308 DMR optics

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snowplow

Sergeant of the Hide
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Minuteman
Oct 1, 2024
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WA
#1
I got a big heavy rock river lar-8 308. I think I'll do a DMR style setup to shoot longer ranges with my buddy. I'm thinking of what to do with the scope on this thing. I like the idea of a 5-25 but they get pretty darn heavy. It's already a tank of a gun so maybe who cares? I also like a 4-20. Pretty close in power but about 12 oz lighter. Both prob also need an offset Red dot so more weight but lots of capability. A 3-18 is lighter still and wouldn't need a red dot but l feel like I'd be wanting more magnification at some point. Not sure but a 3-18 seems maybe a better choice for a 556 vs a 308.

What do you guys think?
 
#2
I'm not set on anything but l know you'll ask so here are the 3 lm loosely considering.

Arken 5x25-56
Athlon Helos BTR Gen 2 4x20-50
GPO Centuri 3x18-44i
 
#4
Of those choices, I'd take the athlon 4-20x. they are solid scopes and would fit well. Just know its Chinese glass, capabilities and quality.

If you increase your budget, a used nx8, razor LHT/AMG or Element nexus 4-25x would give you the lighter weight along with drastically better quality than the options above.
 
#5
I just bought an Athlon Ares BTR gen2 2.5x15 for my 308 AR. My reason for this was that 2.5x is a good low end and 15x is a good high end to work with. The reticle is also about twice as thick as what’s in the Helos 4-20 without being too thick so it could help seeing it at low power and still give me a fine enough reticle on the high end.

I’m still waiting on it to arrive so I couldn’t tell you if my choice was good or not, but it’s what I decided on after over a month of going back and forth between all the options in my budget range.
 
#6
Budget? Mil vs MOA? Reticle choice (e.g., christmas tree, BDC, etc.) ?

I used to use a NF ATACR F1 4-20 Tremor3 on my SR25 APR (20" heavy boi), I have a 7-35 on there now with all the high speed shit just for fun. Cannot hunt with it in PA, so I just shoot it from a bench so the weight doesn't matter.

You don't have to go as expensive as a NF, but I wouldn't cheap out on something that'll get beat up on a 308. I picked up one of the Primary Arms 3-18x44s with the MIL-BPR reticle. Nice christmas tree, but it uses a fine chevron which I'm not a fan of, but great value for the money with a decent set of features you'd want.

Don't cheap out on the mount though.
 
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#7
snowplow said:
I got a big heavy rock river lar-8 308. I think I'll do a DMR style setup to shoot longer ranges with my buddy. I'm thinking of what to do with the scope on this thing. I like the idea of a 5-25 but they get pretty darn heavy. It's already a tank of a gun so maybe who cares? I also like a 4-20. Pretty close in power but about 12 oz lighter. Both prob also need an offset Red dot so more weight but lots of capability. A 3-18 is lighter still and wouldn't need a red dot but l feel like I'd be wanting more magnification at some point. Not sure but a 3-18 seems maybe a better choice for a 556 vs a 308.

What do you guys think?
Click to expand...
What 4-20 is 12 ounces lighter than a 5-25?

-Stan
 
#10
I just went with a Leupold MK4 4.5 18 with the illum pr1 reticle 27 oz. Went that route couse i hate trees and wanted illumination. I am quite sure 18 on the top end will get the 308 to it's maximum distance.
 
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#11
snowplow said:
I got a big heavy rock river lar-8 308. I think I'll do a DMR style setup to shoot longer ranges with my buddy. I'm thinking of what to do with the scope on this thing. I like the idea of a 5-25 but they get pretty darn heavy. It's already a tank of a gun so maybe who cares? I also like a 4-20. Pretty close in power but about 12 oz lighter. Both prob also need an offset Red dot so more weight but lots of capability. A 3-18 is lighter still and wouldn't need a red dot but l feel like I'd be wanting more magnification at some point. Not sure but a 3-18 seems maybe a better choice for a 556 vs a 308.

What do you guys think?
Click to expand...

Going to be clearing houses and humping it up and down mountains? If not then a red dot is a waste of money and the weight doesn’t matter. Get a good scope in the power range you want.

Here’s a 30.4 ounce 5-25 on an AR15. No issues with weight. It had a 42 ounce optic on before this.

IMG_4653.jpeg
 
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#14
Once you hit about 5x l feel like you need an offset Red dot. Maybe by 4x but 5x for sure lm thinking. So with that thought do think you are giving up anything going from a 4-20 to a 5x25 or a 6x24? Assuming a back up red dot would be on both?
 
#20
snowplow said:
I'm not set on anything but l know you'll ask so here are the 3 lm loosely considering.

Arken 5x25-56
Athlon Helos BTR Gen 2 4x20-50
GPO Centuri 3x18-44i
Click to expand...

Shop the used market imho

www.snipershide.com

Optics - Bushnell DMR IIi 3.5-21x50 G3i

For sale is a Bushnell DMR IIi 3.5-21x50 mil/mil scope with an illuminated G3i reticle. This was mounted but never used and is in like-new condition. Includes sunshade, lenses covers, scope cover, adjustment tool, and packaging. $750 shipped. I am not interested in trade offers at this time.
www.snipershide.com www.snipershide.com
 
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#22
If it's a heavy range gun then getting a heavier scope and more magnification can be a good thing. More weight = less felt recoil. Only to the vehicle and back then that's fine.

Otherwise if hunting buy something with a thicker reticle. I'll be getting a Athlon Ares BTR G3 2.5-15 in a month or so and'll be putting it on my 6mm FatRat AR. This should be another scope good for a wider range of capabilties.
Currently I have a Vortex Razor LHT 4.5-22 on it which is as lightweight as it gets for this magnification range. I bought this scope for a match which I had a specific use case for, which didn't work out, so I'm using it rather than it sitting in the safe. I'm not enthused with this scope for various reason although it does have some upsides. I hate it when MD's change the rules, so it turned out I didn't need a lightweight scope after all for a "light scope on a heavy rifle". He went from offhand one month to the use of a tripod the next and stayed with tripod :unsure:🤪

A friend has a Athlon ETR 3-18 on his 7 Saum. He hunts long range and shoots long range steel but he doesn't ever shoot on low magnification(thin reticle so....). It's a great scope for the money with surprisingly good IQ. I'm impressed with it when I shoot his gun occasionally. "Right now" if I was going to buy a 3-18 this would be it. I like it more than that LHT and ETR's can be had for less these days. The main reasons then - are price, great turrets, and great mil reticle.
 
#25
^Pretty much lol. Just an idea.

Ill look into all that. Thank you. The reason l picked those 3 scopes is because they seem better than most to pickup on low power.

The Arken seems to have a decently bright reticle and only lights the center. That would help on low power.

The Athlon is fully lit (not my favorite) but has a thicker cross hair that seems possible to readily pickup on low power.

The GPO has just a lighted dot in the center whick from what l hear is quite bright. So that would also be my low power strategy.

Not sure if this is the correct way to think about this, but that is my train of thought.
 
#26
snowplow said:
^Pretty much lol. Just an idea.

Ill look into all that. Thank you. The reason l picked those 3 scopes is because they seem better than most to pickup on low power.

The Arken seems to have a decently bright reticle and only lights the center. That would help on low power.

The Athlon is fully lit (not my favorite) but has a thicker cross hair that seems possible to readily pickup on low power.

The GPO has just a lighted dot in the center whick from what l hear is quite bright. So that would also be my low power strategy.

Not sure if this is the correct way to think about this, but that is my train of thought.
Click to expand...

You still have never said why you think you will need the lowest power for the rifle. Or why you think you need a red dot. You said you want it to shoot longer ranges with your buddy. Neither of those will help but more power up top might. You are planning for something you won’t use and giving up something you will. You are not thinking correctly but you seem to not want to hear it so buy your lightweight low power scope and red dot. lol
 
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#27
I want a lightweight low power scope? The Arken 5-25 l said l am considering is way heavier and higher powered than what most have recommended in this thread. And l said the red dot was just an idea. So l really don't know what you're talking about.

Why do l want it usable on low power? Because if given the choice of having a scope usable at high power only or low power and high power and it seems like an easy choice regardless of l think l need it or not. If they don't make a scope that satisfies that it might be one thing. But if they do in my budget why on Earth wouldn't I want that?

I'd like to shoot long range with my buddy with this. But it also could be a fun bear hunting gun, and maybe even a predator rifle. Not really sure but I don't know why I wouldn't try to build it as well rounded as I could within reason.
 
#29
snowplow said:
I want a lightweight low power scope? The Arken 5-25 l said l am considering is way heavier and higher powered than what most have recommended in this thread. And l said the red dot was just an idea. So l really don't know what you're talking about.

Why do l want it usable on low power? Because if given the choice of having a scope usable at high power only or low power and high power and it seems like an easy choice regardless of l think l need it or not. If they don't make a scope that satisfies that it might be one thing. But if they do in my budget why on Earth wouldn't I want that?

I'd like to shoot long range with my buddy with this. But it also could be a fun bear hunting gun, and maybe even a predator rifle. Not really sure but I don't know why I wouldn't try to build it as well rounded as I could within reason.
Click to expand...

Yeah you did say you wanted lightweight and low power. You saying you didn’t? You kept talking about red dots and never gave a reason why. Why? Go read your posts again if you don’t know what I am talking about.

Also whenever you try to make a rifle do everything ok then it doesn’t do anything great. You need to figure the use and then pick accordingly. But your money so go buy what you want.
 
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#30
Ok sounds like you vote for the Arken. This is by far my heaviest rifle, and that is by far far the heaviest scope I would own. I don't know if anybody else thinks this is heavy or not, but it seems super heavy to me. I'm not saying that's a bad thing necessarily. It's just really weird for me and I want to make sure I'm not doing something stupid with my money. That's all. I would love a Leupold Mark V but that's definitely not in the budget at this point. It also seems like most of these DMR builds that l am seeing have a 4-18 or so. So I wasn't sure if it was smart to consider a 4-20 or a 5-25. I'm way out of my realm of what I normally do here. That's why I'm asking. I'm definitely not trying to act like a know-it-all. I basically know nothing about this which would be why I'm asking.
 
#31
You’re never gonna get matching answers to this from everyone. Take all the advice you get here, weigh it against your needs, put considerable thought into it all, and make a decision based on what you want out of the rifle. Go try to get hands on some of these scopes if you can and try them out for yourself. Rest assured if you’re not happy with what you get, come here and post about it and someone will tell you “I told you so” regardless of what you pick.

Rob01 is right about trying to get a scope that does everything though. It’s not gonna do anything particularly great. You have to weigh the options and strike a balance that fits your needs. Not someone else’s needs. Everyone has good points but you’re gonna be the one that has to carry and shoot it.
 
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#33
This is what I did for my 308 AR. I set a minimum upper power limit and a maximum lower power limit. I decided if I wanted to prioritize long range or close range capabilities with a reticle. Those were my primary concerns that overruled everything else. I then decided on the other features that I wanted and figured which ones I could do without and which ones I couldn’t. I then understood whatever I eventually got was going to be a compromise on something and that absolutely nothing was going to be 100% perfect. Once I did that it narrowed my choices dramatically. My choice might not be what you would choose.
 
#35
Don’t overlook the Leupold Mk 4HD 2.5-10, FFP (or the other Mk 4 HD optics if you want more magnification). Reticle is very usable @ 2.5x. Although there is no parallax adj., depth of field is pretty impressive. Large eye box. Minimal scope tube in your periphery. Lighter weight. I run one with an offset red dot on a 20” 308 JP gas gun. It’s a nice combo and will fit in your budget. 10x is plenty for steel out to 600- 800, which is where 308 gas guns are happiest. I’ve also run a Vortex Razor 1-6x and a NF ATACR 4-16 and actually prefer the Leupold on this rifle. @Rob01 is right. You need to define your use and distances you want to engage to determine what optic(s) you need. Hope this helps.
 
#36
snowplow said:
Ok sounds like you vote for the Arken. This is by far my heaviest rifle, and that is by far far the heaviest scope I would own. I don't know if anybody else thinks this is heavy or not, but it seems super heavy to me. I'm not saying that's a bad thing necessarily. It's just really weird for me and I want to make sure I'm not doing something stupid with my money. That's all. I would love a Leupold Mark V but that's definitely not in the budget at this point. It also seems like most of these DMR builds that l am seeing have a 4-18 or so. So I wasn't sure if it was smart to consider a 4-20 or a 5-25. I'm way out of my realm of what I normally do here. That's why I'm asking. I'm definitely not trying to act like a know-it-all. I basically know nothing about this which would be why I'm asking.
Click to expand...

Knowing nothing is fine and why we are here, to help. Knowing the budget is a huge part of it as people can scream out all sorts of expensive brands but if you can’t afford them then it doesn’t help. So what is your comfortable price range?

I don’t necessarily vote for the Arken but it’s not a bad option. On my 20” AR .308 I have a 3-18 Vortex Strike Eagle and it works fine for my uses with that rifle which are just to bring it out and shoot every now and then. I had the scope on hand and put it on and wasn’t worrying about weight or power range as I knew 18x would get me as far as I needed with that rifle. But as you see above my 6mmARC has a 5-25 on it. A heavier scope on a smaller rifle but I wanted more power as I plan to use that rifle in some gas gun matches. It all comes down to end use and needs. That is why I was asking the questions I was asking. Not to bust your balls and be a dick. Trying to get an idea of need and then help with some ideas.

And if you buy something and down the road you wanted something else as the use changes then that is fine too as we have all done that too. You are not locked in with the first scope you buy for the rifle.
 
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#37
Thanks guys. I could prob spend up to 1000 if needed but really hoped to keep it in the 600ish range. This is just a fun gun at the moment and lm kinda trying these things out for the first time. Truth is l really don't know what l want and am looking around to see what you guys do. I could drop the red dot no prob, just seemed like it was common. 3-18 seems great but my buddy always says it's ok but he always wants a little more and encourages larger. The 5-25 arken seems great everywhere but weight. Not looking for lightweight but the Arken on a heavy gun would be a package way way heavier than anything I've had so it makes me a bit apprehensive. The Athlon seems like a good middle. I'm certainly not set on just these but l would like illumination if possible. I am in no real hurry on this so I'll prob just keep looking until lm sure or there's a deal l can't pass up.
 
#38
Honestly weight can be your friend with a heavier recoiling rifle. I bet I could put that Arken on and also a lighter scope and hand them to you blindfolded and you wouldn’t even feel the difference. If you like the Arken then get it. Just don’t get into analysis paralysis and not make a decision and have the rifle just sitting in the safe. Buy something and get shooting. 😉
 
#41
My SR25 wears the traditional Leupold Mark4 3.5-10 optic.
Beware of fakes.
I also have a set of canted Knights irons installed but really could not get them to POI at 25 yds.-Richard
 
#42
This is an old post with useful insights however I’m open to new suggestions as well.
www.snipershide.com

Rifle Scopes - DMR scope recommendations

All, I am looking for an optic to put on a light weight 16 inch .308 gas gun for use out to 600 yards ish. The idea is to have the smallest, lightest possible optic with enough magnification to identify a target out to my effective range. I would like magnification in the 8-10X range, light...
www.snipershide.com www.snipershide.com
 
#43
steve123 said:
Otherwise if hunting buy something with a thicker reticle. I'll be getting a Athlon Ares BTR G3 2.5-15 in a month or so and'll be putting it on my 6mm FatRat AR. This should be another scope good for a wider range of capabilties.
Click to expand...

I think you’ll like it. I just got the gen2 a couple days ago and it has the same thickness in reticle as the gen3. I don’t have a problem with seeing it on 2.5x but I also haven’t been able to test it out a whole awful lot. I got the gen2 because the gen3 isn’t fully illuminated.
 
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#44
Yesterday I got out my S&B 5-25/H59, also my Athlon Helos G2 4-20/APRS6, both at .05 mil reticle thickness as well as the center dot, and had a tough time seeing the reticle well on lowest magnification. I couldn't see the center dots but at 6x for the H59, and 5x for the HG2 I could make it out somewhat. It's surprising what 1x more presents visually.

Well back to lowest mag for either of my two scopes, I suppose the best way to put it is, I'd need time for a shot to concentrate on the center of the reticle, and I'd need a contrasting background, or it'd be way better dialing up 1-2x for a shot. So basically I have 6-25 and 5-20, lol.

Then I think to myself, man 3x with a .05 mil reticle must be nearly useless??

I guess I'll know next week how a .06 reticle works at 2.5x for my eyes.

Thinking out loud a center dot in a MPVO that I could bloom out nuclear bright would solve a lot of my/our problems for a quick shot on lowest mag.
 
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#45
steve123 said:
So basically I have 6-25 and 5-20, lol.

Thinking out loud a center dot in a MPVO that I could bloom out nuclear bright would solve a lot of my/our problems for a quick shot on lowest mag.
Click to expand...

You are totally picking up what I'm putting down. My thoughts exactly. That's why I like the Arken and the GPO. The GPO just has a bright center dot and the Arken has a lit center +. I haven't seen either but it sounds like they're about as bright as you can get. Seems like it would be helpful.
 
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#46
snowplow said:
You are totally picking up what I'm putting down. My thoughts exactly. That's why I like the Arken and the GPO. The GPO just has a bright center dot and the Arken has a lit center +. I haven't seen either but it sounds like they're about as bright as you can get. Seems like it would be helpful.
Click to expand...

My March shorty DFP has a small-ish illuminated dot and it's easy to see at 1x in normal lighting during the day and I can still mostly see it in bright sunlight but it needs a tad bit brighter illume nevertheless IMHO.

At least it's DFP which helps a lot.
 
#47
steve123 said:
Yesterday I got out my S&B 5-25/H59, also my Athlon Helos G2 4-20/APRS6, both at .05 mil reticle thickness as well as the center dot, and had a tough time seeing the reticle well on lowest magnification. I couldn't see the center dots but at 6x for the H59, and 5x for the HG2 I could make it out somewhat. It's surprising what 1x more presents visually.

Well back to lowest mag for either of my two scopes, I suppose the best way to put it is, I'd need time for a shot to concentrate on the center of the reticle, and I'd need a contrasting background, or it'd be way better dialing up 1-2x for a shot. So basically I have 6-25 and 5-20, lol.

Then I think to myself, man 3x with a .05 mil reticle must be nearly useless??

I guess I'll know next week how a .06 reticle works at 2.5x for my eyes.

Thinking out loud a center dot in a MPVO that I could bloom out nuclear bright would solve a lot of my/our problems for a quick shot on lowest mag.
Click to expand...
I tried the 2.5-15x’s reticle out on contrasting noisy backgrounds, dark backgrounds, low light, and even tried dry firing snap shots and I have no issue picking it up. Is it ideal? No, but it works well enough for me and gives me a useable reticle on low power and a fine enough reticle on high power as well. It’s slightly thinner than a duplex but not bad and people have been using a duplex for hunting for years successfully.
 
#49
It depends on your situation too. I'm in western WA and it's always dark and rainy around here. A little bit of illumination goes a long long way for me. It takes a pretty bold reticle sometimes to see, especially if you step into the timber.
 
#50
snowplow said:
It depends on your situation too. I'm in western WA and it's always dark and rainy around here. A little bit of illumination goes a long long way for me. It takes a pretty bold reticle sometimes to see, especially if you step into the timber.
Click to expand...
I tested this out in fading light and even after dark. It’s been overcast and actually started snowing after I did the testing. Not arguing that illumination helps, but I deliberately tested it in darkening conditions without illumination just to see how it did. This was done against a brick wall, a large cedar tree, dark windows on a building across the street, and again on the cedar tree after the snowfall when it was heavily contrasted. Again, perfect it’s not, but still very useable.
 
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