short barrel cartridge choice help

[texote]

I am Going to build a 16.5 in barrel rifle short Acton and wanted to get y'alls insight on caliber choice

I'm really thinking between 6.5x47 Lapua, 338 federal and a plain Jane 308

I don't have any experience with 30 or 338 Cal so don't know much on bullets or preferred weights
But in 6.5 I'll try the 123 to 130 gr bullets

Plan on running suppressor but later

It'll be used for everything, plinking to whatever Crosses in my path.. Probably mostly pigs

What do y'all think?

 

[BoilerUP]

Folks here get 2575fps with 139s from a 16.5" 6.5 Creed, 2800fps with 123s...

 

[AKONA]

Have you considered a 358 winchester? This will give you a big heavy punch but what is more important
you could use 357 pistol bullets from value packs to do the plinking or even hunt in a pinch.
Then a barnes TSX or a 225 nosler partition will obliterate anything in sight.
With the hornady 180gr with faster powders I think this will give you the most with that size barrel. More than any other choice.
You could hunt a large bear with it. The 9mm bore leaves a massive trauma behind and it is fun to shoot.
Forming 358 brass from inexpensive spent 308 brass is easy. No neck turning or anything too special needed.
The 338 federal is amazing too but do not have the cheap bullet value pack option.
The 308w or 6.5mm is a waste from a 16" barrel. In this case consider the 6.8 or 7.62x39 both hog smashers.

Think outside the box.

 

[Scotty22]

I'm getting ready to start a 7-08 build. It's gonna be 17-18 in barrel from what I have read on is that people are getting 2550+ with 168 bergers.

 

[Crosshair]

I concur with the .358 win idea. It's one of he most efficient cartridges out there. 338 fed would be great too. Both way way less impacted by short barrel length as compared to a 6.5mm, or 7mm sa cartridge. I'd go .308 minimum bore dia for 16" barrel, for blast, noise, and efficiency sake.

 

[texote]

Yea that's a pretty cool idea..

What do you think killing range is with the 338 fed and 358 win? From coyotes to big pigs or elk?

What's the barrel life?

 

[RTH1800]

Amazing how far astray you can be led on the 'net. We are now looking at a .358 Win coyote rifle.

 

[pyplynr]

I have a 18" 6.5x47. I can easily get 130's to 2600fps and the 95 gr vmax to 3000fps. I also have a 18" 308. I have shot it to 1000 yards so I would think hunting with it out to 5-600 wouldn't be a problem.

 

[texote]

Amazing how far astray you can be led on the 'net. We are now looking at a .358 Win coyote rifle.

I don't follow, do you mean to say that it won't work on a coyote ?

 

[Bear24]

The DTA guys are hitting 1000y+ targets with Fed gold metal match out of a 16.5" .308

 

[docdredd]

I don't follow, do you mean to say that it won't work on a coyote ?

Oh it will work. But it's a little like killing a fly with a sledgehammer

 

[texote]

Do yall know of any gunsmiths that have reamers for 338 fed or 358 winchester?

Is there a specific reamer yall recommend for 308, and what bullet do yall recommend out of a short barrel?

 

[Crosshair]

Amazing how far astray you can be led on the 'net. We are now looking at a .358 Win coyote rifle.

I wouldn't build a 358 for a coyote rifle. I only saw pigs mentioned in his first post, and no mention of long range. There is no misinformation here, it is a fact that cartridges like 338 fed and 358 win are less adversely effected by a stubby barrel, which was the topic of this thread. For coyotes, obviously a 6.5 creed, 260, or 243 would make vastly more sense.

 

[wvlapua]

300 blackout is a good choice for the info provided.

 

[KelsonAK]

I have a stubby barrel .338 federal - Ruger 77. Long range? naaa. It's got a 'scout scope' on it. Whack a moose at 200 yards no big deal. 300 would work, but where I would carry the stubby 338 there aren't many 300 yard opportunities. Elk and pigs? Sure, no problem - but it's not a magic solution for every situation. 185 Gr TSX Boat tail is what gets loaded in mine most of the time. I've loaded the 210 Partitions as well as the 180 accubond and they all work just fine. I bought 'factory seconds' to do plinking. 358 Win would do the same thing. Is it 'tactical' 'n chit? No. It's kind of a specific purpose tool - short fast handling moderate recoil package with 'pre expanded' bullets and easy to come by components. Not a 'steel banging, kill 'em at a mile, wunder gun' that folds up and fits in your pocket. Personally, I wouldn't go to the expense of putting a premium barrel full on custom together - just chop a factory tube and call it good. Then chuck it in the trunk with the extra socket set, rusty screw driver and the flares that are squished flat on one end and be done with it....

 

[AKONA]

1000 yards, +P pistol calibers like blackout ?
Doesn't apply to none of the purposes the OP mentioned.
You really need to understand what a 9mm/358 bullet can do.
A coyote at 400 yards pulverized maybe cut in two halfs.

Also if you need an elk, a brown bear or whatever, look at the 225gr partition track record and then come back.
For plinking AFFORDABLE 357 158 vale pack bullets at AR15 3,300fps speeds.
One needs to test and choose wisely to avoid jacket separation.

So inherently accurate, fun, big super deadly wound channels, cheap bullet option?

Also use the search and look for the 358 Indiana folks here.

 

[texote]

what twist for the 358,338 and 308?

 

[6.5BR]

10 in 308 and 338, 12 in 358. Range, 300-400 yds, depending on mv and bullet. I would run 200gr in 338, and 185 Barnes, in 358 I would run 225 Sierra for deer/hogs and smaller, Noz Partition 225 for anything larger. Pistol bullets were fun in my 350 RM MKII 77. I would personally go with a 19-20" on short side with any round, if only for blast.

With shot placement and good bullets, you would not give up much going with a 6.5 like a Creedmoor, and improve trajectory and wind drift.

 

[AKONA]

Learn a bit about the range of options and mighty power of 358 winchester facts before you decide.


Here ... 358 winchester. 500ft ASL... 22"BBL Stainless 6Polygonal (assume a few lower fps with shorter barrels, not so much with the lighter bullets)

Ballistics Results - 358 Winchester - 225gr Partition
Ballistic Coefficient 0.421 Velocity (ft/s) 2452 Weight (grains) 225
Maximum Range (yds) 1000 Interval (yds) 100 Drag Function G1
Sight Height (inches) 1.5 Shooting Angle (degrees) 0 Zero Range (yds) 200
Wind Speed (mph) 10 Wind Angle (degrees) 90 Altitude (ft) 500
Pressure (hg) 29.53 Temperature (F) 70 Humidity (%) 0.78

RANGE (YARDS) VELOCITY (FPS) ENERGY (FT.-LB.) TRAJECTORY (IN) COME UP IN MOA COME UP IN MILS WIND DRIFT (IN) WIND DRIFT IN MOA WIND DRIFT IN MILS
Muzzle 2452 3004 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0
100 2261 2554 2.7 -2.6 -0.7 0.9 0.9 0.3
200 2079 2158 0 0 0 3.8 1.8 0.5
300 1905 1813 -10.7 3.4 1 8.8 2.8 0.8
400 1741 1515 -31 7.4 2.2 16.2 3.9 1.1
500 1589 1261 -62.9 12 3.5 26.5 5.1 1.5
600 1448 1048 -108.5 17.3 5 39.7 6.3 1.8
700 1323 874 -170.8 23.3 6.8 56.4 7.7 2.2
800 1215 737 -253 30.2 8.8 76.6 9.1 2.7
900 1127 635 -358.7 38.1 11.1 100.2 10.6 3.1
1000 1059 560 -492 47 13.7 127.1 12.1 3.5



Ballistics Results - 358 Winchester -200gr ftx
Ballistic Coefficient .3 Velocity (ft/s) 2620 Weight (grains) 200
Maximum Range (yds) 1000 Interval (yds) 100 Drag Function G1
Sight Height (inches) 1.5 Shooting Angle (degrees) 0 Zero Range (yds) 200
Wind Speed (mph) 10 Wind Angle (degrees) 90 Altitude (ft) 500
Pressure (hg) 29.53 Temperature (F) 70 Humidity (%) 0.78

RANGE (YARDS) VELOCITY (FPS) ENERGY (FT.-LB.) TRAJECTORY (IN) COME UP IN MOA COME UP IN MILS WIND DRIFT (IN) WIND DRIFT IN MOA WIND DRIFT IN MILS
Muzzle 2620 3048 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0
100 2344 2440 2.4 -2.3 -0.7 1.2 1.1 0.3
200 2085 1931 0 0 0 4.9 2.4 0.7
300 1844 1510 -10.5 3.3 1 11.7 3.7 1.1
400 1623 1170 -31.2 7.5 2.2 22.1 5.3 1.5
500 1426 903 -65.3 12.5 3.6 36.7 7 2
600 1258 703 -116.5 18.5 5.4 56 8.9 2.6
700 1128 565 -189.7 25.9 7.5 80.3 11 3.2
800 1037 477 -290.2 34.6 10.1 109.1 13 3.8
900 970 418 -423.2 44.9 13.1 141.7 15 4.4
1000 917 374 -593.2 56.6 16.5 177.7 17 4.9


Ballistics Results - 358 Winchester - 158gr Pistol Bullet Burner FMJ
Ballistic Coefficient 0.2 Velocity (ft/s) 3011 Weight (grains) 158
Maximum Range (yds) 1000 Interval (yds) 100 Drag Function G1
Sight Height (inches) 1.5 Shooting Angle (degrees) 0 Zero Range (yds) 100
Wind Speed (mph) 10 Wind Angle (degrees) 90 Altitude (ft) 500
Pressure (hg) 29.53 Temperature (F) 70 Humidity (%) 0.78

RANGE (YARDS) VELOCITY (FPS) ENERGY (FT.-LB.) TRAJECTORY (IN) COME UP IN MOA COME UP IN MILS WIND DRIFT (IN) WIND DRIFT IN MOA WIND DRIFT IN MILS
Muzzle 3011 3181 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0
100 2568 2313 0 0 0 1.5 1.4 0.4
200 2165 1645 -3.8 1.8 0.5 6.4 3 0.9
300 1802 1139 -15.2 4.8 1.4 15.6 5 1.4
400 1485 774 -37.4 8.9 2.6 30.4 7.2 2.1
500 1231 532 -75.5 14.4 4.2 52 9.9 2.9
600 1062 396 -136.6 21.7 6.3 80.9 12.9 3.7
700 959 323 -228.5 31.2 9.1 115.9 15.8 4.6
800 886 275 -358.3 42.8 12.4 155.8 18.6 5.4
900 827 240 -532.5 56.5 16.4 200.1 21.2 6.2
1000 776 211 -757.7 72.3 21 248.7 23.7 6.9


Mystery of the .358 Winchester

 

[AKONA]

what twist for the 358,338 and 308?

Typical twists
358 .. 14
338 .. 10 /12
308 ... 12/ 11/ 10(latest fashion) /8 (Subsonic)

 

[tt66]

I have an 18" .308 in a McRees chassis and 16.5" .243 in a bedded B&C stock. I am not sure which one is my favorite. I love the .243, it is light and handy while the .308 feels like a tank. The muzzle blast on the shorty .243 is quite a bit more noticeable than on the .308.

My next project will be a 16.5" .223 with a Broughton 8 twist barrel to shoot heavies.

I really like the handiness of the shorter barrels.

 

[Bob L Swagger]

http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...dous-kill-stick-has-arrived-16-5-6-5x47l.html

 

[valkyries]

The .44 magnum makes a dandy carbine. Velocity will be good with the barrel length, ammo is available and cheap when compared to most of the center fires and this would be a pigs worst nightmare.

 

[SUIScide]

I've been thinking about a 16" ar10 and have run through the same caliber choices. As I have a 30 caliber suppressor already I'll probably go with 308. I don't know how hard it is to find an appropriate 33 or 35 caliber suppressor, but perhaps a form1. Either would be good for hunting at any range I'd take a shot, even at a pig. Both would have less muzzle blast and better short range energy than the 260 or 308. On another note, I do have a 300 blackout bolt gun and while it's lots of fun it isn't much for hunting especially at any more than 150 yards