Why do you buy cheep safes?

[Big Bo]

I don`t get it, I read over and over where members here and on other forums buy cheep safes. Explain to me, how and why you buy a safe that is the price of a rifle, and then put potentially thousands of dollars worth of guns, scopes, jewels, coins, pictures, important papers, and other items that would be difficult to replace in a cheep or low quality safe. I don`t care what the mfgr says, I don`t give a damn what the salesman says, thin steel sheeting for a safe is BS. If we buy thin walled safes, they will keep making them and giving the false impression of security.

I see members more interest in how thick the brass case is than how thick the steel is to protect that valuable gun.

Please flame on, I have my PPE on.

 

[ORD]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

I personally don't buy cheap safes, but I suppose that the logic with some folks is that "it is better than nothing at all." The simple fact is that many people don't see them for the incredible investment (not to mention piece of mind) that they are. I personally wouldn't want tens of thousands of dollars in firearms, optics, and other items sitting around in a cheap chicom, pot metal, glorified file cabinet...but that's just me. Their loss...not mine.

 

[socalsheepdog]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

I waited a long time to be able to afford the Amsec BF I got. When my wife found out how much I spent on it, she had a fit. Especially after walking past safes in Costco for so many years that cost $800. I would always say I needed one but she always thought I was talking about the Costco special. I didn't do a very good job at managing her expectations, but then again I don't know how I would have. She would just not understand. I think many guys cheap out due to the wife/cost factor. I almost caved on it a few times but I am glad I didn't. In Calif you have to have a lock on all firearms or have them in an approved safe. Some get the safe because it's easier and just don't seam to care about all the benefits a quality safe can give you. Just my .02

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Because a $800 residential security cabinet properly installed goes MUCH FURTHER at keeping my guns out of a smash and grab meth heads hands than not having one does.....

Nothing short of a real safe (and most of the "good" safes you refer to are just RSC's) will foil a determined and/or knowledgable thief/thieves.


Why do people buy cheap cars when they could save their money and get (insert favorite marque here)???

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

What brand "safe" are you ranting on having, by the way??

 

[pyplynr]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

When I build my house next year, I'm going to build a saferoom with a vault door on it. Here in Oklahoma if you don't have a "fraidy hole" your taking a gamble with your life. It's going to cost about the same to have a good safe and storm shelter or combining the two with a safe room and a vault door. Ft. Knox has a very nice (and very heavy) inside swing vault door.

 

[Big Bo]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?



Petrochem, BS.

Rent, own, live with mom and dad. One does not have to spend $5000 to get a good safe. One has to look, and do his/her home work. The good safes are out there, and they will not break the bank.

 

[sootstorm]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

not purchased for theft protection, more to keep away from visiting children. running through the house, playing hide and seek in the house you all know the senarios

 

[Big Bo]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

I DO NOT KNOW of this Company. I just read of them a week ago. But I like that they have safes with steel walls, not sheet metal walls.

http://www.brownsafe.com/features_weapon_safes/Weapon_safe_single_door.html

I am not saying go and buy one of these safes. Do your home work, investigate and make a wise choice.

It is a start. One has to look. How much did one put into looking for that rifle? That scope? That perfect load?

Good luck.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

So what brand do you have your guns in?

 

[Redmanss]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Bolted down Cannon gun safe, home security system, lighting, dog, neighbors, and the home occupied on average 18-20 hours a day. I consider that a defense in layers. I'm happy with my $800 safe and the rest of the money I didn't spend on a fancy job went to other more worthy causes. Good enough for my insurance company, good enough for me.

OP, I understand what you mean by having a "real" gun safe that has inch+ thick steel all around, but what is separating most gun safes from being stolen? A $20 dead bolt that can be breached with a $10 wrecking bar? Most folks will justify spending $3000 on a safe but think $34.95/mo is too much for a monitored security system or $8 is too much for the Readhead anchors. Single source protection is the real waste of money. I just hope anyone that invests that much into a safe also invests the money into other measures of security too.

If anyone wants my guns that badly, then bring it on, they're insured and I'll only be inconvenienced by the theft but not heartbroken. Try it when I'm home and I hope they know the value of their life because they just sold it to me for $1.50 of 12ga shells. Quite frankly they'll get more money by stealing one of my 3 vehicles I have, but they're all insured too.

Locks, safes, security systems, etc. only keep honest people honest. My goal is not to be the hardest target in the city, just the hardest target on the block. If they do their homework enough to realize that I have things of value, they'll also know that I'm not the target they're looking for and they'll hit the house 2 blocks up the road.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Redmanss</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Quite frankly they'll get more money by stealing one of my 3 vehicles I have, but they're all insured too.

</div></div>

There's a point often missed by most...

I also have a whole pack of rescued ill behaved chihuahuas, so that my house is way less appealing than my neighbors.
<span style="font-style: italic">"I don't need to outrun the bear, I just need to outrun you"</span>

 

[echo5charlie]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

In the future, I would like to get a Cannon safe to store my firearms and gear. But for now a "cheap" cabinet will have to suffice. My primary reason to have one is to keep the little curious hands from touching them. Just trying to save a penny here and a dollar there to get a nice Cannon. (Safe, that is)

 

[Big Bo]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

I have a Visalia Safe that I keep my guns in. It is made of 1/4" and 3/8" walls, roof and floor. This puppy weighs 1200# empty. I had to move it earlier this year. No fun at all. It was made before Visalia Safes decided to make their safes out of sheet metal. My collection is growing in size, and I am need of a larger safe. I will buy a larger safe, that weighs more than the present one. Co-worker has offered more for the safe than I paid for it. Why, he has seen it, and at the local safe store they don`t have any 1/4" steel or thicker steel walled safes, only sheet metal backed by sheetrock. That is their selling point.

I have let Brown safes know that I will contact then to see their safes. I too will do my home work.

 

[VKC]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Fort Knox safe for fire protection as well.

 

[Morgan711]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

My EX Wife gave me the same ol' line ..blah,blah,blah,,,how I should not have spent $ 1200 for the Cannon Brand safe I got ....she shut up once I told her I had about 5k just in my .308 alone!

 

[AXEMAN]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

it is better than nothing. $300-$400 safe bolted down is better than stuck in a closet, under a bed, behind a door. plus most break ins arent safe crackers unless they have been watching youtube

 

[TrooperBrian]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

I'm not sure actually, because when I buy a safe I want to make sure it doesn't cheep. That sound can get annoying after a while.

 

[Morgan711]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

most hits will be quick in and out grabs, anything that is going to slow them down they won't waste time on. If they know you will be gone for a while and bring in a portable torch it really dosen't matter what brand safe you have unless it is really $$$$$$ high end

 

[Switchblade]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

I got my $89 safe when Panty 6 said we didn't need the $750 safe to store guns in. When I could afford the really sweet 24 gun $750 safe I have no where to put it. SO I stuck the safe where it goes un noticed by everyone, and am drawing up plans to turn half a kid's closet into a nice big gun safe with 10 hour burn time rated walls and door. Gonna make a nice access through our master bedroom wall with a fancy shelf she can put stuff on so it looks like it was meant to be there and not like 'a ugly piece of shit that's NOT going in my new master bedroom!'

 

[Redmanss]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TrooperBrian</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm not sure actually, because when I buy a safe I want to make sure it doesn't cheep. That sound can get annoying after a while. </div></div> Epic.

 

[Sean the Nailer]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

"Hiding in Plain Sight"


That statement works for more than you can imagine.

 

[Big Bo]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Nice read.

http://www.sturdysafe.com/gaugethicknesswar.htm

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Big Bo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a Visalia Safe that I keep my guns in. It is made of 1/4" and 3/8" walls, roof and floor. This puppy weighs 1200# empty. I had to move it earlier this year. No fun at all. It was made before Visalia Safes decided to make their safes out of sheet metal. My collection is growing in size, and I am need of a larger safe. I will buy a larger safe, that weighs more than the present one. Co-worker has offered more for the safe than I paid for it. Why, he has seen it, and at the local safe store they don`t have any 1/4" steel or thicker steel walled safes, only sheet metal backed by sheetrock. That is their selling point.

I have let Brown safes know that I will contact then to see their safes. I too will do my home work.
</div></div>

Very cool. You know if I have an oxy/acetylene torch it will be an empty 1200# ashtray in minutes right?

 

[marduk185]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

its to slow down burglers or determined bad seed children. it aint fort knox. i was raised in a home where grandads pistol sat on the kitchen refrigerator in plain view and everyone had sense(and fear of grandpa) enuf not to fool with it. i believe id never buy a safe at all if it werent for liability issues in an age where lawyers insist guns are responsible for killings.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">its to slow down burglers or determined bad seed children. it aint fort knox. </div></div>

That's what mine's for...

 

[TrooperBrian]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Big Bo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nice read.

http://www.sturdysafe.com/gaugethicknesswar.htm</div></div>

That's a very eye opening article. Does anyone know what the Cannon EX20 thickness is? It's on sale at Costco right now..

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Big Bo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Explain to me, how and why you buy a safe that is the price of a rifle, and then put potentially thousands of dollars worth of guns, scopes, jewels, coins, pictures, important papers, and other items that would be difficult to replace in a cheep or low quality safe. </div></div>

Because no Safe is "safe". Your level of protection needs to be proportional to your risk. You don't hunt rabbit with a .50BMG do you?

Even the most state of the art Safe can be defeated and face it, the "Residential Security Containers" most of us use are nowhere near the protection of the safe at your local bank/jewelry store.

Before I had my current safe I had the equivalent of a school locker hidden in a closet. The purpose was simply to dissuade a casual thief and keep my guns out of view of service folks.

Now my safe just needs to resist long enough for the local on-duty responders to arrive. Where I live this is going to be less than five minutes from the time of call and I have good neighbors on all sides looking out for me. Soon I will probably add an alarm system to supplement that.

I don't need a six ton behemoth. A securty container bolted to the floor that will resist pry attempts is about perfect.

Now if I lived out in the middle of nowhere I would go quite a bit heavier on protection. It can take county law enforcement some time to arrive once the call has gone out. That is assuming someone is even around to report it.

 

[Searcher]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

A few years back, while looking at my newly finished vault, my wife made the comment; "you know the best way to protect your guns? dont keep them all in the same place".

Talk about deflating ego. The worst part is I think she is probably correct.

 

[JRose]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Because I'm poor.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Bolt down the 60" wide version of this:

 

[JuniperEyes]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

I worked at a place where they had a REAL safe.

Had steel outer shell with concrete walls and door lining that had glass vials filled with a liquid that turned to some type of tear gas if the concrete was broken. Big and heavy S.O.B.

We came in one morning and the tear gas was so strong in the building one brave worker was rendered almost unconcious trying to go in just a few feet and open a bay door to let it air out.

Guess what? The safe door was wide open when firefighters finally got the doors opened up and the place aired out. We figured the safecracher hit a vial by accident when he was drilling the door to get to the lock mechanism. 3 holes drilled and he opened the door and left with the loot. Must have had breathing apparatus to stay in there with the gas.

If the right guy wants your safe open, it will be...

 

[chawk]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Locked house, monitored alarm system and a "cheep" 800lb cannon safe bolted down. That's enough to stop the average thief. If someone is determined... that's what insurance is for. I don't have a single material possession that can't be easily replaced when the insurance check shows up.

That's why I bought a "cheep" safe.

 

[BoredEngineer]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

For someone who plans on living in the same house for a while I wouldn't recommend those Costco Safes after seeing this video and checking one out for myself. Comparing my safe to the ones they sell at big box stores is night and day. Although they would probably have a much harder time in this video if the safe was bolted to the ground.

I figure if people will pay 1200 bucks for a quality AR-15 upper whats 1700 for a BF series Amsec. Like someone mentioned in this thread it is a valid investment. A good safe is something you can pass down to your kids especially if you plan on passing your guns down to them. The bottom line is the safe is supposed to do its job get what you feel will get the job done not the least you can spend to give yourself a false sense of security.

The only justification for a lower level (cheaper) safe is if the value of your guns don't warrant it or you have other reliable layers of security. Which may in some cases be a better plan.


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[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

So do you guys keep your tools in safes as well?

Want to guess what's more easily stolen and converted to cash?

Sometimes you just have to insure your stuff, take reasonable precautions and drive on.

 

[TrooperBrian]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BoredEngineer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For someone who plans on living in the same house for a while I wouldn't recommend those Costco Safes after seeing this video and checking one out for myself. Comparing my safe to the ones they sell at big box stores is night and day. Although they would probably have a much harder time in this video if the safe was bolted to the ground.

I figure if people will pay 1200 bucks for a quality AR-15 upper whats 1700 for a BF series Amsec. Like someone mentioned in this thread it is a valid investment. A good safe is something you can pass down to your kids especially if you plan on passing your guns down to them. The bottom line is the safe is supposed to do its job get what you feel will get the job done not the least you can spend to give yourself a false sense of security.

The only justification for a lower level (cheaper) safe is if the value of your guns don't warrant it or you have other reliable layers of security. Which may in some cases be a better plan.


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Don't believe everything you see, that video is not even close to a fair assessment. Its like saying a Glock is unreliable when you shoot it sideways with two fingers and it jams.

Almost everyone who buys a safe of that size, WILL bolt it down. Personally, I would have it in a cove in the basement with a door. That means there isn't even room to pry, which will be true for most homes and basement. In order to remotely get that kind of leverage, you would have to remove that entire wall.

 

[vman]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Like all things in life, there has to be a balance.

For example, do i spend $7,000 on which option...

a) $5,000 on a safe, $1000 on a rifle and $1000 on a scope
b) $5,000 on a rifle/scope, $1000 on reloading gear, $1000 on a safe

The way I see it, I have everything insured and I have a safe that complies, and I get to shoot the rifle and scope I want when i go to the range. If, god forbid, something does get stolen I have insurance and will learn from my mistake of not going above and beyond in purchasing an impenetrable safe.

The alarm system in my home is extremely uncomfortable when it goes off. I have gone beyond the legal limit for the volume the screamers emit... so unless these guys come in my house with hearing protection and balls enough to hack away at my safe while the entire world hears my alarm going off, they arent going to get as far as they wish.

It also helps when you neighbours are all old farts that do nothing in their retirement and are always within good vacinity.

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For example, do i spend $7,000 on which option...

a) $5,000 on a safe, $1000 on a rifle and $1000 on a scope
b) $5,000 on a rifle/scope, $1000 on reloading gear, $1000 on a safe</div></div>

Good example. Never seen a match won with a $5000 safe.

 

[springerjb]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So do you guys keep your tools in safes as well?

Want to guess what's more easily stolen and converted to cash?

Sometimes you just have to insure your stuff, take reasonable precautions and drive on. </div></div>

The wife and I were just talking about that last night. I've got $7,000 worth of firearms in a safe, in a locked closet, in the house with an alarm. And I've got $10,000 worth of tools in a workshop out back that is locked with a deadbolt and a pad lock...an unskilled meth-head could be inside in about 25 seconds if motivated. Sometimes you just gotta document your stuff, insure it, and move on...

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Hell for that matter, who has less than $10K worth of cars just sitting in their drive or parking lot unattended.

I take a lot more stolen car reports than I do stolen guns.

The real question is....who has more than a couple thousand dollars worth of shootin' iron with no insurance? I bet more than a couple.

I only have a couple of guns that can't be replaced.

 

[BasraBoy]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TrooperBrian</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Don't believe everything you see, that video is not even close to a fair assessment......

Almost everyone who buys a safe of that size, WILL bolt it down. Personally, I would have it in a cove in the basement with a door. That means there isn't even room to pry, which will be true for most homes and basement. In order to remotely get that kind of leverage, you would have to remove that entire wall. </div></div>

Over this side of the water, before allowing firearms to be kept at home the Firearms Officer will do a home inspection, assist in locating a suitable site for a safe and advise on how to secure the safe to the fabric of the building (normally in a closet, bolted to the floor and external wall, and with the openng side of the door against a wall so as to prevent or reduce the possibility of levering open). There are also various "approved" safes that they would recommend you buy.

Once installed, they will do another house visit to inspect and approve.

If they ain't happy with anything....you don't get to keep your kit at home.

But, as others have said, the safe is just one part of the picture.

I work from home so am in the house a lot but, even though I live in a low crime area, I still have two dogs, only one direction of approach to the house (past two neighbours) and have high grade windows/window locks, doors with 5 lever mortice locks and deadlock latches and outside security lights.

Most opportunist theives will take the easiest route first......

Don't make yourself a target.

 

[KYpatriot]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

I just went through this thought process as well, and went with the cheaper (cheeper) option. The safe will protect against children and smash and grabbers - I am under no illusion it will slow down a safecracker much. Anyone with time will drill it or torch it or concrete saw it. If money was no object of course I would have something more expensive that would take longer, but for the prepared/knowledgeable thief your "higher end" gunsafes aren't going to be a lot of trouble either. You would have to go to a commercial safe like a jeweler might have - these are in the tens of thousands of dollars. I dont have anything one of of kind or irreplaceable so I insure, record serials for tracking, have a big dog, alarm, etc.
To me it makes sense to go cheap or go really high end, depending on your monetary priorities and threat assessment, or perhaps if you are protecting something one of kind or with sentimental value, in which case I would consider the high end commercials or if it would fit a safe deposit box.

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BasraBoy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Once installed, they will do another house visit to inspect and approve.

If they ain't happy with anything....you don't get to keep your kit at home.</div></div>

I find this incredibly humorous since I was raised with loaded long guns propped in the corner.

Until the day he died my Grandfather had a loaded shotgun leaning against the corner behind his recliner.

One of the reasons I am glad that we declined our membership in the British Empire. Our gun laws suck, but they could always be worse.

 

[Muskett]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

We spend about about $300 on ours. I happen to have 4 and spread the bolts and stuff so they have to break into two. With cordless power tools they are going to take 20 minutes or so which 99% of the vermin are just not going to spend that amount of time on. Also, don't give them working space by placing your safe somewhere cramped.

If I'm out I'm insured. If I'm in and I have a weapon shoved up my nose they can have it (live to fight another day and all that). Frankly, if its a super dooper safe they will think there is something important in it. Over here illegal guns don't have much value but they do have a straight to jail card making them too hot to handle.

I would prefer to spend my shooting budget money on shooting.

Brits were disarmed just after World War I and additional legislation heaped on top over the years. Our Police generally don't go around armed, though can call it up. Sure we have a high enough crime rate but for the population size violent gun crime, shoot'em up type stuff, is incredibly rare and more legislation would make no difference.
My cousin is Swiss and keeps his assault rifle under his bed, just like half the male population in his village do. Its all a cultural thing.

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Muskett</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sure we have a high enough crime rate but for the population size violent gun crime, shoot'em up type stuff, is incredibly rare and more legislation would make no difference.</div></div>

The truly funny part is the majority of our gun violence is "dirtbag on dirtbag". That is a statistic that doesn't make the news or the government reports because they can't agree upon the politically correct definition of a "dirtbag".

It's been awhile since I worked an intentional shooting where an honest citizen was the victim.

 

[patriotoutlaw]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

Mine is a FIRE SAFE. The "safe", locks, gate, etc... are merely deterents, regardless of price. Me, The Rot, .45ACP, 12ga. and the fact that I am home 98% of the time are the TRUE Gun safe(s).

 

[SniperCJ]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

In 22 years of LE in a meduim sized suburb bordered by a Large metroplex, Ive seen about one true safe cracker.

Ive seen about a bazillion, give or take, kick the back door and grab the big screen TV.

Even the guys that pull their car into the garage to load it up, still load up the TV and computer first.

Your job isnt to make your house the hardest on the planet, you just gotta be harder than your neighbor.

 

[vman]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

It would be pretty funny to leave some ultra realistic body part props in some big jars filled with formaldehyde, and some blood infused (fake blood of course) linen sheets, all packed into the same cupboard that people install their safes.

Imagine when some dumb ass breaks into your place and opens a cupboard filled with body parts and photos of randoms pinned to the wall, add some newspaper clippings for effect.

I cant imagine them staying for too long.

 

[Clamber]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

So I guess the OP wouldn't approve of my $50 yard sell safe?

I can barely afford a rifle, let alone a really nice safe.

 

[neeley205]

Re: Why do you buy cheep safes?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">its to slow down burglers or determined bad seed children. it aint fort knox. </div></div>

That's what mine's for... </div></div>

as mine. i live in an apartment building, no one is going to get a big ass safe out of my apt, expensive or cheap without causing a shitload of attention. i dont have $5k,3k or even 1k to throw at something that is basically an extre closet for my gear. it serves its purpose. plus my landlord would be pissed if i had a safe that weighs as much as a small car on the 2nd floor of his 90yo building.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SniperCJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In 22 years of LE in a meduim sized suburb bordered by a Large metroplex, Ive seen about one true safe cracker.
Your job isnt to make your house the hardest on the planet, you just gotta be harder than your neighbor. </div></div>

very true words sir, most robberies are no more than convenient targets of opportunity. if its that inconvenient, they will move on.