Range Report Selier & Bellot 6.5 CM seems okay to me. At least, for this rifle.

[Frgood]

Hello all, as an entry level rifle shooter, I believe I have my setup all set and ready for me to practice, practice, practice. While I am quite satisfied with the fact that my Tikka T3 A1 and Berger 140 OTM makes me look like a better shooter, I did put together a Berger B14 action/barrel onto an MPA BA chassis with the intent to use it for the short range F-Class competitions at my local club.

Here's the thing, I read a lot of comments regarding the low price, and, thus low quality, of S& B 130gr. tactical ammo. But it was cheap and I've got a case. It turns out, as posted previously, that I'm getting .75 groups at 100 despite my bitching about the Conquest V4 scope. Today, I met some of the guys at my first practice session with the high power rifle boys at our 300yd range.

These guys were absolutely great and were nice enough to show me the ropes of target setup and general range usage. They were practicing XTC so they were off hand while played with my Kestrel to confirm my 200 DOPE. Funny thing, They just walked up, setup their scopes, wheeled over their small carts, and started shooting. Me, I'm doing a bit of an Ed Norton as I lay out my mat, mess around with my scope and tripod, and try to find some shade for my ammo. It was 78 at 7:30 and 86 by 10:00, 92 by noon.

I was dripping all over my eyes as I put my first ten down. It was nice to see them all in the 10-ring. Here's the second string, just before full bore dehydration kicked in.

Now I realize we're looking at a near 2" MOA. But, that is all on me. Calling shots is an insanely humbling experience. But I'm extremely happy to see them all 'in the black'. I am extremely confident in the equipment and ammo choice and can focus solely on my trigger control, position, and skill.

This is how the addiction begins.

 

[hunter1959]

Every rifle is different.... but the typical class in precision that people work through to find the sweet spot are Federal, Black Hills, Norma, Lapua and Hornady... to be honest with you, I used your stuff to cut paper with on the initial zero of my AI/AT in 6.5cm this past January... I settled on Hornady 140's with consistent .25 moa in 5 sets of 3 shot groups... little more money, but with the rifle and the intent, was worth it

 

[Frgood]

Every rifle is different.... but the typical class in precision that people work through to find the sweet spot are Federal, Black Hills, Norma, Lapua and Hornady... to be honest with you, I used your stuff to cut paper with on the initial zero of my AI/AT in 6.5cm this past January... I settled on Hornady 140's with consistent .25 moa in 5 sets of 3 shot groups... little more money, but with the rifle and the intent, was worth it

Sounds good and I hope over time I become capable of shooting at that level where I can effectively evaluate and notice that level of difference. The only path is forward and up.

Funny, and lame, excuse. By the time I get everything setup, I'm exhausted. I have to do this twice a week. I was breathing far too heavy when I settled down for those first shots. But in this heat, I start rushing. Then, of all things, friggin' hay fever decides to re-awake after a 20 year hiatus.

I'm dripping onto the scope, got snot running down my lip and start to pull the trigger. The whole moment finds me starting to laugh to much which only aggravates it all more. It's a pretty sad but funny picture. My thinking is that if I survive through the summer, by winter (Florida), I'll be an ace as I will be calm and comfortable.

 

[Gatorshark]

S&B creed is great practice ammo. It holds surprisingly good groups in a Tikka CTR as well..., for cheap fmj "tactiacl". But if its tactical, how can it be wrong? Am I right?

Fundamentals and acclimation will pay dividends by end of summer. Good luck.

 

[bfoosh006]

Good shooting !!

Which S&B ? You said 130gr, did you mean the 140gr FMJ ?

S&B also sells, 131gr SP, 140gr SP and 156gr SP

It is good ammo for the price, but the 140gr FMJ is not very BC friendly...

I use this fora better BC bullet , and "reasonable cost"
https://www.laxammo.com/hornady-6-5-creedmoor-140-gr-bthp-200-round-cans-81483-detail

They also sell, 131gr SP, 140gr SP and 156gr SP

 

[checkmate101]

I tried some S&B ammo recently. only took about 10 shots with it but the groups at 100 (limit of the range i was at) were not great. Shooting a Tikka CTR currently. I picked up 2 boxes to test it out and out of the 10, 3 were pretty bad fliers (about 1-1.5 inches from the rest of the group and 1.5-2 inches from POA). I have really good luck with the hornady american gunner linked above. I haven't been able to tell the difference at short range between the american gunner vs the Hornady ELD-m 140s. I have yet to take either of them beyond 600 yards though.

 

[Frgood]

I tried some S&B ammo recently. only took about 10 shots with it but the groups at 100 (limit of the range i was at) were not great. Shooting a Tikka CTR currently. I picked up 2 boxes to test it out and out of the 10, 3 were pretty bad fliers (about 1-1.5 inches from the rest of the group and 1.5-2 inches from POA). I have really good luck with the hornady american gunner linked above. I haven't been able to tell the difference at short range between the american gunner vs the Hornady ELD-m 140s. I have yet to take either of them beyond 600 yards though.

There is definitely a relationship between factory ammo and a barrel/action. The S&B is miserable in my Tikka. But I'm not going to spend more time on bullet weights. My Tikka performs with factory Berger 140 gr OTM. The Bergaga barrel definitely prefers 130 and there I had Prime and S&B 140[correction]. As money is tight this season S&B it is. I just can't afford Prime in a good quantity at the moment. Plus the groupings on the Bergara are sufficient as I plan to use it for mid-range F-Class, as a beginner. I think I can get some pretty good scores at the 300 yd range.

Later, whenever my scope gets back from Zeiss, I'll focus on that while I determine if I like that scope.

 

[Nik H]

I posted a similar thread.

It is very inconsistent. It is the only centerfire ammo I have shot through my AT that produces flyers like rimfire. I shot 20 rounds today doing dot drills. 18 good shots and 2 that missed the dot by over 2.5". I have shot about 100 rounds (5 boxes) so far and every box produces the same results.

I also chronographed 20 rounds (box 3). ES was 92.

 

[Frgood]

Good shooting !!

Which S&B ? You said 130gr, did you mean the 140gr FMJ ?

S&B also sells, 131gr SP, 140gr SP and 156gr SP

It is good ammo for the price, but the 140gr FMJ is not very BC friendly...

I use this fora better BC bullet , and "reasonable cost"
https://www.laxammo.com/hornady-6-5-creedmoor-140-gr-bthp-200-round-cans-81483-detail

They also sell, 131gr SP, 140gr SP and 156gr SP

I messed that up pretty good. but I'm not going to go back and edit all my posts. Thank you for making me go and revisit this.

S& B 140 gr FMJ BT.
Prime 130 gr. HPBT.
Berger 140 gr. Hybrid Target.

I think the Prime performed best so that is why the 130 number is stuck in my head. Sadly, on ten rounds left. So I'm working with 500 rds of Berger and about 500 rds. of S&B . As far as why one performs better than the other in the various barrels is beyond my knowledge at this time. Especially since there is a 6.5 crd Springfield M1a Loaded in the corral that I can't hit the broad side of a barn. For that one, I will have to reach out to someone knowledgeable at the range to help me get the iron sight sighted. I'm not sure why I can't follow the manual on this one. Ever have a mental block for an unknown reason?

I think part of it is windage. I'm finding two different instruction, one refers to adjusting windage with the front sight. But, the rear sight is also adjustable. So I don't have a feel for which to follow. If I mess around with it , I'll just make it worse at this point.

 

[hunter1959]

I posted a similar thread.

It is very inconsistent. It is the only centerfire ammo I have shot through my AT that produces flyers like rimfire. I shot 20 rounds today doing dot drills. 18 good shots and 2 that missed the dot by over 2.5". I have shot about 100 rounds (5 boxes) so far and every box produces the same results.

I also chronographed 20 rounds (box 3). ES was 92.

a few days back I had added a comment about my AT when I went through zeroing and factory ammo selection... I worked Federal, Black Hills, Norma and Hornady... I used the S&B for initial paper cutting on the first stage of zeroing only.... my results were extremely satisfying with the Hornady 140 ELD M's.. I finished the zeroing with 5 groups of 3 shots each at a consistent .25.. the other three ranged from .5 to 1.0... congrats on your AT by the way... what glass are you running?

 

[Frgood]

a few days back I had added a comment about my AT when I went through zeroing and factory ammo selection... I worked Federal, Black Hills, Norma and Hornady... I used the S&B for initial paper cutting on the first stage of zeroing only.... my results were extremely satisfying with the Hornady 140 ELD M's.. I finished the zeroing with 5 groups of 3 shots each at a consistent .25.. the other three ranged from .5 to 1.0... congrats on your AT by the way... what glass are you running?

[removed] my response. I realized I was not the recipient of the question.]

 

[Nik H]

a few days back I had added a comment about my AT when I went through zeroing and factory ammo selection... I worked Federal, Black Hills, Norma and Hornady... I used the S&B for initial paper cutting on the first stage of zeroing only.... my results were extremely satisfying with the Hornady 140 ELD M's.. I finished the zeroing with 5 groups of 3 shots each at a consistent .25.. the other three ranged from .5 to 1.0... congrats on your AT by the way... what glass are you running?

I run a NF 7-35 on my AT. It is a very good pair. Not as good as my AXMC with the ZCO but my AT will always be special as it was my first AI

I have had good luck with AG 140 BTHP for cheaper ammo. I was really hoping the S&B would work better. It still isn't bad for ringing steel inside 500 yards. That is about it

 

[hunter1959]

I am running an S&B PMII 5-25... both good glass for sure... congrats on owning two... get them from Euro?

 

[Nik H]

I am running an S&B PMII 5-25... both good glass for sure... congrats on owning two... get them from Euro?

Bought my AT from EO and my LH AXMC was new in box from the PX here

I like the S&B PMII 5-25. It was the scope I bought with the AT. It now sits on my Anschutz. It is a fantastic scope for rimfire

 

[Baron23]

Sounds good and I hope over time I become capable of shooting at that level where I can effectively evaluate and notice that level of difference. The only path is forward and up.

Funny, and lame, excuse. By the time I get everything setup, I'm exhausted. I have to do this twice a week. I was breathing far too heavy when I settled down for those first shots. But in this heat, I start rushing. Then, of all things, friggin' hay fever decides to re-awake after a 20 year hiatus.

I'm dripping onto the scope, got snot running down my lip and start to pull the trigger. The whole moment finds me starting to laugh to much which only aggravates it all more. It's a pretty sad but funny picture. My thinking is that if I survive through the summer, by winter (Florida), I'll be an ace as I will be calm and comfortable.

A sweat band on your forehead will be your friend.

 

[checkmate101]

There is definitely a relationship between factory ammo and a barrel/action. The S&B is miserable in my Tikka. But I'm not going to spend more time on bullet weights. My Tikka performs with factory Berger 140 gr OTM. The Bergaga barrel definitely prefers 130 and there I had Prime and S&B 140[correction]. As money is tight this season S&B it is. I just can't afford Prime in a good quantity at the moment. Plus the groupings on the Bergara are sufficient as I plan to use it for mid-range F-Class, as a beginner. I think I can get some pretty good scores at the 300 yd range.

Later, whenever my scope gets back from Zeiss, I'll focus on that while I determine if I like that scope.

You are correct on the relationship between ammo/rifle. I only shoot factory ammo, not willing to dive down the endless rabbit hole of reloading (yet...). But I really like finally finding the factory ammo that a rifle likes. I got lucky and the Tikka really liked the American Gunner stuff right away. I don't know that there is a reason for me to use anything else - unless i can find differences at longer distances than I have already shot. That said, use what works of course. I wish my rifle would have like the S&B stuff too. Would have been nice having a couple cheap options. I'm sure I'll try some prime at some stage, but with the AG performing the way it does I can't ask for more right now. I need to work on my shooting more than criticizing the gear/ammo at this point.

 

[Frgood]

A sweat band on your forehead will be your friend.

I'll do my beat Arthur Ashe impersonation. lol

 

[Shawn1492]

Sounds good and I hope over time I become capable of shooting at that level where I can effectively evaluate and notice that level of difference. The only path is forward and up.

Funny, and lame, excuse. By the time I get everything setup, I'm exhausted. I have to do this twice a week. I was breathing far too heavy when I settled down for those first shots. But in this heat, I start rushing. Then, of all things, friggin' hay fever decides to re-awake after a 20 year hiatus.

I'm dripping onto the scope, got snot running down my lip and start to pull the trigger. The whole moment finds me starting to laugh to much which only aggravates it all more. It's a pretty sad but funny picture. My thinking is that if I survive through the summer, by winter (Florida), I'll be an ace as I will be calm and comfortable.

after your shooting session, with your range bag packed up do a few front squats and walking lunges holding your range bag as extra weight. Do a few 30 second planks on your shooting mat.

 

[KYpatriot]

Try Hornady American Gunner 140gr. Easily sub moa in my rifle in multiple groups and at .80/rd hard to beat. In a large enough sample you will start to see ES creep up but according to my labradar I have recorded ES of at least 30-40 in every match factory loading out there except prime...havent shot prime. Sure you can get single digit ES on a five shot sample....but thats just due to small sample size.

 

[AnimalMother224]

I run a NF 7-35 on my AT. It is a very good pair. Not as good as my AXMC with the ZCO but my AT will always be special as it was my first AI

I have had good luck with AG 140 BTHP for cheaper ammo. I was really hoping the S&B would work better. It still isn't bad for ringing steel inside 500 yards. That is about it

ive had great luck with the AG 140. I had one box show better SD and ES than the 140 match ammo