Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

[Dylan in AZ]

WARNING: SUPER LONG POST

Hey guys, as the title states, I'm looking into building a single shot rifle. I want to keep the costs down as much as possible but any and all suggestions will be taken into consideration here. The finished gun will be in 22lr, used specifically for shooting iron sights, and need to be well balanced. It will be shot offhand unsupported in smallbore competition, shot prone unsupported in "mini-palma" matches, and anything in between.

What I want to do is simply start with an action. Then add a barrel. Then a stock. A trigger if needed. And then go from there in terms of completing the rifle.

I have considered an Anschutz, Savage MkI, and a Cz 452 or 455 action for the task. The first question I have is if I am missing any great actions here or if the ones I have listed so far are the best of the litter?

I have also considered a 40x but as I don't want to hunt parts down to complete the action I don't want to go that rout.

The action will have to be threaded as i want to replace the barrel with a longer unit in a different contour, this causes a problem with the Savage MkI because the barrel is, to the best of my knowledge, pressed in and pinned in spot. That means that I would have to thread the action to have a new barrel fitted and I don't want to go through that.

The problem I'm having with the Cz line is that I don't know where the action screws are placed. I saw a picture over at RFC where a guy showed his and the bedding process he went through and I noticed that model had only one screw in the action and the other stemmed out from the barrel. As the barrel will be replaced, this also causes a problem for me. I don't know hich model that was but it was a Cz none-the-less.

Obviously, the Anschutz action would appear to be my best and possibly only option at this point (of course unless someone informs me of another great action to build off of!).

From there the barrel is the next concern. I know of a few names that produce match grade barrels for the competetive 22lr shooter. I would love some input as to who makes great barrels and will work with their customers to produce unique pieces that wouldn't usually be asked for. What I want is something in a longer configuration for an extended aperature length for use of the iron sights. I'm thinking anywhere between 22-28 inches. I know this seems like an incredibly long barrel for a 22lr but keep in mind it will be used for iron shooting only most likely, that's not to say that I won't ever mount up a scope just for the heck of it though

The contour will have to be something similar to a medium palma for a balanced, not overly heavy, long barrel.

Then after that it's just trying to find a good smith to work with on this project. I live in Arizona and would prefer that my rifle doesn't pass over state borders so a smith in my area would be perfect, but someone who really knows about rimfire rifles. Again, I'm taking advice on any smiths you all would recomend in my area.

After choosing an action, barrel, and smith, I have to choose a stock that will conform to any and all restrictions that the matches the gun will be shot in. Honestly, this causes me to want to make my own

As I know it's no easy task I am discouraged but still intrigued by the idea all the same. I will bed the stock with pillars and devcon just to make sure it's well taken care of accuracy wise. An addition of an adjustable butt-pad and an adjustable cheek rest would also be in the build.

Just looking at everything that will be in this one is leading to there being no way it's going to be an inexpensive build

I'll probably have to resort back to the start small and build off of it approach.

But in any case, I'm very open on opinions and suggestions on any aspects of this one...

Thanks guys and gals,
-Dylan

PS - I know this is probably more ideal at RFC but I don't care for the forums there too much so I'll keep this here for now.

 

[kraigWY]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Have you looked into the H&R 5200. It's a copy of the Winchester 52, that National Guard bought tons of them when they were smart enough to see the value of shooting with rim fires.

I bought one in the early 80s to compete in Small Bore Matches. Using the old green box Remington match ammo, and Winchester White box for pistol (it wouldnt shoot he Winchester WB for Rifle very good) I cleaned several 50 Meter Targets in the English Match using my Remington 24X scope (this was back when I was heavy into ISU shooting).

Their not made any more but there are lots around. It's pretty much set up the way you want "as issued"

In prone it shoots as good as my Anschutz 1807 but I can't shoot it as will as the 1807 in position shooting.

Problem is around here all they shoot is NRA or CMP Light Rifle so I had to go to CZ 452 Military Trainer.

 

[RTH1800]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

I am always amazed at how the Win 52 is never considered. Why not just get a complete 52 C,D,or E and be done with it? I am sure you can find a good one for less than the cost of building a rifle. No time, no fuss. If you go with a C, you will even have a repeater. Accuracy is as good as any rimfire. Sub MOA to 100 and around 1.5 MOA at 200. JMO
Good luck with your project.

 

[RicosRevenge]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Sounds like something I am considering also. I have the heavy gun that would never fit into any weight class limits with my 40x/AICS; but the lure of an open sight .22 was pushed even more when I got to play with a peep-sight Annie last weekend.

My next build was going to be a .338LM... so much for that.

I'm still thinking 40X action. Even with the task of tracking down parts it still comes out "budgetarily positive" compared to the alternatives of an Annie, Hall, Turbo or Skunkwerks. Add to that the ease of stocking the Remmy action and it becomes very thought provoking.

As for barrels, I emailed Shilen asking them the question and they pushed me to Dan Killough (here in TX) and his shop recommended Broughton. My gunsmith here recommended Kreiger. Neither thought there would be much work needed on the action; but said it would be checked. And the barrel would be chambered to my ammo of choice (Eley Match EPS).

I'm still working on gathering info and I know there are a lot of tourney and ex-tourney shooters here so I will watch this thread carefully!

Good luck!

 

[steve123]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

I owned one of these Kimber's. It was a fantastic iron sight 22 target rifle.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...rue#Post2412611

I also owned a economy Anschutz like this.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=218702338#PIC

Shop around.I bet you could find one cheaper than building a 22.

 

[Scott E White]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Mike (<span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="text-decoration: underline"><span style="color: #FFCC00">Skunkworks</span></span></span>) is a sponsor/vendor here. "The Model 323 is a smaller precision action... the Model 605, is a true-to-scale Remington 700 size action that uses a 40X style bolt."
Looks real good to me, might be something for you to consider, too.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...Search=true#top

 

[John L]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Dylan,
Here are some of my thoughts. The stock is going to be a compromise as you want to shoot prone and offhand. No stock I know of is going to get both jobs done well. If you want a threaded action then the Anchutz is going to need to have this done as they use a press/pin setup. It can be done by any good gunsmith but their setup does work. Stillers 40x clone is carried by Dan Killough but the price point may not be where you need it. The 40x's the CMP is selling seem to me to be a bit overpriced when you factor in the cost of parts needed. If I were going this route I would buy the Stiller and be done with it. Most smallbore prone shooters seem to use a barrel in the 23-25" range than add a bloop tube if you need to. Your going to want a bit of weight to this gun but it will help in prone but may hurt you offhand. You cannot go wrong with any of the barrels Dan sells. Broughton is good and so is Shilen. Might want to try the Ross taper either of them would do. The Ross tapers are 1.200 for 4" then either .875 or .900 for the rest of the barrel. Adds weight between the hands and not too much out front. Try a CG Jackson trigger if you want a good 2 stage and they can be adjusted down to about 10 oz. but no lower. Wish I could think of a good stock but I dont shoot any smallbore matches that require offhand shooting.

John

 

[RicosRevenge]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

I actually just got another email directly from Dan Killough:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dan Killough</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For Sihlouette, I would recommend the new Myers action that Stiller is building. He is building them for me and we are in the prototype stage, but we should have some of them ready shortly. They will have an open top and be extremely easy to load from either side. The problem with most custom .22lr actions is the small port. They are hard to load for silhouette because you can not see in the port easily.

Turn around time on rebarreling the action would be 3-4 weeks. I would have you ship it to Richard Gorham in Claremore, Ok and I would send the barrel to him. We work closely with Richard, and he would do a great job for you. Total cost would be $585 plus whatever it would cost for you to get the rifle to Richard.

Let me know if I can help,

Dan Killough
5999 US Hwy 83
Winters, Tx 79567
www.KilloughShootingSports.com
325-754-KSS1(5771)</div></div>

 

[RicosRevenge]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

PS... Gorham puts together many of the TOP shooting rifles in the sport

 

[jeepwilson]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

If you can find a Suhl they are good too.Especially if you can find one with all the accessories(peep sights,handles and such.They do have a pinned barrel as well but usually shoot good.Make sure before you spend the jack on peep sights that they are allowed.The Suhls came with the peep sights with diffierent size iris holes and an assortment of front aperatures.I`ll try and post pics of my sights for mine.

 

[jeepwilson]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Also you know for the Annie`s that you can get the single shot adapter.The two stage trigger would probably be a benefit to shooting off hand.My Annie 64 R has one set on 8oz from the factory and it gives you time to get set before firing.My Suhl you do not touch the trigger until you are ready.It is 2oz and set up for benchrest shooting.I bought a leather case with the standard sights and stock off of RFC.If you go on there you can probably find something.

 

[Dylan in AZ]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Thanks a ton guys! So far the replies I've recieved have been incredibly helpful. I have alot of searching to do tonight

Keep the suggestions coming!

-Dylan

 

[Dylan in AZ]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

I recieved an email from Lilja today (just checked my email) and they had replied to me saying they can do exactly what i want and it will cost me $325 and take 12 weeks to arrive on my doorstep. I'm going to get in contact with Broughton, Krieger, and Shilen are next on my emal list. I think I'm going to choose between these three companies and price/wait time will be the deciding factors because I know all of them will produce quality barrels.

As for the action choice, I'm still stumped... I do love the idea of the 40x action and its clones because i can use any stock available for the 700 or if I have a certain style made for me I can get it inletted for the 700 action pretty much through any gunsmith. So the 40x and clones definatly have a major interest but it's just the simple fact that you have to find all the parts to put it together and send it off to a smith to make sure it'll shoot and function properly just seems like a massive ammount of spent money on a project. I think if I were to do all that I'd be better off just buying a clone action. This seems like my best option.

I am intrigued by the older rifles like the Winchesters, Kimbers, and other "antiques" and will probably end up collecting them when i'm an adult but I'd still rather have something newer because I don't even want to deal with the slightest possibility of replacing a part on an old rifle that doesn't have support anymore or one that has a defect somewhere. I know this probably sounds rediculous but I'd just rather know that the action is in tip top condition from the start and have a confidence that the finished product will be flawless and any errors that occur can be placed soley on my own shoulders as the shooter.

Something with a larger port would be fantastic though. Due to the fact that I do want a single shot rifle (even though the capability of being a repeater would be useful sometimes) I will have to find a way to fit the bullet into the chamber because as it is, I cannot single load my Savage MkII because the port is simply too small to fit my fingers into to place a round safely into the chamber. (which remind me I have to add a little magazine issue I started having with this rifle into my other thread...)

The Skunkworks action is also very appealing but they don't have the rimfire portion of their website up yet

If anyone can give more info on these action I'd greatly appreciate it. And a price list as well.

Thanks,
-Dylan

 

[John L]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

http://www.killoughshootingsports.com/Webs/Rifles/Lonestar.html

http://baityscustom.com/

Here are two. The second one is not a 40x clone.

 

[Dylan in AZ]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

I have to say I'm really loving the Lonestar by Stiller...

 

[RicosRevenge]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Yup, that Lonestar is pretty nice... although from what Dan said, it may be worth waiting to see that new Myers action from Stiller.

Another thing to keep in mind when finding barrels is that some smith's prefer certain barrels over others. Sometimes that has to be a consideration.

 

[Dylan in AZ]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Oh I've got plenty of time to decide what I want, and I'll keep in mind the barrel preferance too. It would make more sense to be unbiased about that type of thing from a smiths point of view. It would be stupid to turn down a customer because they want a different barrel then what you like. That's an easy road to a less than amazing reputation IMHO

 

[skinnj1]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

If you want to play the NRA/ ISU smallbore game iether prone or three p you will want either a euro rifle (Annie, Walther , bleiker...) or an oldschool Rem 37 / Win 52 match rifle . It will need a GOOD trigger (5018 anschutz or equivalent) of likes not availible for a sav/cz....but if all you have is a 10-22 you can play/learn just don't expect to win or break through platuea's in your performance as quick (single loading them is a bitch but i've seen guys do it at matches)

One of the new clone actions may be the hot ticket for BR but all the medals at Perry and the Olympics are Euro- see above.

The best advice is find a used match rifle and save your $ for buying cases of match ammo. If 3 p is a real consideration (and you do not already have a background) in smallbore consider a standard rifle (anschutz 1407/1807/1907/2007) and skip the complications of a free rifle until you know what you want and how to use it (read rebarrel/restock time)
I recomend calling MT guns and checking his used inventory it will save time and money probably in the long run

 

[RicosRevenge]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Nah, thats not what I'm saying at all... they would never turn it down; they just have preference and more experience with certain barrels.

 

[Dylan in AZ]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Oh I see what you mean RR, it's more of a comfort level thing for the smith it appears.

Skinnj1, I have to agree, starting off with a used Anschutz is my best bet and that's probably the way I will go in the short run, but this is more of a theoretical thread I guess. So I'm wondering what the best way to go about things but more along the lines of several years down the road.

At the moment, the mini-palma style shooting has 90% of my interest. My overall goal in learning how to shoot is to get to the point where I can compete in palma matches and be decent at it. That being said, I'm interested in almost all types of shooting. And pretty much anything smallbore related is something I'm willing to try. So the 3P/4P comps are on my list of things to try out.

For now I'll be sticking to my Savage MkII but I would like something more specialized in the near future to compete with.

 

[karux408]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

Hi Dylan, i read through the thread you started, then realized your interests are "theoretical".

If you are serious about smallbore competition, buy a used, ready-made Anschutz which fits your intended pursuit. The rifles hold their value, are extremely accurate, possess the best smallbore actions and triggers, and you should be able to sell the rifle for very-close-to your purchase price.

The earlier recommendation is your best course of action:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The best advice is find a used match rifle and save your $ for buying cases of match ammo. If 3 p is a real consideration (and you do not already have a background) in smallbore consider a standard rifle (anschutz 1407/1807/1907/2007) and skip the complications of a free rifle until you know what you want and how to use it (read rebarrel/restock tim
</div></div>

 

[karux408]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

BTW, I own an Anschutz 1813, purchased new circa 1982. The rifle took me to the 1984 Olympic Tryouts in LAX (Smallbore English) and helped me win many prone and 3p medals in Camp Perry.

Shooting the rifle with good ammo (Eley Match or Tenex) will train you on how to call shots, read wind, and shoot 10x.

 

[Dylan in AZ]

Re: Thinking of a Single Shot Build (Spitballing)

For now, do you think that my Savage with a laminate prone style stock from Richard’s Microfit, iron sights, and the necessary equipment would get me going on a decent start?

I figure I could get hands on experience with the type of shooting and then later decide what I truly want to do with the rifle. Also, I have come to the conclusion that it would be pretty inadequate to use one rifle for such different shooting disciplines. So I'll have to split it up into a wider array of rifles, one for each discipline I find a passion for.

No harm there, just means I'll have to buy a bigger safe someday