my googlefu isn’t getting me an answer. Why did Seekins go with a 22in barrel and rifle length gas system on their 6.5 Creedmore SP10? Did they spec the port hole smaller rather than go with a +2 gas length?
Seekins SP10 Gas System
- Thread starter Jigstick
- Start date
I understand that. And while that can help mitigate some of the problems I believe it has less of an affect on bolt lock / unlock timing
That’s a good question. How about you can’t access the set screws without taking off the Foreend or cutting a slat out? I wish they did the +2 so folks could use their adjustable gas block with the throw lever. I still like the gun but that is annoying.
Exactly. I just ordered one and added them toolless gas block. But it’s going to be recessed under the handguard because they won’t do a +2 gas system on it unless I cough up $ for them SP10M variant. So I’m stuck dealing with the dwell time / gas issues.
I could always cut 2 inches off the barrel and remedy the issue...but that’s if their gas port holes are the right diameter for rifle length gas.
I could always cut 2 inches off the barrel and remedy the issue...but that’s if their gas port holes are the right diameter for rifle length gas.
I've personally addressed this issue with seekins and spoken with a some of the department heads. A few months back I bought a SP10 in 6.5CM strictly for review purposes here on Snipers Hide. I'm about 3/4 of the way done with the review, I've put 300rds down the OEM Barrel consisting of hand loads and match box ammo. All testing at this point has been done with the rifle setup as it came from the manufacturer. I've now started the last phase of the evaluation with pulling the OEM barrel and replacing it with the custom Bartlein with a +2 Gas system, I will also be replacing the OEM Trigger, BCG and Buffer system. I feel that this will not only be an informative evaluation of the SP-10 but will also show if the high-end improvements make a large enough difference to justify the extra cost.
Yeah now I’ll have mill out the handguard to get access to that throw lever. Not thrilled about that but oh well. Could always cut 2in off the barrel and knock it back to 20in. With the rifle length gas system that should help with any dwell time issues.
No don't do that I've already spoken to them about that and it won't have enough Dwell time. You need to stop putting it on you to do these mods. Seekins is one hell of a company and they will do whatever they have to to make sure the customer is satisfied and that includes milling out your handguard to give you easy access to the gas block adjustment. I had them do several small modifications to my rifle including the one you are having trouble with right now, and not only are they happy to do it but they'll cerakote the parts after they machine them for you.
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So quick question: if you get the throw lever gas block and install it, will it fit under the handguard? It’s not the best but I’d do that and then switch it with a stick or Allen key or something. Let me know. I may just do that.
The Seekins SP10 has a .750 gas block so plenty of room under the handguard and the throw lever AGB has a large and small lever option.
Ok. Thanks! It will be a pain to flip under the handguard but I carry a pocket knife always.
Other than the gas block, gun is a boss!
@bigjake83 did you ask Seekins why they haven’t machined an Arca type rail into their handguard yet? Seems like a no brained.
Other than the gas block, gun is a boss!
@bigjake83 did you ask Seekins why they haven’t machined an Arca type rail into their handguard yet? Seems like a no brained.
TBAC Ultra 7 tax stamp is in route. Placing on a SP10 308. Instructions from SP seem pretty clear In re to adjusting the gas. My apologies, is this a 6.5 SP10 issue only? Thank you
No I haven't asked but if I had to guess I would say it's probably because Glenn knows that these are primarily range toys and people are going to rip them up and rebuild them the way they want. But who knows maybe if you keep talking about the integrated arca rail he might make a special handguard option for it, The SP-10 handguards are all interchangeable with each other so can't see why they couldn't make a optional handguard style with it built in.
Well just watch for my review, It will highlight all the positives and the shortcomings of the SP-10... Spoil alert the rifling gas is one of the shortcomings. I'm still waiting on my custom Bartlein to be spun up so I can compare If there is any real difference or benefit between the OEM Rock Creek barrels and a Custom Bartlein.
I’m interested to hear your review once you’ve completed it. I bought an SP-10 a couple years ago for my first large frame AR, and I was thinking that I might put a Bartlein on it in a few years - after I’ve had some time to develop my shooting more. It’s already an accurate gun, but there’s always the “what if” in the back of my mind.
Well I hope it’s minute of groundhog or better. I have no desire to build my own. I’ve always had good performance with my other Seekins products.
The Seekins is a very accurate platform, definitely outreaching the potential of most shooters... Here are some groups from my first round of load development and testing some box ammo. I strive for sub 1/2 MOA on my set ups, Large and small Frame alike and to alot of people thats probably a bit ridiculous to expect from a rifle that is essentially a machine that has a lot of variables that contribute to accuracy inconsistency.
But the rifle length gas system on the 6.5CM is definitely one of the aspects that could be approved upon... But has it caused me any operation failures or accuracy issues???...No Sir! But the SP10 definitely could use a few refinements.
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@Jigstick you will be happy with the SP-10. Mine is stock and still continues to impress. Truth be told I’m not the best on a gas gun but these things shoot. I did a post a while back with my first few outings.
www.snipershide.com
I planned on doing the same as @bigjake83 with a barrel swap. I ordered a 22” Proof plus 2 but I just can’t bring myself to swap it out. The plan is to shoot it as is until the original barrel is gone and the put the Proof on it.
New Seekins SP10 is a keeper
I loaded up 17 rounds to try out in the 6.5 SP10 @100yd. Put them all in the mag and shot 14 myself and my buddy shot the last 3 in the middle. I’d say she shoots good. To bad I only have 83 of the 140bthp left... and then onto trying the 140 Amax stash. This was rounds 21-37 on the new rifle...
www.snipershide.com
I planned on doing the same as @bigjake83 with a barrel swap. I ordered a 22” Proof plus 2 but I just can’t bring myself to swap it out. The plan is to shoot it as is until the original barrel is gone and the put the Proof on it.
The lever gas block might fit under the handguard with a .750 barrel but not with an .875 barrel. As to the rifle gas length. I have an sp10 that with the original 6.5cm Seekins barrel and the Seekins GB completely closed, it would still lock back on an empty mag with my AAC titan QD can attached and still brat the hell outa the brass. Thats a 338 can so there is lots of room for gas in it. I do not understand why Glenn went with a rifle gas instead of a +2. I would imagine it had something to do with setup cost? I have since switched the barrel out with a 20" Krieger 308, slash buffer/spring and milled my handgaurd for the lever adjustable GB and it hammers 185 jugs! Lever gas block is the shit!
I followed their instructions for setting up the gas block on my 308 with an Ultra 7 and it works great with the can. I really don't shoot unsupressed though, so I can't comment on the unsupressed as a long term thing other than it worked on the day I set it.
I wonder if it's a caliber or barrel length issue. I'm running one of the 18" 308 SP10Ms that Mile High had on sale before the rona craziness.
22" 6.5cm. Had the gas block turned all the way down and still beat the shit out of the brass. Was a bolt action without the back pressure from the can.
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Did you talk to Seekins about that? They test fire the rifles before they leave the shop. I can’t believe they would ship a rifle that would cycle factory ammo.
You’re saying an SP10 is so undergassed that it won’t cycle without a suppressor on it? I’m calling bullshit dude.
Dude. I'm saying to get it to run halfway decent with a can, the gas block had to be completely closed and without being suppressed it obviously would not cycle. What is so hard to understand about that???
Then open up the fucking block when you shoot unsuppressed. How hard is it dude. That’s why they make adjustable gas blocks. What can are you using that’s generating horrific back pressure? I don’t have any problems tuning my gas guns with my DeadAir cans. Curious what you’re using.
Ever tried to readjust a seekins gas block after you've shot about 50 rounds with a can??? It was an AAC titan qd, 338 rated can so there is lots of volume...
Ran like shit with the rifle gas and seekins block. The non M model is definitely not ported or designed for running suppressed.
I’ve dumped a 1000rds through my Seekins PDW upper with the toolless block. Suppressed and unsuppressed. No hiccups yet. Anybody have pin gauge to size that Seekins port hole on the SP10?
Is anybody else having cycling issues with a stock SP10 in 6.5CM? I’m calling Seekins today to talk about this shit
Dude you are the only fucking person I’ve come across with cycling issues on an SP10. You’ve already said your piece. Move the fuck along
Lol^
Anyways, yeah I had cycling problems with mine. Found out my headspace was a tad off. Sent back to seekins and they fixed it. I got it back and brass ejection was weird. I fiddled with the gas over the course of a few range visits and got fed up with the gas block (seriously wtf). Swapped on an SLR detent adjustable model (read: one fucking Allen wrench and easy to get to with the long driver I ordered). I use this block on most my ARs. Always worked well.
With the old block, I found very inconsistent results when shooting suppressed and when I'd think it was tuned, it would do something stupid. Short stroke, or not lock back, etc. Id open it up a tad more, etc. Cleaning and lubing didn't matter. Once I got a better gas block? One visit. Set it to barely lock back on an empty mag, then opened 2 more clicks. No more issues at all.
I use a dead air sandman, dead air 30 cal brake, slr gas block and a geissele SSA-E. The rest of the rifle is factory. I did recently add a sawtooth arca rail that I'm a big fan of, subtle and functions well. Can't wait to be able to shoot again soon. Depending on the political bs and my healing.
I have the exact same issues as @black max does. I have to turn the gas screw all the way in and the rifle is still way over gassed. My brass looks like shit. The 22” 6.5 creedmoor as it comes from Seekins is NOT suitable to shoot suppressed.
Its been back once because it would not chamber factory ammunition. I would have to mortar out the rounds with some bullets even being pulled from the case. Seekins had to ream the chamber again as it had a WAY out of spec throat. They had to polish the feed ramps as well because my brass would be ate up just from loading a round.
Its a good shooter now as long as a can isn’t used. Maybe a gasblock change is what is needed. I’m not happy with this rifle. If I wanted problems I would have built my own.
Edit to add: It will shoot suppressed with the gas block all the way closed. It’s just a little harsh when doing so. Without the suppressor it is fine. The rifle is very accurate as long as the shooter points it in the right direction.
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I'v never had one failure to feed or failure to eject but there is a significant problem with the SP10 with a 22" in 6.5CM. I have spoken to the heads of R&D at Seekins a few times about the rifle being way over gassed. And simply it because they are using a Rifle Length Gas on a 22" 6.5 Creedmoor and the OEM buffer is way to light and the excessive pressure is just beating the shit out of the whole set-up. I have asked several time if Seekins is planning on correcting this issue and they seem to have no intention to because the rifle will perform adequately enough in its stock configuration, and damaged brass and harsh cycling it's not a big concern for them.
Seekins has outstanding customer service and they will do their best within reasonable limits to fix these issues, I've told Matty and Luke a few times that if they would just change the Gas system to a +2 from the rifle length system 70% of the issues customers are having would go away. Maybe if enough people on here bitch about it might get them to stop dragging their heels.
On a side note for $550 Seekins will spin you up one of the Rock Creek Barrels in any configuration and contour you want.
It sucks that to fix the problem I would have to replace the barrel to add the +2 gas system, have a upgraded gas block and gas tube installed, change out the buffer and recoil spring. Man thats a bit of cash and a hard pill to swallow for something that should have come that way from the factory.
Re a previous post in re to the issues w suppressing my 308, no solutions were found based on SP’s guidance or the gracious amount of time spent by Zak at Thunderbeast on my issue. Just sent an email to Seekins to give me info on sending it back to them. Will let y’all know...
I went to the range yesterday to sight in my thermal on my 6.5 SP-10. I was shooting 130Norma ammo and switched back to 140 American Gunner. I added a TBAC Ultra 9 to the front to be more civilized. I had to do what others have done to their gas block. I completely closed the gas block to get it to cycle correctly. I have changed out the stock buffer/spring to a JP SCS H2 buffer.
Did Bigjake83 complete his evaluation of updates for the SP10 like a +2 gas system, etc? If so, is there a link to that thread?
Thanks
Phil G
Thanks
Phil G
I have not finished the eval on the SP-10 the Bartlein Barrel from Craddock unfortunately development a detrimental issue, so it's back to the waiting game for a new Blank from Bartlein. Before the barrel shit the bed it was producing exceptional accuracy. Craddock does without a doubt make a quality Barrel, my issue was with the blank itself not the Smithing.
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