.300 blackout Help

[mdmountainman]

I am loading .300 Blackout for the first time using the Hodgdon recipe above. Brass is starline and measures correct. I chose 23.1gr of cfe blk. I am ising a Hornady die set. The bullet seating feels really tight. I measured the diameter of the neck spacer in the full length die as .307 so I’m guessing it’s a little tight. The load says the powder charge is compressed even at the starting load and I can see why. I am getting the bullet seated to a COL of 2.06. I’m afraid to push them in any harder because it’s already deforming the V-Max. I just checked them in the gun and they seem to feed fine.

Thought? What would you do?

 

[mike278]

JMHO, but I would back off of that. I use CFE BLK (12gr) for 220gr subsonics. I'm using a suppressor and 16 inch barrel and there is plenty of gas to cycle the action reliably and give me around 1050 fps. Personally, I would go all the way down to the starting load and work up from there. I know getting your choice of powders is tough right now, but maybe CFE isn't the best choice for that bullet weight.

 

[st1650]

I know it's probably not much help but I've loaded quite a bit of 300blk and I'm really not of fan of CFE BLK in both sub and super loads. For sub its dirty and the velocity spread is too high for decent accuracy. For lightweight supers the density is too high and yeah you'll be compressing even at starting load.

Any chance you have some H110 or W296 on hand ? I can run 110 vmax and 110 tax-tc 0.75 moa or better and it's easy to load.

There are some threads on 300blktalk about load data with CFE BLK and the 110s, maybe that will help you. Especially anything written by Dellet, guy is pretty knowledgable on that topic

Compressed CFE BLK 110 gr. ok? » 300BlkTalk

110 grain V-Max CFE BLK load data » 300BlkTalk

It's a little bit similar with AA1680, which is actually not the greatest for the light bullets but it does shine in the 147/150 or even heavier supersonics.

 

[mdmountainman]

I don’t have any h110 right now. I debated it but the guy at Hidgon thought I’d be fine unless I was trying to push the velocity beyond what I really need in a 7” pistol. After reading the threads posted I felt more comfortable compressing the load to the 2.050 COL. I adjusted my die up in the press and it’s smoother but man it’s still marring the bullets with both seating stems. Is there an aftermarket seating stem for these V-Max? I’m guessing the tac-tx I’ve got will do the same thing.

I plan to load sub sonics too but was hoping to get these guys too.

 

[bunsen27]

View attachment 7894110

I am loading .300 Blackout for the first time using the Hodgdon recipe above. Brass is starline and measures correct. I chose 23.1gr of cfe blk. I am ising a Hornady die set. The bullet seating feels really tight. I measured the diameter of the neck spacer in the full length die as .307 so I’m guessing it’s a little tight. The load says the powder charge is compressed even at the starting load and I can see why. I am getting the bullet seated to a COL of 2.06. I’m afraid to push them in any harder because it’s already deforming the V-Max. I just checked them in the gun and they seem to feed fine.

Thought? What would you do?

I’ve gotten the full 22.7gr of CFE BLK into a Hornady case using a drop tube. It will not be that easy seating the Vmax at that charge weight. Some seating diess are better than others at not deforming the bullet. Slight tangent; I do recommend using the Redding taper crimp dye. I’ve had excellent success with it.

One thing you may be running up against with the .300BLK starline brass is that their 223 Remington brass is notorious for being thick walled with less case capacity than Lapua and LC. brass. I’m willing to hazard a guess that the initial forming steps for both of the calibers is very similar.

Nonetheless if your ultimate goal is a higher velocity supersonic round I will concur that H110 or W269 is the preferred powder. My best CFE BLK load was 200 ft./s slower than my H110 load. CFE BLK did have exceptional accuracy though worth the 110 Vmax.

 

[spife7980]

Chamfer your case necks.

What made you choose to start at the higher end of the spectrum? If you are compressing and it’s leading to progressively longer seating depths then I’d either stop putting powder in and make sure it’s not too hot or I would seat longer so they are all at least the same depth.
I certainly wouldn’t continue to try and put that much powder in a case that short and expect the soft copper not deform as there isn’t space for it.

 

[mdmountainman]

Chamfer your case necks.

What made you choose to start at the higher end of the spectrum? If you are compressing and it’s leading to progressively longer seating depths then I’d either stop putting powder in and make sure it’s not too hot or I would seat longer so they are all at least the same depth.
I certainly wouldn’t continue to try and put that much powder in a case that short and expect the soft copper not deform as there isn’t space for it.

I’m right in the middle of the load data. Everything I read suggested that more compression is better with this powder from an accuracy standpoint. It woukd be hard to raise pressures to dangerous levels with this powder. I could drop .5gr powder to lower the load to the minimum but I doubt it would then not deform the bullets. I’m getting the 2.05 COL now. I just need to figure out if a different seating stem would fit the bullets better.

I camfered the edges and it’s still marring.

 

[bunsen27]

I’m right in the middle of the load data. Everything I read suggested that more compression is better with this powder from an accuracy standpoint. It woukd be hard to raise pressures to dangerous levels with this powder. I could drop .5gr powder to lower the load to the minimum but I doubt it would then not deform the bullets. I’m getting the 2.05 COL now. I just need to figure out if a different seating stem would fit the bullets better.

I camfered the edges and it’s still marring.

A slight ring around the tip of a Vmax bullet is not completely uncommon. What brands of dies are you using? I’m assuming Hornady.

 

[mdmountainman]

Yes. Hornady dies. I switched to the second included seating stem. 1 is maybe a little better but they’re ringed pretty bad. I might call Hornady Monday. Their dies doing that to their bullets?

 

[st1650]

yeah that’s pretty bad it’s not just a mark

 

[bunsen27]

View attachment 7894213Yes. Hornady dies. I switched to the second included seating stem. 1 is maybe a little better but they’re ringed pretty bad. I might call Hornady Monday. Their dies doing that to their bullets?

Yeah that is pretty bad and definitely due to the compressed load. I would either back the charge weight off, or try to utilize in the drop tube to get a better powder stack height. Although CFE black is a really small fine grain powder to begin with, so it may not improve any.

 

[mdmountainman]

I have a nice area 419 funnel I’m using and I tap them down when filling to get it to settle. I can try a couple with less powder but I can’t imagine .5 gr less would stop the bullet from marring. I’ll find out! As someone said above, maybe the case capacity of this brass is lower causing it to be more full???? I wish I could go out back and chrono each bullet as I load them instead of having to drive far to get to a range.

 

[bunsen27]

I have a nice area 419 funnel I’m using and I tap them down when filling to get it to settle. I can try a couple with less powder but I can’t imagine .5 gr less would stop the bullet from marring. I’ll find out! As someone said above, maybe the case capacity of this brass is lower causing it to be more full???? I wish I could go out back and chrono each bullet as I load them instead of having to drive far to get to a range.

So the case volume being lower was my guess, and it may be correct based on the quick experiment I just tried.

23.3 grains in each case using the drop tube on the area 419 powder funnel. Hornady brass on the left virgin Starline on the right.

 

[mdmountainman]

. Well damn. I’ll drop the charge weight then.

 

[huntnh]

23 of 110 is hot as hell I’m running 19 with the Barnes 110s and I thought that was stout

 

[bunsen27]

23 of 110 is hot as hell I’m running 19 with the Barnes 110s and I thought that was stout

Clarification: I am not loading 22.3gr of H110; nor do I recommend anyone else do it.

H110 is a similar kernal size to CFE BLK and it's what I has easily accessible to investigate/demonstrate powder stack height in Hornady vs Starline brass. I've edited the previous post to avoid some potential dumb-dumb having a ka-boom.

 

[mdmountainman]

I just loaded at 22.5 and another at 22.0. Still marred. A friend suggested maybe the bullet jacket is just crazy thin on this run of V-Max??

 

[mdmountainman]

For Better Bullet Seating — Try Lapping Inside of Seating Stems « Daily Bulletin

Here's a simple task you can do that will give your seater die a more perfect fit to your match bullets. You can lap the inside of the seater stem so that it matches the exact profile of the bullet. This spreads out the seating force over a larger area of the bullet jacket.

bulletin.accurateshooter.com

I might try this. Maybe my stems have some sharp machining edges.

 

[mdmountainman]

I knew going in that I might be giving up 2-250fps with the cfe black vs. h110 but I already have 8# of the cfe blk. When I talked to Hodgdon the guy thought the velocity spread would be on the smaller side because of the 7” barrel. If I had more length he said the difference between the two powders would be more noticeable. I will probably wnd up grabbing some H110 if Insee it locally. I just don’t want to pay the hazmat and more powder if I can make these work. I’m not going to hunt deer with it.

That said, I chucked one of the V-Max bullets in a hand drill and coated it with 220grit lapping compound and polished the seating stem. The line on the bullet when seated is still there but is MUCH less aggressive. These V-Max are going to be my plinking load on a pistol length weapon so I’m not terribly concerned with absolutely perfect flight as long as they feed and fire.

Next test is to see what happens with the barnes 110gr tac-tx projectiles. I was hoping to get some data with the V-Max first.

 

[bunsen27]

Barnes has load data for that bullet, but does not list CFE BLK. Surprisingly they list Lil'Gun as their preferred powder and not H110 or W296.

https://www.barnesbullets.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/300AACBlackoutV6ForWeb.pdf

 

[mdmountainman]

Barnes has load data for that bullet, but does not list CFE BLK. Surprisingly they list Lil'Gun as their preferred powder and not H110 or W296.

https://www.barnesbullets.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/300AACBlackoutV6ForWeb.pdf

I saw that. I messaged them about using cfe blk. I’ll report back what they say. I looked at the bullets and compared their recommended COL next to the V-Max. Even with the longer COL of the tac-tx ammo, they still seat lower in the case so the compression would be even higher than with the V-max. I’m guessing that’s why Barnes doesn’t list it as viable.

I’ll likely grab some h110 or lil gun when I can find it to run these supers with. I was hoping to get away without adding another powder to the mix but oh well.

Hey, I learned a new trick about lapping seating stems.

 

[bunsen27]

I'm running 20.5gr with 110's. 1:13" barrel tho. Brass looks fine. 2500fps out of a 14.5" barrel.

OP, cfeblack just isn't your friend for meaningful full house 110gr supersonic loads

I can confirm that just over 19gr to just shy of 21gr is usually where most people end up with H110 and Barnes 110’s. I’m at 19.9gr getting 2500fps from a 19” barrel in Starline brass.

 

[db2000]

Here’s some data from today out of my buddy’s AR 300 Blk 16” barrel.

 

[Haney]

You could try seating a bullet with no powder and see how the bullet looks .

 

[AutoBolt308]

Contemplating reloading 300AAC however I have to ask is it really worth it?
I just started to reload for 308 Win and have brass I have saved for past 6 months that I am processing now and also am eyeballing tools and components for 300AAC. Only have 1 AR-15 chambered and honestly only purchased that to help my youngest 16 year old son feel some recoil.

Honestly I myself would plink and maybe try to work up a deer hunting load.

 

[spife7980]

Contemplating reloading 300AAC however I have to ask is it really worth it?
I just started to reload for 308 Win and have brass I have saved for past 6 months that I am processing now and also am eyeballing tools and components for 300AAC. Only have 1 AR-15 chambered and honestly only purchased that to help my youngest 16 year old son feel some recoil.

Honestly I myself would plink and maybe try to work up a deer hunting load.

I can’t speak to “worth” as that’s a personal opinion but I think it’s a great round to reload for.

Brass can be had dirt cheap even if you don’t want to make case form it.

It doesn’t take much powder at all and you can use maaaaany from pistol to rifle. A pound of cfeblk will make 580 subsonic or 300 super sonic rounds. You can play with a whole spectrum of bullets with that one cheaper powder and an adjustable gas block.

It’s not a “long range round” but 200-300 yards with a subsonic is pretty damn fun. You kid will love it.

 

[pstrJdh]

I’m just looking for loading data for .300 blackout using CFE PISTOL powder. Not having any luck in finding it. I was informed when I bought powder it made for .300 blackout rifle. Now the task at hand where the beef at. Without loading data I was considered following the CFE BLK load data and start light and work to speed I was looking for. Thanks.

 

[pstrJdh]

Thanks for any information that will work

 

[Rangemaster]

I run imr 4227 at like 10gr behind a hornady 208 gr bullet. Cycles just fine, running sub sonic. I can see the bullet trace very easy. I never tried CFE pistol.

 

[spife7980]

I’m just looking for loading data for .300 blackout using CFE PISTOL powder. Not having any luck in finding it. I was informed when I bought powder it made for .300 blackout rifle. Now the task at hand where the beef at. Without loading data I was considered following the CFE BLK load data and start light and work to speed I was looking for. Thanks.

Cfe blk and cfe pistol are two very different powders.

 

[FLIGHT762]

I’m just looking for loading data for .300 blackout using CFE PISTOL powder. Not having any luck in finding it. I was informed when I bought powder it made for .300 blackout rifle. Now the task at hand where the beef at. Without loading data I was considered following the CFE BLK load data and start light and work to speed I was looking for. Thanks.

CFE Pistol was NOT made for the 300 Blackout. It's a faster burning Pistol powder. Hodgdon CFE BLK was made for the 300 Blackout. The "CFE" in the names only refers to "Copper Fouling Eraser"elements being in the powder.

You're gonna put your eye out!

Don't mess around if you don't know WTF you're doing.

You really have to pay attention to the powder canister labels these days. A guy blew up his rifle by using Reloader 7 instead of reloader 17. I read another thread where a guy blew up his rifle using accurate 7 instead of Alliant reloader 7.

The powder market today has a lot of powders using the same numbers on the label. You have to pay more attention today.