambering, the twist is 1:9", and that 1:8" is needed for anything over 168gr. In a 'normal' length that could be true, but I suspect that at 28" and longer, the 175 may get by with the 1:9". I think this is also all academic because the 168 will definitely get to job done out to at least 1000yd and in a 28" or longer barrel, the 150 will act just like or better than a .30-'06 with a 155 Palma. In other words, no problem here; and it will tame the recoil more effectively. Believe me, 40 shots plus sighters prone can get tedious in a hurry. Mediating recoil can be a big factor in your performance and your enjoyment.

The 6 can be sexy as you say, but I suspect it's a stretch sending it all the way out to 1Kyd. The .280 can perform (at least) with the 6.5-284, should have little or no more recoil than a truly LR capable .308, and probably can do it with better bore life too. The recoil of a .280/168 should be similar with (or slightly less than) .30-'06 168 FGMM, and you can make the 150 do the job with a longer than average barrel. If you are still overwhelmed by the recoil, you can add ballast, and (also) even place a sandbag between butt and shoulder (it's not mounted on the rifle so the weight is not counted against the overall limit), supplying yet more mass to absorb more recoil. Getting a short LOP on the stock and providing maximum adjustability (at least 4", if possible) of LOP extensibility would make that last suggestion more practical.

I hope this all helps.

Greg

PS, I see the advice about the .260, etc., and it's good advice. All I would add is that, after three years of 1Kyd F Open comp with the .260, is that, yes, its better than the .308. But it also usually falls onto the rails before the 6.5-284 juggernaut. A .280 could beat it at its own game

 

[Greene]

I would highly consider 260 or 6.5 cm for what you are wanting to do. Either will get you to 1000+ yds with ease and the right bullet combo. Components are pretty easy to come by, great brass on the Hornady 6.5 cm., and overall a great do all setup.

I started competing in tactical comps using a home build 260 CBI barreled setup. They are very accurate rifles. There are good and bad to both. Main plus to savage builds is the do it yourself aspect and overall budget. I have evolved and moved up to some custom remmy clones (Defiance actions). Some of the things I like on the remmy road is better easier choices for DBM, etc. I have the CDI on my savage and its pretty good, but you can get the PTG Stealth for $100 and is a badge clone. I also like the better extractor options for remmy, as under not so nice conditions a stronger spring and extractor can be handy. Down side to remmy, is a smith is needed to fit the barrel. I have no experience with the pre-fit barrels for remington but some on here may.

I got off on a little bit of a side trail. If you can't find the parts to put the Savage together I would recommend the Predator Hunter Max series in 260 or 6.5cm package. Has a varmint 8 twist barrel 24", pop it out of the factory stock and into a stock of your choice and go shooting. Or just buy the LRP version.

If you were to want to build a remmy contact me and I have a smith who is great with them and very reasonable prices.

Hope I have not confused you. Just laying out the things I have found.

Any questions you may have please feel free to ask.

Greene

 

[GONE BAD]

Cat, I would not buy anything yet! You need to gain all info you can on rifles and chamberings before you buy. That Tikka is a great platform to work off of and a web search can get you going. One last thing about the 260. take a 260 round with 140 vld's and put it next to a 300 wm with 210 vld's and look at the ballistics. Another thing about the savage, their short action magazines are long enough to load the long bullets. In the 2.900+ range.Oh and the recoil of the 6.5's is like nothing.

 

[Cat64]

You guys are great. I mean it. I never met any of you but I feel like you are my friends. Anyway, some of your advice is telling me to "take my time and do more research". Well...guys...we men don’t do very well with "waiting"...so for this one I think I made up my mind. Again, I listen to all your suggestions, read a lot, drawn the line and made a decision (I know that some of you probably are still not agreeing with me 100%...but guys, we will never totally agree...not all of us). I want to buy/build a Savage Model 12 6BR (or similar).
Now the fun part begins. I am debating whether to buy a factory rifle and take it from there or if I should start with parts? Buying the rifle would mean I have what I need to start shooting soon. I will need the rings and optics and in time I will make whatever adjustments I will desire (i.e. changing the stock, etc). If I go the buying route, which one is going to offer me “more” of what I want: the BR model or the F-Class model? Where are some places I can look for either for a new rifle of for parts to assemble? Also I read that a 6BR Norma will not accommodate the Lapua cases? Is that accurate? Well let’s stop here for now. Hope you guys have a blessed, peaceful weekend.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

OK, reviewing the Savage factory offerings, the 6mmBR Norma is only available in the 12BR model, but my choice for the best bag rider is the stock from the 12F Class. I would be fairly certain a call to the Savage Custom people, requesting the 6mmBR Norma barreled 12BR barreled action being mated to the F Class Stock would be a 'can do'. I think it's worth a try, that a factory assembled and warrantied gun is worth at least the asking price, and it might/could be the most direct (and maybe most cost effective, too...) route to your heart's desire.

Hope you too have a blessed, peaceful weekend.

Greg

 

[Capt Beach]

Been shooting SAVAGES for a long time...longer than some on here have been alive...

Have you considered .243AI...107 SMK or Bergers at 3000fps+ or very close to...uses a standard .308 bolt head, uses standard Lapua 243 brass thats fire formed after first shooting, improved barrel life over the standard 243 and others

I've got one that puts 5 into one ragged hole...

If your serious about building a Savage head over and join Savage Shooters Forum and dive in head first...for about $100 in specialized tools you can be a member of the Barrel Nut Club...

Capt Beach

 

[Cat64]

Greg, I am just looking at Savage Arms website and the 12 Norma BR is available in F class stock (30 inch barrel) or in BR model (29 inch barrel)

 

[Cat64]

Been shooting SAVAGES for a long time...longer than some on here have been alive...

If your serious about building a Savage head over and join Savage Shooters Forum and dive in head first...for about $100 in specialized tools you can be a member of the Barrel Nut Club...

Capt Beach

Can you tell more about this. I am very interested Capt.

Cat

 

[jbjh]

Can you tell more about this. I am very interested Capt.

Cat

Cat,

The tools Capt is talking about are a barrel nut wrench, action vice, and Go/No-Go gauges for setting the headspace. If you intend on doing a lot of barrel changes, or building more than one gun (its very addictive) then it is worth investing in the tools. If you are going to do this once, there's a good chance you can borrow the tools.

 

[Cat64]

Good morning Greg. Hope you will have a wonderful weekend. The reason I am considering the purchasing route is because it will put in my hands a good rifle ready to go vs. getting the parts which I will have to spend time finding and then putting them together. I wish I'd have you closer to eventually guide me through the assembly process; however at this point I am wondering how much I would really save and how much more quality I would add to the rifle going the building route. Full of dilemmas am I
( to paraphrase Yoda).

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Right you are, I must have missed that when I brought up the Site's Gun Finder app yesterday evening. Aside from the absence of adjustable stock ergonomics, the F Class looks just the ticket.

I'm not a gun builder.

I have always trusted my rifles to Dan Shumway, the principal at Dark Eagle Customs. We have been family friends for many years now, and his background far exceeds any requirements I can imagine in a master gunsmith's portfolio. I know how good he is because I shoot what he makes. I don't do as well as I probable could because I'm really too antsy to buckle down and follow the program. The part about guns shooting rings around their owners definitely applies where my employment of his work is concerned; and in some ways I hesitate to associate my performance with his work because my own performance really should be better. His guns are not even marginally a cause for my shortcomings.

Depending on your stature and degree of fitness, you may find you can match up to the Savage stock, or at most satisfy your needs by fitting up a stock pack to achieve a suitable cheek weld. The stock pack should have enough space in front of it to allow bolt removal without disturbing the stock pack. I would suggest your scope mountings conform to a goal of keeping the scope clearance down to about 1/16", and that you then use the resulting optical axis to serve as the basis for determining cheek rest height. I do this by inserting 3/6" wide strips cut from a sheet of Foamies Craft Foam, 2MM thick or 5mm thick, a firm and flexible Neoprene foam. Be sure to then adjust the eye relief front to rear to match your most comfortable prone NPA. If you need more LOP, the simplest way, within limits, is to append a Limbsaver Slip-On Recoil Pad, ask the Dealer or Savage about which size works best; I'm guessing a Large, but I really can't say with any certainty. I find that as long as you are buying a straight, non-customized Savage catalogue item, the right Dealer can save you some buckage; mine always has.

Greg

 

[Cat64]

Ok Greg. Thank you again. You might not be the builder but you certainly have know-how and the insight. I appreciate it. I will try to find the best place to get a factory rifle. Where is a good place to look for railing and rings which will not be so expensive? And which one/specs you recommend. For a scope I was looking at a vortex viper x25. I have on my 308 a mil dot x 20 which I love.

 

[Cat64]

And one more question my friend ( haven't met you in person but based on our communication past and present I feel that way) where do I turn for the necessary tools/ components to start reloading for the 6mm BR cartridge. I have a Lee turret press which I converted to a single stage after I learned the meticulous process if you wish of case preparation. Looking at the information on AccurateShooter.com 6mmBR.com -- Best Guide to Precision Shooting and Precision Rifle Accuracy I see they suggest a few things but was wondering which I really need. And have you heard about Norma cases being different than Lapua?

 

[Greg Langelius *]

I have a Ken Farrel 20MOA and I like it, but I also think I could get by with something not quite as tall. That said, I use Weaver rings when I can find the ones with 4 or more ring/cap screws, medium height for a 40-44mm Objective diameter, high for a 50mm diameter. F Class doesn't (or shouldn't) subject a scope and mounts to the kinds of stresses that might mandate a Tactical Grade mounting system. A properly torqued and Loctited pair of Weaver bases, or a Leupold or Redding(?) 'JR' windage adjustable base should do OK. By favorite Weaver/Picatinny-style rings at Burris Signature 'Zee' rings, which have bushing inserts that prevent scope damage and are available with offset values that can allow windage and elevation correction for less-than-perfect base alignments.

The Vortex Viper gets good comment around here. I make do with a Weaver V-24, and it's adequate for our club's FV-250 matches (F Cass rules, 250yd distance, fired on an old traditional 'V'-style target sized for the distance; we design and print our own, two scoring bulls on legal size paper). I like the V-24 a lot.

Greg

 

[Greg Langelius *]

I use Lapua brass and a Redding two die (expander ball) set for my 30BR which starts out with Lapua 6mmBR brass. The only press I have ever used is a Dillon RL550B press I picked up used around 1995. I don't seem to have any problem producing match ammo on my 550; and I'm sure others might disagree (to-may-to/to-mah-to).

Beyond that, I have no knowledge, and my 30BR uses a .344" diameter 'no-turn' neck. I am a fan of 'the least work possible' in reloading approach. I think you will find about all the info you need to win at Yo's 6mmBR.com site that you mentioned. Excepting my 30BR (which is my only custom built rifle), all my rifles use SAAMI chambers. If I ever had to sell any of them, I would not want to be forcing anyone to adapt their ammunition needs to something uncommon in order to shoot them safely.

Be advised that Redding will not sell for below list prices to individuals, so their dealers don't get undercut by the supplier; a sound business practice. You may find better prices from dealers, who have more pricing options.

My favorite rings are Burris Signature 'Zee' rings. They employ self aligning insert bushings that prevent/reduce scope damage, and can also be obtained with offsets that can correct the mounting to compensate for scope base windage misalignments or and/even provide an equivalent to base slope. With them, a properly torqued and Loctited pair of individual bases can be adequate.

You can also use Leupold (and other brands) 'JR'-style windage adjustable bases which have their own special design rings.

Greg

 

[Cat64]

Thank you Greg. I found the following rings I like.
Burris Xtreme Tactical Picatinny Style Rail 30mm Rings 420166 420167 420164 420165 420162 420163 420160 420161
Burris Zee Signature 30mm Rifle Scope Mount Rings for Weaver Bases FREE S&H 420587, 420588, 420585. Burris Riflescope Mounts, Rings & Bases..
What base could I use with those?

 

[Capt Beach]

Thank you Greg. I found the following rings I like.
Burris Xtreme Tactical Picatinny Style Rail 30mm Rings 420166 420167 420164 420165 420162 420163 420160 420161
Burris Zee Signature 30mm Rifle Scope Mount Rings for Weaver Bases FREE S&H 420587, 420588, 420585. Burris Riflescope Mounts, Rings & Bases..
What base could I use with those?

Match the Burris XTreme PICATINNY to a PICATINNY RAIL...like an EGW