Range Report shooting a gun sideways?

42769vette

Gunny Sergeant
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Minuteman
Feb 4, 2009
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liberty indiana
we have all seen the gangsters shoot pistols as if the sites were on the side of the slide.

i have also seen jerry michlec (spelling) shoot his ar as a slight tilt and it got me to thinking. a bullet goes up for x amount of yards and then falls. does jerrys bullet go straight 12 oclock or up and left (10oclock) also he is running optics. what does the cant do to his adjustments.

just curious
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

Jerry uses an Aim Point or simular optic that he mounted on the side of his scope. I know Jerry but it's been a while since I saw his comp AR. He uses that for close up engagements.

As far as gangsters go....thats the way it comes out of the box
wink.gif
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

Negative, as soon as the bullet leaves the muzzle it is dropping... bullets do not have "wings" If the bore is level, and the surface you were shooting over was also level and you dropped a bullet from your fingers (from the same distance to the ground as the bore)at the exact moment you fired the weapon then both bullets will hit the ground at the same time. There is "some" difference but I'll just leave it at that.

To you question, the bullet would continue on its normal path just like if you had the weapon it the normal position, the only thing different is your sights will not line up with the POI.
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

Brian that is true but I believe he may be talking about the issue of mechanical offset. This is obvious, but with a scope mounted two inches or so above the bore then the bullet will, in effect, "rise" up to the line of sight, cross it while continuing to "rise", then come down and cross it going back down. As you pointed out this is not at all due to a bullet somehow generating lift or rising as it travels down range. It's the direction that the bore is pointing that sends it on that intersecting path through the line of sight.

On closer targets you can shoot with some degree of cant without much effect. As you get farther away that becomes more of a problem. If you're shooting a .308 with a 175 SMK at a 1,000 yard target your bullet will be about 10 or 11 feet higher than your line of sight at about the 550 yard mark. Imagine if you were canted to the right. That bullet would not travel in a line straight up and straight back down to the target (let's leave out wind for this). If you're canted then the bullet will travel up at the angle of your cant so it's already going off course, come to it's highest point in the arc, then start dropping out to the side continually drifting away from the target.

Not sure if I explained this well or not I hope it makes sense.

As for Jerry's AR I couldn't tell you what he has but I have seen three gun shooters run small sights on their scopes and they set them at an angle and run them for close range targets. I've never done that so I can't comment on that technique. I would think they zero that sight for that technique and just use it for close engagements. How close I have no idea.

Marc
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

If the sights you are using are adjusted for accurate fire with the rifle level, and then fire it at a cant, then it will effect the trajectory like any other time, low and in the direction of the cant. The significance of the effect will depend on the distance to target. That's why precision shooters use a level to make sure the rifle is always in the same state as it was when zeroed.

Those that train for competitions to fire using side mounted sights usually zero them in that way, therefore there will be no cant effect on the trajectory. As long as they are holding the rifle at the same degree of offset, the sights will remain accurate.

It all depends on the state of the weapon and sights at the time of zeroing vs. the state of the weapon when firing later on. Same state, same zero.
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ggmanning</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This should help
grin.gif
Probably adaptable to the M4.

homie-sights-39a.jpg
</div></div>

post 4 beat you
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jcvibby</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was wondering about this too. Does anyone have any real world advice and data on where the bullet would hit??? I was shooting at 300 yards and have to aim high and left to hit the target.</div></div>
I don't think there will be a standard because there are so many different variables;
Height of sight from center of bore
different calibers/ different drops
length of barrels/ different fps
different bullet weights ....ETC.
.......SmokeRolls
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

If you hold it sideways and spin in a circle the bullet will curve when you shoot it. It takes a lot of work but after a few thousand rounds you will learn to control where it will hit. I saw it with my own eyes in a movie.
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Re: shooting a gun sideways?

Unless you mean hold high and left using the crosshairs' regular layout as a reference.
I just try to remeber where to hold on the sight pic. My current setup on my gasgun accentuates the vertical at 100yds because of scope's height over bore to the point that I held 1 Mil X 1 Mil and missed 1 mil low on the target. 1X1 is my usual 90 degree (port up) prone hold for my boltgun.
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

Depends on how your tilitng the gun, ejection up hold high right at 2 , ejection down hold at 10. The best way I can explain is the bullet sort of corkscrews down. On .223's at 100 on a small plate just hold on the 3 "O" clock side if your ejecting up, the drop isn't too bad. If your shooting a .308 on a 4" plate at 100 and you don't hold for the drop, you'll miss.
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

Is this like riding a motorcycle while sitting backwards?...
It's not that it can't be done but "why?"
Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
.......SmokeRolls
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TheSmokeRolls</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is this like riding a motorcycle while sitting backwards?...
It's not that it can't be done but "why?"
Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
.......SmokeRolls </div></div>

Practical application: low wide narrow loophole

Real world application: sadistic match directors.
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

I know there are jokes flying now and I really didnt take the time to read them all....but....

This is the way my rifle is set up....in fact mine are actually 90* offset. I have a permanent scope mounted on top and flipup irons on the right side of the forearm.....its not different then sighting in as if the irons were on top of the rifle.....I rotate the rifle 90* and shoot with irons....It works very well for me....

So....sighted in is sighted in, irregardless of where the sights are. As long as you are positioning the weapon in the same way as you did when you sighted it in....
 
Re: shooting a gun sideways?

I'm just being silly. I realize that sometimes we will have to turn the weapon and still hit the target, especially in a potential firefight.
......SmokeRolls