Surgeon Action?

[MPrimo]

Was going to hijack another thread but thought better of it ...

Are Surgeon actions competitive with today's modern top tier offerings from Defiance, Impact, etc.? I don't hear much talk about them. Had one a few years ago that I loved. Looking to collect pieces for a new 6mm build and was thinking of that direction again. I'm not concerned about swapping barrels if that is part of the explanation.

 

[nexusfire]

They were one of the first to integrate the pic rail, action, and recoil lug as one solid piece. I own several and they have always been problem free.

 

[Painjob38]

They are awesome. I have many different actions from surgeon to big horn and the surgeon is one of my favorites.

 

[RTH1800]

They utilize a Remington extractor which is better than most of what folks try to improve it with.

 

[kthomas]

I think people went away from Surgeon due to the new management and how they run business. CS is not like what it used to be (supposedly - never had any dealings with them).

The actions are still great as they always were (as far as I know), but with all the great options these days, people tend to choose the companies that have great CS and support the customers.

 

[bas402]

Been running 591’s for yrs 1000’s of rds. without issues. Decided to try out a BRA in my WSM Action. Called up CS and ordered a 308 w/m16 extractor and SFP. Had it in 10 days as they weren’t in stock. They are not the same company as old for sure but still have had good service. Owned and sold Bighorns, Impacts still have my Surgeons and Defiance. They are still as good as ever but... have not kept up with the options available that some like and companies offer but.... I have yet to have one of my Surgeons let we down in ANY environment.

 

[427Cobra]

Mine has had a few barrels on it, and it has never let me down, I am going to send my bolt to Gretan to have the firing pin bushed for a small diameter pin, then I'm gonna have a 6gt tube installed. If I was in the market today for a action I would get a Impact, small diameter firing pin, ION or whatever you call it coating, all one piece body, and I absolutely love the fact that I can order a barrel screw it on my self, and it will shoot lights out.

 

[MikeRTacOps]

I'd go with the surgeon hands down but what would I know...

Mike R.
Tac Ops

 

[toader]

I'd go with the surgeon hands down but what would I know...

Mike R.
Tac Ops

Me too if it wasn't such a pain in the ass to get one nowadays!! (1086 w/ magnum bolt face)

 

[MPrimo]

Thanks for the input. Still seems like a viable candidate for a build but there may be better choices. At the right price I will surely consider it. Now to fully expose my old school tendencies, how are we feeling about the Sentinel stock? I just get this stuff stuck in my head and can't get away from it. BTW, I am not a competitive shooter in PRS but will dabble in it. I spend all of my free time practicing and competing in Sporting Clays and FITASC.

 

[BCX]

I have owned most of the above mentioned actions and hands down Surgeon is my favorite. Only other action i have been really impressed w is Lone Peak Fusion. My $1800 Defiance is finally breaking in after 500 rounds and many lubed cycles.

 

[BCX]

Me too if it wasn't such a pain in the ass to get one nowadays!! (1086 w/ magnum bolt face)

Thats the only downside is finding one. I ordered a 1086 a few months ago and was told Surgeon will be revamping the way they do business. Fingers Crossed LOL

 

[Scampo]

I own surgeon actions in 308 and 223. Mike R is building me an X-Ray 51 in 6.5cm on a surgeon 591 as well.

 

[djarecke]

I wouldn’t bother with them and just go for something I know works well and has great customer service - Impact.

 

[bas402]

Seems funny that Surgeon’s site shows 1086 in stock mag or 308 b/f. If your looking I would call them and verify

 

[toader]

Seems funny that Surgeon’s site shows 1086 in stock mag or 308 b/f. If your looking I would call them and verify

They need to update their website...….

 

[tacops1]

Got one they built me I’m selling like new from 2015. Round count is 10. Things a freak under 1/4” @ 110 yards w FGMM 168 gr BTHP very smooth action

 

[BCX]

My Surgeon Scapel in 308 was a hammer. .5 inch groups at 300 yards. Fist size at 1k

 

[zink14]

there are so many other actions out there that are currently better values: Curtis, Defiance, Zematt, Kelly atlas....is surgeon good yes but it comes unfinished, and rusts almost instantly upon touching; the trigger sear is finicky as fuck, you will have to contact timiny and get a sear that is specifically made for Surgeon, Remington, Huber, Gesilee, regular Timiny just don't work....and they are extremely heavy.....so do I hate my surgeon no, but it took a shit ton of money and trial and error to get it to shoot reliably; conversely I have never had that issue with any other of my custom actions

 

[ColdBore007]

Was going to hijack another thread but thought better of it ...

Are Surgeon actions competitive with today's modern top tier offerings from Defiance, Impact, etc.? I don't hear much talk about them. Had one a few years ago that I loved. Looking to collect pieces for a new 6mm build and was thinking of that direction again. I'm not concerned about swapping barrels if that is part of the explanation.

Surgeon Actions are built to incredible tolerances, with the bolt raceway 100% wire edm. The smith (and not just any smith - he runs one of the top accuracy schools in the nation) that built my .338 with a Barlein 5r barrel, said it is one of the most impressive actions ever produced. There is a reason they were bought out and snapped up for SOCOM contracts. The 591 action with the barrel chambered in 6mm would be an absolute tack driver, with a match barrel and the right smith. One of the features that I like most is the provision for the barrel tenon- it is significantly deeper, allowing for a more rigid barrel to action interface.

Good luck with your build!

 

[tacops1]

there are so many other actions out there that are currently better values: Curtis, Defiance, Zematt, Kelly atlas....is surgeon good yes but it comes unfinished, and rusts almost instantly upon touching; the trigger sear is finicky as fuck, you will have to contact timiny and get a sear that is specifically made for Surgeon, Remington, Huber, Gesilee, regular Timiny just don't work....and they are extremely heavy.....so do I hate my surgeon no, but it took a shit ton of money and trial and error to get it to shoot reliably; conversely I have never had that issue with any other of my custom actions

I’m just curious why not use a Jewell or Trigger tech than any of those listed im surprised I didn’t see them in your list

 

[BCX]

I have ran Jewell, TT and Hubers triggers on my Surgeons w no issues. All these next FAD actions everyone praises on here, i end up playing w at the range and I'm not one bit impressed.

 

[candyx]

1581XL 338 Lapua Surgeon still puts out a nice product you just have to wait for it and wait........

 

[BCX]

Love my Surgeon XL 338 LM AI

 

[BCX]

Surgeon 591 WSM 6.5 PRC

 

[Manna13]

Was going to start another thread but saw this one

I have a 591 in 6x47 Lapua , Krieger barrel , I like it alot

And have another Krieger ready for the 223 conversion


All that was missing was the bolt and lo and behold

I check the for sale section and there you go last piece of my puzzle

Just decided to change trigger

probably go triggertech straight

 

[MikeRTacOps]

Was it frustrating getting a Surgeon 591 and the DBM from them for a while? Yes, I must say that it was but they moved the operation from Oklahoma to Phoenix AZ. They had to get the bugs out and from my understanding they are back on the block and making chips. I went to SHOT walked into their booth and saw Preston Pritchett and we talked for about an hour and we spoke about some a GOOD STUFF going on. I’m not a 100% and don’t want to speak out of school but it looks like Preston is coming back to over see full production of the surgeon products. I also spoke with Dave Armberger ( spelling ? ) and they are moving forward to get production full steam ahead and I would say that for your gents that are interested in the Surgeon actions and products keep your shirts on for another minute…

Tac Ops is looking forward to continuing using the XL actions for our Tac 70 platforms and the 591’s for other projects when a non-LEO customer (s) wants a custom action not a Remington 700.

The Surgeon is a Great product and we get them to shoot in the zero’s with factory ammo leaving Beverly Hills need I say more ?

But what would I know...

Mike R.
Tac Ops

 

[MPrimo]

Thanks for that update Mike ... looking forward to what's coming. Gives me time to plan my build.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Was it frustrating getting a Surgeon 591 and the DBM from them for a while? Yes, I must say that it was but they moved the operation from Oklahoma to Phoenix AZ. They had to get the bugs out and from my understanding they are back on the block and making chips. I went to SHOT walked into their booth and saw Preston Pritchett and we talked for about an hour and we spoke about some a GOOD STUFF going on. I’m not a 100% and don’t want to speak out of school but it looks like Preston is coming back to over see full production of the surgeon products. I also spoke with Dave Armberger ( spelling ? ) and they are moving forward to get production full steam ahead and I would say that for your gents that are interested in the Surgeon actions and products keep your shirts on for another minute…

Tac Ops is looking forward to continuing using the XL actions for our Tac 70 platforms and the 591’s for other projects when a non-LEO customer (s) wants a custom action not a Remington 700.

The Surgeon is a Great product and we get them to shoot in the zero’s with factory ammo leaving Beverly Hills need I say more ?

But what would I know...

Mike R.
Tac Ops

This would be a big step back in the right direction for them.

 

[RTH1800]

A Surgeon action has the most “solid” feel of any I have handled. I really like the retained Remington features/parts. All that and a bolt knob that looks like a Jap grenade.

Fortunately, I have a lifetime supply of actions and parts so no issues with supply.

 

[zink14]

Jewell's shop is down the road from me, I like his single stage triggers a lot, but I don't use singles, I have 2 stage triggers on all of my hunting rifles, and most of my tactical rifles, just a preference. I haven't tried trigger tech, I am not adverse to them but I just haven't tried one.

In a conversation with surgeon they have said they want to close the gaps between the old product and the new products on the, this would put them back into consideration. I am a picky bastard, but my money my rifle, I get what works for me, and I was really let down by the Surgeon 591, esp for the premium price...with that said I do like the feel of the surgeon better than most.

I’m just curious why not use a Jewell or Trigger tech than any of those listed im surprised I didn’t see them in your list
[/QUOT]

 

[tacops1]

Trigger tech is some of the most durable triggers on the market. You can use and abuse them, they perform. jewell is awesome but requires way way way more maintenance many go with triggertech now A days because of this I guess plus ease of adjusting

I had this surgeon built by them in early 2015 when they didn’t have any issues. I didn’t get to hardly even shoot it as I had another full time shooter at the time and this thing with a jewell in it with FGMM 168’s shoots in the 0’s well under 1/4” she’s insane it’s a freak one hole ? gun. I’m selling it at this time

 

[tacops1]

Hey fellas I actually don’t know and never heard what barrels did surgeon use on their factory builds around 2015 year ? I never been told or asked is it another company or made in-house ??

 

[toader]

Hey fellas I actually don’t know and never heard what barrels did surgeon use on their factory builds around 2015 year ? I never been told or asked is it another company or made in-house ??

I think they used Krieger barrels...not 100% sure though.

 

[tacops1]

I think they used Krieger barrels...not 100% sure though.

Thanks makes sense that’s def one reason why the factory guns shot so well then

 

[BCX]

I know the earlier Scapels used Kriegers but the later ones also used Bartleins. I had a Scapel 308 w Bartlein. Gun was a tack driver.

 

[RTH1800]

I think the website offered both options later in production.

 

[tacops1]

Yeah makes sense for both brands mentioned to shoot lights out

 

[Ep1985]

Hey fellas I actually don’t know and never heard what barrels did surgeon use on their factory builds around 2015 year ? I never been told or asked is it another company or made in-house ??

Krieger

 

[Tokay444]

there are so many other actions out there that are currently better values: Curtis, Defiance, Zematt, Kelly atlas....is surgeon good yes but it comes unfinished, and rusts almost instantly upon touching; the trigger sear is finicky as fuck, you will have to contact timiny and get a sear that is specifically made for Surgeon, Remington, Huber, Gesilee, regular Timiny just don't work....and they are extremely heavy.....so do I hate my surgeon no, but it took a shit ton of money and trial and error to get it to shoot reliably; conversely I have never had that issue with any other of my custom actions

Zermatt? Kelbly's? Geissele?
Curtis can't hold a fucking candle to a Surgeon. If I had to wager a guess, it would be you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

 

[tacops1]

Krieger

AWESOME THANKS

 

[Hoser]

Around 5-7 years ago I ordered a 591 with a 308 and 223 bolt.

The 223 bolt has never showed up.

Frustrated, I sold the action a little while back.

 

[RTH1800]

The fact that @MikeRTacOps likes them makes me appreciate mine more. Mike knows a bit about accuracy and actions. ?

 

[BCX]

Finally a smith that prefers Surgeon actions. Far and few between these days.

 

[RTH1800]

If Preston is back on board I suspect that will change rapidly.

 

[zink14]

well your guess is wrong...i've been in this game a long long time and had a ton of custom built rifles over the years ...lol...move along

Zermatt? Kelbly's? Geissele?
Curtis can't hold a fucking candle to a Surgeon. If I had to wager a guess, it would be you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

 

[Tokay444]

well your guess is wrong...i've been in this game a long long time and had a ton of custom built rifles over the years ...lol...move along

I think I’ll trust Mike at TacOps over you, thanks.
Having a lot of rifles clearly hasn’t made you an expert.
Building hundreds or maybe thousands of some of the most well reputed rifles in the business for decades does.

 

[zink14]

Mike does great stuff, I think you think there is a pissing match here....there is not I own and shoot all of the above...

I think I’ll trust Mike at TacOps over you, thanks.

 

[Tokay444]

Great. Then we can agree Curtis is dogshit compared to a Surgeon.

 

[RTH1800]

Taste vary.

I appreciate the features of many actions.
Borden, Lone Peak Arms, Remington 700 etc.

For Tough+accurate+never fail reliability in a rough environment I choose Surgeon.

I take no offense to those that make or promote other choices.