The other three cops with Chauvin got charged. Great. What about all the assholes that recorded this murder on their phones and did nothing to stop it? I would not have interfered with the police until it was obvious that he was going to die, and you can clearly see that moment that something needs to happen to turn it around. I would have at least tried to knock Chauvin off of him even though I know I would get jacked up. The assholes recording knew what was happening because they even say it, yet they just stood there videoing. Disgusting. They should be charged with the same thing as the other cops. I hope none of us have to depend on this gutless scum to save our lives. If we do, we are screwed, but at least it would be captured on video and posted for everyone to comment on and for more likes.
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What About the People That Recorded the Murder?
- Thread starter DustBun
- Start date
Have you ever tried to stop 4 cops before? Can you name a moment in your life where you stood against 4 armed men? People always say they would have done something and most of the time they do the least.
They'd either be dead or charged with some kind of felony against an officer if any bystander stepped in. Unless there was a mass swarm on all the officers and all video of the incident destroyed there's nothing they could do.
I have asked myself this question. What would I have done standing there
I would like to think that I would have intervened.
inwould like to think when the one officer checked for a pulse and reported he couldn’t find one that I would have knocked the officer off him and started rendering aid. But that’s me now sitting in a chair 2k miles away and a week later.
the part that’s hard to balance is had a citizen knocked the cop off Floyd, and Floyd lived. It would be nearly impossible to make the argument had I not assaulted the officer he would have died.
and had the person filming been a minority odds are sentencing would have been harsh.
the difference between the cops standing by and the public filming isFloyd was in their care and control and they had a legal duty to protect him and supposedly the training to do it.
the onlookers were pleading for them to get off him their only option would have been to commit a crime to possibly save a life. Again I would like to think I would have. But who knows if I would have
I would like to think that I would have intervened.
inwould like to think when the one officer checked for a pulse and reported he couldn’t find one that I would have knocked the officer off him and started rendering aid. But that’s me now sitting in a chair 2k miles away and a week later.
the part that’s hard to balance is had a citizen knocked the cop off Floyd, and Floyd lived. It would be nearly impossible to make the argument had I not assaulted the officer he would have died.
and had the person filming been a minority odds are sentencing would have been harsh.
the difference between the cops standing by and the public filming isFloyd was in their care and control and they had a legal duty to protect him and supposedly the training to do it.
the onlookers were pleading for them to get off him their only option would have been to commit a crime to possibly save a life. Again I would like to think I would have. But who knows if I would have
The problem is that you are operating now with the knowledge of the shit show that occurs after the fact. If those 3 officers had any idea of what was to come because they didn’t step in I think it’s pretty safe to say they would have beaten the other officer themselves.
It shouldn't matter if they could have anticipated the shitstorm that came or not.
The facts, as I have seen them, are these:
- A man, suspected of committing a crime, was detained and arrested by the police
- At a point in time when he was on the ground, in cuffs, and wasn't resisting or fighting, a police officer kept his knee on the suspect's neck
- The suspect in custody complained of having difficulty breathing several times
- The suspect died in custody while still in cuffs on the ground
Personally, I would like to think that by 2. above someone in a uniform should have told Chauvin to lay off Floyd and to cool the fuck off. By 3. above, Chauvin should have been physically removed and some form of aid provided to the suspect.
People in police custody are entitled to some basic level of dignity and compassion commensurate with their behavior.
The days of cops yelling "stop resisting" while beating the fuck out of someone who isn't fighting back need to be over yesterday. Even the most pro-police people are starting to wonder if the next traffic stop will bring with it a beating.
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Okay, at this point it is no longer about the poor unfortunate fentynal and meth laced Mr. Floyd. At this point I could not care less about what happened to him. You want to win the hearts and minds and once again these morons have failed, made it worse, and even more have gotten themselves murdered, assaulted, and battered at their own hands. These people are the worse most unorganized self-destructing insurgency and they keep making the same mistake. Fucking idiots.
Havent heard any cops condone or make excuses for what is shown in the video.
Cuffing technique will put a knee over and below the shoulder to isolate the arm in prep for cuffing but once cuffed the party is controlled and their safety/health is the responsibility of the officer.
The video doesnt show that.
I’m honestly more disturbed the other officers didn’t step in than I am of the officer with his knee on him.
Anyone who has any significant amount of time in LE has seen someone or themselves gotten carried away. And not just bad cops. Happens to the good ones too.
It only takes a tap on the shoulder and a “take a breather man, we got this.” Happens all the time. You watch out for your partners (I’m not talking about the cover up wrongdoing type of watching out).
Anyone who has any significant amount of time in LE has seen someone or themselves gotten carried away. And not just bad cops. Happens to the good ones too.
It only takes a tap on the shoulder and a “take a breather man, we got this.” Happens all the time. You watch out for your partners (I’m not talking about the cover up wrongdoing type of watching out).
I read this last night on a different news site:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/10-naacp-demands-for-all-police-departments/ar-BB151G3K
I especially was drawn to #6, because I wonder if a black officer shoots a white person if that's going to need to have extra scrutiny. If not, the very demand of #6 is itself racist.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/10-naacp-demands-for-all-police-departments/ar-BB151G3K
I especially was drawn to #6, because I wonder if a black officer shoots a white person if that's going to need to have extra scrutiny. If not, the very demand of #6 is itself racist.
Most of that list is a product of zero knowledge of LE procedure.
In the LE world there is never a “shoot to injure” scenario.
The naacp already pushed for cameras. In 99% of the scenarios it showed LE was doing their job properly. Then the naacp got mad because it “violated citizens privacy.” As in, they wanted the cop to be the only one on camera as they got their ass handed to them when the videos showed no wrong doing.
Agreed you didnt say it or insinuate that is your belief.
Whats really at work here is a similar tactic applied over and over that reverses the correct and traditional American concept of innocent until proven guilty.
Everyone of "the other" is being blasted with the message of guilt and expected to atone for that which they are not guilty of.
Soviets were expert at making their enemies confess to crimes they had not committed and than their executions had an air of legitimacy.
This is so fucked up people are not seeing it and the horror of it was within the lifetime of many.....
of course these polarity reverses of American protections dont apply to communists do they as evidenced by the treatment of Kavanaugh compared to Biden.
No disagreement here. I read that, and since this was announced "close to me" I was appalled by the complete lack of understanding of any type of procedure. But, never discount the narrative the press will put on this.
It would be interesting to know the various factors like time in the field and personal dynamics of those involved.
Chauvin apparently has been involved in things, unverified at this time, that paint him as "aggressive".
What if the other three are in comparison "rookies"?
Doesnt excuse their inaction, makes you want to investigate the leadership of the dept and what deficiencies there are in their training that prevented them from performing to "reasonable expectations".
What if Chauvin is that cancer that intimidates even his co-workers?
Are they going to have a "hostile work environment" defense?
The three charged represent a variety of racial characteristics.
If we are to accept the current premise of the riots its not about character - skin color should direct you to act in deference to your race. Why didnt their "race" instinctively force them to get involved?
Footage that shows the officer doing the job correctly gets 0 attention. The 1% of the time there is a fuck-up gets blown out of proportion. If you're a cop and think you might have fucked up best bet is to have that camera "destroyed in the struggle" and take the Dem approach of DENY DENY DENY.
As bad as the media is making "Knee to neck" sound, it is not "banned" or "illegal" - it's just really effective at keeping a guy down. Yeah, it hurts and isn't comfortable. That's the point. Alot of people out there condemning it now after the fact.
We all know how deadly COVID is. Floyd had it, that was the real cause.
kstp.com
As bad as the media is making "Knee to neck" sound, it is not "banned" or "illegal" - it's just really effective at keeping a guy down. Yeah, it hurts and isn't comfortable. That's the point. Alot of people out there condemning it now after the fact.
We all know how deadly COVID is. Floyd had it, that was the real cause.
Autopsy report: George Floyd died from cardiopulmonary arrest, was positive for COVID-19
A postmortem nasal swab was taken which confirmed that Floyd was positive for SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. The postmortem positivity likely reflects asymptomatic but persistent PCR positivity from previous infection, the report said ...
kstp.com
Bodycam footage that shows the officer doing the job correctly gets 0 attention. The 1% of the time there is a fuck-up gets blown out of proportion. If you're a cop and think you might have fucked up best bet is to have that camera "destroyed in the struggle" and take the Dem approach of DENY DENY DENY.
As bad as the media is making "Knee to neck" sound, it is not "banned" or "illegal" - it's just really effective at keeping a guy down.
We all know how deadly COVID is. Floyd had it, that was the real cause.
Autopsy report: George Floyd died from cardiopulmonary arrest, was positive for COVID-19
A postmortem nasal swab was taken which confirmed that Floyd was positive for SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. The postmortem positivity likely reflects asymptomatic but persistent PCR positivity from previous infection, the report said ...
I read your link about Floyd's autopsy and your conclusion is not supported by what I read.
As for the pressing the knee against someone's neck, no one here has claimed that it's banned or illegal. Only that the need for it seems to have passed by the time the video was filmed.
This was a black officer having a physical confrontation with a black contact.....
As reported the clip only showed the woman striking the Sgt twice before she was hit by lightning.
This is the whole video.....
Much different perspective of the nature of this event and the restraint shown by the PO. I think if she had showed up in her vehicle at any other "check point" she may have not been able to recover so easily.
I agree that for that many officers to stand there......something larger is a problem. Be it training or cultural.
They didn’t even attempt to take the “fuck this“ and leave the scene as to not be associated. They just stood there.
That is very disturbing.
1 and 2 are being adopted by Somerville MA.
As well they have declared Police Violence a health emergency.
Senator Ed Markey is prepping a bill to remove officer protections from "civil liability".
Markeys bill will be the end of law enforcement as any interaction would result in a civil case the officer must personally defend against.
Give a speeding ticket get civilly served for unlawful arrest in stopping them to discuss speeding. Frivolous or not who could afford it?
I agree with the NAACP that society must abide by an enumerated contract.
How about 330 million of us raising our right hands and swearing an oath to the Constitution?
Abide by that and all is well.
It is fairly clear in the autopsy report that he was not healthy by any standards, with heart issues and fetanyl and meth in his system (clearly someone living life to the fullest). Possible altered state of mind would fully support he was resisting or had resisted or posed a threat at least at one point.
COVID is the reason for all deaths right now. Or was that last week?
It would seem the knee to neck had passed by what is shown in the video. Does the video show the entire interaction with Floyd? Had he been detained previously and escaped or posed resistance when the officer let up before, and the cop didn't want to offer that opportunity to him before? Did the cop run him and see the 5 year prison term he served for armed robbery?
Footage that shows the officer doing the job correctly gets 0 attention. The 1% of the time there is a fuck-up gets blown out of proportion. If you're a cop and think you might have fucked up best bet is to have that camera "destroyed in the struggle" and take the Dem approach of DENY DENY DENY.
As bad as the media is making "Knee to neck" sound, it is not "banned" or "illegal" - it's just really effective at keeping a guy down. Yeah, it hurts and isn't comfortable. That's the point. Alot of people out there condemning it now after the fact.
We all know how deadly COVID is. Floyd had it, that was the real cause.
Autopsy report: George Floyd died from cardiopulmonary arrest, was positive for COVID-19
A postmortem nasal swab was taken which confirmed that Floyd was positive for SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. The postmortem positivity likely reflects asymptomatic but persistent PCR positivity from previous infection, the report said ...
There are no “illegal” techniques or moves. There are some that may be against a department or agency policy, but doesn’t make them illegal.
What there *is* are circumstances that determine if an action is legal.
You have different levels of resistance which in turn legally allow different uses of force:
Compliant: no force
Actively resistant: hands on with some techniques. OC spray, taser are allowed (as long as it wouldn’t reasonably harm them like standing on the edge of a bridge to fall off when tased).
Assaultive: can strike them or use baton
Deadly force: all’s fair no rules do what you have to
Any of these levels you can obviously use tactics from the lower tiers as well. And this isn’t an all inclusive list. Situationally and circumstantially dependent.
Generally speaking, many techniques or strikes to the neck/throat can be considered deadly force. You typically don’t put your weight on someone’s throat And not expect the possibility of great harm.
And let’s say you can articulate the need to use the techniques.......there’s zero way you can articulate why you needed to remain on his neck for 6min. Especially with plenty of help there.
So, yes, the techniques itself may not be illegal, but the way he used the technique will almost assuredly be considered illegal.
Again, none of that last paragraph matters. 6min with him subdued.
He could have just murdered 200 people. Can’t do that.
Well, if they didn’t have trouble hiring people, they will now.
Qualified immunity is a huge deal.
There are other ways to restrain someone who continues to fight
That's the last thing I will say to you, who appears to want to find a justification for something I find unjustifiable.
How about 330 million of us raising our right hands and swearing an oath to the Constitution? AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So here's a question. Do people (the average Joe and Jane Citizen), not realize that what Markey is proposing will absolutely destroy LE in this country? That crime and anarchy like we are seeing right now will continue to escalate? That the Republic will fail at that point? Or do they believe everything Fake News, Twatter, F'Book, Yahoo, etc put in front of them as "News" - Orange Man bad. Have We the People forgotten how to think and reason? Do cause and effect analysis on events? God help us!!!
The other thing is at least 95% of these communists are < 35 years old, with the occasional handler showing up in their 40s....shows also how the brainwashing started en mass with children born in the 80s-90s. About the time the klinton education system got to rolling.
There is always "that guy".
They dont understand tactics and they are the hammer that only knows his job is to sink nails.
They would view the officers intervention as "weakness" and coddling of someone that doesnt deserve "kindness".
Its not "kindness" its "subtle tactics" to create a stronger case so that you can lawfully increase the pain to the fullest lawful extent upon the creature in custody.
"Hey sir, lets get through this booking and we will get you out of here.....would you like some water?"...... is more conducive to getting good voluntary statements than when "that guy", with no business doing so, walks by and says "You piece of shit! You're lucky I didnt get you!" and starts a shouting match whereby the first guy has to say to "that guy" - "Get the fuck out of here before I give you what you are threatening him with"
.....and sometimes there are not.
Eventually what you are trying to do gets done but everyone is at risk until you get there.
The only one creating the problem assuming the officers are reasonable is the one not complying.
Even if the non complier feels unjust custody, if it is a time of functional justice systems, comply for the time being and address the abuses against you in court.
Yep. Had the video shown them fighting for 6min and the officer was alone with his knee on his neck because he was exhausted and without backup, I’d be behind him 100%.
We're still in agreement. My statement has a very limited context: George Floyd and the minutes right before his death.
Edit add to my last.....
One dynamic that the typical reasonable person is unequipped for understanding in police encounters is that every confrontation has a firearm involved.
South Weymouth MA a year or so ago police officer responds to call of a tresspasser.
Officer comes upon an emotionally disturbed person.
Man is unarmed officer is going to de-escalate and do some community policing.
Armed man goes Tom Brady and throws rock incapacitating if not immediately killing officer.
Crazy man gets officers firearm and certainly kills him than kills elderly woman that came to window of her house to see what the ruckus was.
In the "resisting" contact the officer does not generally have the option to "tap out". Only half their attention is on what their force may or may not be doing to the other party. The other half of their mind is on their belt and what is going on in and around that gear.
The other party may have no intention or knowledge that a firearm is involved but the cop does.
One dynamic that the typical reasonable person is unequipped for understanding in police encounters is that every confrontation has a firearm involved.
South Weymouth MA a year or so ago police officer responds to call of a tresspasser.
Officer comes upon an emotionally disturbed person.
Man is unarmed officer is going to de-escalate and do some community policing.
Armed man goes Tom Brady and throws rock incapacitating if not immediately killing officer.
Crazy man gets officers firearm and certainly kills him than kills elderly woman that came to window of her house to see what the ruckus was.
In the "resisting" contact the officer does not generally have the option to "tap out". Only half their attention is on what their force may or may not be doing to the other party. The other half of their mind is on their belt and what is going on in and around that gear.
The other party may have no intention or knowledge that a firearm is involved but the cop does.
Facts interest no one.
Sound bites start unstoppable movements.
Everyone in New York loved the governors no bail money required policy until it became policy.
Lincoln had it right. The best way to end an unjust law is to enforce it to the hilt and let people experience its consequences.
Please explain how you would restrain a 6'6" 250lb male on drugs with your 5'9" maybe 180lbs of flab by the looks of the gap in Chauvin's uniform sleeves in a way that is comfortable for them.
Appreciate the input from someone who has never stood the line. No one in their right mind will want to be a cop if you continue to throw them under the bus based on what you are told in the news and a clip of the whole story. Just let them run away for fear of harming any little hairs on their head.
I'm not the judge, who should have the whole story, neither is anyone here so it really doesn't matter what you deem justifiable or not.
Let's all just side with BLM so maybe they'll be confused and stop looting...
Had they stepped in a saved Floyd the bystanders would have been charged and we would have never heard anything about this. Not like the media would have picked it up saying "Bystanders save man from certain death" or something like that.
This incident killed two birds with one stone, it removed an obvious rogue officer from society and it removed a lifelong, violent criminal from society. Not worth all the destruction but the destruction of the United States has been brewing for a long time, if not over the George Floyd death it would have happened over something else.
This incident killed two birds with one stone, it removed an obvious rogue officer from society and it removed a lifelong, violent criminal from society. Not worth all the destruction but the destruction of the United States has been brewing for a long time, if not over the George Floyd death it would have happened over something else.
Chauvin has 19 yrs experience
Thao has 10 yrs
The other 2 less than 1 yr.
One of cops (Lane) reportedly asked 2 or more times if Floyd should be rolled onto his side. Not clear right now if anyone answered or not.
I brought this up based on a personal experience. Many years ago I injected myself in an altercation where a guy had another smaller guy in a choke hold. I stood there with others not doing anything until the smaller guy passed out but the other guy kept choking. I and other people yelled at him to stop and he didn’t. I lunged at him and he let go of the other guy. He and one of his friends then proceeded to beat the crap out of me. I’m not a big guy but no one else tried to help me out either. I cannot know what the outcome would have been had I not got involved but I know what the outcome was. I regretted getting involved for a long time even after I healed, asking myself was it worth it. I finally convinced myself that I did the right thing even though there were severe and lasting consequences.
I understand that after something is all played out it is easy to say “someone should have done this or could have done that.” I also know that I can’t possibly know the outcome of something that did not play out. I would like to think that I would have injected myself into this situation like I did many years ago, but I guess I won’t know the answer to that either. Didn't mean to piss so many off.
I understand that after something is all played out it is easy to say “someone should have done this or could have done that.” I also know that I can’t possibly know the outcome of something that did not play out. I would like to think that I would have injected myself into this situation like I did many years ago, but I guess I won’t know the answer to that either. Didn't mean to piss so many off.
Hi,
LOLOL so now because the Officer choose that job AND choose to be out of shape..that gives him the right to go against the golden rule of "Cuffs ON, Hands OFF"??? Because it matters NONE of what transpired BEFORE the cuffs were put on, NONE at all.
As mentioned already..the other Officers not intervening in the attempt to "calm him down" and take over primary care of the restrained subject shows either a serious lack of training issue or a serious disregard for said training.
Sincerely,
Theis
2 months ago I went into a small store to pay for gas I come out and a 30+ deputy holding a sidearm in my face shaking so bad I doubt he could have hit me at 15 feet yelling the good Lord knows what .turned out he was not long out of the fine training school in Bossier parish .thank God he called for backup and cooler heads showed up .I have a concealed carry permit.I carry at all times.turned out one of my ex-wife sisters saw him across the street and and told him ?never did get that part sorted out .but for 20plus min I had 3 cops sweet talking to just look past this it's just a small matter nooo big deal best not push it. I did !found out from a town le he was put out at the jail to transfer people to court. Maybe things like that need to be looked into a bit more.someone may not be cut out to be a cop .little more boot camp little less it's ok buddy you'll get it
.
I’m having trouble deciphering the long sentence.
Someone reported you for carrying a firearm illegally (though you weren’t actually carrying illegally).
The officer approached you with weapon drawn (as he was acting under info that you were armed).
Once it was sorted out the call was bogus, you were released to go on your way?
Let me know how nicely you play when confronted with someone twice your size and on drugs. YES, IT MATTERS WHAT HAPPENED BEFORE THE VIDEO STARTED. Yes, it matters if ol George had a gun on him before, escaped detainment, punched Chauvin and a baby. History tends to repeat itself.
Maybe they agreed harsh treatment was appropriate. They consented to the treatment by not opposing, which is what is being argued in this thread, so why did they consent? Were there valid reasons to treat this drugged up idiot harshly?
Do you know how many people I see on good old LIVE PD state they "can't breathe" when they're just sitting in handcuffs? Ol' George can thank his fellow criminals for always crying wolf. Seems the majority of people physically detained "can't breathe".
Brilliant. Let's say you charged Chauvin and knocked him off Floyd. Floyd still alive, and cops shot a hide member; right wing agitator. And it wouldnt have even made the news.
Look bud. I’ve been doing this as long as the officer on his neck.
It does NOT matter what happened before in this instance because he sat on him not fight for 6min with other officers standing there.
The exactly second where there is no threat is the exact second you must deescalate.
You’re literally in here saying “I saw in live PD.”
You are absolutely wrong in this instance.
Yep .typing on a phone sooo.my point was not the fact he made contact with me it was he was almost shitting his pants and giving commands that were unintelligible.hands shaking with finger on trigger
Hi,
No it doesn't.....once restrained as he was the use of force policy dictates completely opposite of what happened and what you are saying is allowed.
Use of force policy does not let LE remain at the highest level of force required for the actual restraining/control once the subjects' level of force/resistance/etc has been changed.
That is what separates PROFESSIONAL Law Enforcement from what this spectacle has turned into.
That is why others in this thread have mentioned the other Officers not looking out for their partner.....
Sincerely,
Theis
No it doesn't.....once restrained as he was the use of force policy dictates completely opposite of what happened and what you are saying is allowed.
Use of force policy does not let LE remain at the highest level of force required for the actual restraining/control once the subjects' level of force/resistance/etc has been changed.
That is what separates PROFESSIONAL Law Enforcement from what this spectacle has turned into.
That is why others in this thread have mentioned the other Officers not looking out for their partner.....
Sincerely,
Theis
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