Suggestions for tips, tricks, and lessons for 2021

[Dthomas3523]

So, got a few things in the works for 2021. Would like to get suggestions on what the hide and community in general would like more info and explanations on in the Rimfire (centerfire as well) world.

For example:

Building position for barricade/props
Balancing a rifle
Acceptable wobble zone
Cleaning
Movers

Etc etc.

What things do you all feel like either needs better explanations/examples?

What are you having trouble with?

What would you like to know more about?

 

[Newbie2020]

Those would sure be a great start

some of us don’t know what we don’t know yet

 

[littlepod]

I'm still learning the importance of balance and good fundamentals versus bad ones. I've been trying to get my rimfire balanced without it becoming 20lbs. Though I'm only trying to cut weight due to positional stages.

The other thing with cleaning is the carbon ring. Apparently that could be the cause of the cold bore shift. I just picked up some vfg pellets to try out and going to try to use it also to plug one end of the rifle and soak my vudoo barrel in boretech c4.

 

[Dthomas3523]

I'm still learning the importance of balance and good fundamentals versus bad ones. I've been trying to get my rimfire balanced without it becoming 20lbs. Though I'm only trying to cut weight due to positional stages.

The other thing with cleaning is the carbon ring. Apparently that could be the cause of the cold bore shift. I just picked up some vfg pellets to try out and going to try to use it also to plug one end of the rifle and soak my vudoo barrel in boretech c4.

Unless you get a custom barrel made, you likely won’t get it balanced and be light. Unless carbon shell manners....maybe.

I’m at 19lbs or so in matrix to get the right balance. Doesn’t slow me down as I shoot 20+ lbs centerfire.

But I’ll put it on the list. Will do several types of balance points and show the pros/cons.

 

[Gunfighter716]

22LR version of Weaponized Math

 

[RAVAGE88]

Pretty awesome that you're willing to devote time to this. I believe it could be beneficial to at least a few to start a little further back, at the very basics. I'm sure most are beyond that part, but we all pick up bad habits that aren't realized until later on, sometimes years later. That way, everyone is aware of what it means to take good habits into building good positions for barricades/props.

MB

 

[Dthomas3523]

22LR version of Weaponized Math

In works.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

You should make same type of thread in the bolt action section.

Hoping 2021 is a great year for you and those around you.

Some suggestions for informative series:

Test and provide data on the age old debate of whether to clean just the chamber/throat area or entire barrel on RFs.

Test and provide data on the age old debate of utilizing action screw torques to help/hurt group sizes aka using action screw torque as "tuner" for divisions tuners are not allowed.

Entire series on setting up and/or equipping an entire RF "Trainer" to get the most bang for your buck and I am not referring to cost but to experience/knowledge benefits.

Entire series on taking lessons learned from the "Trainer" rifle and making sure you incorporate them correctly into your CF weapon systems.
----Which lessons incorporate and which lessons cannot incorporate

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Dthomas3523]

The NRL22 just announced a big change....so the "hardest" part of the match is officially gone.
View attachment 7485444

Was pretty dumb and impractical. Which is why no one took it seriously and they just dealt with it.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Nobody that actually wanted to win took it seriously you mean.

Anyone who knows anything about practical rifle.

Target size wasn’t appropriate. Amount of time given vs amount of targets wasn’t appropriate.

It was terrible all the way around.

 

[accurate obsession]

Nobody that actually didnt want to win took it seriously you mean.

So not being familiar with all the NRL22 COF's, what is the "positional stage" it's all positional shooting, isn't it?

 

[Dthomas3523]

So not being familiar with all the NRL22 COF's, what is the "positional stage" it's all positional shooting, isn't it?

Its unsupported. That used to be considered “positional” in years past.

Now it’s typically defined as unsupported or supported positional shooting. And unsupported and supported prone.

But as far as Nrl22 was concerned, it was unsupported standing, kneeling, sitting, prone. And they called it positional.

 

[Lastsaint21]

I wasn’t good at them but didn’t mind the positional stages..I could see using those at some point in real life, meaning hunting. What I don’t get much out of is the support eye/side stuff..I guess you could use that hunting as well but usually I can position myself to get the shot.

 

[accurate obsession]

Its unsupported. That used to be considered “positional” in years past.

Now it’s typically defined as unsupported or supported positional shooting. And unsupported and supported prone.

But as far as Nrl22 was concerned, it was unsupported standing, kneeling, sitting, prone. And they called it positional.

Gotcha, sling only stage, everybody luvs awfulhand . I include that stage in every match I set up.

 

[accurate obsession]

The COF every month is 5 stages made up and submitted by random individuals. So 1 dude submitting 5 stages and the NRL reviews and approves.

2 stages were predominantly prone (using bipod and bag)

2 stages were predominantly using barricades

1 stage was the "positional stage" were the only support you were allowed the use of a sling only.

Any one of those 5 could be designed to be the timed stage.....so you recieved extra points based on time elapsed. This was used to break ties.

Each month the COF is different potentially but you as a stage designer only have the NRL22 targetry kit to design the 5 stages. So things often are compromise and it's up to the creativity of the individual designing to spice things up.

Then usually MD's add extra bonus stages if they choose. The bonus stages are tacked on....but not part of the score that submitted to the NRL for your monthly match points. So you can have say 2 bonus stages. Your 7 stage score "wins the day". But the NRL only cares about your 5 stage score.

With the advent of NRL22X they will make the regular NRL22 matches more entry level friendly. The gear race can tend to discourage some people. X matches will be full on, no holds barred.

 

[BLJ]

Step 1)"I'd like to shoot in NRL22/PRS style matches. Sounds like fun. I'll get an at one 457, bushnell 5-20 and some ammo. I'm zerod at 50. Step 2)...........

Dry fire, positional, trigger control, support eqipment..........? I`d be in for the super basics of learning how to be competitive in the events mentioned above. Based on a 1-2 year plan with appropriate goals for that time line. Not full on sponsored national stuff, but being able to hold my own on a regional level.

 

[Moe Ron]

Any NRL22 in DFW area? Website says one in GREENVILLE. Any closer?

 

[Dthomas3523]

I wasn’t good at them but didn’t mind the positional stages..I could see using those at some point in real life, meaning hunting. What I don’t get much out of is the support eye/side stuff..I guess you could use that hunting as well but usually I can position myself to get the shot.

No, you’d never have to get into a position and shoot a target too small for the rifle you’re using and too fast to get into the proper position. It’s not realistic at all. Unless you wanted to set yourself up for missing.

A realistic shot with these rifles would be like a kneeling or standing ipsc. Or with a hunting weight rifle, a rabbit within range. Not 4-6 targets in two min from several positions. It would be like giving you two min to find it, range it and engage 5 targets or something.

Proper stage design doesn’t stop at a position you might use. Target size, time, practicality, etc etc must all be factored in. They fell back on the “well, no one has ever shot a perfect score” like that was some sort of logical train of thought. I’m glad they are evolving. I think you’ll see some people start returning to matches as it takes out what was basically a gimmick.

 

[Dthomas3523]

For example, if I were to make a tips or explanation series for unsupported, it wouldn’t make you that much better at Nrl22 unsupported. If you were hitting zero, it might get you up into the 50% range.....maybe.

Because I’d be doing a disservice to you attempting to show you how to do something that isn’t practical with the parameters set via target size and time allowed.

 

[accurate obsession]

Except the NRL22X matches are only 1 event....maybe 2 a year for one location. If you want to go to another location it could mean hours and hours one way of travel. I think my buddy and another guy drove 6hrs one way to go from eastern South Dakota to the Ames, IA match.

The NRL22 is every month and relatively close.

I don't see how people can write off NRL22 as just a beginner level competition when the top shooters of a match tend to shoot scores that are equivalent to 85% or more hit ratio across ALL STAGES with winners often determined by the timed stage. If you have 1 bad stage....your likely done as far as winning. Does that not sound like real competition?

And that's not always Open Class....thats Base Class too. I attended a match where a Base Class shooter beat the entire field by 100pts. The rules are not written in terms of beginner and advanced. The NRL can say Base is "for beginners" but their rules say different. It's an equipment class. The Youth Class is more of a beginner class. But even that is flawed in practice as there no stopping a youth from shooting a $2000 Voodoo against another youth with a $200 10/22.

As far as beginner friendly.....I've never seen match yet were a beginner couldnt come and just compete in whatever Division they wish/qualify for. Nothing is designed to discourage beginners. There is a minimum skill level barrier....but that's the sport itself. I don't expect a person to magically know how to make sight adjustments. That is a minimum skill to have a cursory understanding of. The NRL can't control that nor the match director. It's on the shooter to learn or seek to learn those minimum skills. And you can nerf the match with whatever you like in the name of being "beginner friendly" but the baseline skills are still required in the end.

You know what I never see? The NRL create or incentivize clubs to teach classes so beginners can actually get those baseline skills. The NRL22 match (or any match for that matter) is supposed to be the test of skills. Not a class to learn them.

Sorry for the long post.

Didn't mean that NRL22 is just for beginners, COF's are plenty challenging and matches are way more accessible. What they lack in distance they make up for in small targets and stage descriptions that will screw with your mind when under the clock, convoluted shoot order, contrived objects. Not ranting here, I get it, there's only so many things you can do with a 100yds and keep it interesting.
Unfortunately unless you have land or access to a range that will let you shoot from barricades you will have to learn at matches, otherwise maybe you can dry fire at home.
X matches seem to be about 80% out west, in GA very few choices, one in FLA panhandle(5hrs away) and one coming in SC(4hrs) in Jan that I am signed up for. Rimfire competition(NRL-PRS) just doesn't seem to be catching on in the south, I know there's a shit ton of Vudoo's down here, people must just want to bench shoot or something. Full disclosure, I haven't drank the Vudoo cool aid -- yet, but from my handle you can imagine I'm thinking very hard.

 

[stello1001]

I like what was mentioned above about using action screws almost the same way as a tuner. Obviously, torque settings matter, I'd be interested to know when to stop adjusting torque or when to call it good and keep it as is...

 

[Badjujuu]

Step 1)"I'd like to shoot in NRL22/PRS style matches. Sounds like fun. I'll get an at one 457, bushnell 5-20 and some ammo. I'm zerod at 50. Step 2)...........

Dry fire, positional, trigger control, support eqipment..........? I`d be in for the super basics of learning how to be competitive in the events mentioned above. Based on a 1-2 year plan with appropriate goals for that time line. Not full on sponsored national stuff, but being able to hold my own on a regional level.

Just my 2 cents....

Just getting comfortable behind the rifle, with the right equipment (bag/bipod) (nrl22 you can have 1 piece of equipment, PRS is unlimited) on different things you shot from is key. Most things you shoot from you can find in the garage (5 gallon bucket, ladder, saw horse, tires, anything else you can easily build it from 2x4s etc). Having a solid zero is fundamental. Decide if you want to hold over or dial in between distances and practice that. Wind calls are kicking my ass, I need to get better at it. I missed quite a few shots because of wind last match - also I need to slow down, as i rush i get flustered and screw up simple things...

Luke

 

[BLJ]

@Badjuju. We ordered 16 different targets/spinners last night. Going to build our own walking match style range. I can out to 400 yards. Started looking around and have more than enough for barricades. Leftover lumber as well. Hopefully by mid summer I'll be more comfortable.

X2 on the wind calls.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Just my 2 cents....

Just getting comfortable behind the rifle, with the right equipment (bag/bipod) (nrl22 you can have 1 piece of equipment, PRS is unlimited) on different things you shot from is key. Most things you shoot from you can find in the garage (5 gallon bucket, ladder, saw horse, tires, anything else you can easily build it from 2x4s etc). Having a solid zero is fundamental. Decide if you want to hold over or dial in between distances and practice that. Wind calls are kicking my ass, I need to get better at it. I missed quite a few shots because of wind last match - also I need to slow down, as i rush i get flustered and screw up simple things...

Luke

If you’re missing Nrl22 distances for wind, something else is up. Targets that close, it’s basically just a matter of know the direction and just holding a bit into that direction. Obviously there are abnormalities like super heavy wind days.

If it’s longer distances, then a lot comes into play. Target size and having or not having dirt berms behind the target are the two biggest factors. If an MD makes it a small target without a berm, even the best wind callers might have a bad day.

I will add a “to dial or not to dial” into the list though. That’s a good one.

 

[427Cobra]

The ize will greatly help in the mental game
Analize
Strategize
Memorize
Visualize(hint spend most of your time here)

 

[Badjujuu]

If you’re missing Nrl22 distances for wind, something else is up. Targets that close, it’s basically just a matter of know the direction and just holding a bit into that direction. Obviously there are abnormalities like super heavy wind days.

If it’s longer distances, then a lot comes into play. Target size and having or not having dirt berms behind the target are the two biggest factors. If an MD makes it a small target without a berm, even the best wind callers might have a bad day.

I will add a “to dial or not to dial” into the list though. That’s a good one.

You're right, not really an issue with NRL22 (unless you're shooting at Racine, Wisconsin with back berms next to Lake Michigan with 18 mile wind gusts )

It was last PRS match, targets were up to 200 without a backing of any sort, spotters had no data to go off of. Even my kestrel said .5L mils for wind at 200 - when I finally figured out i was .5L right - the wind was different at the target.
Struggle continues.

 

[Badjujuu]

What

@Badjuju. We ordered 16 different targets/spinners last night. Going to build our own walking match style range. I can out to 400 yards. Started looking around and have more than enough for barricades. Leftover lumber as well. Hopefully by mid summer I'll be more comfortable.

X2 on the wind calls.

What you described is what I call

#BackYardGoals

Sound awesome!

 

[MDrimfirerookie]

nothing to add as those topics are all my areas of suck but i do want to say thanks for devoting the time to actually helping shooters develop