Union upset over Keystone Pipeline cancellation

[Maggot]

I've never voted for a dem and never will. My local always pushes the dumb politics stuff.

I just want to say one fact in this thread about unions for all the ignorant people that have no idea what they are talking about.

Each year in this country 1200 people on average are killed on construction/industrial sites. Almost none of them are on union sites.

I've worked as a rat for a couple of years and 16 years union on a ton of different kind of sites. Coal power plants, nukes, refineries, Chem plants, food plants, etc..

I know when I step out of the truck in the morning now that there's a 99.999 percent chance that I'm going home to my family at the end of the day the same way I got there. I can't say that for any of my friends that are non union.

Yep. You should see some of the scaffolding Ive worked on...

Then you go to a job where its done right..

 

[Blutroop]

I've never voted for a dem and never will. My local always pushes the dumb politics stuff.

I just want to say one fact in this thread about unions for all the ignorant people that have no idea what they are talking about.

Each year in this country 1200 people on average are killed on construction/industrial sites. Almost none of them are on union sites.

I've worked as a rat for a couple of years and 16 years union on a ton of different kind of sites. Coal power plants, nukes, refineries, Chem plants, food plants, etc..

I know when I step out of the truck in the morning now that there's a 99.999 percent chance that I'm going home to my family at the end of the day the same way I got there. I can't say that for any of my friends that are non union.

So non union makes you a safety risk? Take your union and shove it.
I am the only one responsible for my safety.

 

[SONIC SAAMI]

I don't know about all that but from personal experience I can tell you this.
30 years On the convention industry trade show floor only 3 fires.
All 3 Fires electrical with non union electricians.

 

[louu]

So non union makes you a safety risk? Take your union and shove it.
I am the only one responsible for my safety.

Any reason why you felt the need to tell me to shove it?

 

[Charger442]

Any reason why you felt the need to tell me to shove it?

He made that decision on his own. He didn't have to check with a Union rep to tell him what to do/think.

 

[Bradu]

I’ve seen shady shit both union and non union, the worst was on union jobs. Ultimately, it comes down to the job site and crew you work for. I’ve done some stupid shit when I was younger because I was dumb enough to do what I was told. Now, I will refuse to do it even if that means that I get fired.

 

[srtsam]

My personal experience is this. I used to work for a company that was contracted to run priority mail. The usps basically farmed it out because the Company I worked for promised to make it better in terms of hitting promised delivery times and still be cheap enough that the usps could make money with little to no involvement. We ran that company excellently. People were concerned about safety goals, hourly goals, weekly goals and of course quarterly goals where everyone would get a nice bonus. Fast forward to 3 years later, the usps realized that traditional letter mail was dying ( due to emails) and really the only product left that had growth potential was packages. So they opted out of the contract took back the priority mail and overnight we became usps employees. The deal they cut with the unions is that the first year in the newly repossessed facility’s there would be no union presence in the plant but after the first year ended the unions could come in and get going. Now, does anyone want to take a wild guess as to what happened to the plant‘s production, staffing, quality of employee? The production sunk to lows I didn’t think were possible or acceptable, staffing went through the roof because of all the unions rules, and the plant ended up shutting within 5 years after the unions came in Because it was not worth having a previously top flight facility open.. in short the unions came in and ran that sucker straight into the ground. Maybe a longtime ago, they served their purpose but in today’s world they are absolutely a major problem in today’s America. So, no, I am not pro union. I have seen how they operate first hand. And now with the usps on the brink of finally going out of business they can thank all of their unions for basically helping them out of a job.

 

[Farmerhunter]

I’m a non union electrician and know union electricians, a couple are friends. They are lazy as shit. The company I worked for payed me just a little less than union wages but I always got bonuses making it better. Now I own my own business.

 

[SONIC SAAMI]

Do you think you'll have to Confide with the union rep when he cashes a pension check?

 

[Blutroop]

Any reason why you felt the need to tell me to shove it?

Your comment struck a nerve with me. I alone am responsible for my safety.

It shouldn’t have bothered me so as I am more the “get it done” type then the “I just felt a drop, I won’t work in this” type.

@louu I’m sorry.. that comment was not needed.

I haven’t had much work these years and one skill set in particular in my small town environment that I had extensive training and experience With and even worked with both companies before the merger to one company turned union only.

I know that’s no excuse for commenting like that. For you to respond in that way shows more patience and wisdom than I currently possess.

 

[BullGear]

I’m a non union electrician and know union electricians, a couple are friends. They are lazy as shit. The company I worked for payed me just a little less than union wages but I always got bonuses making it better. Now I own my own business.

That great, I'm glad your company takes care of you, but I have seen non union companies rape their employees over pay and benefits. I'm not saying unions are good for everyone, but they are essential for others. Don't work in manufacturing without a union.

 

[Dunraven]

there is no need for the 'union' to donate money to ANY candidiate. the members are free to donate on their own. public sector unions are, perhaps, the most egregious example, where money goes to democrat candidates(almost exclusively), who, in turn, pass legislation to increase spending for 'education', for 'the children'. Yet, our 'education'/indoctrination system is sorely lacking in most respects. this is just one way that democrats cleverly 'rig' the system in their favor.

 

[Major Wader]

I have worked in Union manufacturing facilities where it was nearly impossible to get anything done. I have worked in independent plants that were clean, bright and safe. For the majority of workers, a union is not needed. For the trades, where you rarely work a career for the same employer, I can see the benefits.

Safety depends on the company and the culture. The safest places I have ever worked were non-union. OSHA has made employee safety a priority that can't be ignored.

The company I currently work for is non-union everywhere except New Jersey. It costs 50-100% more to get anything done in Jersey, takes significantly longer, and the safety training, policies, procedures, and performance is no different from the other states.

 

[AngryKoala]

But but but he said that he would provide ONE MILLION jobs creating negative emission government vehicles!!! Dontcha believe him? One million jobs!!! Come on man!

You're going to see even more job loss once the big car companies figure out how to cast sections of a vehicle like Tesla.

Just had a conference and the trend is automation with a reduction in workforce for metalworking industry. I believe that trend applies to multiple industries.

 

[AngryKoala]

And he literally ran on a new green promises. He stated he was going to get rid of the pipeline. He stated he was going to get rid of fracking.

These union people must be really dense......

Doc

I don't think he will get rid of fracking which is why the liberals are pissed at him. He is getting rid of new fracking on federal lands. Why do we keep saying he as if these are his policies? He is a puppet, nothing more.

I could be wrong but I don't think the demorats policies will be as progressive as advertised. They still need to obtain votes in two years.

 

[Romeo458]

Left a non union job for a union that was part of the teamsters or steel workers I don't remember. Took a pay cut, but after 30 days I was able to join the union and then I would get bumped up and the benefits. 30 days hits and I join. Next check still shit pay, only with the dies deducted. Ask the boss "You have to be in for 30 days then you get the raise" well that's not what I was told but whatever.

Go to the union meeting and they said they were Donating to a bunch of state Democrats and whoever was running against Bush Jr at the time (wanna say it was Gore). I stand up and ask "What if some of us don't want to donate to them do we get a vote on this?" The union reps said they voted and it was settled.

Then 30 days later it was 60, bunch of us new workers started making noise. The 3 of us who were chosen to represent the group went to the rep and told him what was up. He said "Well I can give you the raise but the company will just fire you." What in the appledairy fuck. We went back and forth about how it want their job to protect us from dirty shot like this, got a lie about 90 days before raise and benefits. Within a couple weeks all of us were laid off, we three and those of us who continued to make noise after the meeting never got a job in the union again.

Fuck unions.

 

[Animal357]

Bro if you really believe that. I got to say your lacking in some information. In non right to work states a union worker is one of the few tax payers than can provided solely for their family. So personally at 32 years old I can provided a decent living to my stay at home wife and three kids,as well as more recently my Mother who got laid off during the Rona BS. My friend who performs the same work for a non union company works 60 plus hours to my 40 and his wife has to continue to work to make their ends meet. As long as there are companies trying to cut wages to increase profits there will always be a need for unions, that is unless you belive the government will do a better job of protecting us. <Sarcasm. I haven't seen very many ethical companies out there have you? If there were ethical companies they were likely family owned and didn't survive this "epidemic."

This is the reason that unions should not exist any longer. You should not be paid more because you are union. My profession does not have a union. Why should you benefit and not me? This is why $25,000 cars sell for $40,000

 

[whatsupdoc]

LOL I remember my first meeting with union delegates telling the workers you dont have to join the union
but you will be paying the dues regardless. Straight up MOB

 

[silentwoods]

Exactly, and well put.

I'm a union worker also. Electrical generation to be exact. I know 3 people who voted for China Joe who are union.

How many non union people do the union haters know who voted for China Joe? I'll wager more than 3.

With the wages I make I've been able to let the wife stay home and raise our children, instead of a stranger, helped them out some as they got older, they're both an E-4 in different branches, and been able to donate money to charities, save money for us.

Also, considering the lack of quality in management at my facility, with a union, we can stop decisions that will get us maimed or killed. Try that at a non union job.

All of you union haters can simply fuck off. You sound like a bunch of liberals grouping folks together and painting with a broad brush of ignorance and hate.

Some of the dumbest fuckers i know are union haters, watch mslsd and vote Democrat. It amazes me reading some of the posts in this thread.

Most of the union members I personally know hate communists, voted Trump and are prior service, fwiw, and decidedly love this republic.

As far as the union leadership being in the bag for communists, yes, yes they are. And that is changing each election regardless of what the old guard wants.

So, it appears that even snipershide has a litmus test, purity gayness similar to the progressive movement.

Sad really.

 

[silentwoods]

This is the reason that unions should not exist any longer. You should not be paid more because you are union. My profession does not have a union. Why should you benefit and not me? This is why $25,000 cars sell for $40,000

It's your decision to work where you work.

Your reasoning is exactly that of a true communist. I've seen AOC and Bernie say the exact same thing comrade.

And no, your example of a car is full of shit and purely ignorant.

 

[...]

I'm a union worker also. Electrical generation to be exact. I know 3 people who voted for China Joe who are union.

How many non union people do the union haters know who voted for China Joe? I'll wager more than 3.

With the wages I make I've been able to let the wife stay home and raise our children, instead of a stranger, helped them out some as they got older, they're both an E-4 in different branches, and been able to donate money to charities, save money for us.

Also, considering the lack of quality in management at my facility, with a union, we can stop decisions that will get us maimed or killed. Try that at a non union job.

All of you union haters can simply fuck off. You sound like a bunch of liberals grouping folks together and painting with a broad brush of ignorance and hate.

Some of the dumbest fuckers i know are union haters, watch mslsd and vote Democrat. It amazes me reading some of the posts in this thread.

Most of the union members I personally know hate communists, voted Trump and are prior service, fwiw, and decidedly love this republic.

As far as the union leadership being in the bag for communists, yes, yes they are. And that is changing each election regardless of what the old guard wants.

So, it appears that even snipershide has a litmus test, purity gayness similar to the progressive movement.

Sad really.

did you post all that during your hourly union mandated 15 minute break?

 

[silentwoods]

there is no need for the 'union' to donate money to ANY candidiate. the members are free to donate on their own. public sector unions are, perhaps, the most egregious example, where money goes to democrat candidates(almost exclusively), who, in turn, pass legislation to increase spending for 'education', for 'the children'. Yet, our 'education'/indoctrination system is sorely lacking in most respects. this is just one way that democrats cleverly 'rig' the system in their favor.

Agreed.

Ironically, because of the wages I make at my Union job I can afford to donate money.

 

[silentwoods]

did you post all that during your hourly union mandated 15 minute break?

Actually smartass, before union's nobody got any breaks , safety healthcare or made enough money to pay the bills.

Don't let those pesky facts get in the way of your ignorance.

 

[...]

Actually smartass, before union's nobody got any breaks , safety healthcare or made enough money to pay the bills.

Don't let those pesky facts get in the way of your ignorance.

also, if what you are claiming IS actually true (it isnt but lets pretend here).....with the advent of:

• federal labor laws
• OSHA
• and minumum wage laws

.....what exactly are unions doing for their members again?.....i mean, other than stifling productivity, and extorting money.....?

 

[louu]

Your comment struck a nerve with me. I alone am responsible for my safety.

It shouldn’t have bothered me so as I am more the “get it done” type then the “I just felt a drop, I won’t work in this” type.

@louu I’m sorry.. that comment was not needed.

I haven’t had much work these years and one skill set in particular in my small town environment that I had extensive training and experience With and even worked with both companies before the merger to one company turned union only.

I know that’s no excuse for commenting like that. For you to respond in that way shows more patience and wisdom than I currently possess.

It's all good bud, sometimes everyone on this board gets a little heated over things but we need to take a step back and realize that we, on this board have more in common than any other group of people in this whole country.

We all have to work and we've all been in messed up situations at work. I just know from my personal experience in this part of the country doing the kind of work that I love I need to be in a real union.

 

[R0man]

The idea of a union is good.
The leadership of the unions is bad and corrupt.

 

[silentwoods]

View attachment 7539309


also, if what you are claiming IS actually true (it isnt but lets pretend here).....with the advent of:

• federal labor laws
• OSHA
• and minumum wage laws

.....what exactly are unions doing for their members again?.....i mean, other than stifling productivity, and extorting money.....?

What was the primary driver of each of your examples?

Organized labor.

Yes, that's correct. Look it up, or not, I don't really care either way.

Let's see, two more ignorant theories to dismiss...

Stifling productivity: nope but they do make members pass multiple certifications, tests and continue and validate their knowledge.

Extorting money: not in right to work states. That's a state law issue, not a union issue. change the laws in your respective state or stop bitching.

Nobody says you have to like or dislike a union.

But at least be correct instead of ignorant.

I'm all in on the critique of ,at least ,my labor union, but just bullshit posting, not so much.

Even non union fields benefit from union. So, ironically the haters get some benefits by proxy. That's the funniest part about threads like this.

I guess I can't hang out with the kool kids now.

 

[samadisoulcrusher]

My union pushes the dems down our throats every election cycle .
20 years ago half the plant voted Democrat . Not now . Most were and still are Trump supporters .

I pissed off the local union President years ago . They sent me the news letter . which was nothing more than a Democrat
propaganda sheet for then senator Paul Wellstone . Who I loathed and voted against .
Called the union President . Told him . That if I wanted democrat propaganda .
I would call the democrats directly and ask them to send me some .
He replied that the news letter wasn't just about Paul Wellstone .
To which I said , You . Sir are right . The back page is about how great Paul's wife is too !
With that , The president growled . Fine you wont be getting the news letter and he hung up .
I have been a thorn in their side for 22 years now .
I don't like paying dues for zero return .
My boss pays me my union wage plus a bonus every 6 months .
I don't need the union . They need me !

Now every election I get a nice glossy magazine with pictures of all the democrats that the union wants us to vote for !
They even told us this year that Trump caused many union members to lose their jobs .
Funny We have hired a bunch of new employees in the last 4 years . All union members now .
We went from 3 shifts down to one and a half for the 8 years of obama/Biden !

 

[silentwoods]

I'd call being in a union a love-hate relationship.

I'd agree with that.

But the only people who will ever change a union for the good are it's members.

I'm extremely critical of mine, much to the angst of some members.

 

[EddieNFL]

I'm a union worker also. Electrical generation to be exact. I know 3 people who voted for China Joe who are union.

How many non union people do the union haters know who voted for China Joe? I'll wager more than 3.

With the wages I make I've been able to let the wife stay home and raise our children, instead of a stranger, helped them out some as they got older, they're both an E-4 in different branches, and been able to donate money to charities, save money for us.

Also, considering the lack of quality in management at my facility, with a union, we can stop decisions that will get us maimed or killed. Try that at a non union job.

All of you union haters can simply fuck off. You sound like a bunch of liberals grouping folks together and painting with a broad brush of ignorance and hate.

Some of the dumbest fuckers i know are union haters, watch mslsd and vote Democrat. It amazes me reading some of the posts in this thread.

Most of the union members I personally know hate communists, voted Trump and are prior service, fwiw, and decidedly love this republic.

As far as the union leadership being in the bag for communists, yes, yes they are. And that is changing each election regardless of what the old guard wants.

So, it appears that even snipershide has a litmus test, purity gayness similar to the progressive movement.

Sad really.

How do you rationalize donations to socialist/communist politicians?

 

[silentwoods]

My union pushes the dems down our throats every election cycle .
20 years ago half the plant voted Democrat . Not now . Most were and still are Trump supporters .

I pissed off the local union President years ago . They sent me the news letter . which was nothing more than a Democrat
propaganda sheet for then senator Paul Wellstone . Who I loathed and voted against .
Called the union President . Told him . That if I wanted democrat propaganda .
I would call the democrats directly and ask them to send me some .
He replied that the news letter wasn't just about Paul Wellstone .
To which I said , You . Sir are right . The back page is about how great Paul's wife is too !
With that , The president growled . Fine you wont be getting the news letter and he hung up .
I have been a thorn in their side for 22 years now .
I don't like paying dues for zero return .
My boss pays me my union wage plus a bonus every 6 months .
I don't need the union . They need me !

Now every election I get a nice glossy magazine with pictures of all the democrats that the union wants us to vote for !
They even told us this year that Trump caused many union members to lose their jobs .
Funny We have hired a bunch of new employees in the last 4 years . All union members now .
We went from 3 shifts down to one and a half for the 8 years of obama/Biden !

Obama killed coal.

I was non union in the mines. Even big daddy Peabody filed bankruptcy because of his policies.

Now I work in generation, and it's dying too. Trump didn't do anything to help fossil plants, or the coal industry.

Now that'll get the trump kool aid drinkers bitching at me too. .

See, I don't really follow a crowd, there are a few things I appreciate in organized labor, and many that I raise helll about. But at the end of the day, the non union management are responsible for the injuries that occured. Lack of maintenance is a bad thing when dealing with 3550 psi, 345kv and 1050 steam temps.

Same thing with Trump. He did some fantastic things, but only with EO. Unfortunately the gimp is erasing them daily. Imho, the anger should be focused on the Republican party.

Just call em like I see em.

 

[...]

Stifling productivity: nope but they do make members pass multiple certifications, tests and continue and validate their knowledge.

When i worked at Raytheon.....we were not allowed to move ANY test equipment...not even a fucking benchtop power supply or a damn office chair...it was a "union job"...so we had to file a ticket to have a chair moved...

it took a minimum of 3 days for a union guy to get around to it...i had several projects set back a WEEKS waiting on union guys to move something that would have taken me 30 second and a walk down the hall to do.

but god forbid we did it ourselves....the union guys would come running to claim we were "stealing their jobs!" and would file grievances after grievance......funny, thats the only time they seemed to get off their ass was when it was to bitch you out for stealing the job they werent doing.

Extorting money: not in right to work states. That's a state law issue, not a union issue. change the laws in your respective state or stop bitching.

.....so you are admitting in states without right work laws.....unions are basically extorting money?........1/2 the country unions have the ability to force you to pay for the privilege of working......

funny, it seems most of the "right to work" states are primarily republican......huh.....so in democrat run areas, you HAVE to join a union......hmmmm.....no wonder unions are big Democrat donors.....im guessing thats not a coincidence.

 

[silentwoods]

How do you rationalize donations to socialist/communist politicians?

How much gets donated?
To whom?

Where do you get your information?

How much do I donate personally to whom?

Do you pay taxes?

Did you cash your stimulus check, any of them?

How much of your tax money is parsed out to Planned Parenthood?

How much goes to Democrat pork projects and by proxy democratic politicians?

I could go on, but I think you see my point here.

Turn that light of indignation on yourself and reflect before you point it at others sir.


Brawndo, it has what plants crave.

 

[Sean the Nailer]

I'm gonna say a few things about Unions. As I have worked in a few, and in two completely different area's of the country. (yes, there's a difference)

To have anyone come here and say "all unions are bad" is equivalent to the media saying 'all guns are bad'....

To have anyone come here and say "all unions are good" is also the equivalent of a hunter stating "the 30.06 is the goodest cartridge EVER"....

C'mon people, think about it. There is good and bad in everything. Some things have more good, and some things have more bad. It is up to the people/populace/membership to "steer the boat" as best they can.

I've both been a member of, as well as been an officer of the union "out West" where we were strong, respect was shared, and together we all moved forward. I've also been a member of, and a steward for, a union "here Central" that was a flying joke. They were 'bought-and-paid-for', did NOT represent the membership at all, and were ONLY in it for the money and prestige (if you can call it that).

"All Unions are Great".... yeah-NO.
"All Unions Suck".... yeah-NO.

All Red cars speed...... yeah-NO more.

Seeing a pattern?

 

[silentwoods]

When i worked at Raytheon.....we were not allowed to move ANY test equipment...not even a fucking benchtop power supply or a damn office chair...it was a "union job"...so we had to file a ticket to have a chair moved...

it took a minimum of 3 days for a union guy to get around to it...i had several projects set back a WEEKS waiting on union guys to move something that would have taken me 30 second and a walk down the hall to do.

but god forbid we did it ourselves....the union guys would come running to claim we were "stealing their jobs!" and would file grievances after grievance......funny, thats the only time they seemed to get off their ass was when it was to bitch you out for stealing the job they werent doing.


.....so you are admitting in states without right work laws.....unions are basically extorting money?........1/2 the country unions have the ability to force you to pay for the privilege of working......

funny, it seems most of the "right to work" states are primarily republican......huh.....so in democrat run areas, you HAVE to join a union......hmmmm.....no wonder unions are big Democrat donors.....im guessing thats not a coincidence.

I agree with right to work bills.

Choices are good.

I do like how you skip the parts where you were wrong and continue with your childish thinking.

It's cute really.

It's also funny how everyone seems to have seen a bad example of union workers. Of course, you could never prove it, not that I'd doubt it.

So, by proxy anyone who is union is lazy, communist, worthless etc.etc.etc.

There goes that broad brush again.

 

[BLEE]

To me, free enterprise and liberty, don't make sense with the existence of unions. I think employers have ethical responsibilities to their employees, also. I have two uncles, retired from union railroad jobs and many friend and parents of friends, who retired from UAW jobs. From all stories I've heard, unions do more harm than good, with the strong-arming, corruption, inefficiencies and general lack of common sense.

 

[Animal357]

It's your decision to work where you work.

Your reasoning is exactly that of a true communist. I've seen AOC and Bernie say the exact same thing comrade.

And no, your example of a car is full of shit and purely ignorant.

The car example came from a car manufacturer exec, and by the way, FU

 

[silentwoods]

To me, free enterprise and liberty, don't make sense with the existence of unions. I think employers have ethical responsibilities to their employees, also. I have two uncles, retired from union railroad jobs and many friend and parents of friends, who retired from UAW jobs. From all stories I've heard, unions do more harm than good, with the strong-arming, corruption, inefficiencies and general lack of common sense.

You "think" employers have an ethical responsibility?

Like the Chevrolet board who took a bailout from Obama, filed bankruptcy and killed their stock value btw, and the reniged on payment? And rather than fixing their business model, kept doing business the same way? Lol

40,000.00 per Chevy Volt sold subsidised?



Not to mention those well earned bonuses, nice ethics indeed.

I'd guess that was a union problem too.

If you believe upper management gives a shit about you, well, you'll figure it out eventually.

 

[silentwoods]

The car example came from a car manufacturer exec, and by the way, FU

Very nice comrade .

 

[308pirate]

I think we should really give all of the blue states and demonrat cities what they want.
No gasoline, diesel, natural gas or anything that doesnt come from wind or solar.

100% embargo on all crops grown in red states as well

 

[Flintdog2011]

How much gets donated?
To whom?

Where do you get your information?

How much do I donate personally to whom?

Do you pay taxes?

Did you cash your stimulus check, any of them?

How much of your tax money is parsed out to Planned Parenthood?

How much goes to Democrat pork projects and by proxy democratic politicians?

I could go on, but I think you see my point here.

Turn that light of indignation on yourself and reflect before you point it at others sir.


Brawndo, it has what plants crave.

And the shark has been jumped

 

[silentwoods]

Very nice comrade .

100% embargo on all crops grown in red states as well

And power generated.

Let them live on their so-called renewables.

And erase the subsidies for green energy, allowing the rate payers to actually see what that shit costs, how unreliable it is, and actually experience the future of this country under big green politics.

Hell yes game on bitches.

 

[silentwoods]

And the shark has been jumped

Point was made. Either people get it or they don't. Again, I don't really care, but glass houses are a thing, so is conjecture.

Possibly it's time for some people to look a little deeper instead of parroting tired propaganda that keeps groups divided.

The scumbags grinding this country ain't me.

 

[...]

I agree with right to work bills.

Choices are good.

I do like how you skip the parts where you were wrong and continue with your childish thinking.

It's cute really.

It's also funny how everyone seems to have seen a bad example of union workers. Of course, you could never prove it, not that I'd doubt it.

So, by proxy anyone who is union is lazy, communist, worthless etc.etc.etc.

There goes that broad brush again.

What point did i skip over again and what childish thinking am i engaging in?

and what the fuck do you want me to do to prove union workers taking 3 days to move a chair?......gets sworn statements?......video tape them?....im sure if i tried, ide have a grievance filed against me.....christ man....if thats the line you want to go with, i can easily say "prove it didnt happen".......you cant....because its an absurd thing to say.

im sure there are some hard working union guys out there......i havent met them......but im sure they exist.

you still really havent changed my opinion on unions.....they may have served a purpose at one time......but im really struggling to see what they offer, other than charging me money to work at a job and pressure me to vote democrat.

 

[308pirate]

Where my cars come from. Not a single union worker in sight.

Just the way I like it

 

[BLEE]

You "think" employers have an ethical responsibility?

Like the Chevrolet board who took a bailout from Obama, filed bankruptcy and killed their stock value btw, and the reniged on payment? And rather than fixing their business model, kept doing business the same way? Lol

Not to mention those well earned bonuses, nice ethics indeed.

I'd guess that was a union problem too.

If you believe upper management gives a shit about you, well, you'll figure it out eventually.

Yes, they do have ethical responsibilities. I know they don't always practice good ethics. We all have ethical responsibilities to each other, individually and otherwise. Obviously, we live in a grossly unethical world, where right is wrong and wrong is right, elections can be fraudulent and still be certified, Obama is a tyrant, etc.. That being said, I don't like unions, because they bring more problems than solutions.

 

[obk]

I alone am responsible for my safety.

I get why it's tempting to say this, but it's just not true. You absolutely are responsible for your own safety, but you alone? On a jobsite? I doubt you'd look on as someone did something that'd get them/someone else hurt, result in a site shutdown, fines, whatever. Hopefully everybody else on the job has the same attitude. Most good modern safety approaches are built on shared mission and purpose. Those are the same approaches that avoid getting in everyone's way with a bunch of rules about how you wipe your ass - you don't need those rules when community safety is a priority.

 

[silentwoods]

Where my cars come from. Not a single union worker in sight.

Just the way I like it

View attachment 7539366

I own Toyotas.

They're more American made than "domestic" brands. Parts and assembly.

And, do you honestly think Honda and Toyota would have the pay and benefits packages they do if the UAW vanished?

Be honest now not emotional.

 

[silentwoods]

Yes, they do have ethical responsibilities. I know they don't always practice good ethics. We all have ethical responsibilities to each other, individually and otherwise. Obviously, we live in a grossly unethical world, where right is wrong and wrong is right, elections can be fraudulent and still be certified, Obama is a tyrant, etc.. That being said, I don't like unions, because they bring more problems than solutions.

Lol, funny.

 

[silentwoods]

Okay, I'm off today and not wasting any more time on the inter web.

Everybody have a great day.