Rifle Scopes SEALs Scope... I know!!!

[Mute]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

You seem to fail to understand that many on this forum have owned and tested scopes (both cheap and expensive) that when dialed .1 mil or .25 moa, it does, in fact, adjust to that measurement. Countersnipers don't. You've confirmed it as has many others. If that doesn't define it as junk, I don't know what does.

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

Did you watch my video? In it I convert mils to inches at 100 yards. There are 3600 inches in 100 yards so a mil would be 1000th of that, 3.6 inches. I'm pretty sure I know how to do a tracking test. Just make the adjustments and shoot consistently, right?

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

I hear what you're saying. But my experience with other scopes hasn't shown me that the adjustments are significantly more accurate, except for the Viper PST.

 

[Kevlars]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

Dude. You are delusional. The CS does not repeat does not have a repeatable correction. And that is from personal experience. If three people tell you are drunk, you better sit down.

The magnitude of experience that you are rejectining is astounding.

Do you work for CS or have any interest I them? Or is it that you are such a noob that you would not know the difference between quality and a scam?

I work with electrical engineers and machanical engineers all day and your defiance to the simple fact of that crap scope is just amazing.

 

[Mute]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I hear what you're saying. But my experience with other scopes hasn't shown me that the adjustments are significantly more accurate, except for the Viper PST. </div></div>

Then you don't know what you're doing. Period. The good scopes (and no, not just expensive ones) will track accurately. Period.

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Then you don't know what you're doing. Period. The good scopes (and no, not just expensive ones) will track accurately. Period. </div></div>

Then someone please, explain to me my error. What I do in these tracking tests is simple.
1) Zero the scope.
2) Adjust to the desired point of impact, if the desired point of impact is x left and y up from the point of aim the adjustments should be:
In MOA = atan(x/distance)*60
In mils = (x/distance)*1000
3) Shoot consistently, don't flinch, lean into bipod, I'm pretty sure I have this part right because I make groups that are 1/4-1/3 MOA
4) Adjust to the next point of impact.
etc.

What's going wrong?

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

Don't just insult me. What am I doing wrong?

 

[rivemor]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

At first it was fuun watching people defending Counter Sniper but now it's beating a dead horse.

 

[Mute]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

First, check your mounts and rings and make sure you're torqued at the correct values.

Second, how many rounds are you firing when you adjust your dials? Are you firing only a single shot? Do you trust both your rifle and your own skill enough to know that that one shot is a reliable indicator of the tracking (e.g. your rifle doesn't have a POI shift as it heats up)?

Third, have another shooter, whose shooting skills you find to be reliable, do the same test and see if the results are the same.

Bottom line, you need to eliminate the most likely variables before jumping to a conclusion.

 

[Graham]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

Please don't feed the Trolls.

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> First, check your mounts and rings and make sure you're torqued at the correct values. </div></div>
I don't have a torque wrench for this kind of thing. I have one for doing engine bolts... But I crank everything as tight as it can reasonably go with appropriate tools and add high strength Loctite. Is over torquing going to cause problems with tracking? I don't see a problem with holding zero and shooting precisely. All my groups fall below about 1/2 MOA.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Second, how many rounds are you firing when you adjust your dials? Are you firing only a single shot? Do you trust both your rifle and your own skill enough to know that that one shot is a reliable indicator of the tracking (e.g. your rifle doesn't have a POI shift as it heats up)? </div></div>
I'm firing just one shot at each point. I trust my rifle and myself to reliably put rounds in a 1/2 MOA at 100 yards. I've never noticed a point of impact shift as the barrel heats up. My first groups of the day are typically just as good as any other. Maybe this is something I should test more rigorously.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Third, have another shooter, whose shooting skills you find to be reliable, do the same test and see if the results are the same. </div></div>
Unfortunately, I don't know anyone personally that shoots better than me and I would trust to do this.

There's not anything fundamentally wrong with my procedure, right?

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

Well, Vortex got back to me and told me to send it in for evaluation.

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

Can someone show me a good tracking test of a ~$400 scope and a ~$1000 scope, please? I want to see what everyone is talking about.

 

[Powder_Burns]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

If you search the site there is a review with a tracking test of the Counter Sniper scope. It failed the box test.

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

OK... What about a GOOD tracking test?

 

[O_W]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

get a paper plate put it at 100 yard (3600 inches) and follow the instructions below.
<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/OhqxF40M4Cg"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/OhqxF40M4Cg" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

Some people on this forum are professionals at responding to questions with non-answers.

 

[O_W]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<---- not a professional but i do play one on tv.


Dude this thread has long outlived its useful life. Now it is a punching bag.

 

[cpt.creedmoor]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

dude, nobody is going to give you the answer you seek...simply because nobody here gives two squirts of monkey piss about a counter shitter scope...no one is going to waste their time playing silly fuck fuck games with you over this scope...you have been told these scopes are shit, however you continue to babble your bullshit baiting people to engage you in silly shit.


smart money would be to shut up about this and let it die...you are only solidifying the fact that you look more and more like a troll/numbnuts...let it go dude and try to fit in and be a productive member of this board or continue on this path...but be advised if you continue on with this goofy shit these guys will eventually get tired of it and then they will hurt you bad...


take it for what its worth man.


have a nice day....and may the force be with you.......always

 

[SQUATCH]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

Counter Sniper Scope bite on Mr. Peter Martinson's forehead aka armednsafe. It could be the reason for illogical thinking.

 

[Inogame]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You wouldn't know a reasoned argument if it was etched on your reticle. </div></div>

What if was etched on the reticle in the reticle?

 

[deadly0311]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">OK... What about a GOOD tracking test? </div></div>

Of the countersniper? I did one, Its in the Optics FAQ sticky at the top of this sub forum.

in fact here is a hot link

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1300810&nt=8&page=2

 

[O_W]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">OK... What about a GOOD tracking test? </div></div>

Of the countersniper? I did one, Its in the Optics FAQ sticky at the top of this sub forum. </div></div>


Neither google use nor reading comprehension is on his course list at iowa state apparently

 

[VJJPunisher]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

If you mount it, they will come



And by "they" I mean repair men, customer service reps, and retards

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

I'm not asking questions about the Counter Sniper scope anymore, but scopes in general. Since I've had bad luck with them in the past, I think my expectations were a lowered by a possibly defective Nikon. If you don't want to have anything to do with me, you don't have to. Why are you threatening me? Do you feel like a big man insulting someone in an internet forum for asking questions? It doesn't take any integrity, intelligence, or knowledge to come up with an insult. Again, if you don't want to participate or help me out, no one's forcing you to. You just look like an idiot bitching about something that doesn't affect you.

 

[O_W]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/YoPVC4YxDlI"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/YoPVC4YxDlI" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

That was actually my Nikon Buckmasters, not that it makes a big difference.

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: over_watch</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">OK... What about a GOOD tracking test? </div></div>

Of the countersniper? I did one, Its in the Optics FAQ sticky at the top of this sub forum. </div></div>


Neither google use nor reading comprehension is on his course list at iowa state apparently </div></div>

So, I can find plenty of tracking tests using high end scopes, and they do really well. I can find tracking tests with cheap scopes that don't do very well. But I can't find any tracking tests of cheap scopes doing well. If I am just shitty at using google, show me one.

And I wasn't asking for another tracking test with a Counter Sniper. I thought that was obvious to most people. I was asking for a tracking test that turned out well with OTHER scopes in the price range and in the price range of a Viper PST 6-24x50mm FFP.

 

[cpt.creedmoor]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm not asking questions about the Counter Sniper scope anymore, but scopes in general. Since I've had bad luck with them in the past, I think my expectations were a lowered by a possibly defective Nikon. If you don't want to have anything to do with me, you don't have to. Why are you threatening me? Do you feel like a big man insulting someone in an internet forum for asking questions? It doesn't take any integrity, intelligence, or knowledge to come up with an insult. Again, if you don't want to participate or help me out, no one's forcing you to. You just look like an idiot bitching about something that doesn't affect you. </div></div>


Please show me where I threatened you.....you fuckin dunce...

 

[rivemor]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Can someone show me a good tracking test of a ~$400 scope and a ~$1000 scope, please? I want to see what everyone is talking about. </div></div>

If you look at the other forum post:

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1300810&gonew=1#UNREAD

LoneWolfUSMC AKA John at 8541tactical.com was looking to do a track test for his youtube channel. However, the Counter Sniper he recieved was broken. Send him your CS and he can track test against his NF F1 and post it up to youtube. He will send your CS back once the test is over.

 

[O_W]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cpt.creedmoor</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm not asking questions about the Counter Sniper scope anymore, but scopes in general. Since I've had bad luck with them in the past, I think my expectations were a lowered by a possibly defective Nikon. If you don't want to have anything to do with me, you don't have to. Why are you threatening me? Do you feel like a big man insulting someone in an internet forum for asking questions? It doesn't take any integrity, intelligence, or knowledge to come up with an insult. Again, if you don't want to participate or help me out, no one's forcing you to. You just look like an idiot bitching about something that doesn't affect you. </div></div>


Please show me where I threatened you.....you fuckin <span style="text-decoration: line-through">dunce</span><span style="color: #FF0000">douche</span>...

</div></div>


fixed it for you...

 

[shankster..]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cpt.creedmoor</div><div class="ubbcode-body">dude, nobody is going to give you the answer you seek...simply because nobody here gives two squirts of monkey piss about a counter shitter scope...no one is going to waste their time playing silly fuck fuck games with you over this scope...you have been told these scopes are shit, however you continue to babble your bullshit baiting people to engage you in silly shit.


smart money would be to shut up about this and let it die...you are only solidifying the fact that you look more and more like a troll/numbnuts...let it go dude and try to fit in and be a productive member of this board or continue on this path...but be advised if you continue on with this goofy shit these guys will eventually get tired of it and then they will hurt you bad...


take it for what its worth man.


have a nice day....and may the force be with you.......always </div></div>

I guess you threatened me indirectly, but it seems like a thinly veiled threat.

 

[shankster..]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cpt.creedmoor</div><div class="ubbcode-body">dude, nobody is going to give you the answer you seek...simply because nobody here gives two squirts of monkey piss about a counter shitter scope...no one is going to waste their time playing silly fuck fuck games with you over this scope...you have been told these scopes are shit, however you continue to babble your bullshit baiting people to engage you in silly shit.


smart money would be to shut up about this and let it die...you are only solidifying the fact that you look more and more like a troll/numbnuts...let it go dude and try to fit in and be a productive member of this board or continue on this path...but be advised if you continue on with this goofy shit these guys will eventually get tired of it and then they will hurt you bad...


take it for what its worth man.


have a nice day....and may the force be with you.......always </div></div>

I guess you threatened me directly, but it seems like a thinly veiled threat. </div></div>

<span style="font-weight: bold">I threaten to love you tenderly if I got the chance.</span>

 

[O_W]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

GO AWAY!

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rives</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Can someone show me a good tracking test of a ~$400 scope and a ~$1000 scope, please? I want to see what everyone is talking about. </div></div>

If you look at the other forum post:

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1300810&gonew=1#UNREAD

LoneWolfUSMC AKA John at 8541tactical.com was looking to do a track test for his youtube channel. However, the Counter Sniper he recieved was broken. Send him your CS and he can track test against his NF F1 and post it up to youtube. He will send your CS back once the test is over. </div></div>

Why would anyone compare a CS to a NF?

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shankster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cpt.creedmoor</div><div class="ubbcode-body">dude, nobody is going to give you the answer you seek...simply because nobody here gives two squirts of monkey piss about a counter shitter scope...no one is going to waste their time playing silly fuck fuck games with you over this scope...you have been told these scopes are shit, however you continue to babble your bullshit baiting people to engage you in silly shit.


smart money would be to shut up about this and let it die...you are only solidifying the fact that you look more and more like a troll/numbnuts...let it go dude and try to fit in and be a productive member of this board or continue on this path...but be advised if you continue on with this goofy shit these guys will eventually get tired of it and then they will hurt you bad...


take it for what its worth man.


have a nice day....and may the force be with you.......always </div></div>

I guess you threatened me directly, but it seems like a thinly veiled threat. </div></div>

<span style="font-weight: bold">I threaten to love you tenderly if I got the chance.</span> </div></div>

Cute...

 

[cpt.creedmoor]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I guess you threatened me indirectly, but it seems like a thinly veiled threat. </div></div>



you seem like a thinly veiled simpleton....

 

[BCP]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shankster</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="font-weight: bold">I threaten to love you tenderly if I got the chance.</span> </div></div>

Buy me a nice dinner, take me out to the bar and I'm yours. I haven't had action in months

 

[Chiller]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shankster</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="font-weight: bold">I threaten to love you tenderly if I got the chance.</span> </div></div>

Buy me a nice dinner, take me out to the bar and I'm yours. I haven't had action in months

</div></div>

Wrong on so many levels......

 

[user]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: D_TROS</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

</div></div>

Thanks some funny shit +1

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

So, I talked to Frank Miller, a tech at Dark Ops, and he suggested that the problem is the way I tightened the turrets back down after zeroing them. He said that the way the set screws are supposed to be tightened is to apply a little torque at a time on each one. Is this normal? Because it could cause the problems I've had with the Buckmasters and the Viper PST.
Also, I asked him about locking the turrets to hold a zero, and he said with lighter recoiling rifles it shouldn't matter but since I was shooting with a .338, I should lock the turrets.

 

[cpt.creedmoor]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

lol...

 

[Graham]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So, I talked to Frank Miller, a tech at Dark Ops, and he suggested that the problem is the way I tightened the turrets back down after zeroing them...</div></div>Wrong answer. Like we did, he must have seen you coming.

 

[-Nick-]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So, I talked to Frank Miller, a tech at Dark Ops, and he suggested that the problem is the way I tightened the turrets back down after zeroing them. He said that the way the set screws are supposed to be tightened is to apply a little torque at a time on each one. Is this normal? Because it could cause the problems I've had with the Buckmasters and the Viper PST.
Also, I asked him about locking the turrets to hold a zero, and he said with lighter recoiling rifles it shouldn't matter but since I was shooting with a .338, I should lock the turrets. </div></div>

Well there you have it. The right answer from the very people that made that piece of... I mean that scope.

Did you have a Vortex Viper PST and you instead went with a Counter Sniper?

 

[-Nick-]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So, I talked to Frank Miller, a tech at Dark Ops, and he suggested that the problem is the way I tightened the turrets back down after zeroing them...</div></div>Wrong answer. Like we did, he must have seen you coming. </div></div>

And he sold him another one since it's best to have a back-up in case a turret breaks. At least that's what the SEAL's do...

 

[Graham]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

Their business model is to make money, once, from each moron who doesn't know any better and who won't first take the time to learn. It's a very successful model.

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

No, I bought the PST after.

 

[-Nick-]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armednsafe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No, I bought the PST after. </div></div>

That's your inner common sense trying to help you. Listen to it... It's saying... "Fuck that Counter Sniper crap... Use the Vortex"

 

[armednsafe]

Re: SEALs Scope... I know!!!

I still have the Counter Sniper, and if I can make it work in some capacity that's better than taking a hammer to it.