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Terrapin.... will be..
- Thread starter one shot ST
- Start date
I've heard the same thing from two difference sources now. It's surprising as it's got to be a top selling product for Vectronix; definitely best-in-class. Perhaps Leica, Bushnell and Swaro teamed up to lobby them out of production? 
I can't see most people wanting a Terrapin being willing to throw down the the extra $1,655 for a PLRF-10. So if they discontinue the Terrapin line, they will pretty much be kissing all of the Terrapin generated revenue goodbye.
Personally I think users/operators needing the features of the PLRF-10 are not typically constrained by budgetary issues and forced to go with a Terrapin instead, but maybe I am wrong.
Personally I think users/operators needing the features of the PLRF-10 are not typically constrained by budgetary issues and forced to go with a Terrapin instead, but maybe I am wrong.
I find it kind of hard to believe. If they do im sure there will be a replacement. The PLRF10's are made in switzerland but the terrapins are i think the only model thats made stateside in NH. So they are going to have a free productions line if they do away with it. There must be a replacement.
CJG
CJG
Glad I already have one. Heh.
That said, I think what people are hitting on is probably correct. Its such an underpromised and overperforming product its taking away from some of their other stuff. If I was them, I'd add a data cable and BT feature to the terrapin, raise the price another ~$500.00 or so and discontinue the other products nobody is using. I think that's the more likely scenario. The Terrapin as we know it is going to cease, but a new model with similar performance, a higher price, and a few features you would otherwise have to pay an extra few grand for will be added.
Rich
That said, I think what people are hitting on is probably correct. Its such an underpromised and overperforming product its taking away from some of their other stuff. If I was them, I'd add a data cable and BT feature to the terrapin, raise the price another ~$500.00 or so and discontinue the other products nobody is using. I think that's the more likely scenario. The Terrapin as we know it is going to cease, but a new model with similar performance, a higher price, and a few features you would otherwise have to pay an extra few grand for will be added.
Rich
I'm glad I got mine when I did. Zero complaints with mine!
If they completely discontinue the 05 then if we ever need to sell ours they'll be worth more than we paid for them.
If they completely discontinue the 05 then if we ever need to sell ours they'll be worth more than we paid for them.
I was told this exact info by a reputable vendor on here and it was debunked by both THEIR vendor and I spoke with the marketing director for Vectronix who is just 30 minutes from me and was also told the info was false. Ashbury Precision replied "that is one of our best selling items, why would they discontinue it?!" Now I did get info stating Vectronix is going to revamp the 10 and 15 to bring their outdated design and features more into the direction the market is going and THEN it should be time to roll some R&D into the next Terrapin.
Now as with most things, if a company is not ever changing their products and listening to the consumer they could work themselves out of a job. There will always be change and it is only a matter of time. Like stated above, look at AI discontinuing the AE. AI understands there is a solid market for that tier of rifle and will be rolling out a product that is enhanced but will run in the same price range.
Now as with most things, if a company is not ever changing their products and listening to the consumer they could work themselves out of a job. There will always be change and it is only a matter of time. Like stated above, look at AI discontinuing the AE. AI understands there is a solid market for that tier of rifle and will be rolling out a product that is enhanced but will run in the same price range.
I just heard from the US distributor that the 10, 10C, 15, 15C are all going away, followed closely by the Terrapins (a few months later). The explanation I got was the margins on these (including the Terrapin) are just too low to be able to make enough profit on. If this is really the case - then maybe Vectronix is just re-focusing on their military sales and systems rather than the lower end (the 25C is still going to be kept on)...
If it is really a problem making enough profit at the price point - there may not be a replacement.
If it is really a problem making enough profit at the price point - there may not be a replacement.
I'm going to call vectronix USA Monday and Ashbury precision ordnance to also see if they have any updates. Euro optics said something like this before the summer and Vectronix said they didn't know where they got that info and Euro is not even on their vendor list, implying Euro is a third level dealer.
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/elr-beyond-1000-yards/109083-vectronix-exports.html
Same thing popped up in 2012.
I would think with the cut in mil spending these days that Vectronix would try and push on the civilian side.
Same thing popped up in 2012.
I would think with the cut in mil spending these days that Vectronix would try and push on the civilian side.
Well, I am waiting to see the letter if they will show it to me. I got a pretty unequivocal email saying they would be discontinuing the PLRF's.
After this email I called - and this was for non terrapins - only 10, 10c, 15 and 15C (keeping the 25C only). However they said the Terrapins should be phased out by February.
The big question is if they are going to replace all these lower end products with some other product or not. I just did a search on the exhibitors at Shot - and Vectronix isn't even listed. I would guess this is because their main focus is Military and Agency sales (both US and abroad). If they are not attending Shot, I don't see them releasing a new product line for Civilians at Shot...
So, my guess - uninformed as it is - is they are not making "enough" profit on the lower end models to justify the various product lines - they are reducing the variety to a single one that produces "enough" profit and will primarily sell that to military and governmental agencies. Perhaps they are re-focusing on some of the other business like the systems or thermal imaging (fairly recently acquired) - or perhaps they are focusing on the Vector series combined binocular / rangefinders ?
Anyway, it looks like at least the mid-range PLRF's are going away pretty quickly - so if you were thinking about a PLRF to attach to a FFS handheld - now would be the time to get one...
After this email I called - and this was for non terrapins - only 10, 10c, 15 and 15C (keeping the 25C only). However they said the Terrapins should be phased out by February.
The big question is if they are going to replace all these lower end products with some other product or not. I just did a search on the exhibitors at Shot - and Vectronix isn't even listed. I would guess this is because their main focus is Military and Agency sales (both US and abroad). If they are not attending Shot, I don't see them releasing a new product line for Civilians at Shot...
So, my guess - uninformed as it is - is they are not making "enough" profit on the lower end models to justify the various product lines - they are reducing the variety to a single one that produces "enough" profit and will primarily sell that to military and governmental agencies. Perhaps they are re-focusing on some of the other business like the systems or thermal imaging (fairly recently acquired) - or perhaps they are focusing on the Vector series combined binocular / rangefinders ?
Anyway, it looks like at least the mid-range PLRF's are going away pretty quickly - so if you were thinking about a PLRF to attach to a FFS handheld - now would be the time to get one...
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It is called "the Wille Sutton sign"—go where the money is. Who has money in a crashed economy? Banksters and the governments that the banksters own. Vectronix will service that market because that is where the money is.
I called Vectronix and had to leave a voice mail on Monday and have been a bit busy to follow up. Potomac River Group is right down the hall from Vectronix (actually started and run by a former Vectronix employee), I should have dropped them a line also.
well, I heard that like another poster said Vectronix seems to do this every once in a while. If its not on paper, they don't believe it. So, from that I take it that it may be a bunch of hot air that Terrapins are going away. However the PLRF 10, 10C, 15 and 15C - I have been told are to be discontinued by the end of this month - and Vectronix won't take any new orders on them - only the 25C. This was supposedly in writing from Vectronix, but they won't send me a copy of the letter :-(.
So - I guess it really is a crap shoot at this point - nobody really know won't likely know unless Vectronix publishes a press release or something.
So - I guess it really is a crap shoot at this point - nobody really know won't likely know unless Vectronix publishes a press release or something.
Hmmm, I really would like to upgrade from my terrapin to a 10c/15c at some point to pair with my Trimble and FFS. I hope they continue to make these models in the future as I can't justify the cost difference right now.
As I sit back in my truck warming up from a long quiet morning of hunting, I got a call. Sorry to say the rumors are true guys. I don't want to say a whole lot about it, I understand where they are coming from and at least they will continue to support the products in case of failure.
Now begins the mad dash of all of those out there who wanted one but haven't bought one yet to go get theirs.
Now begins the mad dash of all of those out there who wanted one but haven't bought one yet to go get theirs.
anyone interested in the PLRF 10, 10C, 15 and 15C should get it NOW. The order acceptance ends at the end of December from what I have been told. I know this is not a lot of people - but if you run a slaved PDA, and have been on the fence, you better get moving if you want one.
Matt - did your contact mention anything about the Terrapins going away, or just the PLRF's (minus the 25C)?
Matt - did your contact mention anything about the Terrapins going away, or just the PLRF's (minus the 25C)?
did you hear that from Vectronix or PRG? I just spoke with PRG yesterday and they said they had "heard" talk about that - but at this point it was only talk - which Vectronix seems to like to do every so often. The others were from a letter Vectronix sent, so they felt confident that was going to happen...
yep - that sucks, glad I got mine as well - but its really going to suck for people who want a solid over 1000 M rangefinder...
So this is for real, no doubt? I just figured out this was the one to own and was going to start saving my pennies. Crap. Hopefully Leica or someone else steps up and fills that void in the market at a decent price point. I want to be able to point and shoot at 338 ranges.
Well that blows but I need some hard proof before I get to excited about this. I already have one but would hate to see them go.
I spoke with Ashbury and got some more info. The vectronix will cease terrapin production in March 2014. Sales will continue until there are no more.
I've had LRF's from just about everybody and honestly Leica is NOT on top of their game. Your only hope would be that Swarovski steps up.
We may see a similar product to the Terrapin from Vectronix in the late 2014 time frame. From what I gather they may be offering it at the same price but the unfortunately they are looking a price margins and the unit could be a cheaper made unit. I.e. the plrf-05,10 & 15 weren't bringing in big bucks due to production costs so the next terrapin type unit if it is sold at the same price point would have to cost less to produce.....
I've had LRF's from just about everybody and honestly Leica is NOT on top of their game. Your only hope would be that Swarovski steps up.
We may see a similar product to the Terrapin from Vectronix in the late 2014 time frame. From what I gather they may be offering it at the same price but the unfortunately they are looking a price margins and the unit could be a cheaper made unit. I.e. the plrf-05,10 & 15 weren't bringing in big bucks due to production costs so the next terrapin type unit if it is sold at the same price point would have to cost less to produce.....
Vectronix has a phone number, use it! If you don't want to see it go or would like to express interest in any future Terrapin type products then the best thing you can do is let them know that!
I would not look to other vendors to fill the gap. In reality most of them are focused on the civilian market - and on selling large numbers of units. That means they are not really focused on the needs of long range shooters - since most shots are not over 1000 yards. So, the big question for a Leica or others would be while spool up an entirely new product line and all those costs for a product which gets very little (in comparison) sales volume?
Vectronix approached it from the other direction - they were already creating a product at the high end mostly aimed at Military and Government sales. They simply had to create a minimally different product (less features and different housing) and price it less than what they were charging for the other units - I think that is a lot easier than say taking a Leica and try to get it to match the Terrapin's range.
What doesn't also bode well for us - is that if Vectronix can't make a profit at it, how would the other vendors? If they can't get the benefit of large scale production (ie, sell lots of units) then the cost is going to be high - and if they see very little profit, likely they won't do it.
Vectronix approached it from the other direction - they were already creating a product at the high end mostly aimed at Military and Government sales. They simply had to create a minimally different product (less features and different housing) and price it less than what they were charging for the other units - I think that is a lot easier than say taking a Leica and try to get it to match the Terrapin's range.
What doesn't also bode well for us - is that if Vectronix can't make a profit at it, how would the other vendors? If they can't get the benefit of large scale production (ie, sell lots of units) then the cost is going to be high - and if they see very little profit, likely they won't do it.
I understand your point here, but, Vectronix builds those devices in Switzerland, with all the uber high end parts. For example, the Fischer connectors on the PLRF cost upwards of $60 a piece (and that's direct from Fischer - not through Vectronix!). For just the connector. Vectronix's business model is based on selling mil-spec type stuff to militarys, that don't give a shit (for the most part) how much a product costs, so long as the 50 pages of specification are all in fact met. A product like that is not going to sell well for civilian consumption, obviously, because not many civvys can/will fork out $5k+(++) for a laser.
A company making a product that doesn't have to meet DoD specifications, and isn't built with a "spare no expense" mindset could potentially be produced elsewhere, with quality but not "uber high end" parts, and very nearly match the performance of the Vectronix equipment, but at a much better pricepoint.
...Just some musings...
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Pretty well written: fact is that Vectronix products have always been military first and the small mumber of Terrapin units sold don't make a significant part of their overall revenue. The PLRF units are also now in military terms obsolete: The FIST and other Infantry programmes have already seen delivery of the MOSQUITO from Vectronix and that is in a price/performance range well beyond the average let alone committed shooter.
IMHO those that have the PLRF10-C and 15C will see the value of the units significantly escalate.
Well supposedly there is going to be a Terrapin equal rangefinder coming out at shot that is supposedly designed by a former Vectronix engineer and a guy named Bryce Wells. It's supposed to have ballistic calcs out to as far as the unit will range along with angle. All this for somewhere in the neighborhood of $1200-$1500. Sounds too good to be true to me. Anybody heard of Bryce Wells? Supposed to be a big time hunter with a TV show debuting in '14.
Ill wait til shot and if nothing comes out like the terrapin and the death of the terrapin is true then I guess I'll finally shit and get off the pot. Ive been wanting one for a while, just seems I always end up buying something else.
After using my terrapin for almost 6 months. I'm never letting it go. There will likely be no equal.
I think the big losers in this may be anyone who wants one of the 10c or 15c's. Since there won't likely be a replacement in that niche... If your trying to hook up to FFS if you don't get one now you may be SOL.
The Terrapins may last a while - and you can wait on those till after Shot, but the others I wouldn't wait on...
and Bryce Wells is news to me - I will look him up...
hmmm - maybe you mean the "Long Range Addiction" rangefinder posted on facebook here:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Long-Range-Addiction/308102045888952
Looks like that company is sort of new...
The Long Range Shooting Experts - HOME
Also, just spoke with Vectronix today - again - they don't attend SHOT since they are like 1% focused on the civilian sales market - in case anyone has hopes they will be releasing something there...
The Terrapins may last a while - and you can wait on those till after Shot, but the others I wouldn't wait on...
and Bryce Wells is news to me - I will look him up...
hmmm - maybe you mean the "Long Range Addiction" rangefinder posted on facebook here:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Long-Range-Addiction/308102045888952
Looks like that company is sort of new...
The Long Range Shooting Experts - HOME
Also, just spoke with Vectronix today - again - they don't attend SHOT since they are like 1% focused on the civilian sales market - in case anyone has hopes they will be releasing something there...
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That's him herofish. Claims he is behind a new rangefinder like I described and it will basically replace the Terrapin at a cheaper price.
I talked to him on the phone - he seems legit. He is saying all the right things, and the pricepoint for the 2500Y version seems good - with more features than the Terrapin to boot. He is going to be at SHOT, so I am going to try to hook up and take a look. Will compare it to the Terrapin if I get a chance.
Someone needs to fill the void, and at the worst case, provide some actual competition to the Terrapin...
Someone needs to fill the void, and at the worst case, provide some actual competition to the Terrapin...
I'll believe it when I see it. If it was as easy to put that many features into a 2500 yard capable rangefinder, it would have been done already I say. I have been wrong before but I'll bet one if two things happen. It's released and it can't range shit past 1000 and in the fine print it says something like "2500 yards dependent on targets the size of cars". Or it doesn't make a debut and excuses are made until it falls into obscurity. Yes I am a little negative but like I said, if it could be done, it would already be out there. Gunwerks or some other snake oil salesman would have done it already. I could be wrong, it's happened before...
Wheres the best place to get them and is 2K pretty much the going rate? I really hadn't intended on buying one til the end of next year but I may have to do it sooner.
This is about as cheap as I've seen them.
http://www.prgdefense.com/products/manufacturers/vectronix/terrapin.aspx#.UrZo0qa9LCQ
http://www.prgdefense.com/products/manufacturers/vectronix/terrapin.aspx#.UrZo0qa9LCQ
