Rifle Scopes US Optics Foundation series

[DrDrillgood]

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pretty ironic for a company to name themselves “US optics” then buy chinese internals to use. Same garbage different wrapper

You literally created an account to reply to this thread, which you commented on twice....surprisingly offering nothing of value. You have a total of two other posts, both of which are you being a prick.

Your credibility is precisely zero....which is probably the same number of times you’ve had sex.

You work for a competitor or something? Or just a troll?

 

[Walker TR]

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pretty ironic for a company to name themselves “US optics” then buy chinese internals to use. Same garbage different wrapper

Classic Troll lol....made my point exactly....thanks

 

[Poorboyr]

Trolls will be trolls.....

I’m hoping these scopes turn out great! I’ve always liked USO scopes.

 

[ClamHammer747]

You literally created an account to reply to this thread, which you commented on twice....surprisingly offering nothing of value. You have a total of two other posts, both of which are you being a prick.

Your credibility is precisely zero....which is probably the same number of times you’ve had sex.

You work for a competitor or something? Or just a troll?

oh no. You found me out. Im actually an optical engineer for quigly ford....

btw, I’m just sick of people claiming USO is made in US when it’s not.

age of account means nothing to the truth

admit it to yourself that you’re perfectly fine shooting with inferior chinese trash being passed off as made in America

 

[DrDrillgood]

oh no. You found me out. Im actually an optical engineer for quigly ford....

btw, I’m just sick of people claiming USO is made in US when it’s not.

age of account means nothing to the truth

admit it to yourself that you’re perfectly fine shooting with inferior chinese trash being passed off as made in America

I don’t actually own anything from USO yet so I have no idea how fine I am with shooting their optics.

Now, do you care to offer any evidence in support of your claim of US Optics being “inferior Chinese trash being passed off as made in America”?

 

[ClamHammer747]

I don’t actually own anything from USO yet so I have no idea how fine I am with shooting their optics.

Now, do you care to offer any evidence in support of your claim of US Optics being “inferior Chinese trash being passed off as made in America”?

 

[Walker TR]

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A Tool Bag??? I think so

 

[DrDrillgood]

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So your answer is no then? Got it. Thanks for your immeasurable contribution.

 

[myronman3]

i know squat about the newer USO scopes. I did see they went away from the EREK, which killed the odds of me ever buying one.

Unlike a lot of folks here, i dont have the distance to practice at, 300 yards is about the longest range i can find within reasonable driving distance. So i have two uso scopes that i have never really been able to run through the ringer. An sn3 3-17 and an st10....which has never even made it to getting mounted on a rifle.....yet.
What little fucking with i have been able to do with the sn3, i’ve been happy with it. The erek is a winner, to me anyway. Some folks may hate it for legit reasons, and may not like uso scopes for legit reasons. My experience so far with them.....i have nothing negative to say about it.

Other folks may have had other experiences with them, and i’ll not trash them for sharing their personal experiences; even though they may be totally different from mine. Good, bad, or ugly......i like hearing folks’ experiences with various companies. some have always been great, others good at one point then head south; others may improve with time. And the only way the average fuck is going to know is word of mouth or the voice of experience.

 

[Poorboyr]

It’s crazy to me how much people have brand loyalty to scopes. It seems worse than the Ford vs Chevy vs Ram argument.

I’m looking forward to see this scope at Shot.

 

[Kentucreed6]

I’m also looking forward to seeing this come out. I had a b25 order I took the upgrade on. Too bad we’ll have to wait until March at the earliest.

 

[koshkin]

Interesting discussion. I gave it some though to see how I want to approach this, and here is the summary.

First of all, I have not tested any US Optics scopes in quite a few years. I have looked at a few some years ago when they were made here and while I liked them mechanically, there was a lot of variability with optical quality and I kinda gave up on trying to make conclusions out of them. I did like the people there, but then the team really changed.

Given that the company has moved and changed hands and went through a legal dispute of some sort, I am inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt for a bit and see how their product line develops.

In principle, they are setting it up in a reasonable manner, but it is not clear how it will develop from there.

Their top end line (now called Foundation) is made in the US.

Mid-range TS line is made in China and, presumably, QC'ed in the US.

That is not a bad way to go if they keep the quality up. The odd thing is that the Foundation seem to be a re-hash of the original US Optics scopes that were quite good in their day, but the competition has largely passed them by.

I do like the return to the EREK knob which I always liked. Perhaps, this kind of a refresh was the "low hanging fruit" so to speak that gives them some breathing room to make other improvements. The fact that they decided to not refresh their US-made SVS LPVO is odd, but perhaps that is what they are re-designing first. LPVO market is crucial in the modern market place and I doubt they are planning to only support it with Chinese-made TS-series.

The fact that the TS scopes are made in China does not bother me in the slightest. It would if they were hiding it, but they are being quite honest about it, so I do not see an issue. If they can develop it a little further where they can leverage some OEM designs and add some features specific to USO, TS series might develop into a very worthwhile product line.

Their red dot sights seem to be reasonable. DRS looks to be the same thing as Hawke Micro and a few other Docter pattern sights. They are perfectly adequate for the money, while MCRS looks to be OEM'ed by Shield, likely a version of the RMS design which I like a lot.

The overall product line is fairly complete and with some careful brand development and product evolution can be very good.

We'll just have to wait and see where they will take it.

ILya

 

[BigJimFish]

Between the ones I have owned, and those my immediate family owned I have probably had 10 or so USO scopes pass before my eyes. A number of them have done so after I started doing my testing for reviews with a humbler device and optical charts. People must have worse luck then me because none of those broke. I will say the QC was slightly more lax than industry average, I have more reticles be 1% off or turrets 2% off then average but none broke and I have had other makers scopes prove defective in testing.

For what it is worth, I hope the new U.S.O owners have success. There has been a lot of literally moving around in a short time and that can't be easy.

 

[5RWill]

Loved my SN-3 parted with it this year after 10 years of use. They finally have a competent reticle design for competition. The only thing that honest to God bothers me is the aesthetics and sheer size of their optics. The 5-25 still looks like a softball bat and i don't know of another optic on the market at the moment in it's class/price that is 17" or longer and the 3.2-17 is still 15". Weight is moderate but yeah it just looks odd AF to me. Idk JMO. I wish them the best either way.

 

[Smith1175]

Well, I've had a few uso scopes in the last 5 years. While everyone is entitled to thier opinion, I have had nothing but good luck with them. All of them have tracked perfect, glass has been very good and I have even shot numerous matches in the pouring down rain(like dumping water out of mags before you shoot, raining) with my er25 I had, and it still worked great for over a year afterwards. Lr17 was actually even better imo. Loved that one.

Everyone has thier own opinion and experiences with gear though. I wouldnt own a fucking thing that says American Rifle Co on it, but lots of people love them.

Are any of the scopes you own the B series?

 

[RTV]

I think the 1.8-10x is pretty interesting... not sure how good the old USO's in this range were or how much they have upgraded it but i could very easily see it going on a lot of hunting rifles depending on how hard it is to get behind and the parralax.

From the guys who have some of the older USOs what would your expectations be on that?

 

[koshkin]

I think the 1.8-10x is pretty interesting... not sure how good the old USO's in this range were or how much they have upgraded it but i could very easily see it going on a lot of hunting rifles depending on how hard it is to get behind and the parralax.

From the guys who have some of the older USOs what would your expectations be on that?

The original was always a pretty decent scope except for severe tunneling below 3.5x or so.

ILya

 

[cj10]

My brand new, but faulty, B17 was returned to the UK retailer in August 2019. It arrived with US Optics in early October and when I chased progress on 17th December I was told there had been a delay due to issues with repair part suppliers. Estimated repair completion given as mid January.

Am tempted to see if there is any chance of the new elevation turret given the reported issues with the tool less version. Suspect I know the answer though.

 

[ken226]

I called and pre-ordered a FDN17x this morning. I spent some time on the phone with them asking questions, all of which were answered to my satisfaction.

The glass in the Foundation series is sourced from a US based plant, owned by a German firm. The aluminum, bronze and other raw materials are sourced from local North Carolina vendors, and are machined in-house.

The lifetime warranty follows the scope, not the owner.

@cj10

"Am tempted to see if there is any chance of the new elevation turret given the reported issues with the tool less version. Suspect I know the answer though."

The customer service seems really good at US Optics. If you have your return authorization number, it may be worth a call to ask. Not much to lose in asking.

 

[Kentucreed6]

Anybody at shot show handle the foundation? What’s the first impression?

 

[Poorboyr]

I got to mess with one the other day. First impression is that it is a solid scope. It’s the old Erek knob improved. It seems like a pretty solid scope. I was impressed. I’ll be placing an order for one to test out.

 

[Flyingbullseye]

Poorboyr, how'd the turrets feel? The Bravo scope I had in my opinion had the best I've ever used.

 

[ken226]

I got to mess with one the other day. First impression is that it is a solid scope. It’s the old Erek knob improved. It seems like a pretty solid scope. I was impressed. I’ll be placing an order for one to test out.

That's good to hear. Did you get a chance to look through it? What are your impressions of the glass? How to the turrets feel?

Thanks for the info. I've been waiting to hear something about these for awhile. USO seems to not be putting out much info.

 

[Poorboyr]

The turrets are great. Very tactile and easy to recognize. They feel better than the B turrets without any problems. Extremely easy to set the zero stop also.

Glass at the show is very difficult to tell. Everything looks good under fluorescent light. I like USO glass. They said optically the scope was improved. So take that for what it’s worth. You can never tell until you are at the range.

 

[ken226]

You can find that in the manual except um... USO never did get around to making a manual for any of their scopes that I am aware. That should be a clue.

Just in case anyone ever needs a manual:

U.S. Optics Support: Optic Manuals - US Optics

U.S. Optics support offers owner manuals and other documentation to answer your every question about our products. We are here to serve you.

www.usoptics.com

 

[Smith1175]

My whole bitch with USO is that after owning three of the B series optics, all of which broke, waiting on average 10 weeks for the repairs, dealing with the pretty lacking CS, they come out with a regurgitation of an optic that was introduced in the late 90’s to early 2000’s.

Then they try and sell new said optic as “we just went back to the basics”, “it’s super reliable”, and “ it’s super dependable”. When asked what’s the deference between the Er3k turret the previous turret, I’m assuming meaning the original Erek, all that was said was “ we did away with the locking turret, the more stuff you put in these optics the more chance there is for problems.”

To some up. If you are to buy the new foundation optic you won’t have any of the features that most of all the other high end optics have, it won’t come with caps, or a throw lever, but it will come with a high end price tag. Yeah.... Ok.... Thanks USO...

 

[ken226]

My whole bitch with USO is that after owning three of the B series optics, all of which broke, waiting on average 10 weeks for the repairs, dealing with the pretty lacking CS, they come out with a regurgitation of an optic that was introduced in the late 90’s to early 2000’s.

Then they try and sell new said optic as “we just went back to the basics”, “it’s super reliable”, and “ it’s super dependable”. When asked what’s the deference between the Er3k turret the previous turret, I’m assuming meaning the original Erek, all that was said was “ we did away with the locking turret, the more stuff you put in these optics the more chance there is for problems.”

To some up. If you are to buy the new foundation optic you won’t have any of the features that most of all the other high end optics have, it won’t come with caps, or a throw lever, but it will come with a high end price tag. Yeah.... Ok.... Thanks USO...

What broke on you B series?

I never owned a B series scope, but keep hearing that the B series had horrible turrets that broke alot, which is why i stopped buying new USO scopes when the B series came out.

The windage turret on the FDN series is capped, and it comes with the cap.

The elevation turret is not capped. A cap for the Erek turret would be the size of a Skoal can. I wouldn't want one.

US Optics sucks at putting out info though. They should have their engineer put out some actual detailed information. Everything ive been hearing, comes from marketing people, who rarely know anything technical.

 

[Smith1175]

What broke on you B series?

I never owned a B series scope, but keep hearing that the B series had horrible turrets that broke alot, which is why i stopped buying new USO scopes when the B series came out.

The windage turret on the FDN series is capped, and it comes with the cap.

The elevation turret is not capped. A cap for the Erek turret would be the size of a Skoal can. I wouldn't want one.

US Optics sucks at putting out info though. They should have their engineer put out some actual detailed information. Everything ive been hearing, comes from marketing people, who rarely know anything technical.

On all three of them the elevation turret hand issues, meaning they either locked up, stopped holding zero, the elevation lock broke, dialing up or down felt like you where grinding pepper.

On my B25 something came loose and blocked most of the view threw the scope. If you put it on 25 power, it looked as if there was a pice of electrical tape dangling down blocking the view.

 

[ken226]

On all three of them the elevation turret hand issues, meaning they either locked up, stopped holding zero, the elevation lock broke, dialing up or down felt like you where grinding pepper.

On my B25 something came loose and blocked most of the view threw the scope. If you put it on 25 power, it looked as if there was a pice of electrical tape dangling down blocking the view.

Yea, I didn't want to take a chance during that 2016 to 2019 time frame. They changed ownership, moved twice, kept changing models. Most of the negative reviews come Frome that time frame.

Hopefully, the new factory in NC is permanent, and they can get back on track.

 

[D loop darrell]

I guess my situation has also turned out, odd. I ordered a b17 on Oct 22nd. Today is February 2nd. I do not have my scope yet. I also haven't heard much on updates. I did agree to have my order changed from B17 to FDN17. That added a lot time. I knew they moved n somethings went on. I expected to be delayed. It's just odd ya know.

 

[DrDrillgood]

I guess my situation has also turned out, odd. I ordered a b17 on Oct 22nd. Today is February 2nd. I do not have my scope yet. I also haven't heard much on updates. I did agree to have my order changed from B17 to FDN17. That added a lot time. I knew they moved n somethings went on. I expected to be delayed. It's just odd ya know.

I placed my order on October 21st For a b25. Changed to a fdn25. Still waiting. But I was told February to March.

That’s sort of a wide window. Hopefully it doesn’t go past that.

 

[D loop darrell]

I placed my order on October 21st For a b25. Changed to a fdn25. Still waiting. But I was told February to March.

That’s sort of a wide window. Hopefully it doesn’t go past that.

At least we have a support group. I looked at all the scopes out there again earlier and the FDN17 with the mgr reticle is what I want. I knew it was February/March ship too. I'm really in no rush. I heard on a video someone with US optics tell someone at shot show that they'll start shipping mid march.

 

[ken226]

There have been a few videos from SHOT showing up on YouTube. Still nothing like an actual review, just basic Q&A and showing off the turrets and mag ring.

Basically, nothing we don't already know.

 

[LawnMM]

 

[ken226]

If you find this thread boring, feel free to ignore it.

Here's a couple more exciting ones for you:

https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/my-schmidt-bender-needs-repairs.6984046/

https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/night-force-problems.40130/#post-40130

https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/i-have-a-nightforce-atacr-problem.6890091/#post-7088577

https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...x-viper-pst-ffp-6-24x50mm.242651/#post-242651

 

[elmuzzlebreak]

On all three of them the elevation turret hand issues, meaning they either locked up, stopped holding zero, the elevation lock broke, dialing up or down felt like you where grinding pepper.

On my B25 something came loose and blocked most of the view threw the scope. If you put it on 25 power, it looked as if there was a pice of electrical tape dangling down blocking the view.

Pretty much my experience except it started with a SN3. Something broke in the elevation turret twice then they upgraded me to the B25. So that was about a 3 month delay. B25 arrived and first time, I went out the zero the center screw failed so I didn't have a zero stop. Also the windage turret lock was not functioning. That took about 5 weeks to repair. Then the lock ring broke so I didn't have the ability to lock my turret. That took about another 2 weeks. Then I had the same thing happen again so it was never really fixed.

My issue is this- every scope breaks. Search here and you'll see Tangent Thetas, Schmidts, and Nightforces have to go back for repairs. But what differentiates then from USO is if they handle things in a timely manner and get you back up and running. Many scope companies are more than ready to send you a label, repair your stuff in a matter of days, and overnight it back to you so you're on your way. USO seems to be still riding the struggle bus with this and their QC.

Looking at the videos from @ken226 I'm surprised that John M didn't ask about their QC issues since he's said in videos that USO scopes suffer from issues out of the box that are unacceptable.

 

[ken226]

Pretty much my experience except it started with a SN3. Something broke in the elevation turret twice then they upgraded me to the B25. So that was about a 3 month delay. B25 arrived and first time, I went out the zero the center screw failed so I didn't have a zero stop. Also the windage turret lock was not functioning. That took about 5 weeks to repair. Then the lock ring broke so I didn't have the ability to lock my turret. That took about another 2 weeks. Then I had the same thing happen again so it was never really fixed.

My issue is this- every scope breaks. Search here and you'll see Tangent Thetas, Schmidts, and Nightforces have to go back for repairs. But what differentiates then from USO is if they handle things in a timely manner and get you back up and running. Many scope companies are more than ready to send you a label, repair your stuff in a matter of days, and overnight it back to you so you're on your way. USO seems to be still riding the struggle bus with this and their QC.

Looking at the videos from @ken226 I'm surprised that John M didn't ask about their QC issues since he's said in videos that USO scopes suffer from issues out of the box that are unacceptable.

I suspect that US Optics knows it's more of a design problem than a QC problem. Not that they didn't have a QC problem, but apparently the B series turret was a design that was easy to screw up (by the manufacturer).

Otherwise, they'd likely have kept the design and just spent the money on QC. I suspect that a finicky design that's prone to trouble, can't be fixed by any amount of QC.

Some people like the B series turrets. But, scopes can be everything from safe queens to hard use equipment. I suspect that the design issues with the B turrets pop up more frequently when subjected to more serious use.

What month/year did you send in your SN3? I'm wondering if it was during the ownership changes and moves?

 

[elmuzzlebreak]

I suspect that US Optics knows it's more of a design problem than a QC problem. Not that they didn't have a QC problem, but apparently the B series turret was a design that was easy to screw up.

Otherwise, they'd likely have kept the design and just spent the money on QC. I suspect that a finicky design that's prone to trouble, can't be fixed by any amount of QC.

Some people like the B series turrets. But, scopes can be everything from safe queens to hard use equipment. I suspect that the design issues with the B turrets pop up more frequently when subjected to more serious use.

What month/year did you send in your SN3? I'm wondering if it was during the ownership changes and moves?

I agree and in talking to the techs/CS there it was a design issue that caused the lock ring to fail. In my case it happened during a basic zeroing procedure (both times).

As to when I sent my SN3 back I don't recall the exact time but I do know it was received when they were still in MT and then my replacement b25 was delayed due to their move to NC.

 

[ken226]

I agree and in talking to the techs/CS there it was a design issue that caused the lock ring to fail. In my case it happened during a basic zeroing procedure (both times).

As to when I sent my SN3 back I don't recall the exact time but I do know it was received when they were still in MT and then my replacement b25 was delayed due to their move to NC.

I avoided them until now for that reason.

I'm giving them a chance now because I really want them to succeed. They just moved twice, within a couple years and changed owners. Usually when a company starts doing that, the doors get nailed shut shortly after.

But they didn't shut down, rather they ended up sharing a big factory with ZeroDelta and the new owners dumped alot of money into them.

This is their chance to turn it around. If no-one decides to take a chance with them, then another American company disappears.

 

[elmuzzlebreak]

I avoided them until now for that reason.

I'm giving them a chance now because I really want them to succeed. They just moved twice, within a couple years and changed owners. Usually when a company starts doing that, the doors get nailed shut shortly after.

But they didn't shut down, rather they ended up sharing a big factory with ZeroDelta and the new owners dumped alot of money into them.

This is their chance to turn it around. If no-one decides to take a chance with them, then another American company disappears.

Only time will tell. I'm all for seeing American companies thrive but seeing as to how none of these foundations have hit the streets yet it's hard to say. More so given that many people are still waiting on B series orders as stated above which would explain why there aren't any recent reviews on the B series. I don't think there's denying that they have a lot of ground to cover before they get close to the top 5.

 

[elmuzzlebreak]

So has anyone actually gotten a hold of these yet?

 

[just browsing]

So has anyone actually gotten a hold of these yet?

They will be starting to ship next month.

 

[DrDrillgood]

So has anyone actually gotten a hold of these yet?

Interesting timing, as I just got an email response from them today stating:

“They will be completed sometime between March and April. We had a delay in getting our bodies anodized, but they should be here shortly and then production will begin ASAP.”

 

[elmuzzlebreak]

Anything yet?

 

[ken226]

Anything yet?

I spoke with with their marketing director Monday morning. There are alot of pre-orders ahead of mine, and mine is expected to ship in late March.

They have a few set aside to go out to some third parties for testing and reviews. @koshkin was mentioned.

 

[koshkin]

I spoke with with their marketing director Monday morning. There are alot of pre-orders ahead of mine, and mine is expected to ship in late March.

They have a few set aside to go out to some third parties for testing and reviews. @koshkin was mentioned.

Good to know. Thanks for the update.

ILya

 

[ken226]

Good to know. Thanks for the update.

ILya

I'll send you a PM with the info I got.

 

[sixpack340]

Man...I've been out of the loop with USO scopes for a few years now. I just bought a b17 used of the optics section here a couple days ago. I had no idea uso had these issues. I never had an issue with the st10 or the sn3 I had before. Now I'm starting to get a little itchy about the purchase I just made. I hope mine was made on a Wednesday and doesnt have these issues...

 

[Mute]

They're just a bit behind the times but to be fair, I've never had any issues with the ones I owned.

 

[koshkin]

They're just a bit behind the times but to be fair, I've never had any issues with the ones I owned.

The company went through a bunch of transitiong and relocations. I am inclined to see how they do now that things are settling down before I make too many conclusions.

ILya