300 BO vs. 762x39

[Windage and Elevation]

Frist - please - I really don't want to start a 'pissing war' like 9mm vs. 45. That said, I did just acquire a 300 BO and am very impressed with its ballistics and handling. I appreciate that it can be suppressed very nicely and therefore even more enjoyable to shoot, and I am a fan of the AR platform. It is a hoot! That said, I also love the AK platform. My favorites are my Saiga AK made at the original Kalishnakov factory in Tula, and a sweet metal Hungarian side folder I have had for years. Ever since they were cheap to shoot! What would be your argument / feelings of what makes one platform superior to the other? I believe the AR platform is more accurate and easier to service, but it is not also more problematic, or finicky? Please educate.

 

[fdkay]

The .300 BLK is a very good, but niche cartridge.
It is an awesome SBR round and just about perfect for home defense and as a patrol/entry weapon.
There are better bullets available in factory rounds and you don't have to deal with extreme curvature on the magazines.

The AR is far more ergonomic, has better sights, is easier to mount optics.

The AK has fewer parts and is easier to clean.

The 7.62x39 round is an excellent round, hampered by crappy bullets. When loaded with quality bullets, it performs far better.

No matter what the fan boys say, the blackout has never been and never will be the equal of the x39.
The 7.62x40 Wilson Tactical, however, is a different story.

There are just way too many advantages to an AR platform with several excellent cartridges available to fill different roles.

There is nothing wrong with a good AK, though the sights do really suck.
I'm a huge fan of the simple, compact SKS carbine.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

If I want a semi, the .223/5.56 cartridge provides the performance I need, and the AR package manipulates it to my complete satisfaction.

For a .30 in a small cartridge format, I like the 7.62x39 in all but one of its aspects, mainly its case taper; it has too much for convenient incorporation in the AR package. The 7.62x39 is widely available, but the common x39 platforms are generally woeful in term s of accuracy, and yes, the bullets don't serve it well.

But when we select a better bullet and drive it from a decent barrel, it's an entirely different animal. A lighter weight, properly constructed .308" diameter bullet, in a .308 diameter bore and a bolt action really bring out the cartridge's accuracy potential.

I have tested Hornady 110gr V-Max in a Savage 10FCP 7.62x39 Scout rifle, and seen under 1" 100yd groups in preliminary testing. The barrel incorporates a choke/throat to swage larger than .308 bullets to fit the bore, resulting in a considerable jump to the rifling. To accommodate this, I have loaded the longer Hornady 110gr GMX bullets at a COAL of 2.440". This COAL will feed from the Savage magazine, and the bullet retention still reaches to the bottom of the neck. The powder charge is the Hornady IMR-4198 listed max for the 110gr bullet range, which is mildly compressed at the selected COAL The brass is Hornady, which uses the Small Rifle primer, and I have seated CCI BR-4's for testing.

These are the rounds that await accuracy testing over the next week or two. I have no idea how they will shoot, but I have some considerable hopes.

A good friend is trying to get me enthused about the .300BO. I respect him, and pay attention when he extols the 300BO. We are both in the preliminary stages of refining our handloads. Soon, I believe we can make a meaningful comparison.

Greg

 

[mpk1996]

the only advantage I see to the AK/7.62x39 platform over the AR/300 BO platform is getting ammo in some 3rd world shit hole. so if that's not your back yard the BO is the way to go for just about any use a civilian in the US would use it for.

 

[K-tech]

I feel picking a platform is something to consider too. I know either platform can be either caliber but I feel the 300 lends itself really well to the AR platform and the x39 the AK. If you not sure what platform you want use I think you need to prioritize what you're going to use it for. I don't think accuracy is as big of a deal with these rounds as some make it because their effective range is pretty short. I have both calibers (several, but don't tell my wife) and find myself going out to the woods with the x39 more often then not. A quality AK is capable of hitting a man sized torso at 300 yards which is more than what I need to hunt. If running suppressed is your thing, black out all day long

 

[JeffLebowski]

The AR can be just as reliable as the AK and more accurate as well. Define your needs.

 

[W54/XM-388]

The .300 Blackout is a smaller case that makes for straighter magazines as well as being lighter than AK rounds.
The biggest thing however is that the .300 Blackout is made from the ground up to be a hard hitting close quarters suppressed round.
It can also be a good close range supersonic round that hits hard.

It works well in small AR platforms and is very easy to adapt to.

 

[txfireguy2003]

I went with the blackout because I like to run suppressed, and the blackout is purpose built to run in a suppressed sbr. It loses very little due to short barrels, which makes it convenient for suppressing.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk

 

[Strykervet]

7.62x39 generally weights a few grains more and is going approx. 200fps faster, depending. Works in the AK. Berdan primers, no reloading. Lack of imagination too, because bullets are ALL 123gr. I guess you can safely assume the rest of the weapon has been optimized to that slug.

.300BLK is an AR round and will function fine with 90-240gr. bullets and is generally going approx. 200fps slower than the AK when using ~125gr. ammo, about the same with 115's, depending on barrel, etc. Subs in the AR work great, best in the biz, phenomenal BC, the damn subs really have the reach with little drop; good lucking doing that in the AK.

They are very similar rounds, only one is more "American" and has the benefit of also being one of the best subsonic loads for any weapon period, and it can also be reloaded due to boxer primers. No pissing match, because one here pisses sitting down and the other does it standing up.

 

[oldfatguy]

I like the 300 BLK better then 7.62x39 in every way except for..........cost. And suppressed subs are stupid quiet.

OFG

 

[07yzryder]

I went with the blackout because I like to run suppressed, and the blackout is purpose built to run in a suppressed sbr. It loses very little due to short barrels, which makes it convenient for suppressing.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk

exact reason I built one. funny the haters don't understand the concept behind the blackout.... it's not a long range precision round, not a drop a deer at 300 yards hunting round. it's developed to be short suppressed and kick ass up close.

 

[Former0302]

PROS: If you reload, the 300 BLK has a lot more versatility. With a huge selection of .308 bullets available, you can really customize the round for most practical purposes. It's a very accurate round too...but it has a lot of drop. Know your holdovers and it's no big deal. Delivers plenty of punch/energy for hunting purposes. I'd be very comfortable taking deer/hogs at 300 yds and in with 125 or 110 supers...essentially I consider it on par with a .30-30. For east coast hunting distances and brush it's does the job just fine. Folks in MD can't hunt deer with .223, so a 300 BLK offers a great bambi slayer in an AR platform.

Because of the powders you're using, it'll pretty much burn it all by about 10". This makes for a great round for an SBR that will cycle reliably.

Easy to drop the round subsonic (although without a suppressor cycling issues can be common without an adjustable gas block). As a subsonic round, it hits hard and has a high BC that flies it further and more accurately than a pistol caliber SBR.

CONS: It's more expensive to shoot if you don't reload and there is no bulk / surplus ammo available.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

When I step back a few paces on the subject of ideal cartridges for suppressed applications, they all just seem to be emulating the pistol cartridge. For goodness sake, why not just run a suppressed pistol caliber setup and be done with it? 9mm subs

As for the 7.62x39; I have just always seen it as a rifle cartridge. It's burdened with overweight bullets, poor platform accuracy, and a mindless commitment to a bore diameter that is out of step with every other American ballistic application.

My 7.62x39 is a .308" diameter bore Savage 10FCM Scout. The cartridge loads a Hornady 110V-Max (and is to be tested next with 110Gr GMX, already loaded up) with a just shy of max load of IMR4198, and prelims with the V-Max demonstrate wicked accuracy (MOA or sub at 100yd). Flatter shooting than either example as being discussed here, I figure it still has some poop left at 300yd. Good enough for me. I shot my Norinco SKS with Norinco ammo at 300yd in N/M Highpower to get started. I don't even have a reason consider suppressed applications.

When I want to run bulk 7.62x39, I have my Yugo SKS.

This subject is really (to me) an apples/tomatoes comparison.

Greg

 

[bab029]

When I step back a few paces on the subject of ideal cartridges for suppressed applications, they all just seem to be emulating the pistol cartridge. For goodness sake, why not just run a suppressed pistol caliber setup and be done with it?

I think a big reason for the success of the 300bo is compatibility with standard AR-15 stuff, but it is still more of a novelty in my opinion. If you have an AR and a 30 caliber suppressor then for the cost of an upper you can have a pretty cool subsonic setup while retaining good supersonic performance with only a mag change. It won't and shouldn't replace the 5.56, or the 6.5s, or a dedicated pistol cartridge, but it's dead quiet and cheap to get into, so there's the draw.

 

[ballisticdaddy]

I think a big reason for the success of the 300bo is compatibility with standard AR-15 stuff, but it is still more of a novelty in my opinion. If you have an AR and a 30 caliber suppressor then for the cost of an upper you can have a pretty cool subsonic setup while retaining good supersonic performance with only a mag change. It won't and shouldn't replace the 5.56, or the 6.5s, or a dedicated pistol cartridge, but it's dead quiet and cheap to get into, so there's the draw.

The only thing you need to change is the barrel as the magazine and upper receiver are the same. One can shoot from 115 grain standard velocity up to 220 grain subsonic with no changes at all except for the ammunition. To me the draw comes from nothing but a barrel swap and the range from 115 to 220 grain projectiles.

 

[bab029]

The only thing you need to change is the barrel as the magazine and upper receiver are the same. One can shoot from 115 grain standard velocity up to 220 grain subsonic with no changes at all except for the ammunition. To me the draw comes from nothing but a barrel swap and the range from 115 to 220 grain projectiles.

Correct, I guess what I meant was that functionally, if you have a 556 and want a 300 bo also, you build another upper. not many people swap barrels at the range or in the field.

 

[sav338lapua]

Mmm as far as the BO it's a nice specialty round, just like most of you are saying, BUT I wouldn't want to depend on it for heavy use or a SHTF gun as that straight case with little taper will surely stick in an overheated gun. 7.62X39's taper is there to prevent exactly that. With more and more rifles in other actions being built there are more and more bullet types and weights being made. I just loaded up some 7.62X39 with 123 gr SST's and also some Czech 7.62X45 for my VZ-52 rifle.
As for hunting have take 10 different whitetails with the 7.62X39, it's has a proven track record.
Oh, did I say reloaded with brand new Winchester brass at that?? Yep sure it's.
SB

 

[Former0302]

Mmm as far as the BO it's a nice specialty round, just like most of you are saying, BUT I wouldn't want to depend on it for heavy use or a SHTF gun as that straight case with little taper will surely stick in an overheated gun. 7.62X39's taper is there to prevent exactly that. With more and more rifles in other actions being built there are more and more bullet types and weights being made. I just loaded up some 7.62X39 with 123 gr SST's and also some Czech 7.62X45 for my VZ-52 rifle.
As for hunting have take 10 different whitetails with the 7.62X39, it's has a proven track record.
Oh, did I say reloaded with brand new Winchester brass at that?? Yep sure it's.
SB

LOL...someone should tell the US military that then, since the 300 BLK round is just a cut down 5.56 case. My God, think of all those servicemen who are risking their M4's jamming on them and nobody is telling them!!

 

[supercorndogs]

I have 2 magazines that will run 7.62x39 in an ar-15 100%, and 2 that after a little work are 100%. I still have the mags even though I don't have a 7.62x39 upper. I ran about 6k rounds of steal case crap ammo through the first upper. The second I worked up some loads with brass cases and 125 and 150 Sierra and Hornady .311 bullets and WC844. It shot pretty well, about 200 rounds in the bolt I bought for the new upper broke, and I sold the barrel. I figured in a lightweight deer gun AR-15, the 6x45 might do anything the 7.62x39 did for me. Only without the marginal bolt. Same goes for the 300 B.O. Except you can't get ammo for 20 cents a round.

 

[Delicatessen]

Like them both ak for easy ammo but Ar are better on ar....ak pistol eats any ammo but ar has accuracy and optic mount advantage. I view both 300 blk and 7.62 as good pistol length barrel rounds (loose less potential than others).

 

[Delicatessen]

That was supposed to be ergonomics better on ar....

 

[K-tech]

Lol this thread is still going?? I thought the first handful of posts about had the topic nailed down to where if the Op couldn't make an educated decision, we have failed him as a community

 

[sav338lapua]

Former0302, got news for you, there have been several instances since the war in Afghanistan and Iraq started of M-16 type rifles failing due to over heating, bolt carriers breaking and bolt head locking lugs shearing off. But the truly sad things is this just didn't come up in the "sand box" it's been going on with the AR platform rifles since the day it came into service. People have died while using them and depending on them to save their lives!! I don't know of any other rifle that the U.S. Has adopted that has this record!!!! I'll keep using my AK-74 and 47, maybe not quite as accurate but they will get the job done and I won't have to wonder if it's going to shoot.
SB

 

[Delicatessen]

Personally like both, basically what platform do you like. To me they serve a similar roll, awesome for short pistol set up...bo better for suppressing. That said 7.62x39 is far cheaper and easier to keep on hand. I just have both. Similar thinking on 5.45 and 5.56 though price per round not big difference there. Oh and leave the 7.62x39 to aks tried some in ar for range toy and it was crazy finicky (likely magazine but none worked reliably for me).

 

[Delicatessen]

Whoops thought this was a new person asking...my bad basically said similar thing a bit ago

 

[Ayoung1]

300 blk if you have a can or x39 if you want cheap blasting rounds. There's more than that but that is the basics in my eyes. I only shoot subsonics out of my 300, if I lived in a non friendly state I wouldn't own one. I do not own an ak and I don't have a reason to honestly.

 

[David4570]

No one has mentioned the FULL AUTO angle.
It is much easier to find a fully automatic M-16 lower that can be easily be set up to reliably run a 300 BO upper in both super (without a can) and sub-sonic (with a can) even without an adjustable gas system. Just change ammo and put on the can for the subs. I think using the can with super sonic loads may be over-gassed without some kind of adjustable gas block.

I don't think the same can be said for an AK. Registered AKs are much rarer and a lot more expensive as a result. I've never heard of anyone running an automatic suppressed 7.62x39 AK, especially in both super and sub configurations. I'm not saying it can't be done, but I would expect it to be a very expensive custom set up.

 

[Anchor Zero Six]

Not going to get into the fray of 7.62x39 vs 300BO as I think the quality of the ammo is what separates the two.

What I will add to those who want to shoot the cheap ammo is ditch the AK's and dont try to make it work in an AR.

VZ-58 is such a fantastic platform that always gets overlooked. Side by side with a top end AK (Arsenal) with same ammo the VZ will show an accuracy gain. Price is about same as AK mags a little more but I feel of better quality.

Anyways its something to consider as its always assumed x39 will be firing in an AK variant.

The CMMG Mutant looked promising at SHOT but the manual of arms was a bit funky. IMO they should ditch the AR charging handle and make it with a side charge.

 

[deersniper]

The 300BLK shines with the Leupold scope with the 300 BLK reticle. Works amazingly well with subs and supers. Might not be sub moa precise but definitely good enough for its purpose.

 

[Primus]

Ballisticlly they are damn near the same. As far as feeding from an AR or non AK mag, the BO is obviously superior.