Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

#102
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The PGW Timberwolf is the best and beats the AI hands down... I think it is the finest 338LM on the market. </div></div>

LL,

What makes it better than the AW? And wouldn't it make it the finest .308 also?
I thought that AW was pretty much the (field) rifle to beat out there.

Thanks
 
#103
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

Interresting thread!

I'd get a AI AWSM, seems to be quite popular in many armies/units, which hands down is a very good criteria - that at least proves to me that it should work nice in terms of durability, flexibility etc..
 
#105
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

Pertaining to accuracy I have found from my own experience.
TRG-42's are typically a little more accurate than AI rifles. PGW T'Wolf is more accurate than both of the above.
I believe the reason/s the T'Wolf is more accurate is possibly a little tighter tolerances on the bolt/chambering. And I really am starting to believe that the action/bedding system has something to do with it being able to hold accuracy at very long ranges.
I have never shot or had a custom/precision built tactical rifle with a conventionally bedded action shoot as accurately as the T'Wolf at very long distances.
The T'Wolf accuracy seems to hold together a little bit better the farther out you shoot it. Whereas every other rifle I have shot at extreme long ranges the accuracy has seemed to open up in comparison.
These are my own findings and personal opinions. Other opinions may vary.
But I will say that Nick (owner of Desert Tactical Arms) has done a lot of shooting at extreme long ranges with a T'Wolf and has logged very good results also.
I am interested to see thru testing and refinement of DTA's SRS rifle if he will be able to achieve better accuracy performance at extreme long ranges than he did with his T'Wolf. Hopefully we can learn thru DTA's R&D if an all metal chassis/stock can lend to better accuracy than fiberglass/carbon fiber stocks in extreme long range accuracy.
 
#106
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Lowlight,

Can you expound for us the advantages of the PGW Timberwolf compared to the AI and maybe over other 338 systems also.

Not doubting you in any way.It would be cool to know.

Steve </div></div>

BTT Waiting for LL
grin.gif
 
#107
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

I prefer the PGW Timberwolf over the AI. The Twolf 338LM is definitely more accurate. When the Twolf was new it shot well under 1/2 MOA. The Twolf now has over 1800 rounds down the tube and still shoots under 3/4 MOA, luckily I have a spare barrel for when it's time to retire the first one.

I really like PGW's side folding aluminum chassis stock, it is very ergonomic and streamlined, the only thing I would change is the locking switch. The AI stock feels like a square brick in comparison. The PGW is a bit lighter in weight.

Ross and Steve are great guys I have known them for years, they make an excellent product and have had much military success.

As far as the AI AWSM 338's, their average accuracy from my experience is around 3/4 MOA, the best consistently shot 1/2" MOA. I do prefer the 60 degree bolt throw of the AI over the Twolf's though. I like the plastic skins better in extreme temperatures, because it's not fun touching metal surfaces in 120+ or -0 degree weather. I also like the ability to have swappable color molded skins over cheap spray paint.

In developing our SRS rifle I tried to take what I liked about many different systems and combine it into one to create the ultimate rifle system. We have all the bugs worked out now and production guns are just around the corner. Last week when we tested our first production 338 SRS the first five rounds out of the gun were 0.35" (saved the target for historical purposes
laugh.gif
). I am as excited to get these guns shipped out as I'm sure all of you are.
 
#113
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sr90</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I prefer the PGW Timberwolf over the AI. The Twolf 338LM is definitely more accurate. ........the only thing I would change is the locking switch. The AI stock feels like a square brick in comparison. </div></div>

sr90 ,

I have never had the chance to handle one Timberwolf rifle so , because the accuacy of 1/4 MOA more or less is not everything in a modern SWS , just out of my curiosity , is the Timberwolf "soldierproof-tank built-rock solid" as the AI stuff is ?

I mean , can the Timberwolf survive the many and many abuses that an SWS usually takes living in the wild for long time ?

We are talking about real world "tools of the trade" and not just nice boomsticks to be showed up at the range , you agree ?

So they must be able to survive at the worst conditions , is the Timberwold good at that ?

Thanks for lighting me up ,

PP out
 
#114
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

Pinco,
Yes the Timberwolf is bomb proof, it is the issued sniper rifle for the Canadian Military and I know that the British Marines have also purchased several systems. It has it where it counts for sure.
 
#117
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sr90</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Pinco,
Yes the Timberwolf is bomb proof, it is the issued sniper rifle for the Canadian Military and I know that the British Marines have also purchased several systems. It has it where it counts for sure. </div></div>

sr90,

got it , thanks , I'd like to shot it one day .

PP out
 
#118
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

Call Rifles Only, they have a couple of Timberwolf's down there, Jacob has some pictures too, maybe he can post them, I will let him know.

The Timberwolf rocks, we see a couple with the MCM A5 stock, but I like the PGW "Terry Fox" stock better, smaller, handy, folding. the accuracy is insane with the Timberwolf for sure... good parts good barrels.
 
#119
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

I zeroed a scope on one of the .338 Timberwolfs Jacob has last week. At 100 yards, I fired a three-shot confirmation group that was one hole - shooting prone off the bed of my pickup truck - and this on a rifle which hasn't been properly broken in yet.

I like them - I wish I could afford to shoot one.

 
#126
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

Timberwolf action
40x trigger
Nightforce 5.5-22x56 and rings
Badger brake
Krieger barrel
Sentinel stock

Not shown is the harris bipod, podclaws, podlock, eagle stock pack and TIS sling
 
#127
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

Only had exp. with the TRG as well, but I have had real good luck and accuracy with it. Have a good load for it and its dialed in @ 300yds zero
 
#129
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pinco Palla</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Vulcan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">....honest expectations on barrel life are 7500 rounds ....</div></div>

Hey , that's way too optimistic !

Barrel life expectancy is not more than 1.500 rounds for a 338LM .

I also like the PGM design , even if I never shot one , but for amos the same retail price I preferred to go with the AI AWM hands down .

PP out
</div></div>

Finnish Army re-barrels TRG42:s around 5000 shot. Accuracy limit is 1MOA I´ve been told.
Sako uses cold hammer forger barrel, its about as durable as it gets.
Way, way beyond 1500 anyway, thats for sure. And I presume we´re not talking about BR shooting.

P.S.
Just re-barreled my own TRG42 @ around 4000 shots, perhaps bit more.
 
#133
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

I would go with a Surgeon XL action. I have some trigger time on their .308 Scalpel and .338 Remedy and they have been the most accurate weapons I have ever shot......
 
#137
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

I've heard about Sako coming out with a faster twist for the TRG 42, I think it was mentioned in this thread as well. A 1 in 9 twist for the .338 LM. Anyone know anything more about this? Expected date of release?
 
#138
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

On that same note, Accuracy International is working on that as well, so I am told. I think the military gets the first dip on that. Hope that they have one by the time my AIAWSM needs a new barrel. Hoping to get a 1:9" twist.
 
#139
accuracy tests from the NATO tests by spansih army

On extensive tests run FOR NATO as part as the upgrade program for bolt action sniper rfile (.308 to 338LM), The most accurate 338LM is Brugger and thomet APR.

These is just accuracy with and without Suppressor.

the worst is SAKO that cant shoot the 300gr with it current issue barrel.

Ed
 
#140
Re: accuracy tests from the NATO tests by spansih army

can you paste the link to the document with such info? i saw the APR here in Switzerland and i was tempted. When i emailed the company though they told me, they cannot guarantee that it will shoot the 300smk and after having poured all that cash i wouldnt feel like a new barrel. i think its the same twist rate as AI AWSM 1.11 twist.
which 300gr ammo where they using? I know that many European sniper are fielded Ruag 250grain but i dont know of company in europe loading 300grain bullets. Did lapua have a shot at this with their new 300scenar?
 
#141
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: aregullinjr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I had a TRG and it was a fine rifle except for the 1 in 12 twist of the barrel. But for the price it is great buy, and it is a shame that they dont make a 1 in 10 twist barrel. I sold it for an AIAW that is still on back order, I don't know what the hellis going on a Tac Pro but it has been pushed back again until late august. But if you paying a lot of money in the excess of 6,500.00 i would have it built buy a reputible gun builder. I like Gap, I have a Rock by them that is AWSOME and I like Surgeon Rifle, but it all comes down to what is comfrotable with you and your wallet. If you got the cash to spend a nice rifle buy it, but if you want the best rifle for you have one built to your standards. Either way you cant go wrong </div></div>

First Stop Guns in Rapid City, SD has a new TRG 42 in stock right now in .338 Lapua. Of course I was obligated to play with it for a moment and give it the once over. On the side of the barrel where the chamber info and branding are stamped there was a <span style="font-weight: bold">10"</span> stamped into the side of the barrel. I talked to one of the guys that does their ordering, and he stated that the TRG 42 in .338 Lapua can now be ordered from the factory with a 1:10" barrel. They exist, I have held one. Sorely sorely tempted to buy it, but I have other things on my plate.
 
#142
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: precisionshutr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've heard about Sako coming out with a faster twist for the TRG 42, I think it was mentioned in this thread as well. A 1 in 9 twist for the .338 LM. Anyone know anything more about this? Expected date of release? </div></div>

Now shipping with 1:10s. Probably since mid-February.

Chris
 
#143
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

I just cant stop wondering- why 1/10" is so big issue to some people?

If one cant shoot LR with 250gr, 300gr wont really make difference according to QTU w/Cd radar data.
250grainer runs flatter up to 1250meters. goes subsonic 1450-1500meters- and flies well at least up to 2000meters.

Perhaps I´m just too stupid to see it, please explain.




 
#144
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

Just think of it as added versatility. Also the 300gr bullet is a bit less susceptible to wind, which in my experience is more important than shooting flat. If I have a good ballistics chart, and some range time to verify it I am not all that concerned with a few MOA or MIL's difference in drop. On the other hand reading the wind is a pain for me, and a bullet that reduces the effects of my error on making wind calls is pretty damn useful.
 
#145
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

I'm actually perfectly happy with the 250 Scenar. If you run the numbers using Metro Standard and a 10 MPH 90 degree wind, at 1500 yards there is about .4 MOA differance in the wind call. That amounts to about .09 mil. 1 mph moves the 250 1 MOA and the 300 .9 MOA. To me, that's not so much of an advantage.

Running the BoreTech 245's at 3100, I can reduce the wind drift to.6 MOA for 1 MPH. 10 MPH is 6.3 MOA, or 1.84 Mil, compared to a 300 at 2700 with 9.3 MOA, 2.7 Mil. Now, .9 Mil differance is something that's worth the effort.
 
#146
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

I'm with Cory, think about it, who is really going to take a real world shot @ 2000 yards, I know it might be fun at the range. For all incisive purposes, I will not take a shot over 900 with my TRG on a living critter ( i hunt with mine) I really think we are speaking semantics by wishing to hit a man size target at 2000 yards. Car yes, man, I don’t think so.
 
#147
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JL</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just cant stop wondering- why 1/10" is so big issue to some people?

If one cant shoot LR with 250gr, 300gr wont really make difference according to QTU w/Cd radar data.
250grainer runs flatter up to 1250meters. goes subsonic 1450-1500meters- and flies well at least up to 2000meters.

Perhaps I´m just too stupid to see it, please explain.




</div></div>

I'm happy to shoot 250s out of my 42. Longest I can shoot in Florida is 1022 and that's a 208 mile hike each way. Still, I'm somewhat envious of the 1:10s, as I have some loaded 300 SMK ammo I got from an Ebayer and also some loose 300s, but this being said, the 250s are more than fine for my needs and with the Hornadys, SMKs and Scenars, I'm not jonesing as much as the 300 shooters.

Less of a thump, as well.

Chris
 
#148
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Coal Dragger</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just think of it as added versatility. Also the 300gr bullet is a bit less susceptible to wind, which in my experience is more important than shooting flat. If I have a good ballistics chart, and some range time to verify it I am not all that concerned with a few MOA or MIL's difference in drop. On the other hand reading the wind is a pain for me, and a bullet that reduces the effects of my error on making wind calls is pretty damn useful. </div></div>

Could You kindly calculate drop/wind charts for 300 and 250gr Scenars with typical TRG MV:s and copy it in this thread?
Would be interesting to compare. 250gr Scenars typically live barrel around 3000fps with reasonable loads.
Not sure about 300grs MV:s- perhaps 2750fps would be "fair" comparsion?

 
#149
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

JL, do you think that the 250 gr ammo (Scenar or Lock Base?) contributes to the TRG long barrel life, or is it mostly because of the steel used (CM hammer forged)?

Is the loong (for a 338 LM) barrel life claimed also due to the military, somewhat loose, 1.0 MOA standard?

Are the barrels factory or custom (twist?) for this ELR, post-transonic shooting? What accuracy do you get at 2000 m with the 250 grain bullets?
 
#150
Re: Who makes the best 338 Lapua?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TiroFijo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Are the barrels factory or custom (twist?) for this ELR, post-transonic shooting? What accuracy do you get at 2000 m with the 250 grain bullets?</div></div>

TiroFijo,

Here is link to thread about the 2000m and its ballistic calculations. You will see the barrel and rifle were complete factory.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=621547&page=1
 
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