Squib load, got it out!

[verdugo60]

I’m an idiot. Let’s just get that out of the way first. Doing a ladder test on a 6.5 Creedmoor proof carbon barrel, I didn’t powder the case. Primer shot bullet into lands about an inch and a half from the back of the breach, including chamber. Bullet is a 140 ELD-M.

1. Tried tapping, then ramming it out with a cleaning rod. No luck.

2. Tried a steel rod next. No dice. Really hammered on it (idiot).

3. Tried tight fitting brass rod from the hardware store after soaking in penetrating oil. No luck.

4. Rigged a 5/8-24 fitting into threaded muzzle in an attempt to use hydraulic pressure and blow out with a grease gun. Ruptured 2 grease gun tubes, hasn’t moved.

I’m guessing with the hammering from the muzzle end the bullet has expanded, making it even more tightly stuck.

Any ideas or a smith that could take this on before I send it to PROOF and beg for mercy? This barrel was just starting to show promise and I’ll be really bummed to lose it.

 

[theHerder]

Damn. Maybe (carefully) drilling out center of bullet to allow it to collapse on itself and relieve some pressure and then try tapping it out again. It worked for me in the past, as I’m an idiot as well.

 

[Mike_in_FL]

Have or know anybody with a powerful air compressor? Instead of using the grease gun get a male air adapter for the hose connected and adapt it to the 5/8-24. Fill the void with water and then hit it with air. You need a lot of PSI for this to work. But drilling out the center may be easier if you have a drill press.

Maybe try putting some CLR down the muzzle. Might be able to eat enough jacket to rod it out?

 

[padom]

Go to Home Depot....buy an OAK dowel in the wood working section at the largest diameter that fits your bore...they have a bunch of different sizes... make sure you buy the Oak one...not the soft pine dowels they also have there....

Remove barrel from your gun and put in your barrel vice.....insert oak dowel down muzzle till it contacts bullet...tap out with mallet... it will come out..

What comes out will look something like one of these depending on caliber and bullet...

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Ive used an aluminum rod slightly smaller than bore diameter. Drilled the end sort of like a seating stem to cradle the ogive of the bullet. Tap tap tap and it popped back out the breech side.

GL

 

[whatsupdoc]

At this point I would not use a wooden dowel, if you used a brass rod and it did not move its bad.
What diameter is the brass rod ?

Im really surprised a grease gun did not pop it out. You are saying the "grease gun tubes" ruptured you mean the rubber hose correct?
Is there a pressure rating on the hose? The ones I use are rated to 3000psi.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

I used a cleaning rod with an extention on it so that the tip of the bullet would fit into the hole just like a seater. That way you can tap it pretty hard and no deform the tip and not get against the barrel with the rod.

Sorry, didn't see that you've already beaten it hard. I did the same thing about a week ago. Missed one case due to my wife talking to me then handing me the baby while I was filling cases.... should have just stopped but, I digress....

If it'd now smashed inside the barrel, I think you will have to either have a ton of pressure or send it to proof or a smith who can do it.

 

[missed]

Damn can't believe the grease gun didn't get it out. 10kpsi usually does the trick. A buddy had a couple 9mm bullets stuck in his PCC barrel and got it out with the grease gun.

Like Padom said hard wood dowel would be another option. It needs to be just smaller than the bore.

 

[47chevycoe]

Have or know anybody with a powerful air compressor? Instead of using the grease gun get a male air adapter for the hose connected and adapt it to the 5/8-24. Fill the void with water and then hit it with air. You need a lot of PSI for this to work. But drilling out the center may be easier if you have a drill press.

Maybe try putting some CLR down the muzzle. Might be able to eat enough jacket to rod it out?

Curiously asking….
How would air work if a grease gun can’t? Our grease guns claim to kick out at something like 8000 psi…..not sure of any compressed air getting anywhere near that number. Like I said, not bashing, just asking.

 

[KZP]

You could try freezing the bullet with canned air turned upside down. Might reduce the diameter enough to use your brass rod again. Never done it on a stuck bullet before, but have done something similar when installing tight AR barrels into uppers.

 

[Mike_in_FL]

Curiously asking….
How would air work if a grease gun can’t? Our grease guns claim to kick out at something like 8000 psi…..not sure of any compressed air getting anywhere near that number. Like I said, not bashing, just asking.

`
You're only using the air pressure to move the liquid a bit, you can't hardly compress a liquid so it's essentially a solid. Back in the good old days if you had to remove the bolt on the end of a crankshaft (holds the harmonic balancer on) and you couldn't get it out with air tools because a crankshaft spins, what do you do? At TDC ,both valves are closed in the cylinder head, pull the sparkplug and fill the cylinder with water, put the plug back in.

Once the piston hits the water it's not compressing and the water can't go anywhere if the valves are closed so now you can use a ratchet or breaker bar to get the bolt out. You don't need the much PSI but probably a compressor that can go up to 120 PSI. I had an adapter at one point which was the male end of the spark plug with whatever NPT male air. Could hold the water against the piston or just air to hold valves if you wanted to mess with locks or whatever so they don't drop into the cylinder.

I watched the crazy guy on that one reloading channel blast grease all over his wall doing this to get a squib out of a Krieger .308 barrel, same premise. He ended up doing what I'm suggesting (air) because a 5/8-24 to a grease zerk would leak or the gun was but he had a barrel full of grease.

I can't speak to how they rate the PSI on a grease gun, you'd think it should work if it's actually that much.

 

[n2ishun]

Drill it with about a 1/8th drill then use straight bladed screwdriver (by hand) to drill as much lead out as possible....and relieve pressure in the bore.
Then try the deal with a wooden dowel.
Should be easy when there's no center in the bullet allowing the expansion pressure.

 

[kriller134]

Shoot it out duhhhhh

 

[spife7980]

Worst I’ve had stuck came out with a steel rod and the same solution to a stuck factory barrel… the sledge.

 

[whatsupdoc]

Shoot it out duhhhhh

Before he forged it by beating it with steel and brass it may have worked.
But now it will be like another 50BMG blowup thread.

 

[Liberator52]

Find someone with a high pressure nitrogen bottle and regulator. [ aircraft mechanic shop ] Fill the barrel with water and use the regulator to slowly apply pressure thru your threaded adapter. Most nitrogen bottles go to 4000 psi. Good luck.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Shoot it out duhhhhh

Actually would like to see a test using case full of powder and some wad packed in.

Send it.

 

[verdugo60]

Thank you for all of your suggestions. The barrel has been off the gun, fyi. I may try drilling next in combination with air, water, dowel, lol. I’ll update with any progress.

In my research I heard of a guy melting the lead out of a stuck bullet with a lab-grade laser then pounding out the copper jacket. So if anyone knows a guy, haha.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

When you used the grease gun, did you fill the barrel with oil first or just hook the grease gun up to it?

 

[iceng]

How i usually do it (and ive removed dozens).

If barrel is off, all the better. Drill from the chamber end into the back of the projectile. (In a lathe). For a 6.5mm, i use a 5mm drill. I have a small plastic sleeve which is almost the length of the drill bit with only 1mm of the tip of the drill exposed.

Drill it one mm at a time. Loosen the drill bit in your drill chuck on the lathe, pull it out a mm or 2, so its out of the sleeve a bit more, repeat drilling the butt of the bullet out. It will take 10+ attempts, but you will get the bullet out, and the plastic sleeve will help centralise so you dont touch the chamber or throat.

Once you are thru, you can usually use a cleaning rod with a jag to push it out. I have a few various alloy / brass things ive made to help.

Im really surprised the grease gun didnt work. Fill the barrel with oil first, then pump it up. Usually works. Also on the butt end of the bullet, you need lube, so i spray crc / case lube / whatever in there. Once the bullet starts moving, it comes out.

Also... Do it into a bucket, 45 deg pointing down. Also put a few old rags in said bucket.

Your wife will thank me for that tip.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Better yet do it on your kitchen counter and have your wife hold the bucket.

Be sure to record it... for science.

 

[redbullitt]

Im surprised the grease ans oil trick didnt do it. If you didnt use oil, definitely try again with it.

Other than that, I've had good luck with wooden dowels... hard wood, fit barrel best possible. I also cut the dowel into 6 inch sections. Havent had any break that way and that did it after the cleaning rod shit failed miserably.

Drilling the bullet if you can will help a ton.

I dump lube in both ends of barrel, let it sit muzzle up a day or a few, then relube from chamber side. Have pounded VERY stuck 300 whisper jacketed bullets out that way without much fuss. Very stuck meaning like 2/3 down the bore stuck... learned my lesson to use cast for that particular application and not go under 900 fps with jackets lol.

 

[verdugo60]

When you used the grease gun, did you fill the barrel with oil first or just hook the grease gun up to it?

Hydraulic fluid in the barrel, full tube of grease in the gun. The hose supposedly rated to 10k psi split open and now the harbor freight grease gun won’t hold pressure either. Like I said…it’s stuck pretty good.

 

[verdugo60]

Better yet do it on your kitchen counter and have your wife hold the bucket.

Be sure to record it... for science.

Some men just want to see the world burn.

 

[verdugo60]

How i usually do it (and ive removed dozens).

If barrel is off, all the better. Drill from the chamber end into the back of the projectile. (In a lathe). For a 6.5mm, i use a 5mm drill. I have a small plastic sleeve which is almost the length of the drill bit with only 1mm of the tip of the drill exposed.

Drill it one mm at a time. Loosen the drill bit in your drill chuck on the lathe, pull it out a mm or 2, so its out of the sleeve a bit more, repeat drilling the butt of the bullet out. It will take 10+ attempts, but you will get the bullet out, and the plastic sleeve will help centralise so you dont touch the chamber or throat.

Once you are thru, you can usually use a cleaning rod with a jag to push it out. I have a few various alloy / brass things ive made to help.

Im really surprised the grease gun didnt work. Fill the barrel with oil first, then pump it up. Usually works. Also on the butt end of the bullet, you need lube, so i spray crc / case lube / whatever in there. Once the bullet starts moving, it comes out.

Also... Do it into a bucket, 45 deg pointing down. Also put a few old rags in said bucket.

Your wife will thank me for that tip.

This method sounds great, unfortunately I don’t have a lathe. I’ll ask a buddy tomorrow who’s friend has a lathe if we might drill it in that manner at his place.

I wonder if clamped down I could get away with using a drill press.

 

[iceng]

You could, but you want to be dead sure you dont drill at an angle and scuff your chamber.

Partly why i use the plastic sleeve. So it doesnt "wobble" to off centre and screw it up. Also why i only do 1mm or so at a time to absolutely guarantee its on centre.

It costs nothing to be slow and super careful. It costs everything to be impatient and rush and fuk up a good barrel.

 

[Dot3]

Would a day or two soak in hoppes 9 help?

 

[whatsupdoc]

Send it to Kamala she can just suck the bullet out.

 

[XikoPlavi]

Ok, a lot of replies here. I have not read them all. However, I have had a few squibs in my time.

Oak dowel from Lowe’s
Longer than barrel but probably cut down some to be just enough to get bullet to pass back out.

Sit barrel upright and put a plate or bowl under it

Squirt a good Ammt of kriol down barrel

Let sit for a day

You may have to push it out from chamber end which will suck but try from crown end first.

I’d buy 2 or 3 wood dowels

You can push it with anothe peice of wood. I never had to hammer my dowel

Edit: trying to remember when I had a squib in my AR barrel. I stick a bunch of rags for cushion to sit chamber end on and I did rubber hammer with 2x4 piece just to get it to move. Then could push it from there. And, yes sometimes the kroil needs to be redone for more than 1 day

 

[TicTacTex]

Getting "things" stuck in "holes" is not uncommon among Creedmoor shooters.

Jokes aside, best of luck on the removal.
I find it funny how there's been multiple suggestions to use an oak dowel... Umm, if your original methods didn't work, I don't see an oak dowel working. (?)
If you end up using a drill press, definitely do something like iceng is saying, using a piece of tubing to align the bit and act as a buffer to keep you from getting into the throat.

 

[BW64]

Yes!! I've seen a lot of chromeless bumpers in her neighborhood!

 

[Jrb572]

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[sirhrmechanic]

The challenge here may be the fact that you are dealing with a carbon wrapped barrel. Thin steel tube with carbon wrapping. Does not necessarily react to long duration pressure like a steel Barrel would. You may find the the internal liner has expanded out into the fiber. And that the bullet is now trapped inside a expanded area like an ostrich swallowing a golf ball. I’m not sure you’ll get the same results with heat etc. that you would get with a carbon or stainless monolithic barrel.

The safest routine is probably to put it on a lathe and drill Enough of the bullet out to be able to collapse the jacket. But even then there may be damage up in the bore that renders that barrel useless. Not from the drill but from the bullet as it got expanded from pounding.

I would also be concerned about the pressure put on the barrel by the grease gun. If you were talking 1000s of PSI over a long duration, what can that do to carbon fiber when the steel lining expands like a balloon? Is there a possibility of carbon wrapping being fractured or damaged? Or delaminated. The carbon fiber is designed to take very short duration loads as a bullet moves down the barrel. Yes they are high pressure loads, but they are taking place over very short time spans. And not a long the full length of the barrel simultaneously. I don’t know what the result is but I would certainly want to talk to the manufacturer about what may occur.

Carbon wrapped barrels and monolithic steel barrels are very different animals. Heating cooling pressure, all have different effects when you’re dealing with carbon fiber versus steel.

Hopefully the OP can get the projectile dislodged. I’m wondering if there are known special procedures for removing a stuck bullet from carbon wrapped barrels, or are we breaking new ground here?

Cheers Sirhr

 

[sirhrmechanic]

How i usually do it (and ive removed dozens).

If barrel is off, all the better. Drill from the chamber end into the back of the projectile. (In a lathe). For a 6.5mm, i use a 5mm drill. I have a small plastic sleeve which is almost the length of the drill bit with only 1mm of the tip of the drill exposed.

Drill it one mm at a time. Loosen the drill bit in your drill chuck on the lathe, pull it out a mm or 2, so its out of the sleeve a bit more, repeat drilling the butt of the bullet out. It will take 10+ attempts, but you will get the bullet out, and the plastic sleeve will help centralise so you dont touch the chamber or throat.

Once you are thru, you can usually use a cleaning rod with a jag to push it out. I have a few various alloy / brass things ive made to help.

Im really surprised the grease gun didnt work. Fill the barrel with oil first, then pump it up. Usually works. Also on the butt end of the bullet, you need lube, so i spray crc / case lube / whatever in there. Once the bullet starts moving, it comes out.

Also... Do it into a bucket, 45 deg pointing down. Also put a few old rags in said bucket.

Your wife will thank me for that tip.

And if you are going to drill it, this is the only way to go. You must guide that drill.

Sirhr

 

[XikoPlavi]

I did t even think about the fact that it’s wrapped carbon. But, yeah I am waiting to hear how it goes. Good luck. I know if it was me right now I don’t have a lathe or anything that I would confidently drill it with. I’d have to find a place to take it to. Or just buy a new barre and do both in parallel. I won’t be buying carbon barrels though (I understand why people do but you see Here it brings other complexities when you have issues).

Shit happens

 

[missed]

I didn't think about the carbon wrapped either.

A thought without a lathe. Get a brass tube with an OD just smaller than the bore. Insert tube from breech. Get drill bit that will fit in tube, use tap handle and hand drill bullet. Being lead that should be easy to hand drill, and if the drill wandered into steel you will be able to feel it with the hand drill.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

I can't believe that there is noone here on SH from Proof Barrels.

Maybe @lowlight can summon the genie.

Because this is a really interesting issue.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[Jcarpenter223]

Im super intrigued on the outcome

 

[TACC]

I'm in on this just to learn , because my luck this will happen to me at some time.

 

[Bigfatcock]

You think a stuck bullet sucks? Wait until you get an oak dowel stuck in there too.

 

[TheGerman]

Put a magnet on a string.

Toss magnet down barrel.

Pull on string.

 

[Mike Casselton]

Soft tacos

 

[Rocketmandb]

Soft tacos

Do you put all the stuff in together? Or do you put tortillas in first?

 

[KZP]

Get yourself a Teslong borescope and see what's going on down the barrel. You can leave off the angled mirror attachment and look straight ahead.
Good to have anyway for checking on carbon rings forming.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

@verdugo60

Is it out yet? The suspense is killing me.

 

[verdugo60]

Success!!! Drilled out the back of the bullet very carefully using a collet made out of thick tape. We purged the grease gun of air again and gave it 3 quick pumps and the lead core went shooting across the room! LOL.

It seems that just relieving that pressure allowed it to shoot out the back after drilling the base. We then easily tapped out the remaining shell of copper jacket with a brass rod. (Note how flat the nose was, pounding on it just flattened it into a wad cutter, lol).

I don’t think the carbon fiber made one bit of difference. If the CF has any kind of structural issues vs all steel it probably would have shown up by now. To the naked eye the barrel looks fine. There’s a small smudge of something near where the bullet was lodged, hoping it’s just needing a good scrubbing and not a small deformity on that rifling.

Planning to re-assemble the rifle and shoot it this week.

Thanks again for all the ideas, and for the asshattery, lol.

 

[TicTacTex]

I hope you’re running the remainder of your hand loads across a scale, or at least giving them the good ole shake test to listen for powder. I know I would be. Lol

And report back if the well-greased barrel helps velocity.

 

[TxWelder35]

After I throw powder I always look into each case with a flash light before I start wearing bullets. Has saved me more than once. Glad you were able to get that out without sending it off. Hopefully she still shoots!

 

[verdugo60]

I hope you’re running the remainder of your hand loads across a scale, or at least giving them the good ole shake test to listen for powder. I know I would be. Lol

And report back if the well-greased barrel helps velocity.

Lol, that hydraulic fluid will give me at least 200 fps I bet. So basically it’s a 6.5 PRC now.

I’ll report back on how she shoots!

 

[redbullitt]

Good good, glad it seems to be a positive outcome.

Good call on the old shakem test lol... i like that one where applicable.