Re: Tragic Events in Palestine.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mike - firstly, the whole world does not perceive jihad as a 'hot' war simply because you think it does.
<span style="font-weight: bold">EH, now here is where you missed my point. You cannot tell me that if I went up to any muslim here or abroad and asked them the definition of jihad they're going to omit that it means a holy war. Will they define it in other ways as well such as "Struggle, internal strife, etc." absolutely. But to presume they do not know it also means a holy war is naive. After all, it's one of the five pillars of Islam so I am sure they are very aware of <span style="font-style: italic">every</span> definition. </span>
Secondly, there are literally over a billion Muslims who have never committed an act of war by any standards so again, your irrational proclamations are unfounded by any empirical evidence.
<span style="font-weight: bold">What empirical evidence do you require? Would you like me to interview a billion muslims? My response can be found above and doesn't detract from the fact. So my "irrational proclamations" are factual based on the definition of the word "jihad".</span>
You may hate muslims, or Palestinians, and by me that's fine, I can't stand Jesuits, Calvinists and I particularly HATE Catholic bishops and cardinals who routinely and for decades knowingly protected child rapists but I'd be foolish to say ALL catholics are rapists and molesters.
<span style="font-weight: bold">Let me be specific so to remove any doubt in your mind. I do not "hate" muslims, palestinians, or any other religious or ethnic group. I hate terrorists. If a terrorist happens to be Saudi, Palestinian, Qatari, or even Filipino or Chechnyan. It's not who they are that I hate. It's what they do. Oh, and BTW let me be clear that includes IRA terrorists as well lest you believe I am excluding based on religion alone.
Second, I find it interesting that in your proclamation of distaste for Jesuits and Calvanists as a blanket statement yet you want to criticize me? </span>
On a completely seperate note, I find it curious we're all hot to debate the injustice or otherwise of the deaths of a comparatively few people when just south of our border there are about a dozen or so people mostly innocent people getting killed in the most horrendous of ways on a daily basis. Makes me wonder... do we care more about the loss of lives or who's dying?
<span style="font-weight: bold">Do you expect us to address every injustice in one thread? I would be more than happy to discuss the travesty that is south of our border if you would like to start a separate thread about it. The context of this thread was the "tragic events in Palestine" not "tragic events in Palestine and Mexico". So let's keep things in context before you go off and make assumptions. </span>
BTW - you missed what I was referring to in regards to Plato's Cave. The central point is people who have never seen anything other than the shadows.
<span style="font-weight: bold">No, I got that. But the point that I was making, that can also be deduced from Plato's allegory is that regardless of true reality, people will believe only what they know until they are convinced otherwise. Do you remember the movie "The Village"?</span> </div></div>
My point about jihad was a 'hot' war, not the meaning of the word in terms of holy war. holy can mean righteous as in a worthy struggle as well as religious etc. I suspect very few are or have committed violent actions in the spirit of jihad.
The Calvinist/Jesuit thing was a joke - as in hating two polemic views equally, looking back on it, it was a bad one and in not too good a taste. I don't think I've ever met someone who's of either faith and as far as I know the only Calvinists left are in Switzerland and I can forgive the Swiss just about anything every time I shoot one of my K31s.
In regards to the catholic church and pedophiles - no apology, that shit was institutional.
In reference to the IRA - no, I'm not trying to be sneaky or draw you out, it's more a reference to how many here think the only terrorists are ones in the middle east. It seems the 'let's glass crew' have forgotten how widespread support for the IRA was in the US and how the US was a significant source of funds for the procurement of weapons and explosives which directly funded the killing of civilians and then a place of safe harbor for those murderers. However, I do know that the Catholic Irish were pushed, prodded and mercilessly suppressed by the English for generations to the point where their form of armed struggle was the only way to effectively fight back... The point being, very few are blameless and often some introspection will shed more light on the matter.
On the broader topic at hand my view is this, peace is only a byproduct of prosperity where people have something better to do than die. The construct of Palestine as defined and enforced today is such that that will never be the case and therein lies the guarantee that peace will never happen. Killing civvies is wrong, but so is keeping a boot on the neck of a people. The colonists in this country didn't like it much, seems odd we should think it'd be any different today for anyone else.
BTW - yes, I've seen the village and that's my whole point.
