SWFA experience

[Pickle Rick]

I have two SS fixed power scopes (10x and 12x), both in mils. The turrets on the 10x are remarkable. I absolutely love them. The turrets on the 12x are bad.…nearly 0 tactile feel (yes the screws are right). There is some audible, but when I have ear protection on I cannot tell when or what I’m adjusting. I used to have a 16x and the turrets were the same as this. It was actually replaced by SWFA for the 12x.

Reached out to SWFA and was told the mechanics for all of the fixed-powers are the same and the design has not changed. How in the world can one of them be so solid the this other one so bad? They told me something about grease getting into the mechanics and I should move the turrets around a bunch to disperse it. I’ve been using this scope for over a year tho. Any advice??

 

[Secant]

Those are $200 scopes that were designed a couple decades ago. You shouldn’t be too picky.

Even though you had it for a year, how much dialing have you done? You might just dial all the way up, all the way down over and over tonight.

The 5-20 that I used for a bit was on the mushy/sloppy side, but I’ve definitely had worse.

 

[Pickle Rick]

The thing is my first one was was amazing.

 

[Pickle Rick]

Those are $200 scopes that were designed a couple decades ago. You shouldn’t be too picky.

Even though you had it for a year, how much dialing have you done? You might just dial all the way up, all the way down over and over tonight.

The 5-20 that I used for a bit was on the mushy/sloppy side, but I’ve definitely had worse.

Also, the fixed powers are $300. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if the HD series had the same turrets.

 

[FuhQ]

Also, the fixed powers are $300. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if the HD series had the same turrets.

For $300, you should be looking into the Arken SH4... Exponentially more scope for the money. I used to have quite a few SWFA SS scopes, and I'm down to 3 left. One fixed 20x and 2 of the 3-15x42 SFP MQ & MQDM reticle models.

Arken Optics

www.arkenopticsusa.com

 

[Darayavaus]

everything gets cheaper over time. the old ones were made in Japan. the new ones also say Japan....but that could be a Leupoldism.

 

[FuhQ]

everything gets cheaper over time. the old ones were made in Japan. the new ones also say Japan....but that could be a Leupoldism.

I'm glad someone else knows the truth about Leupy... I haven't owned one since about 2008. And hadn't bought a new one since probably 2003. Don't plan on starting back anytime soon, either.

I know the ones I have were MIJ, because I've had them for over a decade, but you never know about the new ones. And honestly, the design for the SWFA scopes is extremely dated, and doesn't even have a simple zero-stop. There are now other companies making scopes with comparable reliability, and glass quality, with way more features for around the same price range.

 

[Pickle Rick]

I bought both of mine used. If I was going to buy one new I would certainly look at Arken. I’m getting a Viper 4-25 for Xmas

 

[Ndbowhunter]

i like the 6x and 10x for what they are..

fairly light, rugged, cheap enough to not give a crap and actually test their durability.

tons of travel, and good enough glass for shots that fall above 1800fps impact.

10x for target guns, 6x for taking heart beats.

had a pile of them. still a few on play guns and loaners.

that they can be had for 200$ is all the better and not made in china.

 

[Aqua Mark]

i like the 6x and 10x for what they are..

fairly light, rugged, cheap enough to not give a crap and actually test their durability.

tons of travel, and good enough glass for shots that fall above 1800fps impact.

10x for target guns, 6x for taking heart beats.

had a pile of them. still a few on play guns and loaners.

that they can be had for 200$ is all the better and not made in china.

This^^^^^
I have 10x on some inexpensive bolt guns and 6x on some $189 loaner 10/22s. Grab them when on sale for $219 (sometimes with free rings). Nothing else from Japan can touch them. These are not PRS level scopes,, they aren't meant to be. I also have Bushnell ET and NF glass, nothing from China if I can avoid it. No offense to the 99 Arken dealers and barkers on here.

 

[koshkin]

I'm glad someone else knows the truth about Leupy... I haven't owned one since about 2008. And hadn't bought a new one since probably 2003. Don't plan on starting back anytime soon, either.

I know the ones I have were MIJ, because I've had them for over a decade, but you never know about the new ones. And honestly, the design for the SWFA scopes is extremely dated, and doesn't even have a simple zero-stop. There are now other companies making scopes with comparable reliability, and glass quality, with way more features for around the same price range.

SFP 1-4x24 is made in Phillipines. All the other ones are made in Japan and always have been.

Arken is a feature rich scope for the money, but one way to never figure out the true track record of a scope is to iterate product lines once a year. Arken did switch OEMs a bit over a year ago and quality seems to have improved.

ILya

 

[FuhQ]

SFP 1-4x24 is made in Phillipines. All the other ones are made in Japan and always have been.

Arken is a feature rich scope for the money, but one way to never figure out the true track record of a scope is to iterate product lines once a year. Arken did switch OEMs a bit over a year ago and quality seems to have improved.

ILya

Have you gotten an EP5 or new EPL4 to try yet? Curious to see where you feel it stands, and your thoughts on the glass.

 

[koshkin]

Have you gotten an EP5 or new EPL4 to try yet? Curious to see where you feel it stands, and your thoughts on the glass.

Not yet. I am still trying to decide if I want to look at them. My basic problem is that I take a long time when I do a full scope test. That means if a manufacturer discontinues their products every year and introduces a new one, my efforts are useless from the standpoint of making recommendations. I do keep track of a few people who have the EP5 and other than exceedingly critical eyebox they seem reasonably happy. Several people did say that they thought Vortex Venom has better image quality, but not by a huge margin. That would imply that optically EP5 performs in line with its price range.

In terms of configuration EPL4 is probably of more interest to me, so we'll see.

ILya

 

[wpeach1912]

I’ve got a SWFA 3-15 SFP with the mil quad reticle I bought in 2017 for $400. It has served me very well. Shot comps with it for a year and lived on a hunting rifle for the last 2. I shot a muley this year at 660 yards with it a few minutes before legal shooting light ended. The glass definitely isn’t the greatest, but it isn’t bad. I’ve dropped, rolled, and bumped that scope quite a bit and it has never shifted zeros on me. I just got an XTR3 to replace it since I had a coupon and the exposed windage turret was bothering me. They’re solid scopes, but I agree they’ve been surpassed by modern technology. Athlon Midas Tac 4-16 fills the same use with better glass, better turrets, and a better reticle.

 

[FuhQ]

Not yet. I am still trying to decide if I want to look at them. My basic problem is that I take a long time when I do a full scope test. That means if a manufacturer discontinues their products every year and introduces a new one, my efforts are useless from the standpoint of making recommendations. I do keep track of a few people who have the EP5 and other than exceedingly critical eyebox they seem reasonably happy. Several people did say that they thought Vortex Venom has better image quality, but not by a huge margin. That would imply that optically EP5 performs in line with its price range.

In terms of configuration EPL4 is probably of more interest to me, so we'll see.

ILya

The people who claim the venom has better glass are clearly blind, or bias. I’m not being bias when I say this, but the glass is better than my Strike Eagle 5-25x56, and was on par with a PST-II 5-25x50 I compared it with. But I’d like to see someone like you do a real comparison and evaluation. The EP5 is becoming extremely popular, I’d venture a guess that it will be around for a while.

The EPL4 6-24x50 feels great in the hands…Very reminiscent of my Vortex HS-T 6-24x50 scopes, but better. Haven’t had a chance to look through it in daylight yet, but I really like the reticle and the turrets feel really good on the one I got. No spring-back noise, and solid clicks. I think you might enjoy that one.

 

[koshkin]

The people who claim the venom has better glass are clearly blind, or bias. I’m not being bias when I say this, but the glass is better than my Strike Eagle 5-25x56, and was on par with a PST-II 5-25x50 I compared it with. But I’d like to see someone like you do a real comparison and evaluation. The EP5 is becoming extremely popular, I’d venture a guess that it will be around for a while.

The EPL4 6-24x50 feels great in the hands…Very reminiscent of my Vortex HS-T 6-24x50 scopes, but better. Haven’t had a chance to look through it in daylight yet, but I really like the reticle and the turrets feel really good on the one I got. No spring-back noise, and solid clicks. I think you might enjoy that one.

As I said, I have not done the comparison myself, but the people I have talked to are generally not Vortex fanboys. Quite the opposite. Perhaps it is a matter of different eyes. Perhaps, it is a sample variation issue.

ILya

 

[Cluggins]

They told me something about grease getting into the mechanics and I should move the turrets around a bunch to disperse it.

That's a common cop out. You mean to tell me that a company can engineer and put together a precision instrument like a scope, but somehow can't figure out how to distribute grease during the manufacturing process? That's some funny stuff.

 

[Cluggins]

The people who claim the venom has better glass are clearly blind, or bias.

I think, to some degree, part of the "glass" equation lies in the way the particular glass works with our individual eyes.

Toss 10 different people 10 different scopes, and ask them to rate glass, I doubt any one list would look like the other.

 

[FuhQ]

I think, to some degree, part of the "glass" equation lies in the way the particular glass works with our individual eyes.

Toss 10 different people 10 different scopes, and ask them to rate glass, I doubt any one list would look like the other.

I agree, the same with Parallax. The numbers are setup for 20/20 vision, and most folks will have to adjust higher or lower depending on their eyes. But the Venom glass is lower quality than the Strike Eagle, so I will never understand the folks who claim the Venom is a better buy than the Strike Eagle. Personally, given the features of the SE, I think it's the better buy, over the Venom. But that's also subjective. I still own a ton of Vortex scopes, so I'm definitely not bias when I say the Arkens are comparable to, or better than, one of the Vortex models. I'm just reporting my findings, and some folks get pissed about it, and then start in the with "shill" accusations. It's pretty frustrating when you've spent your whole life trying to NOT be bias, and then folks on the interwebz want to be keyboard commandos.

 

[koshkin]

I agree, the same with Parallax. The numbers are setup for 20/20 vision, and most folks will have to adjust higher or lower depending on their eyes. But the Venom glass is lower quality than the Strike Eagle, so I will never understand the folks who claim the Venom is a better buy than the Strike Eagle. Personally, given the features of the SE, I think it's the better buy, over the Venom. But that's also subjective. I still own a ton of Vortex scopes, so I'm definitely not bias when I say the Arkens are comparable to, or better than, one of the Vortex models. I'm just reporting my findings, and some folks get pissed about it, and then start in the with "shill" accusations. It's pretty frustrating when you've spent your whole life trying to NOT be bias, and then folks on the interwebz want to be keyboard commandos.

Eyepiece adjustment takes care of your imperfect eyes. If the parallax knob is correctly calibrated and the eyepiece is properly adjusted, the numbers should line up.

Between Venom and Strike Eagle, it is not as simple as that. Strike Eagle has wider FOV, locking turrets and illumination. Venom is easier to get behind and optically surprisingly good. While Strike Eagle is a more feature rich scope, in terms of image quality, I am not convinced it is better than the Venom. I also somewhat prefer the Venom turret feel.

Having a lot of features is nice, if you use them. If you are willing to give up on some of them, sometimes you can get a scope with better fundamentals, which has sorta been the premise behind a lot of the SWFA Classic stuff. They do have updated models coming up, but existing ones are still compelling in their own way. There is a reason whey with all the scopes I have laying around I still use the two 3-9x42 SWFAs I have, 10x42 Classic with side focus and 10x42HD a good bit. There is something to be said about simplicity and track record.

Something to always keep in mind is that all the extra features in the world do not help you if the fundamentals are compromised or if there is so much sample variation that you roll the dice every time you whip out your credit card. Now, we do have a good number of scopes now that are very feature rich and have good fundamentals. However, the lowest price range where these can be acquired reliably is not yet clear to me. I am confident of several in the $1k range and I am slowly moving my expectations downward in price, but I am not yet fully convinced. Still, $500 Athlon Helos BTR Gen2 2-12x42 has had a lot of mileage on hard used hunting rifles in the last year or two and by and large it has really held up well. There is some sample variation with image quality, but the core design is robust. It will end up on my list of recommendations after the next update.

ILya

 

[wade2big]

@Pickle Rick have you rotated the turrets from top to bottom and all the way left to right? The turrets get much better when you do this a few times. I’m figuring grease is globbed in there somewhere.

 

[wade2big]

Eyepiece adjustment takes care of your imperfect eyes. If the parallax knob is correctly calibrated and the eyepiece is properly adjusted, the numbers should line up.

Between Venom and Strike Eagle, it is not as simple as that. Strike Eagle has wider FOV, locking turrets and illumination. Venom is easier to get behind and optically surprisingly good. While Strike Eagle is a more feature rich scope, in terms of image quality, I am not convinced it is better than the Venom. I also somewhat prefer the Venom turret feel.

Having a lot of features is nice, if you use them. If you are willing to give up on some of them, sometimes you can get a scope with better fundamentals, which has sorta been the premise behind a lot of the SWFA Classic stuff. They do have updated models coming up, but existing ones are still compelling in their own way. There is a reason whey with all the scopes I have laying around I still use the two 3-9x42 SWFAs I have, 10x42 Classic with side focus and 10x42HD a good bit. There is something to be said about simplicity and track record.

Something to always keep in mind is that all the extra features in the world do not help you if the fundamentals are compromised or if there is so much sample variation that you roll the dice every time you whip out your credit card. Now, we do have a good number of scopes now that are very feature rich and have good fundamentals. However, the lowest price range where these can be acquired reliably is not yet clear to me. I am confident of several in the $1k range and I am slowly moving my expectations downward in price, but I am not yet fully convinced. Still, $500 Athlon Helos BTR Gen2 2-12x42 has had a lot of mileage on hard used hunting rifles in the last year or two and by and large it has really held up well. There is some sample variation with image quality, but the core design is robust. It will end up on my list of recommendations after the next update.

ILya

Tell us more about the updated swfa scopes.

 

[Pickle Rick]

@Pickle Rick have you rotated the turrets from top to bottom and all the way left to right? The turrets get much better when you do this a few times. I’m figuring grease is globbed in there somewhere.

I did once. I’m going to do it a few more times though. It seemed to help a hair. Thanks for actually replying to my question lol has turned into an arken thread.

 

[Secant]

I did once.

Do it a few dozen times.

 

[koshkin]

Tell us more about the updated swfa scopes.

As soon as they are ready to release information, I will.

 

[Dobermann]

There are now other companies making scopes with comparable reliability, and glass quality, with way more features for around the same price range.

Got any links to reliability tests?

 

[FuhQ]

Got any links to reliability tests?

Well, if you don't know how to use Google or YouTube... Then I guess I can do that for you...

 

[Dobermann]

Well, if you don't know how to use Google or YouTube... Then I guess I can do that for you...

Hmm ... two of the paid influencers who work under the Leviathan Tribe "talent agency" (https://www.leviathantribe.com/ - "The overall objective of the Leviathan Tribe is to grow the client’s brand and ultimately drive sales through dynamic social content or direct feedback...") ... and two of those scopes failed in those reviews ...

I think I'll pass.

 

[FuhQ]

Hmm ... two of the paid influencers who work under the Leviathan Tribe "talent agency" (https://www.leviathantribe.com/ - "The overall objective of the Leviathan Tribe is to grow the client’s brand and ultimately drive sales through dynamic social content or direct feedback...") ... and two of those scopes failed in those reviews ...

I think I'll pass.

Ahhh yes, the YouLuminati…

Dude, please tell me you don’t actually believe in QANON, as well. And think that Trump was pro-gun…

What do you think the point of huge agencies and huge YouTube channels like that are? To sell shit and make money. They’re basically just walking advertisements. That still doesn’t change the fact the dude dropped the scope, bent the turret, and then beat it back straight on a table corner, and it still tracked true…

So, if you don’t trust them, who do you trust on YouTube? DemoDouche? Dickcock45? MAC?

Oh, and I’d love for someone to show me a scope that could actually survive those torture tests…Not many would…Even Alpha-tier brands.

 

[Rebels010]

As soon as they are ready to release information, I will.

Any potential timeframe on when they will release? Have several of their scopes and appreciate them for what they are. Would be intrigued by some new models.

 

[fdkay]

Replace the oring in the cap with one that has a smaller cross section.
Or, at least lube the current one with silicone lube.

 

[Red_SC]

I’ve removed the turrets and replaced the grease with light oil. It helped somewhat. I probably have 4 or 5 12x’s still knocking around, my personal favorite back in the day.