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This dude is "Money"
- Thread starter shark0311
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Re: This dude is "Money"
Right on the money. I work with people who have bachelor's degrees but can not write a decent report. The only thing a college degree proves is that someone spent a good chunk of money to get it.
Right on the money. I work with people who have bachelor's degrees but can not write a decent report. The only thing a college degree proves is that someone spent a good chunk of money to get it.
Re: This dude is "Money"
With my 2 degrees I'm into the man for about 30K but law school when finished will take me to 150K (40,000/yr).
Better be worth it, I've seriously thought about skipping law school and opening my own business with the money I would spend on school... My problem is that I can't get loans to start a business but I can get tons of loans and grants to go to school. It is as if the system wills you onto a specific track. I tried working while going to school and ended up losing money that I would have gotten via grants which again, is like the system punishing you for not going with the established flow.
With my 2 degrees I'm into the man for about 30K but law school when finished will take me to 150K (40,000/yr).
Better be worth it, I've seriously thought about skipping law school and opening my own business with the money I would spend on school... My problem is that I can't get loans to start a business but I can get tons of loans and grants to go to school. It is as if the system wills you onto a specific track. I tried working while going to school and ended up losing money that I would have gotten via grants which again, is like the system punishing you for not going with the established flow.
G
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Re: This dude is "Money"
I'll disagree with Phylodog to an extent.
A college degree proves to a prospective employer that the person before them has what it takes to finish what they start.
A military service record can serve a similar purpose.
I know some smart people with degrees, and I know some who aren't that bright, but all of them started a long-range project at a relatively young age and they saw it through.
Yes, some degrees can be bought by mommy and daddy at the party schools. But they are the exception, not the rule.
You can't make blanket statements about people and expect them to cover everyone.
As gun enthusiasts, we of all people, should realize that.
Anyway, it's Fox News. They don't want their viewers going out there and getting themselves too much of an education. They might stray.
I'll disagree with Phylodog to an extent.
A college degree proves to a prospective employer that the person before them has what it takes to finish what they start.
A military service record can serve a similar purpose.
I know some smart people with degrees, and I know some who aren't that bright, but all of them started a long-range project at a relatively young age and they saw it through.
Yes, some degrees can be bought by mommy and daddy at the party schools. But they are the exception, not the rule.
You can't make blanket statements about people and expect them to cover everyone.
As gun enthusiasts, we of all people, should realize that.
Anyway, it's Fox News. They don't want their viewers going out there and getting themselves too much of an education. They might stray.
Re: This dude is "Money"
I paid for my BA 100% out of pocket. Granted I didn't have to live on campus or feel the need to partake in "campus life." I did work 40+ hours every week. I went into college (aged 23) owning 2 trucks out right, an AR50 and an assortment of other guns. I am by no means well off, probably just barely middle class. But the thing is I don't live beyond my means. Which is something a lot of college kids don't grasp. Everyone wants it now, damn the cost.
I paid for my BA 100% out of pocket. Granted I didn't have to live on campus or feel the need to partake in "campus life." I did work 40+ hours every week. I went into college (aged 23) owning 2 trucks out right, an AR50 and an assortment of other guns. I am by no means well off, probably just barely middle class. But the thing is I don't live beyond my means. Which is something a lot of college kids don't grasp. Everyone wants it now, damn the cost.
Re: This dude is "Money"
If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv
If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv
Re: This dude is "Money"
Funny, I worked full time while getting my degree (last two years active duty military) and came out with $6K in total debt--well worth it. Now my wife's loans after law school and undergrad are a different animal altogether. I think that degrees are worth it if you have a specific goal in mind and plan to use the degree to accomplish that goal. If you don't have a goal and the wherewithal to accomplish it your time would likely be better spent doing something else.
This report has been rehashed and republished at least two-dozen times over the last several years. The reality is the push for the current generation to become educated by the "best" schools along with easy access to borrowed money (thanks China) has driven education prices through the roof. The problem is that if you are not a rock star when you graduate you will likely never get a job that makes the cost worth it. I.e. the return on investment would be better if you went out and got a job and worked your way up rather than going to school.
I think the best way to do it; however, is to get a full-time job and go to school. After you work like a slave and have no life for 4-5 years I guarantee you'll be a step ahead of most of the other grads looking for work (you've proven you can get to work on time), and you'll appreciate the extra money more when it starts rolling in.
And Phylodog, since when does being smart or writing well have anything to do with getting a undergraduate degree?!
Funny, I worked full time while getting my degree (last two years active duty military) and came out with $6K in total debt--well worth it. Now my wife's loans after law school and undergrad are a different animal altogether. I think that degrees are worth it if you have a specific goal in mind and plan to use the degree to accomplish that goal. If you don't have a goal and the wherewithal to accomplish it your time would likely be better spent doing something else.
This report has been rehashed and republished at least two-dozen times over the last several years. The reality is the push for the current generation to become educated by the "best" schools along with easy access to borrowed money (thanks China) has driven education prices through the roof. The problem is that if you are not a rock star when you graduate you will likely never get a job that makes the cost worth it. I.e. the return on investment would be better if you went out and got a job and worked your way up rather than going to school.
I think the best way to do it; however, is to get a full-time job and go to school. After you work like a slave and have no life for 4-5 years I guarantee you'll be a step ahead of most of the other grads looking for work (you've proven you can get to work on time), and you'll appreciate the extra money more when it starts rolling in.
And Phylodog, since when does being smart or writing well have anything to do with getting a undergraduate degree?!
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tucker301</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'll disagree with Phylodog to an extent.
A college degree proves to a prospective employer that the person before them has what it takes to finish what they start.
A military service record can serve a similar purpose.
I know some smart people with degrees, and I know some who aren't that bright, but all of them started a long-range project at a relatively young age and they saw it through.
Yes, some degrees can be bought by mommy and daddy at the party schools. But they are the exception, not the rule.
You can't make blanket statements about people and expect them to cover everyone.
As gun enthusiasts, we of all people, should realize that.
Anyway, it's Fox News. They don't want their viewers going out there and getting themselves too much of an education. They might stray. </div></div>
Started off reasonably enough with a good middle but sadly ended with an incoherent final sentence, denoting a prolonged desire for Rachel Maddow.
Oh Rachel, nice pants...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tucker301</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'll disagree with Phylodog to an extent.
A college degree proves to a prospective employer that the person before them has what it takes to finish what they start.
A military service record can serve a similar purpose.
I know some smart people with degrees, and I know some who aren't that bright, but all of them started a long-range project at a relatively young age and they saw it through.
Yes, some degrees can be bought by mommy and daddy at the party schools. But they are the exception, not the rule.
You can't make blanket statements about people and expect them to cover everyone.
As gun enthusiasts, we of all people, should realize that.
Anyway, it's Fox News. They don't want their viewers going out there and getting themselves too much of an education. They might stray. </div></div>
Started off reasonably enough with a good middle but sadly ended with an incoherent final sentence, denoting a prolonged desire for Rachel Maddow.
Oh Rachel, nice pants...
Re: This dude is "Money"
I never went to college, and spent the rest of my life proving the fact that a college education is not necessarily the measure of a man.
...or trying to.
What I really proved is that there are none so blind as those who will not see, and none so deaf as those who will not hear.
To a large degree, it boiled down to "have" and "have not", and I was apparently never "good enough" to join the former.
There's a lot of elitist hypocrisy in this world. Much of it stems from college alumni.
FWIW, the real value of college is that it teaches you, forces you, to learn how to teach yourself. Unfortunately, the bulk of college graduates seem to be (Deliberately? Slavishly?) blind to the fact that there are also other perfectly effective ways to achieve that.
A good day is a day when you learn something new. If you make a point of it, you have a lot of good days.
Yes, it costs plenty to run a college, even moreso if you pervert its purpose to indoctrinate young folks into extremist political molds. The teaching and learning are not the whole thing, and maybe not even the main thing. But there's also little denying the fact that the tuition level is a bar that's set to 'keep out the riffraff". I suspect that if somebody went around wielding Occam's Razor in the interests of paring down the infrastructure to a point that simply supported genuine learning and very little else, college would suddenly become a lot more within the reach of the mainstream.
You eliminate ghettos with a simple tool, it's called a scholarship. You don't promote learning and stimulate society by making the process exclusive, you do it by making it universal.
Greg
I never went to college, and spent the rest of my life proving the fact that a college education is not necessarily the measure of a man.
...or trying to.
What I really proved is that there are none so blind as those who will not see, and none so deaf as those who will not hear.
To a large degree, it boiled down to "have" and "have not", and I was apparently never "good enough" to join the former.
There's a lot of elitist hypocrisy in this world. Much of it stems from college alumni.
FWIW, the real value of college is that it teaches you, forces you, to learn how to teach yourself. Unfortunately, the bulk of college graduates seem to be (Deliberately? Slavishly?) blind to the fact that there are also other perfectly effective ways to achieve that.
A good day is a day when you learn something new. If you make a point of it, you have a lot of good days.
Yes, it costs plenty to run a college, even moreso if you pervert its purpose to indoctrinate young folks into extremist political molds. The teaching and learning are not the whole thing, and maybe not even the main thing. But there's also little denying the fact that the tuition level is a bar that's set to 'keep out the riffraff". I suspect that if somebody went around wielding Occam's Razor in the interests of paring down the infrastructure to a point that simply supported genuine learning and very little else, college would suddenly become a lot more within the reach of the mainstream.
You eliminate ghettos with a simple tool, it's called a scholarship. You don't promote learning and stimulate society by making the process exclusive, you do it by making it universal.
Greg
G
Guest
Guest
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: queequeg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Started off reasonably enough with a good middle but sadly ended with an incoherent final sentence, denoting a prolonged desire for Rachel Maddow.
</div></div>
I am certain that I can get her to jump back over that fence.... Me and my Wahl clippers.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: queequeg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Started off reasonably enough with a good middle but sadly ended with an incoherent final sentence, denoting a prolonged desire for Rachel Maddow.
</div></div>
I am certain that I can get her to jump back over that fence.... Me and my Wahl clippers.
Re: This dude is "Money"
Get an Associates and be done with it. I work Full time and go to school full time.
Get an Associates and be done with it. I work Full time and go to school full time.
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tucker301</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Anyway, it's Fox News. They don't want their viewers going out there and getting themselves too much of an education. They might stray.</div></div>
The political inference here is crystal clear. Don't do it again or you are gone.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tucker301</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Anyway, it's Fox News. They don't want their viewers going out there and getting themselves too much of an education. They might stray.</div></div>
The political inference here is crystal clear. Don't do it again or you are gone.
Re: This dude is "Money"
The fact that you have a degree, depending on what type it is, does show some insight into your character, to an employer. The converse is not necessarily detrimental though. Similarly, having a prior job is not a guarantee that a candidate is the best choice over a graduate, for many fields.
I think that there are lots of degrees that are probably not worth the money people spend on them. Actually, most college education is overpriced and bordering on ludicrous. There is also a tremendous wealth of information available through the internet, but even sites like this one have misinformation posted on them. You also loose the ability to interact on a personal level with a professor to explore what you are learning.
I believe there are field of study that still require a college education. A university can provide you with opportunities to make mistakes and see for yourself the results of miscalculations in a lab environment. Once you are working there is very little room for error. I would not want a self taught person with no credentials to design a nuclear plant, build a skyscraper, engineer a lift for a 1000ton crane, etc. These people need to be accountable, take tests, and demonstrate that they are proficient in their field. While the guys, tradesmen, that do this everyday could probably 'wing it' some of the time, that is not an absolute. I have seen some pretty serious errors occur when someone just assumed it would be ok.
I also worked through college. I worked in my field of study and it gave me a tremendous edge over a lot of the kids in my graduating class. It also lead to much better job offers upon graduating, but those job offers were all dependent on having a degree. Right or wrong that's the system that's in place. I would bet that over the next 10 years college degrees will become even less of a requirement. As the younger generation of people start to step into positions of power they will be better able to appreciate the knowledge that someone can gain outside of formal schooling.
The fact that you have a degree, depending on what type it is, does show some insight into your character, to an employer. The converse is not necessarily detrimental though. Similarly, having a prior job is not a guarantee that a candidate is the best choice over a graduate, for many fields.
I think that there are lots of degrees that are probably not worth the money people spend on them. Actually, most college education is overpriced and bordering on ludicrous. There is also a tremendous wealth of information available through the internet, but even sites like this one have misinformation posted on them. You also loose the ability to interact on a personal level with a professor to explore what you are learning.
I believe there are field of study that still require a college education. A university can provide you with opportunities to make mistakes and see for yourself the results of miscalculations in a lab environment. Once you are working there is very little room for error. I would not want a self taught person with no credentials to design a nuclear plant, build a skyscraper, engineer a lift for a 1000ton crane, etc. These people need to be accountable, take tests, and demonstrate that they are proficient in their field. While the guys, tradesmen, that do this everyday could probably 'wing it' some of the time, that is not an absolute. I have seen some pretty serious errors occur when someone just assumed it would be ok.
I also worked through college. I worked in my field of study and it gave me a tremendous edge over a lot of the kids in my graduating class. It also lead to much better job offers upon graduating, but those job offers were all dependent on having a degree. Right or wrong that's the system that's in place. I would bet that over the next 10 years college degrees will become even less of a requirement. As the younger generation of people start to step into positions of power they will be better able to appreciate the knowledge that someone can gain outside of formal schooling.
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv </div></div>
Way to generalize thanks a lot for pissing on everything I have fought for. I left home when I was 18 and busted my arse to go through college. I worked three jobs (including washing dirty laundry for the sports teams) and also played college athletics. I paid for it all on my own dime. So what you said is very ignorant and an ass of a comment. I worked in landscaping, masonry, flooring etc etc etc to pay my own way through school. So how did I not get my hands dirty to get ahead and how did I piss mommy and daddy's money away. Way to generalize!!!!! And how does that show I wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it? By busting my ass and doing what was necessary and studying hours upon hours every day (maybe something you don't have the fortitude to accomplish...I have found that that is much more difficult to sit yourself down every day to make sure that you understand and comprehend everything inside a book than learning new things via a job and first hand experience. I learned in school more than any thing I need for any one job and that has made me a well rounded and well informed person) I got to travel, have new learning experiences and as well I got to learn more about business and finance that are necessary to get a job. How does a potential employer know that I understand that laws that govern finance or business, that I am competent in the calculations and formulas that you need to not only know but undertand in finance and investments? You know I can't just buy a book, read it and expect companies to hire me.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv </div></div>
Way to generalize thanks a lot for pissing on everything I have fought for. I left home when I was 18 and busted my arse to go through college. I worked three jobs (including washing dirty laundry for the sports teams) and also played college athletics. I paid for it all on my own dime. So what you said is very ignorant and an ass of a comment. I worked in landscaping, masonry, flooring etc etc etc to pay my own way through school. So how did I not get my hands dirty to get ahead and how did I piss mommy and daddy's money away. Way to generalize!!!!! And how does that show I wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it? By busting my ass and doing what was necessary and studying hours upon hours every day (maybe something you don't have the fortitude to accomplish...I have found that that is much more difficult to sit yourself down every day to make sure that you understand and comprehend everything inside a book than learning new things via a job and first hand experience. I learned in school more than any thing I need for any one job and that has made me a well rounded and well informed person) I got to travel, have new learning experiences and as well I got to learn more about business and finance that are necessary to get a job. How does a potential employer know that I understand that laws that govern finance or business, that I am competent in the calculations and formulas that you need to not only know but undertand in finance and investments? You know I can't just buy a book, read it and expect companies to hire me.
Re: This dude is "Money"
Dosn't it make a differance what kind of degree. My daughter is a chiropractor, she makes tons of money. Kind of hard to work into being a chiropractor without the education.
Then one of my sons has a MBA. He does fairly will but not because of his degree, He's into security, but based on his military (EOD) training, not his MBA.
My college was a joke. I'm retired LE and NG. I have a degree in accounting.
When I was going to school I was working with another cop who was working on his masters in psycoligy. We determined accounting was better then psycoligy for the job of a street cop simply because accounting text books are bigger, and more useful for smacking the nitwits we run across.
Dosn't it make a differance what kind of degree. My daughter is a chiropractor, she makes tons of money. Kind of hard to work into being a chiropractor without the education.
Then one of my sons has a MBA. He does fairly will but not because of his degree, He's into security, but based on his military (EOD) training, not his MBA.
My college was a joke. I'm retired LE and NG. I have a degree in accounting.
When I was going to school I was working with another cop who was working on his masters in psycoligy. We determined accounting was better then psycoligy for the job of a street cop simply because accounting text books are bigger, and more useful for smacking the nitwits we run across.
Re: This dude is "Money"
Degrees open doors, and motivation pays the bills.
Without a college degree, I wouldnt have my job, or rank in the military. Dont confuse motivation with education. A motivated person who seeks a job, and does well in school will do a lot better than a slug with a degree. Case in point....
My dad has 5 college degrees and a couple other financial certifications. He paid his own way by painting houses while in school. He also tought classes and worked his ass off. To say he has done well in life would be an understatement. Take risks, reap the rewards, and work your ass off was his recipe for success. At 71 years old, he still opens his business every morning.
Degrees open doors, and motivation pays the bills.
Without a college degree, I wouldnt have my job, or rank in the military. Dont confuse motivation with education. A motivated person who seeks a job, and does well in school will do a lot better than a slug with a degree. Case in point....
My dad has 5 college degrees and a couple other financial certifications. He paid his own way by painting houses while in school. He also tought classes and worked his ass off. To say he has done well in life would be an understatement. Take risks, reap the rewards, and work your ass off was his recipe for success. At 71 years old, he still opens his business every morning.
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony20031</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv </div></div>
Way to generalize thanks a lot for pissing on everything I have fought for. I left home when I was 18 and busted my arse to go through college. I worked three jobs (including washing dirty laundry for the sports teams) and also played college athletics. I paid for it all on my own dime. So what you said is very ignorant and an ass of a comment. I worked in landscaping, masonry, flooring etc etc etc to pay my own way through school. So how did I not get my hands dirty to get ahead and how did I piss mommy and daddy's money away. Way to generalize!!!!! And how does that show I wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it? By busting my ass and doing what was necessary and studying hours upon hours every day (maybe something you don't have the fortitude to accomplish...I have found that that is much more difficult to sit yourself down every day to make sure that you understand and comprehend everything inside a book than learning new things via a job and first hand experience. I learned in school more than any thing I need for any one job and that has made me a well rounded and well informed person) I got to travel, have new learning experiences and as well I got to learn more about business and finance that are necessary to get a job. How does a potential employer know that I understand that laws that govern finance or business, that I am competent in the calculations and formulas that you need to not only know but undertand in finance and investments? You know I can't just buy a book, read it and expect companies to hire me. </div></div>
Well sir, you are definitely not the norm! Thing is though most college grads (that I have been around) do expect to be hired just because they have a degree. But if take the time to re read my post, to me it is obvious, that I was talking about kids who are going through college on their PARENTS dime, not paying for it themselves and not.working their way through it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony20031</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv </div></div>
Way to generalize thanks a lot for pissing on everything I have fought for. I left home when I was 18 and busted my arse to go through college. I worked three jobs (including washing dirty laundry for the sports teams) and also played college athletics. I paid for it all on my own dime. So what you said is very ignorant and an ass of a comment. I worked in landscaping, masonry, flooring etc etc etc to pay my own way through school. So how did I not get my hands dirty to get ahead and how did I piss mommy and daddy's money away. Way to generalize!!!!! And how does that show I wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it? By busting my ass and doing what was necessary and studying hours upon hours every day (maybe something you don't have the fortitude to accomplish...I have found that that is much more difficult to sit yourself down every day to make sure that you understand and comprehend everything inside a book than learning new things via a job and first hand experience. I learned in school more than any thing I need for any one job and that has made me a well rounded and well informed person) I got to travel, have new learning experiences and as well I got to learn more about business and finance that are necessary to get a job. How does a potential employer know that I understand that laws that govern finance or business, that I am competent in the calculations and formulas that you need to not only know but undertand in finance and investments? You know I can't just buy a book, read it and expect companies to hire me. </div></div>
Well sir, you are definitely not the norm! Thing is though most college grads (that I have been around) do expect to be hired just because they have a degree. But if take the time to re read my post, to me it is obvious, that I was talking about kids who are going through college on their PARENTS dime, not paying for it themselves and not.working their way through it.
Re: This dude is "Money"
I THINK/KNOW that there is a EASIER way...
My story..
Graduated with an Accounting/Finance Bachelors... did the accounting work and hated it..
I decided I wanted to be a cop and found that I like it alot..
As time went on.. I really wanted to further my education but I KNEW that I had already accrued 12K in student loans...
I was hired at the University as a Police Officer... later made it as the current Sgt over investigation and internal affairs..
HERS IS THE KICKER!!!!!!!!!
They paid for my FIRST masters in FULL... now paying for my SECOND Masters and my Doctorate.
All due to a tuituion assistance as long as I work here for them all of my school is taken care of.
My goal... its simple... I want to teach academia at the university level.
At 34... I will be a double masters (Business Admin and Public Admin) with a Doctorate in Higher Education and leadership. This process SHOULD be done when I am 36 and with NO DEBT.
I agree with the work experience completely... That is why I chose to work full time and get my education at the same time.
Matt.
I THINK/KNOW that there is a EASIER way...
My story..
Graduated with an Accounting/Finance Bachelors... did the accounting work and hated it..
I decided I wanted to be a cop and found that I like it alot..
As time went on.. I really wanted to further my education but I KNEW that I had already accrued 12K in student loans...
I was hired at the University as a Police Officer... later made it as the current Sgt over investigation and internal affairs..
HERS IS THE KICKER!!!!!!!!!
They paid for my FIRST masters in FULL... now paying for my SECOND Masters and my Doctorate.
All due to a tuituion assistance as long as I work here for them all of my school is taken care of.
My goal... its simple... I want to teach academia at the university level.
At 34... I will be a double masters (Business Admin and Public Admin) with a Doctorate in Higher Education and leadership. This process SHOULD be done when I am 36 and with NO DEBT.
I agree with the work experience completely... That is why I chose to work full time and get my education at the same time.
Matt.
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv </div></div>
And what do you do when they both have the same experience level? same refs?
You still send the college kid down the road because you clearly don't have any respect for the education or the effort it required.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv </div></div>
And what do you do when they both have the same experience level? same refs?
You still send the college kid down the road because you clearly don't have any respect for the education or the effort it required.
Re: This dude is "Money"
It would be interesting to see the naysayers education levels. Greg made a good argument for not having gone to college but some of you actually seek to spite those who did attend college which makes one wonder... A lot of jobs simply require a degree, it's just part of the game to open those doors.
It would be interesting to see the naysayers education levels. Greg made a good argument for not having gone to college but some of you actually seek to spite those who did attend college which makes one wonder... A lot of jobs simply require a degree, it's just part of the game to open those doors.
Re: This dude is "Money"
I have 3 years complete of my 4 year degree. I started college in 1986 at a major name university (This is a problem nowdays)
But I'll agree, if you have a college degree and experience and drive - I'll hire ya.
it's hard - there are no freerides for single white males. I knew a female of the Jewish religion that rode scholarships for four years. I'm no bigot but having a different race or gender DOES IN FACT help in college.
There was a cookie sale I wrote a report on - the cookies were cheaper if you were not white, and cheaper still if you were female. It was a protest against Florida University I believe because their fees were based on race and gender.
IF all you have is a college degree without much drive, forget it.
IF you have no college degree but a lot of drive and ambition and are presentable, I'd hire ya.
If you have a black belt in Martial Arts and drive I'd still hire you - it still proves you will follow through.
So after I test for my black belt I'll get my credits transferred to a cheaper university...my black belt IS my degree for now.
I have 3 years complete of my 4 year degree. I started college in 1986 at a major name university (This is a problem nowdays)
But I'll agree, if you have a college degree and experience and drive - I'll hire ya.
it's hard - there are no freerides for single white males. I knew a female of the Jewish religion that rode scholarships for four years. I'm no bigot but having a different race or gender DOES IN FACT help in college.
There was a cookie sale I wrote a report on - the cookies were cheaper if you were not white, and cheaper still if you were female. It was a protest against Florida University I believe because their fees were based on race and gender.
IF all you have is a college degree without much drive, forget it.
IF you have no college degree but a lot of drive and ambition and are presentable, I'd hire ya.
If you have a black belt in Martial Arts and drive I'd still hire you - it still proves you will follow through.
So after I test for my black belt I'll get my credits transferred to a cheaper university...my black belt IS my degree for now.
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArcticLight</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> it's hard - there are no freerides for single white males.
</div></div>
Isn't that the truth!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArcticLight</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> it's hard - there are no freerides for single white males.
</div></div>
Isn't that the truth!
Re: This dude is "Money"
I made a poor argument for not going. Biggest mistake of my life on a ton of levels. What I managed to achieve was in spite of that, came at an unnecessarily huge effort, and serves as a recommendation on absolutely no level whatsoever.
The stupid part is, I could have probably managed it if I hadn't gotten so much in love with paychecks and keeping food on the table where my Wife and Daughter ate/eat. Short term profit, long term loss. Penny wise, pound foolish. Brilliance is often a cruel illusion.
Greg
I made a poor argument for not going. Biggest mistake of my life on a ton of levels. What I managed to achieve was in spite of that, came at an unnecessarily huge effort, and serves as a recommendation on absolutely no level whatsoever.
The stupid part is, I could have probably managed it if I hadn't gotten so much in love with paychecks and keeping food on the table where my Wife and Daughter ate/eat. Short term profit, long term loss. Penny wise, pound foolish. Brilliance is often a cruel illusion.
Greg
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony20031</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv </div></div>
Way to generalize thanks a lot for pissing on everything I have fought for. I left home when I was 18 and busted my arse to go through college. I worked three jobs (including washing dirty laundry for the sports teams) and also played college athletics. I paid for it all on my own dime. So what you said is very ignorant and an ass of a comment. I worked in landscaping, masonry, flooring etc etc etc to pay my own way through school. So how did I not get my hands dirty to get ahead and how did I piss mommy and daddy's money away. Way to generalize!!!!! And how does that show I wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it? By busting my ass and doing what was necessary and studying hours upon hours every day (maybe something you don't have the fortitude to accomplish...I have found that that is much more difficult to sit yourself down every day to make sure that you understand and comprehend everything inside a book than learning new things via a job and first hand experience. I learned in school more than any thing I need for any one job and that has made me a well rounded and well informed person) I got to travel, have new learning experiences and as well I got to learn more about business and finance that are necessary to get a job. How does a potential employer know that I understand that laws that govern finance or business, that I am competent in the calculations and formulas that you need to not only know but undertand in finance and investments? You know I can't just buy a book, read it and expect companies to hire me. </div></div>
Well sir, you are definitely not the norm! Thing is though most college grads (that I have been around) do expect to be hired just because they have a degree. But if take the time to re read my post, to me it is obvious, that I was talking about kids who are going through college on their PARENTS dime, not paying for it themselves and not.working their way through it. </div></div>
Nice attempt at a backtrack but you're still talking rubbish. You have something against people working hard and being able to afford to send their kids to college? You automatically think that a college education is just something that's bought with no work involved? A 4.0 GPA at a good school is easy? You're showing your own ignorance. Why not just accept that there's more to the situation than you thought and shut your mouth, open your mind and LEARN something about the topic...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony20031</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If two people come to me, same age, one has a college degree, the other has actual experience/worked with good references, ill send the college kid down the road kicken rocks everytime. All a college degree tells me, is someone wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it. I have no use for any of that, I respect people that get their hands dirty, work and fight to get ahead, not piss it away life on mommy n daddys dime going to school. Ymmv </div></div>
Way to generalize thanks a lot for pissing on everything I have fought for. I left home when I was 18 and busted my arse to go through college. I worked three jobs (including washing dirty laundry for the sports teams) and also played college athletics. I paid for it all on my own dime. So what you said is very ignorant and an ass of a comment. I worked in landscaping, masonry, flooring etc etc etc to pay my own way through school. So how did I not get my hands dirty to get ahead and how did I piss mommy and daddy's money away. Way to generalize!!!!! And how does that show I wanted to buy knowledge and not earn it? By busting my ass and doing what was necessary and studying hours upon hours every day (maybe something you don't have the fortitude to accomplish...I have found that that is much more difficult to sit yourself down every day to make sure that you understand and comprehend everything inside a book than learning new things via a job and first hand experience. I learned in school more than any thing I need for any one job and that has made me a well rounded and well informed person) I got to travel, have new learning experiences and as well I got to learn more about business and finance that are necessary to get a job. How does a potential employer know that I understand that laws that govern finance or business, that I am competent in the calculations and formulas that you need to not only know but undertand in finance and investments? You know I can't just buy a book, read it and expect companies to hire me. </div></div>
Well sir, you are definitely not the norm! Thing is though most college grads (that I have been around) do expect to be hired just because they have a degree. But if take the time to re read my post, to me it is obvious, that I was talking about kids who are going through college on their PARENTS dime, not paying for it themselves and not.working their way through it. </div></div>
Nice attempt at a backtrack but you're still talking rubbish. You have something against people working hard and being able to afford to send their kids to college? You automatically think that a college education is just something that's bought with no work involved? A 4.0 GPA at a good school is easy? You're showing your own ignorance. Why not just accept that there's more to the situation than you thought and shut your mouth, open your mind and LEARN something about the topic...
Re: This dude is "Money"
I've no problem with parents footing the entire bill, or even providing more than that. Otherwise I might as well say, darn those kids who had their parents support them while they were in the crib. They didn't earn their way through toddlerhood! How about people born with clearly better natural skillsets? That prodigy in physics didn't have to work through the challenges that mentally retarded kid did.
In fact, I don't take issue with people receiving things they did not earn. What matters is what those recipients do with the gifts they are given. Receiving a gift, in my mind, makes you responsible for it, and you had darned well better use it properly, or you will be held accountable in the cosmic grand scheme of things.
All that being said, a college degree is a piece of paper. A college degree with a solid GPA from a good school in a difficult major is evidence of scholastic effort. There's a difference between the two, but it's not something that is well advertised.
And to finish my diatribe, I didn't see the news viewership comment as political (though intent is hard to argue), because in my mind, anyone who becomes educated is more than likely to stop watching the news. Sensational headlines full of emotional blather and text messages from a 14 year old about what should be done in the Gulf are hardly facts, from which I want to draw my own conclusions. And that is why I went to college - to learn how to think, to learn that nobody knows as much as they think they do, and to learn that anyone claiming to be the authority on something probably isn't.
I've no problem with parents footing the entire bill, or even providing more than that. Otherwise I might as well say, darn those kids who had their parents support them while they were in the crib. They didn't earn their way through toddlerhood! How about people born with clearly better natural skillsets? That prodigy in physics didn't have to work through the challenges that mentally retarded kid did.
In fact, I don't take issue with people receiving things they did not earn. What matters is what those recipients do with the gifts they are given. Receiving a gift, in my mind, makes you responsible for it, and you had darned well better use it properly, or you will be held accountable in the cosmic grand scheme of things.
All that being said, a college degree is a piece of paper. A college degree with a solid GPA from a good school in a difficult major is evidence of scholastic effort. There's a difference between the two, but it's not something that is well advertised.
And to finish my diatribe, I didn't see the news viewership comment as political (though intent is hard to argue), because in my mind, anyone who becomes educated is more than likely to stop watching the news. Sensational headlines full of emotional blather and text messages from a 14 year old about what should be done in the Gulf are hardly facts, from which I want to draw my own conclusions. And that is why I went to college - to learn how to think, to learn that nobody knows as much as they think they do, and to learn that anyone claiming to be the authority on something probably isn't.
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The338LM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I would bet that over the next 10 years college degrees will become even less of a requirement. </div></div>
I'll take that bet. I will argue the opposite position, and further argue that higher education (bachelor's degree) will become the new minimum standard for many positions. I cannot think of a single time in my life that I was not taking a class in something. I am currently teaching myself HTML though a couple websites, Quicken Premier, and the fighting along the North Anna River. Depending on the job, one needs either experience or education. Some positions call for both. And there are always exceptions, like the hookup, and specialized knowledge or skill set, to name a few. Say for instance that your father is the CEO and President and Owner of a company. Your resume is going to stand out. If you are applying for a position that would ask you to manage a yard crew for a landscaping company, is your MBA from Tucson University Online really going to help you argue for a higher salary? The kid that finished college with a 4.0 GPA in psychology and applies for the FBI is going to get laughed at because he or she would be competing against 1,000 captains that just left the military.
The Economist magazine published a study (in the last decade if I recall) that had a graphic that really stood out. It showed the average lifetime earnings of the HS grad, Bachelors Degree, Master's Degree, and PhD. The graphic compiled 'mostly' Western countries and assumed that each person would live to the age of 78. There was a fairly good jump between the Bachelors degree and the Masters degree, and a very small one between Master and PhD. The LARGE jump was btween high school and 4 years of college completed (w/ degree). The average difference in that case was over $10,000 per year for a total of something like a million and a half in a lifetime, assuming you start work after school in your early 20's. The people that conducted the study had degrees, of course. Not sure about the peope that delivered the copies of the magazines to the newsstands.
I spent most of my adult life in the infantry, so I was qualified for everything.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The338LM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I would bet that over the next 10 years college degrees will become even less of a requirement. </div></div>
I'll take that bet. I will argue the opposite position, and further argue that higher education (bachelor's degree) will become the new minimum standard for many positions. I cannot think of a single time in my life that I was not taking a class in something. I am currently teaching myself HTML though a couple websites, Quicken Premier, and the fighting along the North Anna River. Depending on the job, one needs either experience or education. Some positions call for both. And there are always exceptions, like the hookup, and specialized knowledge or skill set, to name a few. Say for instance that your father is the CEO and President and Owner of a company. Your resume is going to stand out. If you are applying for a position that would ask you to manage a yard crew for a landscaping company, is your MBA from Tucson University Online really going to help you argue for a higher salary? The kid that finished college with a 4.0 GPA in psychology and applies for the FBI is going to get laughed at because he or she would be competing against 1,000 captains that just left the military.
The Economist magazine published a study (in the last decade if I recall) that had a graphic that really stood out. It showed the average lifetime earnings of the HS grad, Bachelors Degree, Master's Degree, and PhD. The graphic compiled 'mostly' Western countries and assumed that each person would live to the age of 78. There was a fairly good jump between the Bachelors degree and the Masters degree, and a very small one between Master and PhD. The LARGE jump was btween high school and 4 years of college completed (w/ degree). The average difference in that case was over $10,000 per year for a total of something like a million and a half in a lifetime, assuming you start work after school in your early 20's. The people that conducted the study had degrees, of course. Not sure about the peope that delivered the copies of the magazines to the newsstands.
I spent most of my adult life in the infantry, so I was qualified for everything.
Re: This dude is "Money"
Forty One, I agree: a college degree will most certainly become the requirement of the future, but with a twist - a college degree, although a requirement, will also no longer get you anywhere without more.
We made enormous progress in the 20th century toward economic justice for everyone. But the westernized nations are now reversing that trend. Today we carry over fifty million unemployed as the status quo and have a system of measuring the unemployment rate which drops newcomers from the official rolls when their situation becomes chronic.
What progress there has been lately in the creation of jobs favors unsecured, poverty-level and part time work. Meanwhile, the rate of illiteracy has risen to a level not seen since the industrial revolution and, as some here have mentioned, the rise in illiteracy now includes college graduates.
As historians have noted, the emphasis of modern society on social programs and policies have made the North American working class obsolete. To counter this we moved menial labor overseas. But the problem this created, other than a lack of jobs at home for the unskilled and newly illiterate, is that our economy must now either absorb these people or change its attitide toward their contribution to our society.
The solution we have implemented is no solution at all: instead of reorganizing our economy to deal with this problem we ramp-up spending on social programs and declare victory, satisfied with creating a new class of working poor with nowhere for them to go but down.
And, with immigration at a standstill, unlike in the 19th century there is now no new group to take over being the working poor. So we fill that niche with illegals and NAFTA free-trade visa holders, comfortable with the knowledge that without citizenship they can't vote or take advantage of our social programs.
The result is not an economy but a food chain: the gradual undermining of a general American social consensus.
Forty One, I agree: a college degree will most certainly become the requirement of the future, but with a twist - a college degree, although a requirement, will also no longer get you anywhere without more.
We made enormous progress in the 20th century toward economic justice for everyone. But the westernized nations are now reversing that trend. Today we carry over fifty million unemployed as the status quo and have a system of measuring the unemployment rate which drops newcomers from the official rolls when their situation becomes chronic.
What progress there has been lately in the creation of jobs favors unsecured, poverty-level and part time work. Meanwhile, the rate of illiteracy has risen to a level not seen since the industrial revolution and, as some here have mentioned, the rise in illiteracy now includes college graduates.
As historians have noted, the emphasis of modern society on social programs and policies have made the North American working class obsolete. To counter this we moved menial labor overseas. But the problem this created, other than a lack of jobs at home for the unskilled and newly illiterate, is that our economy must now either absorb these people or change its attitide toward their contribution to our society.
The solution we have implemented is no solution at all: instead of reorganizing our economy to deal with this problem we ramp-up spending on social programs and declare victory, satisfied with creating a new class of working poor with nowhere for them to go but down.
And, with immigration at a standstill, unlike in the 19th century there is now no new group to take over being the working poor. So we fill that niche with illegals and NAFTA free-trade visa holders, comfortable with the knowledge that without citizenship they can't vote or take advantage of our social programs.
The result is not an economy but a food chain: the gradual undermining of a general American social consensus.
Re: This dude is "Money"
Sounds like Mr. Naysayer in this thread is bitter he does not have a degree or the lifestyle he sees in those with them. Some people are too ignorant, I guess, to understand there are things complex enough to actually need to learn through education.
A bachelor's is fast becoming the minimum to play the game. You can't really climb anywhere in the companies I have worked for without a Master's of some sort. I spent 4 yrs on an unfinished PhD (left with a MS) because I learned the hard way that you get a PhD in order to do something you enjoy, not because it will reliably get you any more money. Often it is less, you don't get paid back the opportunity cost for the years of life invested in it, and you narrowly specialize yourself which restricts your options.
I have a BS in Biochemistry, an MS in Molecular/Cell Biology, and an MBA from a highly ranked school. I manage the commercial side of cancer drug development. Try doing that without a degree, Mr. Naysayer.
The problem is a lot of kids don't look at college as an investment. They choose expensive schools and pursue degrees that are either unemployable, or command pay not enough to justify the up-front expense for the degree. If you want to be an elementary school teacher and command that pay level fine, but don't go to an expensive private school to do it.
I did farm labor through HS to save up for college. I worked up to 3 jobs at a time during college, roofed a professor's house by myself the week after I graduated to get enough of a downpayment to get a car to drive out of town since my old beater had died. My aborted PhD paid slave wages to do yet I managed to save enough to pay most of my wedding. I only went into debt when I signed on for the MBA, which I am still paying off, but the payments are a small inconvenience compared to the level of job it allowed me to land.
Sounds like Mr. Naysayer in this thread is bitter he does not have a degree or the lifestyle he sees in those with them. Some people are too ignorant, I guess, to understand there are things complex enough to actually need to learn through education.
A bachelor's is fast becoming the minimum to play the game. You can't really climb anywhere in the companies I have worked for without a Master's of some sort. I spent 4 yrs on an unfinished PhD (left with a MS) because I learned the hard way that you get a PhD in order to do something you enjoy, not because it will reliably get you any more money. Often it is less, you don't get paid back the opportunity cost for the years of life invested in it, and you narrowly specialize yourself which restricts your options.
I have a BS in Biochemistry, an MS in Molecular/Cell Biology, and an MBA from a highly ranked school. I manage the commercial side of cancer drug development. Try doing that without a degree, Mr. Naysayer.
The problem is a lot of kids don't look at college as an investment. They choose expensive schools and pursue degrees that are either unemployable, or command pay not enough to justify the up-front expense for the degree. If you want to be an elementary school teacher and command that pay level fine, but don't go to an expensive private school to do it.
I did farm labor through HS to save up for college. I worked up to 3 jobs at a time during college, roofed a professor's house by myself the week after I graduated to get enough of a downpayment to get a car to drive out of town since my old beater had died. My aborted PhD paid slave wages to do yet I managed to save enough to pay most of my wedding. I only went into debt when I signed on for the MBA, which I am still paying off, but the payments are a small inconvenience compared to the level of job it allowed me to land.
Re: This dude is "Money"
Got out of USMC in 1970 and started on the GI bill at 175 a month. Partied my ass off. Worked part time the whole way. Got my BGS degree in 1976 and got commissioned in the Army for two years. Was pulling 400 something my last year on the GI bill, not counting my part time job. My son dropped out of highschool in Jan of his senior year. Dope smoker and fast food worker and part time dumb ass criminal. He's 24 and he still thinks he's smarter than everyone.
Go to school, work your ass off, and have a good life. After Vietnam I didn't think I would live to 30, found out I had PTSD bad nine years ago.
(lots of women in school, for gods sake go to school and chase women)
Semper fidelis,
Tipy
Got out of USMC in 1970 and started on the GI bill at 175 a month. Partied my ass off. Worked part time the whole way. Got my BGS degree in 1976 and got commissioned in the Army for two years. Was pulling 400 something my last year on the GI bill, not counting my part time job. My son dropped out of highschool in Jan of his senior year. Dope smoker and fast food worker and part time dumb ass criminal. He's 24 and he still thinks he's smarter than everyone.
Go to school, work your ass off, and have a good life. After Vietnam I didn't think I would live to 30, found out I had PTSD bad nine years ago.
(lots of women in school, for gods sake go to school and chase women)
Semper fidelis,
Tipy
Re: This dude is "Money"
I think the entry income with a college degree has already nose dived; however, the career tenure income is far and above better. I think the career tenure income will also decrease, degrees are slowly becoming a requirement to get in the door rather than get a management job. I was speaking to a recruiter buddy of mine who talked to me about the percentage of people trying to enlist with bachelors degrees--it used to help secure a spot, now it is almost expected. I am not sure this is "good", but it is what it is... With that said I seek as much education, management experience, and responsibility as I can. This is the only way I can ensure I'm a step ahead of my competition.
I think the entry income with a college degree has already nose dived; however, the career tenure income is far and above better. I think the career tenure income will also decrease, degrees are slowly becoming a requirement to get in the door rather than get a management job. I was speaking to a recruiter buddy of mine who talked to me about the percentage of people trying to enlist with bachelors degrees--it used to help secure a spot, now it is almost expected. I am not sure this is "good", but it is what it is... With that said I seek as much education, management experience, and responsibility as I can. This is the only way I can ensure I'm a step ahead of my competition.
Re: This dude is "Money"
This is actually a subject that I've debated with myself and with others several times. I'm one of the "on daddys dime" kids that some of you have mentioned. I did work full time all but my first semester at college though and paid my living expenses, vehicle, spending money etc. I am glad, in retrospect, that I went to college as it has opened doors for me in my career. My job doesn't require a college degree, but the guy that later hired me valued formal education and told me that is what seperated me from the other 70 people he interviewed for 2 positions. Now, my only regret from college is that I was too immature to take full advantage of the opportunity. There are 2 types of college graduates: Those that went into college with a clear goal in mind and college was a stepping stone on their journey. And those, like me, who went to college because that is what their parents wanted them to do and chose to go through the motions of college, party, chase girls and "get by". My little brother is one of the former, he has always wanted to be a mechanical engineer and now he's living that dream and his drive towards that goal coupled with his education/degrees are what made it attainable for him.
All that said, I don't think that a degree is ever going to be anyones ticket to easy street. I am always impressed by what people with very little formal education were able to learn on their own, accomplish and achieve. The most savvy businessman I know only has a 4th grade education, owns car dealerships all over the country, owns the land underneath several huge shopping centers, a minor league baseball team, a trucking company, a fleet of corporate jets and flys around in his personal helicopter. My cousin dropped out of school with a 9th grade education and would be considered a success by anyones measure. Not everyone should go to college, not everyone needs college and then there are some that college would only serve to hamstring them in accomplishing their goals......because their just that damn unstoppable. I believe that many people confuse education with intelligence. The two have very little in common in my opinion. Education is something that you can get, can work for, acquire. Intelligence?.....You either have it, or you don't. Some jobs require education, some require intelligence and some jobs you had better have both.
This is actually a subject that I've debated with myself and with others several times. I'm one of the "on daddys dime" kids that some of you have mentioned. I did work full time all but my first semester at college though and paid my living expenses, vehicle, spending money etc. I am glad, in retrospect, that I went to college as it has opened doors for me in my career. My job doesn't require a college degree, but the guy that later hired me valued formal education and told me that is what seperated me from the other 70 people he interviewed for 2 positions. Now, my only regret from college is that I was too immature to take full advantage of the opportunity. There are 2 types of college graduates: Those that went into college with a clear goal in mind and college was a stepping stone on their journey. And those, like me, who went to college because that is what their parents wanted them to do and chose to go through the motions of college, party, chase girls and "get by". My little brother is one of the former, he has always wanted to be a mechanical engineer and now he's living that dream and his drive towards that goal coupled with his education/degrees are what made it attainable for him.
All that said, I don't think that a degree is ever going to be anyones ticket to easy street. I am always impressed by what people with very little formal education were able to learn on their own, accomplish and achieve. The most savvy businessman I know only has a 4th grade education, owns car dealerships all over the country, owns the land underneath several huge shopping centers, a minor league baseball team, a trucking company, a fleet of corporate jets and flys around in his personal helicopter. My cousin dropped out of school with a 9th grade education and would be considered a success by anyones measure. Not everyone should go to college, not everyone needs college and then there are some that college would only serve to hamstring them in accomplishing their goals......because their just that damn unstoppable. I believe that many people confuse education with intelligence. The two have very little in common in my opinion. Education is something that you can get, can work for, acquire. Intelligence?.....You either have it, or you don't. Some jobs require education, some require intelligence and some jobs you had better have both.
Re: This dude is "Money"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tucker301</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No way to win a debate when the opponent is the moderator.
/walks away </div></div>
Quit acting like a 3 year old who got his hand slapped in the cookie jar.
The problem wasn't your argument it was your completely unnecessary assinine comment about FOX news.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tucker301</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No way to win a debate when the opponent is the moderator.
/walks away </div></div>
Quit acting like a 3 year old who got his hand slapped in the cookie jar.
The problem wasn't your argument it was your completely unnecessary assinine comment about FOX news.
