right on. I’m also using a modified Kifaru gun bearer with my desert tech.
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Rifle Scopes Vortex LHT 4.5-22x50
- Thread starter Mr. Z
- Start date
Here's the reticle at 4.5x. Is it usable, ....yeeeeesssssss... (that was a hesitant yes) but you are not going to see hash marks very well and center might be difficult with busy backgrounds (this is where the G2H reticle excels). While the illumination is daylight bright, I would not rely on it with anything but darker backgrounds at this magnification. Will this reticle be good for running coyotes at 4.5x in bright daylight, maybe not (not many coyotes in bright daylight out here, haha), but once light levels get low or on a clouded day the illumination will definitely help. If your game is stationary I do not think there will be an issue at all.
No.
As someone who competes, as well as LR hunts, I practice a lot, even going through multiple barrels on my hunting rigs, not just my match guns. In this regard, I am not your typical hunter who only shoots before the season box of ammo or whatever.
I have always discovered the issues at the range during practice. Dial-up, and then down and the results are no longer as they should be; or the groups suddenly open up, swap scopes and problem fixed, but moves to the swapped rifle. While over the years, I have also had issues on other scopes and some have been shooter induced; a fall or even too tight on the tube causing erector binding. But hands down the lighter Vortex fail at a rate I am not at all comfortable with. If I take the group of shooters I shoot matches with, I'd say many of them have had a similar issue.
I am not bashing Vortex as they have really helped change the scope market, but the PST, PSTII as a lighter scope do seem to have a failure rate in the group of high round count shooters (match shooters) I am part of. This makes me nervous to use on a high-use lightweight magnum hunting rifle as these tend to be subject to more abuse than the typical range gun. I didn't start out that way, but through personal experience feel that way today. I would love to know what Vortex did that makes this more robust than the PST line.
Jim
PS: Min power and the illumination of FFP. Most of us are at min power to increase or FOV, generally required for much shorter-range shots where drop and wind aren't in play and want the illumination to make the reticle appear and function like a fast acquisition reticle similar to a duplex. Once the animals are further out, where drop and wind are in play, the range allows one to use the zoom and easily see the hashes on the reticle.
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FYI - PST scopes are made in Philippines, the Strike Eagle and below lines are made in China. Vortex is trying to move all its manufacturing out of China is what I've heard through the grapevine.
My apologies Jim, I misunderstood. I have not yet had enough time with the scope to give an idea on if it falls outside my ability to shoot from dialing up/down, maybe ILya can comment here as I think he's shot with this scope more than I have. This year has really limited my range time with home renovation projects and now selling our home taking up most of my free time.
Maybe not apples to apples comparison but hows this scope stack up to the Nightforce SHV ????
@Glassaholic @Ilya R.
@Glassaholic @Ilya R.
Got my review up on the comparison of the Vortex LHT 4.5-22 to the Bushnell 4.5-18
www.snipershide.com
Rifle Scopes - Vortex Razor HD LHT FFP 4.5-22x50 Review and Comparison to Bushnell ET LRHSi 4.5-18x44
The 21.7 oz Vortex Razor HD LHT FFP 4.5-22x50 represents the best crossover design we’ve seen to date if saving weight is your primary goal. - Glassaholic from Snipers Hide on 08/08/2021 What is a Crossover Scope For years we have had a plethora of scopes to choose from that fit certain...
www.snipershide.com
I received mine today and got to mount it and look through it a bit before work. I'm not going to do a full review like others but my initial impression. I did not like the finish/esthetics at all. Not that it's really that important but it just looks like a sub $500 scope with the weird mix between matte/gloss finish. The glass seems pretty decent overall with a mild hint of CA.
I compared it to my 3.5-21 HDMR CR because it's the closest in specs/price range and my other scopes are 7-35 atacrs. Everything about the glass was better than the bushy on my first impression but what really impressed me was how large the image appears in the razor. Side by side my 450yd coyote target in my backyard "appeared" to be the same size in the image at 18x in the vortex compared to the bushy at 21x. The vortex at 22x appeared to be closer to 25x when compared to my bushy at 21x. The image in the Vortex at 22x just seemed much bigger(more than 1x bigger) with more clarity and less CA. This maybe be an optical illusion because I haven't fully setup the scope to me yet but it was impressive in that regard. I'll do some more comparing soon. If I could compare the glass to anything I've had it's overall very close to the k624i's I've had in the past.
I compared it to my 3.5-21 HDMR CR because it's the closest in specs/price range and my other scopes are 7-35 atacrs. Everything about the glass was better than the bushy on my first impression but what really impressed me was how large the image appears in the razor. Side by side my 450yd coyote target in my backyard "appeared" to be the same size in the image at 18x in the vortex compared to the bushy at 21x. The vortex at 22x appeared to be closer to 25x when compared to my bushy at 21x. The image in the Vortex at 22x just seemed much bigger(more than 1x bigger) with more clarity and less CA. This maybe be an optical illusion because I haven't fully setup the scope to me yet but it was impressive in that regard. I'll do some more comparing soon. If I could compare the glass to anything I've had it's overall very close to the k624i's I've had in the past.
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Does the diopter lock on this? That's the only thing I can't seem to find any info on. I'm torn between this and an nx8 4-32.
I Feel Ghey
I received my scopes today, and I agree with you on the finish choices. I have a SFP 3-15 LHT Razor and I was hoping that finish-wise they were going to, I don't know, harmonize? the look. My PST Gen II, Razor 4.5-27, Razor 1-10 Gen III, AMG, and Leupold Mark 5HD/VX-6HD all seem more "put together" from a sensory perspective (Mark 5 & AMG are sold, disliked the CCH & 7b reticles). In fact, any scope I've ever owned has looked better.
This LHT is not dead matte like a Mark 5, not matte like a Razor G2, but sort of spray paint semi-gloss-sparkly-matte? Like the Vortex designers were trying to court old guys that love glossy Leupolds AND the matte-finish guys simultaneously. As a glossy Leupold lover, it didn’t work. And for a matte finish, my gold standard is the Mark 5, which was so dead flat matte it practically teleported into sniper-space just resting in my hand (big Razor not far behind).
This is a quibble, I suppose, but the look is just odd enough that it stands out. I've literally never thought "this scope's finishes look…weird" even with cheap Primary Arms scopes. My name is not Dieter Rams, you know? I hate throw pillows. I don't obsess about how my guns look. There are no goddamn feather boas in my house.
I don't like the rubber nipple button thingy for changing illumination either, but hey, I tell myself it makes the scope lighter. I almost never use illumination unless I'm playing sniper and looking out the window. (pew pew pew squirrel, I got you! I know you all do it)
A Bigger Deal
The bigger-deal thing I was hoping was changing from the SFP LHT Razors is the almost zero effort required to pull up the turret to unlock it. Alas, this is not the case. I am confused as to why they'd make it so easy to pop it up? It might defeat the whole point of a locking turret if it pops up and spins at the drop of a hat. I sort of wrote it off on my SFP as it's on a gun I rarely use, but these FFP's are going on my most used rifles. I like the way the Razor 4.5-27 & AMG unlock…it takes some effort.
The only reason I can think of for this choice is Vortex thinks a hunter doesn't want to struggle at all, not even a little bit when popping the turret up to unlock it. Maybe they thought an AMG-effort unlocking turret would perhaps interrupt a hunter's focus and possibly make a slip of the hand/making noise a stronger possibility? Maybe they think hunters have baby hands? lololol (but wait, the AMG is a hunting scope too!)
Turret FEEL
They suck. Just like the SFP version. I don't really care. They aren't gonna win awards (esp. the windage one), ASMR folks won't get pin-prickly rock-hard…the turrets aren't about that. I'm a "zero once and hold for everything" sort of putz, ok? I like xmas trees, I shoot little vermin that move quickly and spastically, fore & aft, forward & backward, down hidden holes, I want them dead sooner rather than later, I don't live in "one-shot-one-kill" land (usually). So no dialing for me. I get it, I love hi-fi knobs of yore, but some of you actually kill people/large glorious animals and really fucking NEED better turrets, but not here, not now, not for me on this scope. If you
turrets, when out hunting with this scope just stash your TT in a drop-leg holster and edit: I’m probably being a little harsh on the elevation turret. I don’t care that it doesn’t feel great, but maybe some of you do, so here’s more detail. The elevation turret isn’t Mr. Solid, but the spaces between the clicks are nice and wide. In comparison, the PST II’s turrets are much more satisfying and clicky to turn, which in turn don't approach the Razor 4.5-27’s thunky turret feel. I don’t own anything higher end than that.
Reticle
I like it. I loved the 2c & especially the 2d reticles so this is a natural fit. In contrast, I loathed the AMG’s 7b with its dripping horizontal-stadia hashes.
Image Quality
I haven't mounted the scope, so no thoughts on this yet.
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I honestly like the nx8 better. And I can get the nx8 for only like, $200 more. But I'd have to wait 12 weeks and I've got a new 6.5cm that needs glass. I could order an instock nx8 but those run closer to 2100.
The field of view at the lower end just kills this scope for me. For hunting crossover scope it fails. Sorry, just my humble opinion.
I have somewhere in the ballpark of three thousand rounds with this scope. I have taken it back to the collimator to check tracking several times during the last six monts. No issues.
The rifle it is on has not been dropped onto the scope, but it spent some time hiking up and down hill and went in and out of rather tight rifle scabbard on Eberlestock X1A3 without zero shifts. The pack with the rifle in the scabbard ahs been dropped and bounced around on ATVs, similarly with no issues.
ILya
Off topic but somewhat related.
How do you find the X1 Euro scabbard, I have a X1e and find the scabbard a bit tight, as in my Tikka CTR with a Delta Stryker is a very very tight squeeze.
Admittedly the Stryker has quite tall turrets (which is the part that gets caught), whereas the LHT should be a little more streamlined, but the Fix Q is quite angular and not so streamlined.
It is too tight for the Fix with this scope, but it can be wedged in there and that is what I had for the hunt back in April. Works OK for a more conventionally stocked rifle with the same size scope (tried it with my 280Rem Tikka and similarly sized 3-15x50 HD-LHT).
Old Eberlestock Halftrack I have has a large scabbard, so that work a bit better.
Either way, I am going to give X1A3 to my nephew and I just ordered a Kifaru pack/frame. My next elk hunt is muzzleloader, so I want a different way to carry the rifle and a better load bearing frame that what I currently have.
ILya
You'll wonder why you ever used the old packs; especially those that use a scabbard when you can use something faster than a sling and 100% stable like a Kifaru gub bearer. Then everything sucks when you're loaded down with 100lbs packing meat, but it's the difference between sucking and just way worst than sucking. Plus the pack systems are lighter out of the box.
If someone really wanted to carry like a scabbard with a KIUI or Kifaru, it is possible using the load shelf.. but makes no practical sense.
Congratulations! You'll never regret the move~
edited to add: the PST vs the new Razor. I was one of those guys who actually had good luck with the 4-16s and 3-15 PSTs. I especially liked the 41' FOV on the 3-15. But eventually, my luck ran out. It's hard to say, with one scope in an antidotal way just how robust something is. I was hoping for something from the MFG that shared the differences that might make this a more robust unit than the PSTs.
BTW what are you shooting public and what State / Unit for your Elk tags? We've been super lucky in Wyoming, Idaho, and Colorado so far always getting freezer full. But the fires and weather are going to shift things in some of the units this year. Particular concerned about Co 3rd rifle in 11-211 as we're working a migration.
edit 2 lol: this Elk talk inspired me to pop a Elk tender on the Traeger!
I usually Sous vide game, and then a quick sear. This 4 min side on the Traeger was better and was so tender it felt like it was cooked in butter and pounded out. It just melted in your mouth with zero fat. All I had on the elk was salt, pepper, Paprika and a dabble of garlic- so basically dry.
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Yeah, it was a close call between Kifaru and Mystery Ranch. Kifaru was at CompExpo, so the guy there was able to fit me with the exact frame, belt, etc. Generally, nothing ever fits me right, so this was very welcome. I've carried some heavy loads over the years and nothing makes them comfortable. Once the Kifaru pack gets here, I'll load it up and start hiking with it up at the top of Sandia for practice.
My elk hunt is in New Mexico. Unit 17.
As far as scopes go, I have not had any problems with PST Gen2. Either way, Razor HD-LHT has nothing in common with the PST other than both being marketed by Vortex. Completely different designs, different factories, etc.
All of the HD-LHT scopes are made in the same factory. While the new FFP HD-LHT is clearly somewhat different, I would expect all the HD-LHT scopes to be broadly similar durability-wise. Both 3-15x scopes that have been out there for a bit now, to the best of my knowledge, are quite durable.
ILya
Shit that is a trophy unit! Non-res draw odds is like 2-3% I think, even though it is primitive only. My Family is from Sante Fe NM. Did you move to NM or hunting with an outfitter?
I live in New Mexico so it is a resident tag. It is a meat hunt for me. I am sorta new at this, so I will have a guide with me who knows the area. I went on an Aoudad hunt with him earlier this year, so I know he is a good guy and good company.
ILya
For some reason I thought you were from Southern California but in your post you said Up Sandia so I figured you might Have moved to Albuquerque
This is how easy the “locking” elevation turret unlocks. The rest of the scope is good, optics are clearly better than the PST Gen II 5-25.
Even a pinkie can do it.
Even a pinkie can do it.
Well that doesn't instill a whole of confidence. At least it still has a zero stop so can only spin one way?
So has the PST II
I bought this scope to try to solve the spinning when I don't want it to. You can tape it…there's a little shelf under the turret that gives the tape something to grab on to. The PST II turret's shape wasn't really amenable to taping. Silver lining/cloud etc. I called Vortex and the tech pulled one off the shelf and it too was real easy to pop. He told me to email, so I did.
Anyone else care to test their turrets? Maybe mine is a fluke, but my SFP LHT exhibits the same issue (slightly, and I mean slightly, more tension on that one).
Edit: if you're a close reader, you know I bought three of these puppies. The other two lie unmolested in their beds, awaiting a potential return.
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Wonder if up sizing the o-ring would give more tension or drag to keep it downSo has the PST II
I bought this scope to try to solve the spinning when I don't want it to. You can tape it…there's a little shelf under the turret that gives the tape something to grab on to. The PST II turret's shape wasn't really amenable to taping. Silver lining/cloud etc. I called Vortex and the tech pulled one off the shelf and it too was real easy to pop. He told me to email, so I did.
Anyone else care to test their turrets? Maybe mine is a fluke, but my SFP LHT exhibits the same issue (slightly, and I mean slightly, more tension on that one).
If memory serves (I'm lying in bed, too lazy to open the safe etc), the effort to spin the turret is less than the PST II series. The clicks are spaced out more, but I think it's a little easier to spin. Certainly not harder to spin, and the PST II spun on me.
Thanks that’s some good stuff. I owe you a beer!
I made up my mind and am staying with the Mk5 18x - even that scope would be better served with a wider FOV - it seems more trust worthy than the PSTs and this new with only 23’ FOV and funky turret lock and nothing to make me think it be more robust than a pst
FWIW, I've use the 3-15 a lot. Been in and out of a truck with it a lot. Going from slung on my back to off a lot. Never had an issue with the turret unlocking, let alone unlocking and spinning.
Yeah. Was trying to be funny. Whoosh. My bad.
How hard is it to unlock? Try my test.
I’m curious about other’s LHT (SFP, FFP) turrets.
Unfortunate thing about “never had an issue”, Is that it’s often just that, until you do.
When I first started hearing about people rolling their turrets (remember some of us were around before these exposed turrets were ever a thing on a hunting rifle, let alone even PRS matches) I also thought people made too much about the possibility. But when it happened to me on barricades and field matches costing points and ya, hunting too, I changed my tune.
When I first started hearing about people rolling their turrets (remember some of us were around before these exposed turrets were ever a thing on a hunting rifle, let alone even PRS matches) I also thought people made too much about the possibility. But when it happened to me on barricades and field matches costing points and ya, hunting too, I changed my tune.
I've had issues with other scopes, I know it's a real issue. Under the same conditions it happened with other scopes, it has not happened with this one. YMMV
With all of the HD-LHTs I have, the turret is very easy to lock and unlock, which I kinda like. With some locking turrets out there there is sufficient resistance that there is muzzle movement when I unlock the turret.
I have not yet had it unlock and spin on me by accident, but I do have a habit of checking if the turret is sitting against the zero stop whenever it comes out of the case/scabbard/etc. Quite a few scopes I use do not lock, so it has become almost reflex to check that. On scopes with exposed windage turrets I do tend to tape them up since there is no zerostop for a "no eyes" sheck.
In that regard, zerolock turrets that Mark5 has are indeed very nice, but there is a price to pay for that.
ILya
I have not yet had it unlock and spin on me by accident, but I do have a habit of checking if the turret is sitting against the zero stop whenever it comes out of the case/scabbard/etc. Quite a few scopes I use do not lock, so it has become almost reflex to check that. On scopes with exposed windage turrets I do tend to tape them up since there is no zerostop for a "no eyes" sheck.
In that regard, zerolock turrets that Mark5 has are indeed very nice, but there is a price to pay for that.
ILya
You know, I thought you were joking, but now, maybe not? I have some ranger bands around here…if I keep the scope(s) maybe that’s a better solution than tape.
I have had my turrets roll before, but that was dragging a rifle across pickup seats and once bouncing against my leg. Now I glance at my turrets every time I am getting into position, even with my ATACR's locking elevation that takes some intentional effort to move. There is always a chance of spinning with any exposed turret, regardless of the locking... just glance at it, especially if you just smoked a turret off a barricade.
Grip/gaffer tape > ranger bands
Just tested it. At least with the diameter of ranger bands that I have at my disposal…but the bigger problem with this hack is I can’t tell at a glance if the turret spun. With the gaffer tape, I don’t cover the “0” so I can tell at a glance.
Hell tape is not a bad hack, nor is a rubber balloon over your brake in freezing rain, snow, or a crazy downpour. But both are a one-time solution. But @carbonbased hit the nail on the head showing the issue and also identified that not all "fixes" are plenty free.
Someone mention they like that the unlock is easy because it doesn't disrupt the gun. For clarity, @carbonbased was pointing out; turret locks are a travel thing, they should be difficult enough to disengage in a way that miles of hiking, rubbing against your arm, pack, side, back, on and off the pack, and repeated impact with the brush (this alone is another story) doesn’t move the turret.
The fact that you can be on glass and unlocking the turret doesn’t disturb the site picture, is not necessarily a good thing; usually the complete wrong use. It’s like math and the order of operations. Unlike the range, you’re not on glass and making elevation changes back and forth or locking and unlock your turret repeatedly. Unlock it once, be done; leave it unlocked for steel or multiple targets.
Someone mention they like that the unlock is easy because it doesn't disrupt the gun. For clarity, @carbonbased was pointing out; turret locks are a travel thing, they should be difficult enough to disengage in a way that miles of hiking, rubbing against your arm, pack, side, back, on and off the pack, and repeated impact with the brush (this alone is another story) doesn’t move the turret.
The fact that you can be on glass and unlocking the turret doesn’t disturb the site picture, is not necessarily a good thing; usually the complete wrong use. It’s like math and the order of operations. Unlike the range, you’re not on glass and making elevation changes back and forth or locking and unlock your turret repeatedly. Unlock it once, be done; leave it unlocked for steel or multiple targets.
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Exactly. Vortex, please listen to this.
But, the devil whispers in my ear…"You have that light gun with a heavy scope, carbon. You really want a lighter FFP scope, and that LHT has perfect tits, errrr…perfect zoom range. Keep it…keeeeeep it."
So, I might keep one LHT FFP even if Vortex says there's no way to adjust the turret lock tighter and resign myself to tape that bastard up. But I shoot low stakes and relatively low effort varmints.
For someone like you, @Diver160651, there's no frigging way I'd buy this scope as is. The distance you travel just to start hunting combined with the hoofing through thick brush, finding the animal after days and days, and then hoofing back out makes it not worth saving 6-7oz if it means the damn turret spins and you wound an animal, lose them, and go home empty-handed. Not to mention the expense of a big western hunt!
About wounding…you'll think about that poor animal dying a slow agonizing death for the rest of your life, usually right before you drift off to never-never land.
I'm hearing some "It's a training thing" chords wafting through this discussion, and those chords have a ring of truth about them. One can train around defects. But why buy a defect if you don't have to? Imagine the following…
You've finally won the "unit lottery" after years of applying. Now, after months of planning, training your ass off, multiple thousands of dollars in plane flights, backpacks, truck rentals, binoculars, scopes, tents, and everything else, you find yourself deep in the mountains tracking that trophy bighorn sheep you've always wanted. You don't have much time off of work as is; this has gotta count!
Days pass, filled with fruitless scouting. Your head aches; if you never see a spotting scope again, you'll die a happy man. But there's only one day left to hunt and neither of you has even fired a shot yet! Where are these damn sheep?
You're both frustrated and bone tired. Camp food isn't great, but you're starving. A starving, sweating, stinky, angry, filthy grown man.
And you have to take a shit.
Night is falling, you both decide to best get back to camp. Don't want to meet up with a grizzly in the dark.
Then you spot him. A huge bighorn!
Perfect position and distance. Your heart races; you suddenly remember you're the shooter! Your buddy crouches and ranges the sheep and whispers the yardage to you, excitement making his voice raspy. You drop your pack, and with all of the patience you can muster, quietly hustle the rifle out and try to get into a comfortable position, but a rock digs knifes your ribs. This spot will have to do, it sucks, but the light is almost gone. Your brain screams Don’t forget to chamber a round! You try to ignore the rock as sweat drips into your shooting eye and what the fuck is the dope again?
This is the sort of situation that someone like Diver might find himself in, and if you can remove one extra (stupid) thing off the checklist, the chances of bagging that sheep increase significantly.
You guys dig?
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It sounds like you want to buy a scope with a capped elevation turret to be honest. I train because what happens when your locked down turret STILL moved and you didn't catch it because you assumed it was solid? Been there, done that. Thank god it was at a stupid gopher and not a trophy bighorn. If you have buck fever to the point of consciously needing to think about chambering a round, you should be training more anyways.
And for the record: If a turret as a lock on it, I want it to require some effort. I think the LHT's lock looks too light. I just don't think you should be relying on that lock regardless of what optic.
Just got mine in.
I've never had the turret on my LRHS spin on me and I've carried that plenty while hunting. For me the light unlock of the Vortex is a non-issue.
Turret feel is a little disappointing for something that says Razor on it and especially with only 6 mils per turn. It should be a lot more tactile.
Have not had a chance to really look through glass but I did spend some time with the reticle at various powers. I like the general thickness of the reticle, however they should have made a bigger center dot. Even at 12X I can't really make it out. IMO they need to get rid of the .2 hashes closest to the center dot. Makes the center too cluttered and difficult to use, especially at lower power. This is my biggest gripe and potentially a dealbreaker for me. I'll mount it and use it before I decide whether or not to replace my 3-12 LRHS with it.
I've never had the turret on my LRHS spin on me and I've carried that plenty while hunting. For me the light unlock of the Vortex is a non-issue.
Turret feel is a little disappointing for something that says Razor on it and especially with only 6 mils per turn. It should be a lot more tactile.
Have not had a chance to really look through glass but I did spend some time with the reticle at various powers. I like the general thickness of the reticle, however they should have made a bigger center dot. Even at 12X I can't really make it out. IMO they need to get rid of the .2 hashes closest to the center dot. Makes the center too cluttered and difficult to use, especially at lower power. This is my biggest gripe and potentially a dealbreaker for me. I'll mount it and use it before I decide whether or not to replace my 3-12 LRHS with it.
