Rifle Scopes Target blurry when parallax set perfectly. NF ACTAR 7-35x56 F1

[Guthwine]

Lots of good info in your posts, but I'm a bit confused about one point...



The parallax knob is only a focus control? So it doesn't dial out parallax (i.e. reticle and target on same focal plane)?

Parallax knob adjusts the focus of the target and the diopter adjusts the focus of the reticle. If both are set correctly everything is in focus.
And if the target is clearly visible than it should (!!) be parallax free. If the target is either clear or parallax free than something was adjusted poorly.

Allthough parallax depends alot on the ambient light situation. A sunny day can result in a different parallax setting compared to a cloudy day. That is why the numbers on the knob are more of a guide. It's best to trust your eyes and not the knob.

 

[JFR]

Thank you, goosed.

JFR

 

[adventuresnortheast]

I contacted NF about this issue some time ago and they told me that the numbers indicated on the parallax knob don't necessarily correlate to that specific distance. They recommended that I just adjust the parallax knob until the parallax is eliminated and don't remain focused on the numbers on the knob. It works but it definitely begs the question of, "Why put a number there if it's irrelevant?"

Interestingly enough, I have a S&B PM II and a Vortex Razor HD that "behave" in a similar manner.......

Phoning NF support about this, they initially got stuck on the "numbers on the knob don't necessarily..." thing. I clarified with them that the issue I was having wasn't related to the numbers on the dial.

Pretending there are no numbers at all on the dial... if I dial the parallax so that the target is in sharpest focus at a given range, there's still parallax. If I dial the knob so that the parallax is eliminated at a given range, the target is blurry.

In every case, the setting that gives the sharpest focus is always quite a bit off from the setting that gives the least parallax.

Hearing this, NF support suggested I go back to the diopter adjustment again. After initially setting it at home, I had re-preformed it in the field after noticing the issue. They suggested I redo the diopter adjustment inside against a white background. If it doesn't resolve the issue, they'll have me send it in.

 

[adventuresnortheast]

There are scopes that I can’t set the diopter using infinity and the sky. Half the range of the diopter is perfectly sharp to me.

In those situations I place a target at 100 yards with very obvious shapes and letters and such, then I get the image parallax free and then adjust the diopter until the reticle is sharp. I go back and forth between the two until the reticle is sharp and there’s no parallax error.

I then verify at multiple distances until I’m happy. Works for me.

Sounds like a plan. I'll give this method a try. Fingers crossed.

 

[adventuresnortheast]

It means your diopter isn't set properly. The parallax knob is simply a focus control. Diopter adjustment sets the focal plane of the reticle. Parallax sets the focal plane of the target. When both are adjusted properly, both focal planes intersect at your eye. Therefore there is no parallax error.

So why is your target blurry?

Because the whole thing about setting reticle focus at infinity against the sky or a wall is a bit misleading. Do that as a first step. But then you need to get out at distance and look at a target. Set your parallax control to eliminate parallax like what you've done. If your target is now blurry (and not from mirage), then you need to slightly adjust the diopter to bring your target in focus. Then re-adjust your parallax. Do this a few times and it will fine tune everything. Do it at different distances as well.

NOTE: When you adjust your diopter, do not try to focus your eye on the reticle. Your eye needs to be relaxed (i.e. not using eye muscles to try to focus on something). This means you need to be looking at "infinity." Look at the horizon for 5-10 seconds so your eye relaxes. Then move behind your scope and get sight picture while still focusing your eye at infinity. Adjust diopter. Now look at the horizon again. Back behind rifle and adjust diopter. Back and forth a few times.

If you do all of this, your parallax setting will always give you a sharp target, sharp reticle, and zero parallax error. And you will reduce eye fatigue.

You should be able to have a cheek weld with your eyes closed, like you're sleeping on your rifle. Then open your eyes and immediate have a clear sight picture without trying to refocus or strain your eyes. Then you know it's all set right.

Very well put. I'll approach it this way. I appreciate your feedback and recommendation here. Thank you!

 

[theLBC]

thanks for this post. i was seeing something similar on another scope and found i was cheating the diopter focus (letting my eyes adjust).
once i properly focused the sight again, the target focus at the proper parallax is much better.

 

[Aaron47pb]

I cringe thinking about the amount of criticism we see on here about “glass quality” from people with incorrectly set diopters or from people looking through a friend’s/someone else’s scope that’s not set up for them.

 

[jakelly]

I have had the same thought so many times.

 

[hk dave]

I cringe thinking about the amount of criticism we see on here about “glass quality” from people with incorrectly set diopters or from people looking through a friend’s/someone else’s scope that’s not set up for them.

Or massive scope reviews by people that have never looked through a scope, don’t know what a parallax knob or diopter is...

 

[FourT6and2]

The parallax knob is only a focus control?

Correct.

So it doesn't dial out parallax (i.e. reticle and target on same focal plane)?

It dials out parallax error because it's a focus control.

The parallax knob is just a glorified focus ring like on a camera lens. That's it. Diopter adjusts the reticle's focus. Parallax control adjusts the target's focus (well the lens elements' focus). When both are focused to your eye, there is no more parallax error. Magic.

Here's an example. Your parallax control does the same thing. Go look at the ground next time you're at the range from like 100 yards to 1,000 yards and slowly turn the parallax control. You'll see the in-focus portion of ground slide out from 100 yards to infinity.

 

[theLBC]

Correct.



It dials out parallax error because it's a focus control.

The parallax knob is just a glorified focus ring like on a camera lens. That's it. Diopter adjusts the reticle's focus. Parallax control adjusts the target's focus (well the lens elements' focus). When both are focused to your eye, there is no more parallax error. Magic.

it might be more accurate to say it puts the reticle in the same focal plane as the target.
when it isn't, you can easily see the shift in relation to the target behind it when you move your head a little.

 

[FourT6and2]

it might be more accurate to say it puts the reticle in the same focal plane as the target.
when it isn't, you can easily see the shift in relation to the target behind it when you move your head a little.

lol yeah... that's called parallax error.

 

[theLBC]

lol yeah... that's called parallax error.

i just thought it should be clear that adjusting the parallax until the target looks sharp might not be eliminating the error itself.
(like the OP found)

 

[wade2big]

Clear target, pull the trigger. Not clear target, pull the trigger. Two hits.

 

[theLBC]

of course if you can always keep your head and eye positioned perfectly in relation to the scope, this is a moot point.

 

[lash]

i just thought it should be clear that adjusting the parallax until the target looks sharp might not be eliminating the error itself.
(like the OP found)

That wasn’t even what he suggested. One needs to work with both diopter adjustment and parallax/focus adjustment to achieve the best setting for your eyes. Sometimes it’s easy and sometimes it’s not. Good scope evaluators usually mention ease or difficulty of setup, eye relief, and parallax range (or forgiveness if you will).

I’m not one of those, but I have experienced many variations. I have a Steiner that was extremely finicky during initial sight ins and adjustments. It took me more time than I liked to get it set right. Now, it goes to my eye when it should, it has a decent parallax mid-range, and there are no issues with target focus at 100-1200 yards.

 

[theLBC]

That wasn’t even what he suggested. One needs to work with both diopter adjustment and parallax/focus adjustment to achieve the best setting for your eyes. Sometimes it’s easy and sometimes it’s not. Good scope evaluators usually mention ease or difficulty of setup, eye relief, and parallax range (or forgiveness if you will).

I’m not one of those, but I have experienced many variations. I have a Steiner that was extremely finicky during initial sight ins and adjustments. It took me more time than I liked to get it set right. Now, it goes to my eye when it should, it has a decent parallax mid-range, and there are no issues with target focus at 100-1200 yards.

sorry for any confusion.
I didn't mean to put words in his mouth, but he literally said that the parallax is only a focus control.

 

[lash]

sorry for any confusion.
I didn't mean to put words in his mouth, but he literally said that the parallax is only a focus control.

Correct. And as such, it has to be coordinated with the diopter to provide both a parallax free picture and a crisp reticle at the same time.

Let’s not let this bit sidetrack the real possibility that this scope (OPs) may need some factory adjustment.

 

[goosed]

Correct. And as such, it has to be coordinated with the diopter to provide both a parallax free picture and a crisp reticle at the same time.

Let’s not let this bit sidetrack the real possibility that this scope (OPs) may need some factory adjustment.

Well, it was also mentioned the diopter adjusts parallax which is... maybe just a typo, forgot to edit thing. In any case...

I agree no need to get bogged down in the semantics of how the optical system works. Use the traditional diopter method and the target focused one described in this thread. If issues persist send the scope in for a full check up.

 

[jakelly]

Correct. And as such, it has to be coordinated with the diopter to provide both a parallax free picture and a crisp reticle at the same time.

Let’s not let this bit sidetrack the real possibility that this scope (OPs) may need some factory adjustment.

That’s what I was asking earlier, is it ALWAYS possible to get sharp focus and a parallax free image?

Sounds like the answer is no. It is possible to have internal components far enough off, that the adjustment range won’t allow it.

 

[FourT6and2]

but he literally said that the parallax is only a focus control.

That is exactly what I said. And that is exactly what it is.
This is going in circles now. Have fun shooting

 

[jetsurgeon]

Thank you guys for clearing up some of this parallax focus stuff, I’m going to try and refocus when I goto the range again......good stuff!

 

[patriot07]

I agree that the diopter setting is probably off. And to be honest, diopters are just difficult to set properly on high-mag FFP scopes, and the setting is critical. Probably the 2 things I spend the most time on when setting up a new scope is making sure it's level to the gun and making sure my diopter setting is correct.

I'd bet that once you reset diopter, you'll find that your problem goes away. Take some time with it though.

 

[Steel head]

So this thread got me thinking a bit and I tinkered a bit more with the Diopter on my Cronus.

I got it to match up a lot better at 100 yards and Saturday I shot it at 1000+ at a few distances and it’s considerably better.
At this point the reticle doesn’t seem razor sharp but it’s still very clear and not taxing to look at for extended periods but image is clear without parallax.

 

[KJRMolon]

It means your diopter isn't set properly. The parallax knob is simply a focus control. Diopter adjustment sets the focal plane of the reticle. Parallax sets the focal plane of the target. When both are adjusted properly, both focal planes intersect at your eye. Therefore there is no parallax error.

So why is your target blurry?

Because the whole thing about setting reticle focus at infinity against the sky or a wall is a bit misleading. Do that as a first step. But then you need to get out at distance and look at a target. Set your parallax control to eliminate parallax like what you've done. If your target is now blurry (and not from mirage), then you need to slightly adjust the diopter to bring your target in focus. Then re-adjust your parallax. Do this a few times and it will fine tune everything. Do it at different distances as well.

NOTE: When you adjust your diopter, do not try to focus your eye on the reticle. Your eye needs to be relaxed (i.e. not using eye muscles to try to focus on something). This means you need to be looking at "infinity." Look at the horizon for 5-10 seconds so your eye relaxes. Then move behind your scope and get sight picture while still focusing your eye at infinity. Adjust diopter. Now look at the horizon again. Back behind rifle and adjust diopter. Back and forth a few times.

If you do all of this, your parallax setting will always give you a sharp target, sharp reticle, and zero parallax error. And you will reduce eye fatigue.

You should be able to have a cheek weld with your eyes closed, like you're sleeping on your rifle. Then open your eyes and immediate have a clear sight picture without trying to refocus or strain your eyes. Then you know it's all set right.

In the first steps you talked about a target at distance. Does it matter the distance or is it just a reference point to get started? Then you can continue to find tune as stated? Or does it need to be a known distance to get the parralax knob adjustment hash marks close.

I'm really new to the magnified optic world.

 

[lash]

In the first steps you talked about a target at distance. Does it matter the distance or is it just a reference point to get started? Then you can continue to find tune as stated? Or does it need to be a known distance to get the parralax knob adjustment hash marks close.

I'm really new to the magnified optic world.

The specific distance does not matter. Ideally, it’s far enough so that you are using your infinity setting on the focus dial, but in absence of long range things to focus on, it can be any longer distance.

And do not pay any attention to the hash marks or markings on your focus/parallax dial. At least not during this exercise.

 

[Milo 2.5]

The specific distance does not matter. Ideally, it’s far enough so that you are using your infinity setting on the focus dial, but in absence of long range things to focus on, it can be any longer distance.

And do not pay any attention to the hash marks or markings on your focus/parallax dial. At least not during this exercise.

We had issues with 2 NF 7-35 F1's, a call to NF and were told by a tech to set the diopter or eyepiece at 25ft, with the power maxed out, focus on infinity. You can do it on a wall in your house or garage, you are not remotely focusing the picture as much as getting a crisp reticle and no clutter on the sides. Once we did this, no issues to date, and basically over 80% of the focus knobs range is unusable now, I think both of our focus knob settings range from 150-300 on the dial, from zeroing the scope at 100, to hitting steel to 2K.
It looks goofy as hell, scope focused at 2K, parallax set on 250, but once you get the idea out of your head that it seems messed up, it makes it a lot easier just to focus for a clear pic and have fun, regardless off what the dial says.

 

[phlegm]

We had issues with 2 NF 7-35 F1's, a call to NF and were told by a tech to set the diopter or eyepiece at 25ft, with the power maxed out, focus on infinity. You can do it on a wall in your house or garage, you are not remotely focusing the picture as much as getting a crisp reticle and no clutter on the sides. Once we did this, no issues to date, and basically over 80% of the focus knobs range is unusable now, I think both of our focus knob settings range from 150-300 on the dial, from zeroing the scope at 100, to hitting steel to 2K.
It looks goofy as hell, scope focused at 2K, parallax set on 250, but once you get the idea out of your head that it seems messed up, it makes it a lot easier just to focus for a clear pic and have fun, regardless off what the dial says.View attachment 7116851

I've had this exact experience, seeing my parallax knob on the ~200 side while shooting beyond 1k. After getting over the mental hurdle, it makes setting up to shoot at varying distances simple and quick.

 

[Milo 2.5]

I've had this exact experience, seeing my parallax knob on the ~200 side while shooting beyond 1k. After getting over the mental hurdle, it makes setting up to shoot at varying distances simple and quick.

Lol, I also just figured out after fighting 2 kahles optics for 8-10 mos on 2 Dashers, it pays to read the manual. The focus on blue sky horseshit bit hard. I have shot NF for yrs and hated how you set the eyepiece, so shooting Kahles or scopes with fast focus eyepieces was a dream, until I figured out once set, you really do not want to touch it again, or let a friend shoot the rifle and start cranking on it for his pleasure.

 

[KJRMolon]

The specific distance does not matter. Ideally, it’s far enough so that you are using your infinity setting on the focus dial, but in absence of long range things to focus on, it can be any longer distance.

And do not pay any attention to the hash marks or markings on your focus/parallax dial. At least not during this exercise.

Can you please give your ideal distance, yards, you would prefer for the exercise? And what is considered infinity? School me on the infinity setting and what it's used for.

Thank you for your time.

 

[lash]

Can you please give your ideal distance, yards, you would prefer for the exercise? And what is considered infinity? School me on the infinity setting and what it's used for.

Thank you for your time.

I am hardly one to school anyone on optics as I consider myself just a user and not much more. That said, ideally I like to have 1000 or so yards available with a number of other known distances in the middle, like 300, 500-600, and also a known 100 yard target/berm.

And the infinity setting is really misnamed but sometimes literally marked as such on scope focus knobs with the infinity symbol. For me it just means the maximum focus setting on the knob. I often find myself at that setting at longer distances. It is largely dependent on the particular scope you’re using and where you get the best focus and parallax at long distances.

 

[KJRMolon]

I am hardly one to school anyone on optics as I consider myself just a user and not much more. That said, ideally I like to have 1000 or so yards available with a number of other known distances in the middle, like 300, 500-600, and also a known 100 yard target/berm.

And the infinity setting is really misnamed but sometimes literally marked as such on scope focus knobs with the infinity symbol. For me it just means the maximum focus setting on the knob. I often find myself at that setting at longer distances. It is largely dependent on the particular scope you’re using and where you get the best focus and parallax at long distances.

I'm getting a Nightforce 4-16 or a Leupold mark 5 3.6-18 for a spr 556 build for 0-600 yards. Would the process be the same with these intended distances? IE the infinity setting?

 

[lash]

Typically yes, but don’t discount the post above detailing how Nightforce recommended that you proceed.

 

[KJRMolon]

I'm getting a Nightforce 4-16 or a Leupold mark 5 3.6-18 for a spr 556 build for 0-600 yards. Would the process be the same with these intended distances? IE the infinity setting?

Typically yes, but don’t discount the post above detailing how Nightforce recommended that you proceed.

Thank you.

 

[FourT6and2]

The specific distance does not matter. Ideally, it’s far enough so that you are using your infinity setting on the focus dial, but in absence of long range things to focus on, it can be any longer distance.

And do not pay any attention to the hash marks or markings on your focus/parallax dial. At least not during this exercise.

Agreed. Except for the infinity thing. When you're fine-tuning, I find it helps to NOT be at infinity. You don't want to be so far from your target that mirage has an effect. But also not super close. Usually when I get a new optic on a rifle, I zero at 100 and then gather DOPE at 200, 300, 400, 500, etc. out to 1,000. So I typically fine tune at 200. And see how that goes. By 400 yards everything is perfect and I never have to touch the diopter again. Usually the scope is dialed in right off the bat at 200 though.

Too much mirage at 1,000 to really fine tune focus. The target is gonna be too small and too blurry at the distance no matter what.

 

[generalzip]

It's a pretty well known fact on most schmidt 5-25 in cold weather you can not dial out parallax error past about 400 yards. Temperature has a huge impact on parallax. The numbers on the side are useless. My NF 7-35 had to be set at 70 yards for a 100 yard focus. 700 yards it was set at like 150. The schmidt seems to line up better in warm conditions. Apparently you can send them back to have them adjust for different climates. I'd imagine it's one of the downsides to being able to focus in at 10 yards.

 

[KJRMolon]

Agreed. Except for the infinity thing. When you're fine-tuning, I find it helps to NOT be at infinity. You don't want to be so far from your target that mirage has an effect. But also not super close. Usually when I get a new optic on a rifle, I zero at 100 and then gather DOPE at 200, 300, 400, 500, etc. out to 1,000. So I typically fine tune at 200. And see how that goes. By 400 yards everything is perfect and I never have to touch the diopter again. Usually the scope is dialed in right off the bat at 200 though.

Too much mirage at 1,000 to really fine tune focus. The target is gonna be too small and too blurry at the distance no matter what.

Do if I'm following you. Zero at 100 adjusting both paralax and diopter into focus. Then fine tune the diopter and 200 and set. Then would use paralax adjustment in and out depending on shot distance.

 

[FourT6and2]

Do if I'm following you. Zero at 100 adjusting both paralax and diopter into focus. Then fine tune the diopter and 200 and set. Then would use paralax adjustment in and out depending on shot distance.

Sure. You can fine tune at whatever distance you want. I just do it at whatever distance I first shoot at after I mount. Once when I zero, and then again if necessary at distance. If I'm at 400 yards the first time, that's when I do it. Shouldn't matter.

 

[KJRMolon]

Sure. You can fine tune at whatever distance you want. I just do it at whatever distance I first shoot at after I mount. Once when I zero, and then again if necessary at distance. If I'm at 400 yards the first time, that's when I do it. Shouldn't matter.

Copy that

 

[Steel head]

Sure. You can fine tune at whatever distance you want. I just do it at whatever distance I first shoot at after I mount. Once when I zero, and then again if necessary at distance. If I'm at 400 yards the first time, that's when I do it. Shouldn't matter.

I did it at 100 yards so mirage wouldn’tbe an issue.

After I’m parallax free and well focused from zero to past a mile.

Life is good

 

[blbennett1288]

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