Suppressors Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

[RollingThunder51]

In a presentation this week I was asked to elaborate on this article. As it generated the most interest, I thought I would set it out here for those that may have missed it.

This is the abstract from the American Journal of Medicine.

http://www.amjmed.com/article/S0002-9343(09)00795-5/fulltext

YEs, this is a significant finding.

 

[Rogue111]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

It's an interesting correlation study & may lead to further investigation but it didnt seem like they looked for much variability/identification of other sources accounting for hearing loss other than a few demographic/physiological factors. (granted I did just skim)

 

[HPLLC]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rogue111</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's an interesting correlation study & may lead to further investigation but it didnt seem like they looked for much variability/identification of other sources accounting for hearing loss other than a few demographic/physiological factors. (granted I did just skim) </div></div>

I skimmed also. It seemed like perhaps the people who took the drugs may have taken them for headaches- headaches which may have occurred from atmospheric noise levels being too high.

That's a hypothesis- no suggestion that it is accurate.

If Advil and Tylenol can cause hearing loss, I would expect to see it accompany beer and alcohol consumption also.

I went on a deployment about a year ago with a horrible tooth pain from a recent crown that probably didn't fit right, and I was taking about 10-12 advil a day for 8-10 weeks.

I don't notice a negative effect to my hearing, but I already had pretty severe high frequency loss in my right ear, and tinitus in that ear so it wasn't perfect hearing to begin with.

 

[Doogie]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

Also read through it. The multivariate analysis stuff still makes my eyes glaze over a bit, but it appears that they statistically factored in alcohol intake and a few others (age, race, profession, BMI, alcohol intake, folate intake, physical activity, smoking, hypertension, diabetes).

My problem stemmed from the fact they only did self reporting of medically diagnosed hearing loss. I'm sure my hearing has gone some over the past years, I specifically notice it with other ambient noises, but I wouldn't go to a medical professional to be checked. I think some of that generation is of the mindset to not go to the doctor unless they really need to (at least that's how my parents are). Granted hearing loss gets to the point to where older individuals really ned help, just not sure if there is a threshold for that.

And it seemed weird that those that used aspirin for >8 years had less hearing loss that those between 1-8 years.

And since this was all men whose to say they didn't find their hearing as freedom from the nagging wife

.

 

[HPLLC]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Doogie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
And since this was all men whose to say they didn't find their hearing as freedom from the nagging wife

. </div></div>

HAHAHA I don't know how many times I just wished I could be deaf completely!

"Hey!- I'm working over here!"

 

[Doogie]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

So wish I could use that excuse, unfortunately I would be called out on that one way to fast. Maybe it's time to start a company.

 

[Jmilera]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

Just remember Tylenol is metabolized by the liver and NSAIDs "Advil,Motrin" affect prostaglandins in the kidneys which protect the epithelial cells that Line the glomeruli in your kidneys. So if you lack prostaglandins the cells are exposed to noxious chemicals and byproducts produced by the body. If you have to use NSAIDs drink plenty of water and don't exceed recommended doses. Not to mention it also affects prostaglandins in the stomach which protect it from the acids produced by your chief cells in the stomach and pepsin which is an enzyme that digests proteins. To make a long story short you will get a stomach ulcer! I have taken care of males and females in their 20s and 30s that have taken NSAIDs for a long period for tooth pain and are now on kidney dialysis. And Tylenol or acetaminophen is just as bad in high doses to your liver cells. drink plenty of water gents that is the key to prevent acute tubular necrosis.

 

[Jmilera]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

Gents forgot to mention some people will react to opiates such as lortab and Tylenol #3 with tinnitus and possible hearing damage. I have that by the way I found out when I completely tore my Achilles tendon at work. I took one given to me at the ER and the tinnitus and nausea and vomiting and vertigo was worse than the tendon injury.
Hope this helps someone

 

[Bedlam]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

This stuff can also cause an <span style="font-style: italic">increase </span>in pain instead of a decrease, stomach bleeding, bloody vomit, bloody shit, stomach pains, fainting, oh and that little problem about ...HAVING YOUR ENTIRE FACE PEEL OFF.

So when I have a headache, I just put up with the headache.

 

[Downrange1x]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

HUHH???

 

[Sportin Wood]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bedlam</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This stuff can also cause an <span style="font-style: italic">increase </span>in pain instead of a decrease, stomach bleeding, bloody vomit, bloody shit, stomach pains, fainting, oh and that little problem about ...HAVING YOUR ENTIRE FACE PEEL OFF.

So when I have a headache, I just put up with the headache.
</div></div>

All possibilities, but have you ever got one of these possible symptoms? I use excedrin, so I never have my face peel off...

 

[colt933]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

My aunt is a runner and has been using above normal doses of NSAIDs for years. She has significant hearing loss and the doctors attribute it to the NSAIDs.

 

[doc76251]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

I love it when <1% is deemed "clinically significant" with the sampling rated with a 95% confidence.

"During 369,079 person-years of follow-up, 3488 incident cases of hearing loss were reported"

A quick Google will note that

Hearing loss increases with age.
Hearing loss in white males is more significant than any other demographic.
Hearing loss in Mid to Lower income levels is more prevalent than high income earners.

Simply put, a corollary may be drawn from these 3 simple notions. Depending on which side of the fence you wish to sit on........

You get older and your body breaks down so you take pain relievers to mitigate that feeling.

White males are the single largest demographic in the nation and as such encompass the broadest spectrum of employment from administrative to pure physical labor. Combine with above.

Higher income earners are not often associated with employment that would include environmental conditions that would attribute to hearing loss. Combine both of the above.

One side of the fence:

Your white and work for a living and have for some time = You're going to have hearing loss WHETHER OR NOT you take Aspirin, Tylenol or Motrin.

The other side of the fence:

Your white and work for a living and have for some time = You're going to have hearing loss BECAUSE you take Aspirin, Tylenol or Motrin.

Sir Charles Dilke, Benjamin Disraeli, Samuel L. Clemens: "Lies, Damn Lies and Statistics"

Cheers,

Doc

Edit to add: If you read this in THIS forum YOU have hearing loss because you shoot guns

 

[Bedlam]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: StanwoodSpartan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All possibilities, but have you ever got one of these possible symptoms? I use excedrin, so I never have my face peel off...

</div></div>

Only stomach pains, but that was Ibuprofen. On the plus side, the stomach pain was so strong I didn't notice the headache any more.

 

[former naval person]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

As a friend told me, "God invented guns, so that when you can't stand to listen to your wife anymore, you can't hear her".

 

[RollingThunder51]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

Doc,

Your point is well taken....but....all that you have read is above and beyond all that you have singled out as causal.

The Lancet just published a perliminary that younger men are twice as likely (not 1%, a doubling) to suffer mild to sever hearing loss if found to be taking paracetamol (acetaminophen) as littel as twice a week.

"Men under 60 who took at least two aspirins every week were 33 per cent more likely to suffer hearing loss than men who took fewer than two aspirins. No link link for men aged 60 and over.

Men under 50 who regularly took ibuprofen and other NSAIDS were 61 per cent more likely to have hearing problems, while those aged 50 to 59 were 32 per cent more likely to suffer.
Those aged 60 and above had a 16 per cent higher chance of deafness.

<span style="font-weight: bold">But the biggest link was found in men under the age of 50 who regularly took paracetamol. They are 99 per cent more likely to suffer hearing problems.</span> "

 

[doc76251]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

RT,

While it may appear that mine was a casual dismissal of a 25year research project....... it was a tongue in cheek dismissal of the statistical analysis to ensure a quotable point.

Acetaminophen (by any name), Aspirin and NSAID's are pointed out to be a significant contributor of hearing loss across a wide spectrum of age demographics according to this analysis. The single most important factor in hearing loss is simply "noise exposure". This study nor the ones published in the Lancet address that simple little concept in their evaluation of test subjects. They instead paint with broad stokes the occupational demographic of their subjects as "professional, white collar, white males".

Questions omitted from both these "research" studies might have included questions about occupational and recreational noise hazard exposure. Incidental yet repeated exposure to simple things such as lawn mowers, weed whackers, chainsaws, concerts, bars, conventions, motor vehicles, sporting events, hunting, airplanes, motorboats, shooting etc. etc. etc.

Given the unquestioned questions and the vagaries of the occupations, I would submit that their findings fall well within the "normal" ranges of hearing loss experienced by the demographic of age. THESE findings were researched and documented by those whose research is actually interested in the prevention of hearing loss.

As examples:

Modern preventative (or prophylactic if you prefer) medicine advocates an 81mg aspirin be taken every day to prevent blood clots and improve heart function. This has been a standard of care for about 20 ish years or so after the age of 40 - 45. According to this study everyone 65 - 70 years old or older should be stone cold deaf.

Regular consumption of NSAID'S will often cause gastric upset. Many of the common remedies for "upset stomachs" contain certain substances which have been "proven" to increase or cause tinnitus.

When evaluating a statistical analysis that reports a "significant finding" I generally find it useful to see who by and why the research was done. Who in the mid 1980's would have drawn together and PAID a group of doctors/researchers to do a 25+ year study "just to see what aspirin, NSAID's and Tylenol do in the long term to hearing loss".

IMHO this analysis could have targeted anything from colon cancer to heart attack to Alzheimer's and dementia and come up with the same "clinically significant" finding.

Hmmmmm (Add TV voice) "If you or a loved one were directed by your physician to take an 81mg aspirin every day and experienced a heart attack, stroke, dementia, Alzheimer's or DEATH, YOU may be entitled to compensation. Contact the law firm of Suk, Me and Dry to receive your dispensation........"

Food for thought.


Cheers,

Doc

 

[RollingThunder51]

Re: Tylenol/Advil use = Significant Auditory Loss

Doc,

"Modern preventative (or prophylactic if you prefer) medicine advocates an 81mg aspirin be taken every day to prevent blood clots and improve heart function. This has been a standard of care for about 20 ish years or so after the age of 40 - 45. According to this study everyone 65 - 70 years old or older should be stone cold deaf."

81 vs 300 (mg) is important here, in fact low dose of asprin can protect hearing from loss through antibiotic use. 1,500 milligrams (mg) a day or more (once often prescribed for rheumatoid arthritis) resuted in deafness.