Rifle Scopes What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

I

InfiniteGrim

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Minuteman
Mar 22, 2010
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PA,USA
#1
To you guys $450 might not be splurging but to me it was. I did a great review on this scope. I went today to reattach my sunshade which I made sure the BFL was facing up when I painted it, and noticed it didn't line up anymore....well here is the reason...

(Not sure if youtube embedding works here, but I will try)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=WuBWh7vI_xQ?hd=1







I have fired maybe 150 rounds max through this fucking scope. Sadly I am going to compare this to my barska $40 scope I had, but that lasted 500+ rounds and a year, then the front lens fell out.

Time to see about that amazing Vortex CS

Update from Vortex CS....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
No it shouldn't do that. Basically it looks to me like there wasn't enough thread locker put on the objective lens cell. It's really not a big deal to fix. We'll just need to put some thread locker on the objective lens cell and that reset the parallax for you. We can have it done and sent back to you the same day we receive it.

Please call us our customer service and we'll take care of everything for you. 1-800-426-0048.

Sorry that happened. Let me know if there is anything else I can help you with.

-Sam
</div></div>

 
#2
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

That sucks.

What model was it?

Stand by for the whole "you should have let them fix it before blasting them on a public forum" outcry.

They will take care of you though.

Did your scope get excessivley hot at any time?
I'm thnking that MAYBE exposure to extreme heat (say, sitting in a trunk on a very hot day) may have softend the thread locker. It also could have been a bad batch of thread lock or they could have forgotten to put it on the threads.
 
#3
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: InfiniteGrim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Time to see about that amazing Vortex CS
</div></div>

You should have seen about that before posting this thread and posting a youtube video that was titled like it is. I am all about finding out about issues with equipment, but your video title shows you are a complete tool. Then I saw the emblem on the sunshade and it all made sense.

Josh
 
#4
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MinorDamage</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: InfiniteGrim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Time to see about that amazing Vortex CS
</div></div>

You should have seen about that before posting this thread and posting a youtube video that was titled like it is. I am all about finding out about issues with equipment, but your video title shows you are a complete tool. Then I saw the emblem on the sunshade and it all made sense.

Josh </div></div>

Complete tool?

Maybe my title says what I think. The scope was a POS. I've had it for a total of 3 weeks and shot less then 150 rounds with the damn thing. I spent 4 times the amount on this scope then the one that was on the rifle for 2.5 years without an issue.

I probably wouldn't have posted it if the scope wasn't so new, or I hadn't seen many other people posting about having to return their 6.5-20x50mm scopes for various reasons.

If and or when they fix the issue I will gladly post that all over this forum too.


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fdkay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">



Did your scope get excessivley hot at any time?
I'm thnking that MAYBE exposure to extreme heat (say, sitting in a trunk on a very hot day) may have softend the thread locker. It also could have been a bad batch of thread lock or they could have forgotten to put it on the threads. </div></div>

It is Vortex Viper 6.5-20x50mm

No I havent fired enoug rounds through the rifle with the scope on it combined to generate any amount of heat to effect the rifle, and the two times I took the scopes out it was around 75-80F, the rifle stays in my airconditioned bedroom which I keep at a cool 68F
 
#6
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

Makes me think I should spring for the Leupold instead of the Viper PST... Before I "splurge" I will have to make sure my product research is perfect...
 
#7
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

I'm not trying to pile on but maybe you should've contacted their customer service prior to making this post or the video. I'm positive they would've taken care of the issue for you. Contact them and let us know how it turns out.
 
#8
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: swage</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm not trying to pile on but maybe you should've contacted their customer service prior to making this post or the video. I'm positive they would've taken care of the issue for you. Contact them and let us know how it turns out. </div></div>

I'm not really attacking them in anyway so I honestly dont see the problem with posting this.

I'm just showing what happened to basically a brand new scope I just got.

It supposed to be nice out for the next two weeks and I have free time, but I guess I wont be doing any shooting or load development
 
#9
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

This scope is NOT the PST. This is Vortex's lower end model. Sure, it shouldn't have broken, but you also didn't buy the best quality. You knew when you bought it, that it was a relatively cheap scope. I guarantee you their PST line is a completely different story. Buy once, cry once, and if you cry about your cheap scope breaking then you should have known better to begin with.

Also, Vortex will replace or fix your scope despite you bitching about it on youtube and the Hide and throwing them under the bus without contacting them first.
 
#10
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: remau308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This scope is NOT the PST. This is Vortex's lower end model. Sure, it shouldn't have broken, but you also didn't buy the best quality. You knew when you bought it, that it was a relatively cheap scope. I guarantee you their PST line is a completely different story. </div></div>

sick.gif
sick.gif
sick.gif
Careful

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shit breaks no matter what the cost is.</div></div>

This is true.
 
#11
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: remau308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This scope is NOT the PST. This is Vortex's lower end model. Sure, it shouldn't have broken, but you also didn't buy the best quality. You knew when you bought it, that it was a relatively cheap scope. I guarantee you their PST line is a completely different story. Buy once, cry once, and if you cry about your cheap scope breaking then you should have known better to begin with.

Also, Vortex will replace or fix your scope despite you bitching about it on youtube and the Hide and throwing them under the bus without contacting them first. </div></div>It's not like at $450 that this is a super low end scope. While for many on this site it's lower end that what most use, but in reality $450 is more than the majority of the shooters I've met have been willing to spend on a scope. It's certainly not cheap. Had this been a $25 Tasco, then I'd have had a similar opinion as you.

This being said, if you turn the piece there like you did in the video does it tighten down, or just keep spinning freely. I ask this because I had a scope on a .22 rifle years ago that did a similar thing. Actually, it's still on that rifle, but it was quite a while ago that it did this. Anyway, somehow that cap started coming loose. I took it off and if you took it off you could then thread turn the lens on the threads. You could screw this cap back on and tighten it down and it would of course lock in place to keep the lens from turning. Upon further research, I found that while this lock ring shouldn't have come loose, that it was normal to be able to turn the lens after this ring was off. I also found out that quite a few people take these off on that particular scope to turn the lens to adjust the parallax focus for smaller rifles. I quickly found that this did in fact work. I sat the parallax how I wanted it, and then I tightened down the lock ring and went back to shooting and never had an issue again.

I wondering if this is going to be the case with yours, or if it wont tighten down.
 
#12
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

I really hate it when people fly off the deep end over things like this on forums. Grow up and make a phone call before you have an Internet temper tantrum. I am sure that Vortex will send you a new scope. By the way, does the objective twisting like that make the scope useless or does it still function?
 
#13
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

Well as far as Vortex customer service goes.....I had to return a couple of their Crossfire scopes twice and actually chose to upgrade them to the Viper (non PST) model for an additional cost to me. I was happy with the outcome despite the hassle. I just bought another of the $99 Crossfires along with the Facebook Super Sniper, as I know they will take care of it if there is another issue.

The issue was the turrets were moving under recoil of my .308 Win. calibered Remington PSS.
 
#14
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

+1 that a phone call should've been made before going on a forum or YouTube trying to tarnish a brand. Everything can break, even something like a Leupold or NF... I probably jumped the gun on the PST comment earlier, I will see one in person tomorrow so I will make my assumptions then...
 
#15
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

The maker of your scope rings has specifically stated not to bridge the receiver/fore-end gap like you are doing. Said it was bad for scopes....Something about the misalignment between the two put torque on the scope tube.

So maybe Vortex built a faulty scope.

Or maybe you ignored the warnings and instructions of the manufacturer of your rings and induced the failure yourself.

Either way, Vortex will take care of you. Even after your video and roasting here. No matter if your actions were the cause of the problem. What a shitty company....
 
#17
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BachelorJack</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The maker of your scope rings has specifically stated not to bridge the receiver/fore-end gap like you are doing. Said it was bad for scopes....Something about the misalignment between the two put torque on the scope tube.

So maybe Vortex built a faulty scope.

Or maybe you ignored the warnings and instructions of the manufacturer of your rings and induced the failure yourself.

Either way, Vortex will take care of you. Even after your video and roasting here. No matter if your actions were the cause of the problem. What a shitty company.... </div></div>

The instructions with my LT-152's didn't mention a thing. That shouldn't be the issue though because I only fired 10-15 rounds with it like this, I then switched to a LT-104, and last night I got bored and switched back for comparison reasons. When I went to reattach the sunshade I noticed it was loose.

To the poster above me, I only turned it hand tight, ie not tight at all. I made sure not to tighten it too much so I could easily remove it.

The youtube video is only for demonstration, I plan to take it down when this is solved. I only named the file what I was thinking!


EDIT:

One thing that I forgot to mention was the first time I took the scope out and did the review I was able to adust the scope so that it was perfectly parrallax . But I havent been able to get it perfectly parrallax free since. Now I thought this was me because I could get it so there was a very small amount of movement left/right, or movement up/down but now that I see the front lens is moving, that may not have been me.
 
#18
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: InfiniteGrim</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BachelorJack</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The maker of your scope rings has specifically stated not to bridge the receiver/fore-end gap like you are doing. Said it was bad for scopes....Something about the misalignment between the two put torque on the scope tube.

</div></div>
The instructions with my LT-152's didn't mention a thing. <span style="font-weight: bold"> That shouldn't be the issue though because I only fired 10-15 rounds with it like this</span> </div></div>

Not so, what BJ is referring to is clamping down your scope to two different planes. If your upper reciever and foregrip are not perfectly aligned you are putting undue stress on your scope just by tightening it up in the rings. Doesn't matter how many rounds you put through it.
Describe again the parallax thing, I dont quite understand what you mean by "it was perfectly parrallax ".
 
#19
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

I like the others believe you should have called the company and at least let them hear your complaint and respond to it.

Maybe after you call and they make it right, you could go back (if that's possible) to the video, edit it, and let everyone know that the company made it right.

If you cannot go back and edit the video, maybe you could make another one called "Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass.... video #2."
 
#20
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

Maybe you need to think more about your thinking before:

1) Considering $450 splurging on a scope. It's not relative to what you can afford. It's relevant to what manufacturers can afford to build. Quality comes at a price.

2) Titling a video "WTF Vortex". That's the title everybody sees. So no excuses there.

3) Mismounting the scope

4) Not even attempting to contact the company first.
 
#22
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

Even though the OP may have mounted his scope incorrectly, I doubt that it has much bearing on the objective lens of the scope. On the erector assembly, yes.
 
#23
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

"One thing that I forgot to mention was the first time I took the scope out and did the review I was able to adust the scope so that it was perfectly parrallax . But I havent been able to get it perfectly parrallax free since. Now I thought this was me because I could get it so there was a very small amount of movement left/right, or movement up/down but now that I see the front lens is moving, that may not have been me."

I know I wasn't being clear but I was commenting on this part of his post.
 
#24
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

Ok, I just have to ask.... what is the emblem on the sunshade and why does it make the OP a tool as opposed to his lashing out at a scope company when the issue was probably user induced?
 
#25
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

IIRC that's a sticker from arfcom.

Come to think about it I have seen another scope do this before and it was because the owner used a strap wrench to put the sunshade on (it kept rattling loose on him). So if the OP put it on too tight that could do it.
 
#26
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body">IIRC that's a sticker from arfcom.</div></div>

This. I was pointing out that this forum tends to handle things with a bit more tact than many others. The OP has at least altered the title of the video...I think it was something about Vortex P.O.S. originally.

Josh
 
#28
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

Barfcom sticker + bridging the gap between receiver/rail + whining about it before even contacting Vortex to see what they say.

That's pretty much all I need to know about this issue.
 
#32
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

First of all, I'm sorry that happened. The thread locking compound must have broken loose on the objective lens cell or there just wasn't any to begin with on your scope, which is why you are able to turn it like that. We will definitely take care of it. It's an extremely easy fix. We will probably have the scope repaired and sent back the same day we receive it. Please call customer service at 1-800-426-0048 and they will get it taken care of for you.

Also, before this gets blown out of proportion I just want to say that the way that objective lens is built is standard for just about every riflescope on the market. There is nothing inherently flawed with that design. In fact they are designed that way on purpose, because the objective lens has to be adjusted during assembly to correctly set the parallax (Which is why you noticed you now have parallax problems). In fact, many scopes don't even have any thread locker on the objective lens cell and if you grab that ring on the end and turn you are probably going to get it to move. There are even some guys who will buy scopes and purposefully turn the objective lens and adjust it for very short range parallax in rimfire applications.

I'm not saying this to make an excuse for what happened, it clearly shouldn't have done that, but I just want to put it in perspective that it's not a flawed design or anything. It just simply needs to be adjusted for correct parallax and some thread locker applied and then it will be good to go.

Let me know if you have any more questions and I'll do my best to help you out.

-Sam
 
#33
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: InfiniteGrim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Before everyone has a heart attack. 99.9% of 150-200 roudns fired were fired like this....



IMG_1310_1_2_tonemapped.jpg
</div></div>

Thats a better setup, but I have to say again; <span style="font-weight: bold">If your upper reciever and foregrip are not perfectly aligned you are putting undue stress on your scope <span style="color: red"> just </span>by tightening it up in the rings. Doesn't matter how many rounds you put through it.</span> Hate to beat a dead horse but that is the point that was being made. I agree, that wouldn't affect your objective, but no good on the scope just the same.
Sam@vortex obviously is here to help you, nothing excuses what happened, but it's good to know he is here to back up his product. Take advantage of it
smile.gif
 
#34
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fdkay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well, that's the problem, it was hitting the fence.

Just tryin to help. </div></div>

ROFL
 
#35
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sam@Vortex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">First of all, I'm sorry that happened. The thread locking compound must have broken loose on the objective lens cell or there just wasn't any to begin with on your scope, which is why you are able to turn it like that. We will definitely take care of it. It's an extremely easy fix. We will probably have the scope repaired and sent back the same day we receive it. Please call customer service at 1-800-426-0048 and they will get it taken care of for you.

Also, before this gets blown out of proportion I just want to say that the way that objective lens is built is standard for just about every riflescope on the market. There is nothing inherently flawed with that design. In fact they are designed that way on purpose, because the objective lens has to be adjusted during assembly to correctly set the parallax (Which is why you noticed you now have parallax problems). In fact, many scopes don't even have any thread locker on the objective lens cell and if you grab that ring on the end and turn you are probably going to get it to move. There are even some guys who will buy scopes and purposefully turn the objective lens and adjust it for very short range parallax in rimfire applications.

I'm not saying this to make an excuse for what happened, it clearly shouldn't have done that, but I just want to put it in perspective that it's not a flawed design or anything. It just simply needs to be adjusted for correct parallax and some thread locker applied and then it will be good to go.

Let me know if you have any more questions and I'll do my best to help you out.

-Sam
</div></div>

After handling your Viper PST 6-24x50 FFP scope at my local dealer today, I will be telling EVERYONE I see in the market to look at your line. Truly a high quality scope. It was beautifully constructed, with crisp and clear optics (even at high powers), and despite some other people's comments, had really wonderful and precise turrets. Unfortunately I will have to wait a while for mine, and make due with the Crossfire 6-24x50 for 2 or 3 months before I can get one of those on my rifle. Either way I look forward to it.
 
#36
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

The PST and Vortex's other lower end scopes are night and day different. Everything breaks, the real test is to see how CS fixes it, and in Vortex's case, it's often very very good.
 
#37
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

To everyone saying the 6.5-20x50mm is a cheap scope, you obviously have NOT handeled one. From what I have sen in the PST reviews, it is nearly the same, less all the features.

The turrets have nice clicks, and the focus ring, magnification ring, and parallax are smooth yet stiff so they don't move under recoil.

I also read somewhere that the optics are supposed to be nearly identical.

I'm not trying to defend my purchase, but point out what I have read and noticed. Its supposed to have some of the nicest glass in its price and magnification range.
 
#38
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sam@Vortex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">First of all, I'm sorry that happened. The thread locking compound must have broken loose on the objective lens cell or there just wasn't any to begin with on your scope, which is why you are able to turn it like that. We will definitely take care of it. It's an extremely easy fix. We will probably have the scope repaired and sent back the same day we receive it. Please call customer service at 1-800-426-0048 and they will get it taken care of for you.

Also, before this gets blown out of proportion I just want to say that the way that objective lens is built is standard for just about every riflescope on the market. There is nothing inherently flawed with that design. In fact they are designed that way on purpose, because the objective lens has to be adjusted during assembly to correctly set the parallax (Which is why you noticed you now have parallax problems). In fact, many scopes don't even have any thread locker on the objective lens cell and if you grab that ring on the end and turn you are probably going to get it to move. There are even some guys who will buy scopes and purposefully turn the objective lens and adjust it for very short range parallax in rimfire applications.

I'm not saying this to make an excuse for what happened, it clearly shouldn't have done that, but I just want to put it in perspective that it's not a flawed design or anything. It just simply needs to be adjusted for correct parallax and some thread locker applied and then it will be good to go.

Let me know if you have any more questions and I'll do my best to help you out.

-Sam
</div></div>


Wow... rarely do I enter into a thread where someone is bashing on a piece of equipment and find myself by the end of it thinking that this will probably be my next equipment purchase.

Sam, let me say your professional explanation of the situation and willingness to rectify the issue regardless of cause has earned you a future customer.

@ the OP :

Let this be a lesson, never bitch about someone else doing something poorly until you've exhausted every means available to rectify an issue yourself. Seriously... next time something doesn't work quite right start with step 1 (check your own methods), move to step 2 (check with the vendor) and THEN move to step 3 (Ask for input from others).

This thread is the result of doing things ass backwards and being pissed off about it. Hopefully you've heard a loud "POP" noise recently... in case you didn't know at the time, that's the sound of your head coming out of your ass and returning to your shoulders where it should have been the entire time.
 
#39
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: InfiniteGrim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">To everyone saying the 6.5-20x50mm is a cheap scope, you obviously have NOT handeled one. From what I have sen in the PST reviews, it is nearly the same, less all the features.
</div></div>

Have you handled a PST? it sounds like you haven't. All the Vipers I've handle were not in the same ballpark as my PST.
 
#40
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: InfiniteGrim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...it is nearly the same, less all the features.
</div></div>

That quote is priceless.

Josh
 
#42
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tylerw02</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The best part is the Magpul stock was probably nearly as much as the optic. </div></div>

Don't forget the arfcom sticker on that, too!
 
#43
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

So to answer the title......

I get Fuckin' Awesome customer service. They received my scope friday, but didnt get a chance to look at it until monday. Because of a note I left on the return sheet I filled out they waited and called my on Tuesday and allowed to to upgrade to the PST. An Extra $$$ got me the SFP 6-24x50mm moa/moa PST
icon_smile_big.gif
.

They shipped it out on wedsday and Fedex was faster then I have ever seen and delivered it at 9AM today. OF course with my luck it happenned to be the same day I was helping move my aunt, so I finally got to play with it 30 minutes ago. The only word I can think of to describe this scope is pure sex. Their customer service is amazing
icon_smile_cool.gif
 
#44
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: coldboremiracle</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: InfiniteGrim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">To everyone saying the 6.5-20x50mm is a cheap scope, you obviously have NOT handeled one. From what I have sen in the PST reviews, it is nearly the same, less all the features.
</div></div>

Have you handled a PST? it sounds like you haven't. All the Vipers I've handle were not in the same ballpark as my PST. </div></div>

As of Friday I have handled the PST and I stand by what I said.

Have you handled the 6.5-20x50mm Viper? I have read a lot of review on the cheaper vipers and some of them are pretty bad.

I honestly think Vortex made a big mistake having so many scopes named Viper in their lineup. I guarantee you that the 6.5-20x50mm will impress you if you ever have the chance to play with one.

After playing around with the PST I honestly believe the 6.5-20x50mm is right up there with the PST. It felt just as sturdy, and the parallax, focus, and magnification adjustments felt just as nice as the PST. But because of how the turrets re-zero of the viper they are nowhere near as nice.

You are going to laugh at me for this but the 6.5 viper did one thing better then the vortex. The serial number and model number where engraved or stamped into the bottom of the tube, on my PST it is just lasered on with white lettering.

As for glass I haven't gotten to the range yet but looking at limited things around my house the glass between the two are actually very comparable.



<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: THEBEARRRRRRJEW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tylerw02</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The best part is the Magpul stock was probably nearly as much as the optic. </div></div>

Don't forget the arfcom sticker on that, too! </div></div>

So tell me whats all the hate for the BFL? Arfcom or not I think its an awesome looking symbol. I'm a huge AR fan and the symbol is the outline of the bolt face.

 
#45
Re: What do I get for "splurging" on glass....

I'm glad things worked out for you. I hope you learned something from this experience. I'm sure you will handle similar situations differently in the future.

Take care.....
 
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