I'm running a Silencerco Omega on a Sig M400 Predator. The suppressor makes the gun FILTHY and ultimately causes it to fail with the bolt not able to slide shut and lock the next round into battery. My solution has been to clean it after every time I shoot it to prevent the issue; but, royal pain in the arse. Guess I may have to just use it without the suppressor. Anyone have a product or suggestion that might help me solve this issue?
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Suppressor = Filthy failing AR-15
- Thread starter Seeking_Coyotes
- Start date
Suppressors, by nature of their design, are going to trap a lot more gas and carbon and contain it in the weapon system. There is no way around that part. Consistent maintenance, good lubrication, and quality parts will help. A heavier buffer might help too.
How many rounds do you typically put through it between cleanings?
How many rounds do you typically put through it between cleanings?
It seems it is not the round count but the time in days between cleaning. Typically I run maybe 100 rounds through the upper and next time I go to shoot it maybe a month later, it is getting gummy / gritty when closing the bolt.
you'll probably just need to clean more often. I like to do the bolt and bolt carrier about every 300 rounds. The AEM5 can works very well and fouling isn't terrible, but it's certainly there and a super light coat or CLP or Remington dry lube keeps me running.
Add more oil, run it wet. It allows the grime to not build up and move around. I wipe off the BCG every 100-200 rounds or so and relube.
Get a quality can like a OSS an do away with 95% of the blow back. Others are not building cans with similar performance. I shot a OSS on my 16 2 years ago, to say it have almost no blow back is an understatement.
I had the same issues. Adjustable gas block and a better lube helped a lot.
Welcome to the joy of having to clean your gun constantly, lol. As others have stated an adjustable gas block and a heavier buffer will go a long way towards mitigating some of this, but nothing is ever going to solve it.
quality can and OSS don't go together well in my experience. Low back pressure, yes, but also loud as FUCK. There's a reason that they are on absolute FIRE SALE all across the internet right now. If backpressure is your number 1 concern then maybe I could see this, but to imply that the Omega isn't a quality can because it induces back pressure in a gas gun is pretty funny.
It’s the thing no one realizes prior to buying a suppressor and the thing no one really wants to talk about after getting a suppressor because of all the time and money invested in getting one.
Sure, it’s cool and yes, it helps with the sound, but it comes at a price. Is cleaning a little more often really all that bad?
I didn’t realize that not cleaning it after every time you shoot was a thing. The Army ruined me on that one...
Sure, it’s cool and yes, it helps with the sound, but it comes at a price. Is cleaning a little more often really all that bad?
I didn’t realize that not cleaning it after every time you shoot was a thing. The Army ruined me on that one...
I was having the same problems of extreme filthiness levels when running my SiCo Omega on my AR's too and decided to install a JP Enterprises adjustable gas block and a AXTS Freedom Bone charging handle. On a scale of 1-10, 10 being the most filthiness my JP gas block and Freedom bone brought it down to an 8. The Freedom bone did help 50% in reducing gas to my face though! I've learned to accept how dirty my D.I. AR's get when running suppressed that when I get home to clean them I basically hose them down with Remington CLP over a trashcan.
Definitely an adjustable gas block will help. I also use a good amount of fire clean which helps the carbon from getting gunked up. Makes cleaning a ton easier.
Ensure you have enough lubricant on your rifle. I rarely clean my SBR at less than 800 rounds. I am running an LMT 10.5” and a Surefire pre-socom can (lots of back pressure), and have gone in excess of 1500 rounds before cleanings.
Have you possibly used Froglube? That gets gummy and tends to mess up operations of the firearm, especially in anything below 40 F.
Have you possibly used Froglube? That gets gummy and tends to mess up operations of the firearm, especially in anything below 40 F.
All that shit that gets trapped in the action is really dry, and it'll soak up virtually all of your lubricant. So you'll have to lube more frequently if you don't want to clean it. In my case if I'm not going back at it in a day or two I'll go ahead and clean the rifle.
I don't have anything to add that hasn't been mentioned already... but will echo it to stress the importance. Get yourself an adjustable gas block. I like SLR. Start with the gas block closed all the way. Load one round into the mag and shoot. Open gas port one click. Repeat until there is enough gas going to the BCG to lock it back on an empty mag. Leave it there. And run it wet.
I've got tons of rounds on an SBR suppressed. Sure, it gets dirty, but if you run it wet it won't stop working.
I've got tons of rounds on an SBR suppressed. Sure, it gets dirty, but if you run it wet it won't stop working.
Adjustable gas blocks make all the difference but the gun does still get dirty. Mine get dirty, but they continue to function no problem. More than anything, the magazine gets shit all over it.
I looked at these OSS cans too, but never got to try one. Good marketing; they say the baffle design is inferior and antiquated. I didn’t realize how loud they were until a few guys here mentioned it
I looked at these OSS cans too, but never got to try one. Good marketing; they say the baffle design is inferior and antiquated. I didn’t realize how loud they were until a few guys here mentioned it
Well, you say that... but my Adams Arms piston still runs dirty AF when suppressed. The grime doesn't necessarily come down the gas tube. Seems to come out of the chamber on extraction, even if you have your gas adjusted "right".
I wish I'd have seen this earlier, this caused us to lose 2 yotes to malfunctions Sat night.. Decided to show up on a hunt. Pulled the trigger and nuthin..
I use my omega on an AR-15 and AR-10, both have SLR gas blocks.. the Larue AR doesn't get near as dirty as the WC 308. I'm going with more lube, and at minimum a wipe off after a range trip.
I use my omega on an AR-15 and AR-10, both have SLR gas blocks.. the Larue AR doesn't get near as dirty as the WC 308. I'm going with more lube, and at minimum a wipe off after a range trip.
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While it's not my personal approach, I can see not cleaning a bolt gun after an outing... but a semi-auto? If I'm relying on something that (somewhat) resembles a Rube Goldberg mechanism* for my weapon to function, I'm absolutely going to clean/maintain it.
*Most semi-autos look like the sort of thing that, if I were to read a functional description and see a diagram of the intended operation, I'd say that there's not a snowball's chance that it'd operate consistently and reliably. Obviously I'd be wrong, but the long and short of it is that there are a fair number of things that have to go right (or at least right enough) for a semi-auto to function compared to a manually operated action of some flavor, whether that's bolt, lever, pump, etc...
*Most semi-autos look like the sort of thing that, if I were to read a functional description and see a diagram of the intended operation, I'd say that there's not a snowball's chance that it'd operate consistently and reliably. Obviously I'd be wrong, but the long and short of it is that there are a fair number of things that have to go right (or at least right enough) for a semi-auto to function compared to a manually operated action of some flavor, whether that's bolt, lever, pump, etc...
I run an Omega on 5.56 AR15s
Quick and dirty clean and lube for 3-5 mins after every Range trip (50-150) #1&2
Deep clean every 3rd
Clean off parts really well, then use Fireclean to lube and clean, works well for me
I use Slip 2000 EWL for defensive firearms, doesntclean as easily but can go much longer if sitting for long periods
Quick and dirty clean and lube for 3-5 mins after every Range trip (50-150) #1&2
Deep clean every 3rd
Clean off parts really well, then use Fireclean to lube and clean, works well for me
I use Slip 2000 EWL for defensive firearms, doesntclean as easily but can go much longer if sitting for long periods
Adjustable gas block as everyone says, another big plus I have found is the JP VMOS BCG, if you get the heavy version it slows down the carrier allowing more gas to vent which equals less carbon blowback. Of course that comes at a cost, the VMOS itself and it has to use the JP silent spring so you drop a few bucks but who likes to keep money anyway.
This guy has it right. It’s is really the only way to “eliminate” as much blowback as possible. The Adams Arms are decent and can be adjusted with your finger.
However, I ended up selling my piston upper due to weight. Honestly, I don’t see a huge issue with “gunk” in my AR. I really think their good be a bigger issue at work (not to scare you, I have been wrong before).
Regardless of what people say, no DI AR should be failing after 100 rounds/1-2 dirty months in the safe. Call Sig or do some more investigating. Gas block and buffer will help.
Fireclean works like magic for me. I would strip down all my parts and clean with isopropyl alcohol and let dry (get all the other oils and lube previously used off). Then apply “coats” of fireclean with a q tip to any metal parts and let sit for a minute or two between “coats”. I usually repeated 2-3 times. Then lube my BCG and charging handle like normal with fireclean. Took a gun that wouldn’t make it to 300 rounds before laying down to 1000 rounds plus with no issues. Gun would still get dirty but the carbon damn near fell off when recleaning. Literally just used a clean rag to wipe off fallowed up by a quick thin coat of fireclean. Then of course lube BCG and charging handle in normal wear spots and ready to rock. I also use the same steps for suppressor mounts to fight carbon lock. Highly recommended when used properly.
Nature of the beast. Get a big 32oz bottle of MPro7 of SLIP and when you get back from the range pull the BCG, spray it down, wait a minute, wipe it with a rag. Dissassemble BCG and wipe bolt and cam pin, push a couple wet patches inside the carrier to get the bulk of the crap out. Put a wet patch on a chamber brush and give a couple turns in the chamber, then dry the chamber. Liberally lube the bolt, pin and carrier and reassemble. Thats it. No detail cleaning, scraping, whatever. A quick wipe down and re-lube. For extended firing sessions you will need to add lube every couple hundred rounds, especially if you are firing rapidly and burning off the lube/drying up the carbon. Oh, and for magazines use PMAGs that you can disassemble and run a rag through. Mags that get dirty will call cause feeding issues.
PWS long-stroke piston ARs and POF short stroke piston. Both have 5-position adjustable gas blocks AND are piston operated. Both get plenty dirty when suppressed but zero functioning problems.
1. Adjustable gas block.
2. Wipe and lube your BCG before and after each range session.
I have an 11.5 with a can. Its dirty, but it runs.
2. Wipe and lube your BCG before and after each range session.
I have an 11.5 with a can. Its dirty, but it runs.
He probably figured it out in the last 3 years.
Seriously old thread someone brought up, but the fact is, 99 percent of the answers were plain wrong.
Excessive fouling is a matter of high back pressure silencers. Not surprisingly, the BEST solution is LOW back pressure silencers. Duh.
Everything else is a bandaid and will be less effective than the cure.
My first can was an M42000-08. It was the “best” can at the time, and even the SEALS were using it. But it was designed to be quiet and tough without consideration for its place in the overall picture of the weapon system.
Keeping guns running with that thing on the end was a nightmare. I tried EVERYTHING. Swithblock, spring and buffer combinations, A5 buffer system, LMT enhanced BCG, piston, and more.
You know what fixed it? Surefire SOCOM RC. The problem is literally gone. I don’t have to clean or lube my DI guns almost ever now. They just keep running.
Fighting blowback after it’s already happened is a bandaid, and a poor one. Simply don’t introduce excessive back pressure to begin with and the problem is actually avoided altogether.
Excessive fouling is a matter of high back pressure silencers. Not surprisingly, the BEST solution is LOW back pressure silencers. Duh.
Everything else is a bandaid and will be less effective than the cure.
My first can was an M42000-08. It was the “best” can at the time, and even the SEALS were using it. But it was designed to be quiet and tough without consideration for its place in the overall picture of the weapon system.
Keeping guns running with that thing on the end was a nightmare. I tried EVERYTHING. Swithblock, spring and buffer combinations, A5 buffer system, LMT enhanced BCG, piston, and more.
You know what fixed it? Surefire SOCOM RC. The problem is literally gone. I don’t have to clean or lube my DI guns almost ever now. They just keep running.
Fighting blowback after it’s already happened is a bandaid, and a poor one. Simply don’t introduce excessive back pressure to begin with and the problem is actually avoided altogether.
A properly adjusted gas system (at the gas block or port) for the can is first up. Aeros new adjustable block has been working well for me. My thinking is by adjusting it at the port you are cutting the gas ever even coming back down the gas tube and potentially into the carrier piston chamber and upper. Solutions like the bootleg BCG seem to work well at reducing the extra recoil an overgassed rifle has, but you still are venting the extra gas right out the end of the gas tube once the carrier key unseats and slides back. If you cut the gas before it ever gets in the tube you lessen this.
Second is type oil used will help not burn off and cake the burnt residue (which is much of what people call carbon). Lucas extreme is one I'm just trying and seeing good results, but slip2000 EWL is a solid choice.
Lastly, as much as I love the effect my LMT enhanced BCG had on my suppressed SBR, the carrier costing being phosphate sucks. It's hard to clean and the type of crap that really plugs the gun up loves to stick to it. One of my other rifles has a NiB coating on the carrier and bolt head. It wipes clean with a paper towel when dirty. I dont go crazy cleaning it as a result. Just a simple wipe and inspection for cracks and wear, then light lube and back together. The SBR is likely getting a geissele REBCG when I can find one due to its high quality and finish being easy to clean. Shooting brass cased m193 or m855 I dont even touch lug recesses or chamber until at least 500-1000 rounds. I just wipe the BCG parts off and run a paper towel with slip2k through the inside of the upper.
Second is type oil used will help not burn off and cake the burnt residue (which is much of what people call carbon). Lucas extreme is one I'm just trying and seeing good results, but slip2000 EWL is a solid choice.
Lastly, as much as I love the effect my LMT enhanced BCG had on my suppressed SBR, the carrier costing being phosphate sucks. It's hard to clean and the type of crap that really plugs the gun up loves to stick to it. One of my other rifles has a NiB coating on the carrier and bolt head. It wipes clean with a paper towel when dirty. I dont go crazy cleaning it as a result. Just a simple wipe and inspection for cracks and wear, then light lube and back together. The SBR is likely getting a geissele REBCG when I can find one due to its high quality and finish being easy to clean. Shooting brass cased m193 or m855 I dont even touch lug recesses or chamber until at least 500-1000 rounds. I just wipe the BCG parts off and run a paper towel with slip2k through the inside of the upper.
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I have a Griffin Recce 5 on an 11.5
I switched to the Vltor A5 system and use Slip 2000 Extreme weapons grease. Rarely clean that rifle. And it runs great with SIM rounds.
I switched to the Vltor A5 system and use Slip 2000 Extreme weapons grease. Rarely clean that rifle. And it runs great with SIM rounds.
My Dead Air cans have minimal blow back. The rifle runs way fucking cleaner than when running my SiCo cans on it. I think ammo also plays a part. In my expierence certain brands of ammo tend to be dirty as hell compared to others.
I don't believe there is any secret sauce in running a suppressed gun clean. Limit the amount of excess gas coming back, adjustable gas block, do a couple different tests with powder, some powders are just naturally dirty, and clean as needed. Some people have noted different cans are more back pressure friendly, but eventually the gas has to go somewhere. Even in a piston design, you end up cleaning the piston assembly more often, it just keeps the crap away from the BCG.
For example I run H4895 in my 6mmFatRat. I shoot suppressed exclusively on that gun. That much H4895 is not going to burn clean, it just doesn't. I am also not blasting hundreds of rounds in a sitting. I typically bang off a few rounds, go collect animals and then move on.
For example I run H4895 in my 6mmFatRat. I shoot suppressed exclusively on that gun. That much H4895 is not going to burn clean, it just doesn't. I am also not blasting hundreds of rounds in a sitting. I typically bang off a few rounds, go collect animals and then move on.
I’m a 500rd guy on my 11.5, 12.5 supressed guns. (Aac 556sd and chimera) They are disgusting I spray them out with green can brake cleaner over the garage trash can. I even put the straw in the gas tube. Then they are bore snaked with hopes. I grease the bcg and buffer with egw the rest gets that red Lucas stuff of the go juice stuff Geissele sends you. The 12.5 has a superlative arms block and its cleaner than the 11.5 but not much. The 12.5 also gets fancy handloads with varget if that makes any difference. Both run like a top, it seems 500 rounds is the magic number for my shorties.
Why stop a fraction of the return gases (most come down the barrel) when you can actually solve the problem by using a silencer designed to function with a semi auto rifle (low back pressure)???
Bandaid vs. cure, plain and simple.
Bandaid vs. cure, plain and simple.
Depends on what the can was designed for. Sandman’s are pretty solid cans and dont get my gas guns too dirty
