Setting up my first bolt gun, couple questions

[bunnies4r5]

Hey guys,

So I’m starting to get into some longer range shooting, right now my only rifles are bcm ar15s

My 14.5 is set up with a razor 1-10 which I have shot out to 800 yards and have a great time hitting steel at that distance

my buddy has a bergara 6.5cm and drilling 6inch steel plates at 600 yards is super fun so I am wanting to set up my own

My original plan was to buy a tikka ctr 6.5cm and throw it in a krg X ray but now I’m thinking brownells Howa 1500 22in standard or 24in heavy 6.5 barreled action and KRG Bravo, which saves me some money that I can put towards nicer glass

My main 2 questions are does this seem like a solid plan going with one of the Howa actions and the Bravo, is it worth the added length and weight to go with the 24in heavy barrel?

And

with a razor 4.5-27 or viper 5-25 in MRAD, being used for 100yards out to 1200yards, should I go 20moa base or 0moa base

If I do a 20moa base with the 2 scopes I mentioned will I be able to set a 100yard zero or will I have to do a 200yard zero? For this range will I need a 20moa to dial to 1200?

Thanks guys

 

[Rippey715]

20 moa base
100 yard zero
More length is free velocity
More weight is free balance and stability

 

[bunnies4r5]

20 moa base
100 yard zero
More length is free velocity
More weight is free balance and stability

Yea perfect, I figured just didn’t know how heavy I wanted it but I guess for bag or bipod shooting it really doesn’t matter

On the 20moa base and 100yard zero I have heard I may have trouble getting dialed down to 100 yard zero, maybe not a concern with a razor or viper?

Lastly any recommendations for scope ring height with the razor 4.5-27 or viper 5-25 MRAD

 

[K80/6.5]

Tikka/bravo is the easy button. 20moa base works well.

 

[Ebar48]

Razor or MK5 or NX8 would be the direction I would go. With the two you listed, and the 3 I listed, a 100yd zero will not be a problem with a 20 MOA base. Depending on the scope you would be looking at about 1” rings for a 50mm and 1.3ish for a 56mm. I don’t care at all about keeping the scope as close to the barrel as possible and personally run primarily 1.5” mounts. If you so with a scope that has 30 mil or 100moa of elevation you can get away with running a 20 MOA one piece mount to give you 40MOA between the base and the mount total. I would also run the tikka over the Howa. I own 3 howas and when you upgrade them you are pretty limited. If you can swing it I would go with an origin and prefit over the tikka or Howa.

 

[Rippey715]

Razor has 32 mils of elevation I think. Once zeroed and on a 20 base, you should have around 20-21 mils of elevation for dialing. that should be plenty for your 6.5. I shoot 308 with a razor Gen ii on a 20 base and dial 15 mils at 1100.

1.5” height I think is best. Had the lower mounts like everyone else said to get years ago and noticed they only worked prone or off a bench. Once any positional shooting off barricades was introduced I had a hell of a time getting a good sight picture. Chin weld and higher rings have been a huge help.

 

[bunnies4r5]

Razor has 32 mils of elevation I think. Once zeroed and on a 20 base, you should have around 20-21 mils of elevation for dialing. that should be plenty for your 6.5. I shoot 308 with a razor Gen ii on a 20 base and dial 15 mils at 1100.

1.5” height I think is best. Had the lower mounts like everyone else said to get years ago and noticed they only worked prone or off a bench. Once any positional shooting off barricades was introduced I had a hell of a time getting a good sight picture. Chin weld and higher rings have been a huge help.

Awesome appreciate your and everyone else help and opinions

So shooting my razor 1-10 on my
Bcm ar15 prone with an ADM recon medium which if I remember right with a 34mm scope puts the scope center at 1.7in above the top rail, I noticed for me, shooting prone got uncomfortable quick, but for literally everything except prone it is much better


I assume dimensions are probably a little different on a bolt action but with 1.5in rings is prone super uncomfortable? Should I maybe look for something in between 1in and 1.5in?

 

[bunnies4r5]

Razor or MK5 or NX8 would be the direction I would go. With the two you listed, and the 3 I listed, a 100yd zero will not be a problem with a 20 MOA base. Depending on the scope you would be looking at about 1” rings for a 50mm and 1.3ish for a 56mm. I don’t care at all about keeping the scope as close to the barrel as possible and personally run primarily 1.5” mounts. If you so with a scope that has 30 mil or 100moa of elevation you can get away with running a 20 MOA one piece mount to give you 40MOA between the base and the mount total. I would also run the tikka over the Howa. I own 3 howas and when you upgrade them you are pretty limited. If you can swing it I would go with an origin and prefit over the tikka or Howa.

A custom action is gonna be outside what I’m looking to spend right now

I get 40% off Vortex msrp which makes a viper 5-25 less than $800 and a razor 4.5-27 reasonable as well. I know how much nicer the razor is using their LPVOS, I’m just hesitant to spend that much on the first go around but I know I will eventually want it so, I think spending a little less on the rifle and a little more on the glass is gonna be the way to go

I think the tikka and chassis would be the upper limit of what I am looking to spend, buying the howa barreled action for less then $500 is just very appealing

When it comes to my defensive stuff I am all about buy once cry once, since this is for fun I’m a little less concerned with having the absolute best Teir stuff but I also don’t want to waste money on any BS

 

[Rippey715]

I don't think prone is uncomfortable with 1.5" and its so much better everywhere else. How much of you shooting do you plan to do prone? I have the Razor and the Strike Eagle 5-25 with matching reticles. The Strike Eagle is on my 22lr. I would recommend the SE over the Viper. The glass isn't quite as good but for everything else I feel the SE is better: parallax to 15yds, 34mm tube, 30 mils elevation, price. Get the SE for now. Then when you upgrade you can put it on your PRS22lr build you will eventually want.

I'd go Tikka honestly. Building a great reputation for out of the box accuracy and while there isn't as much aftermarket support as the REM 700 foot print there is still a lot and the important companies like trigger tech and chassis makers are there. You could even just look at what ever Tikka comes in 6.5 with a heavy barrel at least 22" and threaded 5/8x24. Don't worry about the stock because you already know you want to replace it. Save you money because you're still going to want bipod, bags, rings/mount, scope base, muzzle brake, AMMO! Get all that, go shoot, have fun, learn, throw it in a chassis or whatever.

Good luck dude!

 

[K80/6.5]

Buy a used razor off of the px you can find them used for 1500 -1600 sometimes with rings included. While your saving for the rifle send the scope into vortex to have them check it out and make sure everything is good to go.

 

[Vivacious Stallion]

Razor G2 27x scopes show up used alot for less than 1600 depending on condition and accessories. That combined with Vortex's warranty you're almost foolish to buy one new.

I tested my Razor gen 2 in a 30 moa mount on a 20 moa rail and was still able to get a 100 yd zero on a 6.5 ccreedmoor

 

[CK1.0]

I dropped a Howa barreled action (in 6CM) from Brownells into a KRG Bravo for my first long-range rifle. I was coming from a USPSA/IDPA/3-gun and LEO background, I was weary of the expense.

The rifle ended up sick, full stop. It's what got me addicted to this shit.

Now I'm running a custom rig, nothing too fancy (Origin/Proof/TT Diamond/Manners/Razor HDG2) and know I could be every bit the same intermediate-advanced-middle-upper-mid-pack shooter I am now had I kept rocking the Howa.

I only "upgraded" to see what all the fuss was about being that most equipment in the sport is R700-platform derived, and that is the undisputed "industry standard" platform ...and because my friend was looking for a solid rifle for him to get into it and had offered to buy the Howa.

When I was done with the Howa/KRG, I had ~$700 into the Bravo for it to hang with anything out there (chassis + weights/KRG side dishes), it weighed a balanced 21.5lbs, I was getting kick-ass MTU-profile prefit "Howage" barrels from Crown Ridge Barrel Works for less than$500 a pop, and was running the Jard trigger at ~9ozs (the Howa version of a TT Diamond IMO, if you have a Howa, do it).

For what it cost to put together... bang for buck in unheard-of territory, just a great rifle, '70s-'80s Japanese engineering is amazing and the Howa M1500 is a fantastic piece of steel.

Now, all that said... if you think you're going to dig it... start with an Origin or whatever and go whole hog, the gun is absolutely, unquestionably, the cheapest thing... in no time you'll be buying $100+ bags of sand lol.

The old Howa:

 

[stanley_white]

I dropped a Howa barreled action (in 6CM) from Brownells into a KRG Bravo for my first long-range rifle. I was coming from a USPSA/IDPA/3-gun and LEO background, I was weary of the expense.

The rifle ended up sick, full stop. It's what got me addicted to this shit.

Now I'm running a custom rig, nothing too fancy (Origin/Proof/TT Diamond/Manners/Razor HDG2) and know I could be every bit the same intermediate-advanced-middle-upper-mid-pack shooter I am now had I kept rocking the Howa.

I only "upgraded" to see what all the fuss was about being that most equipment in the sport is R700-platform derived, and that is the undisputed "industry standard" platform ...and because my friend was looking for a solid rifle for him to get into it and had offered to buy the Howa.

When I was done with the Howa/KRG, I had ~$700 into the Bravo for it to hang with anything out there (chassis + weights/KRG side dishes), it weighed a balanced 21.5lbs, I was getting kick-ass MTU-profile prefit "Howage" barrels from Crown Ridge Barrel Works for less than$500 a pop, and was running the Jard trigger at ~9ozs (the Howa version of a TT Diamond IMO, if you have a Howa, do it).

For what it cost to put together... bang for buck in unheard-of territory, just a great rifle, '70s-'80s Japanese engineering is amazing and the Howa M1500 is a fantastic piece of steel.

Now, all that said... if you think you're going to dig it... start with an Origin or whatever and go whole hog, the gun is absolutely, unquestionably, the cheapest thing... in no time you'll be buying $100+ bags of sand lol.

The old Howa:

View attachment 8132571

I run a Howa as well thanks to the many kind posts by @CK1.0 and others.

When asked why I didn’t get something higher end I reply either that “I am not good enough to know the difference” or “I don’t hate myself like I used to so there is a limit to how good I will ever get in this sport.”



-Stan

 

[Rocketmandb]

On the base, with a Razor you can go to 40 MOA total between base and mount and still zero at 100. On most my rifles, I get a 20 MOA base and a put on a 20 MOA mount.

 

[Rocketmandb]

my buddy has a bergara 6.5cm and drilling 6inch steel plates at 600 yards is super fun so I am wanting to set up my own

No offense to your buddy, but 600 yards to pretty much any precision rifle is sort of like buying a 'vette convertible and just driving it around the neighborhood with the top up

with a razor 4.5-27 or viper 5-25 in MRAD, being used for 100yards out to 1200yards, should I go 20moa base or 0moa base

The Razor was my first mid+ type scope and I still love it. The glass is very good and I've said for a long time that both the Razor and Viper gen 2s represent great value in their respective categories.

Notes:

- The Viper will do fine at 1200, but at longer ranges (heck, even at 1200ish), I found that eye strain became an issue. Not so with the Razor.
- The Viper has significantly less elevation available (as you would expect from a 30mm vs. 34mm tube). It has 70 MOA/20.3 Mil max travel vs. 113.5 MOA/33 Mil on the Razor. That's a BIG difference. You might say, "why? I'm only shooting out to 1200 yards." Go to next point:
- You will always want to shoot farther The Viper will limit you in this regard, both in elevation and clarity.
- The Razor is a fair amount heavier (like a pound), but since this isn't a hunting rifle, weight is not necessarily a bad thing.
- Downside for both: The turrets kind of suck - both in feel and how you zero. Not a critical issue, but worth mentioning.

TLDR:
- If money is an issue and you want a stepping stone scope (i.e. you'll upgrade later), get the Viper.
- If you want a scope that will stay with you for pretty much ever, go Razor.

 

[CK1.0]

I'd go Razor (used, like from the PX, Vortex will still have your back) and get a 20MOA rail, 0MOA mount, you won't go past a full rev until ~1200+ yards.