Thanks Slapchop

[SeanRT]

I've been debating whether I should post this for some time now. But then I read Slapchop's "5 minutes of your time" and I thought 'hey, if he can post that kind of stuff, so can I.' So here goes:

When it comes to self-defense (true self-defense, not that gay octagon BS that has rules) here are some interesting tips:

1. It only takes about 30 pounds of force to break the elbow

2. What do you do when grabbed by someone stronger than yourself and you can't get away? Usually, the best option is to go for the pinky finger and break it. The pinky finger is one of the weakest fingers on the hand and it can be isolated very easily (I played with this idea while fighting a body builder - a really strong guy. No matter how hard he tried, he just wasn't strong enough for my pinky-finger-gung-fu). Try this with someone bigger and stronger than yourself (but don't break their fingers); you'll be suprised with how effective it is.

3. One of the worst places to strike someone: on the inside of the bicep. The brachial artery runs down the inside of the bicep. A strong enough strike can rupture this artery (don't know what happens when an artery is broken? See Black Hawk Down). This also applies to the femoral artery (inside of the upper leg.

4. There are two ways to choke someone out: 1) Blood choke, and 2) Airway choke. If you are using a blood choke, it only takes about 3-5 seconds to be choked out (I can attest to this personally). However, an airway choke can take as long as a full minute (sometimes longer) to choke someone out. If you find yourself in this situtaion (i.e. having a blood choke applied to your throat)...panic! By the time you come up with a plan it's too late; you're out. So, to avoid this potentially embarrassing situation you should have a plan just in case someone tries to apply a blood choke on you.

This has been a public service announcement by Edmund Parker's American Kenpo...more to follow...

 

[Runamuk]

Re: Thanks Slapchop

All potentially sound advice if one can pull it off "in the moment".

But with all due respect (honestly) I have to ask about your statement:

"When it comes to self-defense (true self-defense, not that gay octagon BS that has rules)".

What makes you think that because these guys fight with rules in the cage, that they couldn't kick ass in a fight without rules? Does that mean that if I only shoot on a range with rules that when I’m not on a range (with rules) that I’m not any better than someone who’s never shot?

1. "30 pounds of force to break the elbow" Maybe, I’ve never measured it. But how would you get into a position to apply this amount of force without proper training?

2. Maybe you could "grab a pinky finger" and break it if someone is holding you in a static position. But fights/self defense don’t happen like that, in my experience at least. I’m normally being thrown, punched, kicked; rarely do I ever see an opportunity to grab any finger especially trying to pick out the pinky finger. And if I did get hold of a finger and break it what’s the odds of that stopping someone intent on kicking my ass? I’m sure most of us have broken a finger or two; it’s never put me out of commission and most of the time it doesn’t even hurt that bad (till the next day), I’ve seen guys continue to fight with a broken arm and be effective. (See #4 for stopping fights)

3. Ever try to punch someone on the "inside of their elbow"? Ever watch those "gay octagon" guys kick each other on the inside of their upper leg over and over? They don't go down and the guy doing the kicking normally knows how to kick (watch Jose Alto)

4. Finally! I agree! Blood chokes are much more effective than airway chokes. It’s getting in the proper position to apply the choke that’s the tricky part, and then knowing how to best apply the technique.

When asked about self-defense, I sometimes explain it like this. If someone is bigger, stronger, better trained, and determined, and you’re untrained and unprepared you’re screwed (insert your 2nd amendment rights here). Now if your better trained and have time to prepare (you don’t get blindsided/sucker punched) odds swing to your favor as long as the size difference isn’t WAY off balance. I see big muscle guys get their asses handed to them by guys 50 – 60lbs lighter all the time, while awesome at lifting weights and some are really strong guys, that in no way makes them good at fighting, in fact feeding those muscles O2 is a huge challenge . Then their character/level of intelligence comes out, (good or bad). Bad normally goes something like “yeah but if this was a real fight I could have poked him in the eyes, or fish-hooked him or bit him etc…, my response is “yep you could have done all those things, but if there were no rules and this was a REAL fight so could have he, while he was kicking your ass”, all the rules are doing is saving you from more pain and punishment”.
Fighting and self-defense is just like Shooting, golf, sex, throwing horseshoes etc…

If you don’t practice it you suck at it. IMHO

 

[SeanRT]

Re: Thanks Slapchop

Training, technique, whatever...

This was meant to be a thread on interesting tidbits about fighting, the human body, and some interesting pressure points...nothing more.

I can tell that I've touched a nerve. So, I'm guessing that you're either an amature fighter or you enjoy watching UFC a bit too much. Either way, I don't give a shit whether you agree with me or not.

I'm just about done posting on the Hide --- this is primarily due to the people who enjoy shitting all over my posts: thanks for that all you trolls out there!

 

[Slapchop]

Re: Thanks Slapchop

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr300</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Training, technique, whatever...

This was meant to be a thread on interesting tidbits about fighting, the human body, and some interesting pressure points...nothing more.

I can tell that I've touched a nerve. So, I'm guessing that you're either an amature fighter or you enjoy watching UFC a bit too much. Either way, I don't give a shit whether you agree with me or not.

I'm just about done posting on the Hide --- this is primarily due to the people who enjoy shitting all over my posts: thanks for that all you trolls out there! </div></div>

Dude, don't take the shit too seriously. He just offered a difference of opinion, not everyone is going to agree with you all of the time.

I mean, if everyone had the same mindset and was of the same opinions, how boring would the world be!?

 

[kbrady]

Re: Thanks Slapchop

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Runamuk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

2. Maybe you could "grab a pinky finger" and break it if someone is holding you in a static position. But fights/self defense don’t happen like that, in my experience at least. I’m normally being thrown, punched, kicked; rarely do I ever see an opportunity to grab any finger especially trying to pick out the pinky finger. And if I did get hold of a finger and break it what’s the odds of that stopping someone intent on kicking my ass? I’m sure most of us have broken a finger or two; it’s never put me out of commission and most of the time it doesn’t even hurt that bad (till the next day), I’ve seen guys continue to fight with a broken arm and be effective. (See #4 for stopping fights)

</div></div>

Actually most spontaneous fighting leaves several windows open for damaging extremities. From hands and fingers down to the feet and toes, and also an important part if you can locate it in a struggle, the ears. You have to take the opportunity and strike hard, hoping if you cause enough pain, you will have time to get away. And if your goal isn't to get away from an overpowering assailant, use the few seconds you've rightly earned and deliver the most damaging, brutal attack you can think of.

If your back is against the wall, you are to use any means you have to stop an attack. Don't rely on the kung-fu movies you've watched as "training" because it will only get your ass beat down. If you are untrained, don't fight as if you were. Go for any area you know can be damaged easily and let your goal be getting away.

If that leaves a bad taste in your mouth, sign up and learn boxing, kickboxing, karate etc and put your time in learning it. Hopefully, if a situation comes up and you have to use it, you will have a better chance.

 

[EventHorizon]

Re: Thanks Slapchop

I'm certainly no hardened street fighter but I've been in some more than average scraps. What Ive found makes a real difference is your emotional response. Techniques are all good but if you're on the verge of panic because of fear and adrenaline then your first opponent is your loss of control.

This highlights the need for realistic practice and getting over the fear of being hit. Rugby did that for me.

The other determining factor was having a bicycle chain and skinheads not being too smart.

 

[Wanderlust]

Re: Thanks Slapchop

Can someone reference someone having their brachial artery ruptured from a strike?? Unless you're hitting hard enough to beak the bone (and maaaaybe just maybe taking the artery with it) I don't see the artery rupturing.

 

[Runamuk]

Re: Thanks Slapchop

Mr300—I apologize if my post came off like I was trying to “shit on you post”, that was not my intention at all.

I rarely post due to being relatively inexperienced in the type of shooting most discussed here on the hide and asking stupid questions which is about all I can ask with my level of experience, so I tend to read a lot and mostly send PM’s to guys who seem more patient for answers to my dumb questions. Anyway when I read your post and decided to reply, I was honestly trying to be constructive and in no way patronizing or demeaning, only trying to add some of my “very hard learned” experience to a topic I actually know something about, that opportunity doesn’t present itself too often here.

EventHorizon—I can’t believe I forgot to mention the importance of mindset or as you phrased it “emotional response”, probably the number one most important thing! 17yrs doing this stuff thing and I still forget the most important part!

 

[SeanRT]

Re: Thanks Slapchop

You'll notice that I said a 'hard enough strike;' it's got to be a very hard strike to rupture an artery...no feather-tickling for an artery rupture.