Vudoo Gun Works V-22 Rimfire Bolt Action

[RAVAGE88]

Mike,
How often do the firing pin springs go? What about extractors? Im sitting on my Vudoo from Dec 2021 and all this talk is making me wonder if I should be sourcing these parts for the future.

Yo Dude, not terribly often. I’ve been shooting my oldest one (40X, same spring material) for 15 years without any issues. The extractors are harder than the brass rim, so they wear incredibly slowly. Not too much to worry about.

MB

 

[pballkm21]

Yo Dude, not terribly often. I’ve been shooting my oldest one (40X, same spring material) for 15 years without any issues. The extractors are harder than the brass rim, so they wear incredibly slowly. Not too much to worry about.

MB

Quite frankly that's what I was thinking - just had to ask with all the "noise" currently. Appreciate the response!

 

[J_Reacher]

I am interested in a V-22 right hand action wrench gen3 if selling.

 

[F4 plt]

Since I have both the single shot and the magizine fed rifles I probably should look into spare parts and special tools to keep them running . Thanks again Mike for sharing with us
My single shot is left bolt right e xtraction/ loading port. The magizine fed is left bolt left extraction / loading port

 

[RAVAGE88]

I am interested in a V-22 right hand action wrench gen3 if selling.

Yo Dude, I'm actually not selling parts, but instead, offering them up in exchange for an address so I can ship them. I'm going through a long list of PMs today to see what I have for those that have reached out, and if I have it, I'll circle back via PM and get your address.

MB

 

[J_Reacher]

Yo Dude, I'm actually not selling parts, but instead, offering them up in exchange for an address so I can ship them. I'm going through a long list of PMs today to see what I have for those that have reached out, and if I have it, I'll circle back via PM and get your address.

MB

I didn’t want to be impertinent and assume and I appreciate your generosity.

Best regards.

 

[RAVAGE88]

I'm shipping out two small boxes today, but this empties the parts bins. I'm out of Gen 1 parts and all I have left is some prototype Gen 1.2 and Gen 2 stuff that were test parts....nothing I'd want to put in long-term service. I don't have any extra action wrenches.

MB

 

[David Lott]

Ok, but think about this for a moment. A marking variance was done with a vendor that makes actions, not with Vudoo, whom has never made actions. So how, again, was Vudoo not a middleman for the action maker? And when is it ever wise to create your own competition, especially since margin for Vudoo had to be so incredibly small (or none at all)?

So, did Paul/Vudoo make the arrangement because it was best for Vudoo or best for the action maker? It's the true definition of dilution, especially noting the apples to apples comparison on their websites. The MPA is cheaper than the Vudoo.

MB

So essentially VGW is a drop shipper. Lol

Not exactly, no one sells a complete 360 other than Vudoo because no one makes a complete ready to go action.



Mike, My comments were regarding the statement about Vudoo being the middle man or drop shipper, Vudoo produced(made available) complete, ready-to-go actions for the market, no one else did at the time including MPA or myself.

 

[Kadams1563]

I think it’s just crazy that how much is all of a sudden is coming to light…

Pretty sure we are all surprised that they were not making any parts. They were building rifles.

So just like pretty much all other custom gun builders.

Someone will start building them again in short order I am sure.

The manufacture of the action isn’t gonna just not make them when they sell like they do.

 

[ohiofarmer]

Someone will start building them again in short order I am sure.

The manufacture of the action isn’t gonna just not make them when they sell like they do.

If the manufacturer doesn’t own the IP they won’t be making them. At least, not “as is” without some changes. Then again, that might be my optimism and faith in folks showing… they may keep making them and decide it’s cheaper to litigate. Though for the size of the market, I can’t see that being a good business decision given what legal fees can run!

In a second reading, perhaps you meant Vudoo would keep manufacturing them- regardless of who machines them. If so, I would agree.

 

[RAVAGE88]

Not exactly, no one sells a complete 360 other than Vudoo because no one makes a complete ready to go action.



Mike, My comments were regarding the statement about Vudoo being the middle man or drop shipper, Vudoo produced(made available) complete, ready-to-go actions for the market, no one else did at the time including MPA or myself.

Ok, I hear you, but let's try it this way.

• Vudoo doesn't make any of the parts, in-house, that they use to ASSEMBLE a complete, ready-to-go, action
• Instead, Vudoo pays some number of vendors to make the parts listed on the Bill of Materials (BOM) that make up the total assembly that we're referring to as an action
• The total of the parts listed on the BOM are referred to as the Cost of Goods Sold (COGS), which does not include burdened and non-burdened costs (labor, power, tooling, general overhead, etc.) So, let's say the COGS is $1000 and the retail price of the completed assembly is $1400
• What might one think the likelihood is that the burdened and non-burdened costs eat significantly into the $400 margin at the retail price?
• Now, let's assume that an action assembly is sold to a company that's going to create a product using this assembly; would they pay retail price? No. So let's assume, for conversation sake, dealer price is minus 20%, that leaves a $120 margin, which I'm quite certain is going to be eaten away by burdened and non-burdened costs
• So, is it fair to assume there could be sales at a loss? Well, based on the tax returns I have copies of, absolutely

So based on the above, how could they have been anything other than a pass-through/borderline drop shipper? Of course I'm not using exact numbers nor am I presenting the exact pricing structure because there's things I'm leaving out on purpose, but the fundamentals speak volumes.

Hope this helps....

MB

 

[ma smith]

Ok, I hear you, but let's try it this way.

• Vudoo doesn't make any of the parts, in-house, that they use to ASSEMBLE a complete, ready-to-go, action
• Instead, Vudoo pays some number of vendors to make the parts listed on the Bill of Materials (BOM) that make up the total assembly that we're referring to as an action
• The total of the parts listed on the BOM are referred to as the Cost of Goods Sold (COGS), which does not include burdened and non-burdened costs (labor, power, tooling, general overhead, etc.) So, let's say the COGS is $1000 and the retail price of the completed assembly is $1400
• What might one think the likelihood is that the burdened and non-burdened costs eat significantly into the $400 margin at the retail price?
• Now, let's assume that an action assembly is sold to a company that's going to create a product using this assembly; would they pay retail price? No. So let's assume, for conversation sake, dealer price is minus 20%, that leaves a $120 margin, which I'm quite certain is going to be eaten away by burdened and non-burdened costs
• So, is it fair to assume there could be sales at a loss? Well, based on the tax returns I have copies of, absolutely

So based on the above, how could they have been anything other than a pass-through/borderline drop shipper? If the numbers made sense from the very beginning, no one would be reading about the doors closing. Math can be a real downer....

Hope this helps....

MB

This is going to be a HBS case study...this is actually incredibly good insight into small-business and start-ups.

 

[D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷]

Ok, I hear you, but let's try it this way.

• Vudoo doesn't make any of the parts, in-house, that they use to ASSEMBLE a complete, ready-to-go, action
• Instead, Vudoo pays some number of vendors to make the parts listed on the Bill of Materials (BOM) that make up the total assembly that we're referring to as an action
• The total of the parts listed on the BOM are referred to as the Cost of Goods Sold (COGS), which does not include burdened and non-burdened costs (labor, power, tooling, general overhead, etc.) So, let's say the COGS is $1000 and the retail price of the completed assembly is $1400
• What might one think the likelihood is that the burdened and non-burdened costs eat significantly into the $400 margin at the retail price?
• Now, let's assume that an action assembly is sold to a company that's going to create a product using this assembly; would they pay retail price? No. So let's assume, for conversation sake, dealer price is minus 20%, that leaves a $120 margin, which I'm quite certain is going to be eaten away by burdened and non-burdened costs
• So, is it fair to assume there could be sales at a loss? Well, based on the tax returns I have copies of, absolutely

So based on the above, how could they have been anything other than a pass-through/borderline drop shipper? Of course I'm not using exact numbers nor am I presenting the exact pricing structure because there's things I'm leaving out on purpose, but the fundamentals speak volumes.

Hope this helps....

MB

Better have VOLUME w those number per unit. But I don’t think it works that way w a precision product.

 

[RAVAGE88]

Better have VOLUME....But I don’t think it works that way w a precision product. (NOTE: I edited your post via quote to further your point)

Exactly, volume can be an illusion due to the fact that revenue costs money. If one can't recover costs at lower volumes, it'll be worse at greater volume as the cash can't be turned over quickly enough. There are exceptions to this, but typically, the exceptions are industry specific; MIM/injection molding, most things quoted per piece, etc. More complex assemblies that are heavily sourced by supply chain are not prime volume targets. Especially with rising costs due to raw material increases, obsolescense that requires sustaining engineering that pushes a revision, WIP, finished goods inventory, and so on.

MB

 

[Mechdesigner]

Ok, I hear you, but let's try it this way.

• Vudoo doesn't make any of the parts, in-house, that they use to ASSEMBLE a complete, ready-to-go, action
• Instead, Vudoo pays some number of vendors to make the parts listed on the Bill of Materials (BOM) that make up the total assembly that we're referring to as an action
• The total of the parts listed on the BOM are referred to as the Cost of Goods Sold (COGS), which does not include burdened and non-burdened costs (labor, power, tooling, general overhead, etc.) So, let's say the COGS is $1000 and the retail price of the completed assembly is $1400
• What might one think the likelihood is that the burdened and non-burdened costs eat significantly into the $400 margin at the retail price?
• Now, let's assume that an action assembly is sold to a company that's going to create a product using this assembly; would they pay retail price? No. So let's assume, for conversation sake, dealer price is minus 20%, that leaves a $120 margin, which I'm quite certain is going to be eaten away by burdened and non-burdened costs
• So, is it fair to assume there could be sales at a loss? Well, based on the tax returns I have copies of, absolutely

So based on the above, how could they have been anything other than a pass-through/borderline drop shipper? Of course I'm not using exact numbers nor am I presenting the exact pricing structure because there's things I'm leaving out on purpose, but the fundamentals speak volumes.

Hope this helps....

MB

This 100%, I am sourcing action components and assembling them currently, the COGS plus my very minimal overhead burden leaves very little room for suppling actions to dealers (I am still in my garage and have no payroll employees). No way VGW was operating in a sustainable manner. I suspected VGW had underlying solvency issues after our proposed redesign of their billet magazine went belly up (I later found out this occurred in parallel to the sale of VGW) The lack of initiative they put forward to meet the needs of the community is what initially lead me to design my magazine. It has been a pleasure to read through your insightful comments and I have learned a lot from this thread. You created an entire genre of rifles that will truly cement your legacy in the industry

 

[Tokay444]

This 100%, I am sourcing action components and assembling them currently, the COGS plus my very minimal overhead burden leaves very little room for suppling actions to dealers (I am still in my garage and have no payroll employees). No way VGW was operating in a sustainable manner. I suspected VGW had underlying solvency issues after our proposed redesign of their billet magazine went belly up (I later found out this occurred in parallel to the sale of VGW) The lack of initiative they put forward to meet the needs of the community is what initially lead me to design my magazine. It has been a pleasure to read through your insightful comments and I have learned a lot from this thread. You created an entire genre of rifles that will truly cement your legacy on the industry!

For a measly $2mil consulting fee, you can be the next Vudoo Gunworks.

 

[Mechdesigner]

For a measly $2mil consulting fee, you can be the next Vudoo Gunworks.

We are not currently looking for any defacto investors, thanks for the offer though! All jokes aside we have a profound respect for what VGW has accomplished. We just need to sit back and see how this story unfolds. As a very small player in this industry, I am just trying to listen more and talk less!

 

[Tokay444]

We are not currently looking for any defacto investors, thanks for the offer though! All jokes aside we have a profound respect for what VGW has accomplished. We just need to sit back and see how this story unfolds. As a very small player in this industry, I am just trying to listen more and talk less!

It wasn’t an offer. Just a statement.

 

[JaoeyP]

Someone asked if anyone was at the NRA Show this weekend to see if Vudoo was there. Here is their booth.

 

[TahoeDust]

Someone asked if anyone was at the NRA Show this weekend to see if Vudoo was there. Here is their booth.
View attachment 8675091

Ooooof

 

[deltawiskey]

Someone asked if anyone was at the NRA Show this weekend to see if Vudoo was there. Here is their booth.
View attachment 8675091

They are obviously all so busy moving they couldn't make the show

 

[Aeolus0130]

Someone asked if anyone was at the NRA Show this weekend to see if Vudoo was there. Here is their booth.
View attachment 8675091

That doesn’t bode well for the company at all. There is some cost involved with these booths when you reserve them. I guess the new CEO couldn’t be bothered to fly a few guys out there to staff the booth because he let everyone go…

 

[shoot4fun]

That doesn’t bode well for the company at all. There is some cost involved with these booths when you reserve them. I guess the new CEO couldn’t be bothered to fly a few guys out there to staff the booth because he let everyone go…

The booth rental is small change compared to travel expense, shipping for product samples and booth (and return of all that at end of the show) and the cost of paying the crews at the venue to move crates around with the forklift. I was floored the first time the venue people charged $250 to come plug in an extension cord at one particular show venue!
The company I worked for sent well above ONE MILLION $$ for the SHOT Show every year and almost as much to be at NRA, SCI, NBS and Sport Inc. (each)

 

[Redfisher60]

Their website is down, why would it be down if they were reopening in a few weeks? Hope I don't need any parts for my Gen 1 and Gen 2, I love shooting them.

 

[drglock]

I feel for the ones that put deposits down or completely paid for a build that they’ll never see. Shit like that makes me sick to my stomach

 

[CroweMan]

Their website is down, why would it be down if they were reopening in a few weeks? Hope I don't need any parts for my Gen 1 and Gen 2, I love shooting them.

Works fine for me?

 

[Redfisher60]

Works fine for me?

Interesting, I installed Malwarebytes software last week, and just noticed it was blocking the website due to phishing.