300 NORMA MAG ?

[260shooter]

I'm running a 9 twist Pacnor. 208 A-MAX at 3100 fps, 28" bbl.

Ideal twist? I don't know, but I would rather have one too fast as opposed too slow.

 

[Coltster]

Very true...I'm just wondering if 1:10 is enough for 230 Hybrid out of 24" Bartlein?

 

[RobertB]

The one I saw a while back at the range had a 22or 24" bbl. Range went to 1400 yds and the "short" bbl made it easy. No wind to speak of that day and it was boringly accurate. I have been impressed with the round since then. I have thought of it for a long range hunting build if I ever went down that road again. (Previous build was a 7 STW, great but not the same.)

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

What are ya'll trimming your brass too?

Mike

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Scotty22]

Rifle isn't mine! My good friend and gun smith built this for his customer. 300 Norma mag shooting 215 Berger vlds loaded with reloader 33. Far right gong is 400 yards with a 6 shot group on it. First shot was the low one and the other 5 are right above it.
Few specs on rifle
Bat action
AIAX chassis
Krieger barrel
Jewel trigger
Nightforce 5.5-25x56 atacr

 

[WhiteHunter]

What are ya'll trimming your brass too?

Mike

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

Hi Mike, i'm trimming to 2.4950" - my actual chamber length is 2.5055" - this was cut with a custom PTG reamer to my specified dimensions but is still a .300 Norma.

 

[WhiteHunter]

Updates ? ,particularly with RL-33 powder?

I'd be very interested in any accurate data using R33. Does it exist? If so, does anyone know the parameters that would need to be applied in QL3.6 to experiment with this powder. I'm not quite ready to invest in QL3.8 at the moment. Many thanks in advance.

 

[TheGonz]

Alright already!! Going to call in an order to GAP for a 300 Norma. Was considering a 300wsm, but looking at brass, it's only .10 more for Norma. So what the hell, might as well go LA.
My question is, what or where or who makes box mags for this? What does GAP or surgeon use? I really like the manner T4a stock and if I'm correct, it's a pound or more lighter than an AX and 26" Bartlien.

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

Just took mine to the range for the first time. Still single feeding it as I've yet to open up the feed rails to allow the fatter case to be pushed into the BDL mag box... Just did a ladder test with 2 rounds of each powder charge from 86-89.5 grains of retumbo with the 215 Berger Hybrids. Seating depth was 2.670" measured from the Ogive. It was 95* today with zero humidity and I was able to run up to the 90.5 grains but was seeing a pretty flat primer and slight extractor mark, I'll be running 89 grains of Retumbo and will play with seating depth. Barrel really settled in after 5-6 shots and I had five consecutive shots of 87.5, 88, 88, 88.5, 88.5 all in the same hole with one flyer. .35 MOA group and that's not even tuning seating depth.

Hopefully will play with seating depth and get 'er tuned up a bit more and send some rounds over the chrono. Hoping for 3100+ out of a 27" 1:10" twist Rock Creek cut rifled... This thing is going to be stupid accurate I can tell you that!

Mike

 

[DDoug]

Just took mine to the range for the first time. Still single feeding it as I've yet to open up the feed rails to allow the fatter case to be pushed into the BDL mag box... Just did a ladder test with 2 rounds of each powder charge from 86-89.5 grains of retumbo with the 215 Berger Hybrids. Seating depth was 2.670" measured from the Ogive. It was 95* today with zero humidity and I was able to run up to the 90.5 grains but was seeing a pretty flat primer and slight extractor mark, I'll be running 89 grains of Retumbo and will play with seating depth. Barrel really settled in after 5-6 shots and I had five consecutive shots of 87.5, 88, 88, 88.5, 88.5 all in the same hole with one flyer. .35 MOA group and that's not even tuning seating depth.

Hopefully will play with seating depth and get 'er tuned up a bit more and send some rounds over the chrono. Hoping for 3100+ out of a 27" 1:10" twist Rock Creek cut rifled... This thing is going to be stupid accurate I can tell you that!

Mike

Would love to see pics of this gun.

Thanks Doug

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

Here ya go...


Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

 

[DDoug]

That is a fine looking stick! Is that a remmy action or a custom? What is the OAL will it fit in a standard long action or be better in a cip?

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

That is a fine looking stick! Is that a remmy action or a custom? What is the OAL will it fit in a standard long action or be better in a cip?

It's a semi true'd 700 action. Action lugs and face true'd up... PTG bolt and factory BDL bottom metal. Still have to open up the feed rail to allow the case to load. Overall length isn't even an issue with loading. I loaded these to 2.670" from the ogive which is actually less than my 280 AI.

Mike

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

 

[260shooter]

Mike

Sounds like your on the right track with load development. What amazes me is how easy it is to get single diget extreme spreads.

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

Anybody got a measurement on their feedrail widths to fit this case? I'm not even sure what caliber this action started out as, I got it in trade for some other parts. Thanks!

Mike

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

 

[WhiteHunter]

Anybody got a measurement on their feedrail widths to fit this case? I'm not even sure what caliber this action started out as, I got it in trade for some other parts. Thanks!

Mike

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

Hi HellsCanyonArmory, my McMillan MCRT Outdoorsman started life as a .338 Lapua and has now been re-barrelled as the .300 Norma. It feeds perfectly as the bolt face diameter is the same for both cartridges. The dimensions are as follows for a trap door style, off set double stack type magazine well. Rear rail aperture is 0.5835”. This dimension extends parallel for 1.5000” from the rear of the magazine well. The aperture opens up at that point to 0.7520” and extends parallel to the chamber / end of the action. The magazine well measures 3.6670” from rear to front – the bolt throw is much longer than this. Hope this helps, keep us posted, regards from the UK.

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

Hi HellsCanyonArmory, my McMillan MCRT Outdoorsman started life as a .338 Lapua and has now been re-barrelled as the .300 Norma. It feeds perfectly as the bolt face diameter is the same for both cartridges. The dimensions are as follows for a trap door style, off set double stack type magazine well. Rear rail aperture is 0.5835”. This dimension extends parallel for 1.5000” from the rear of the magazine well. The aperture opens up at that point to 0.7520” and extends parallel to the chamber / end of the action. The magazine well measures 3.6670” from rear to front – the bolt throw is much longer than this. Hope this helps, keep us posted, regards from the UK.

That is great info thanks for that.

Have been disappointed with the 50 rounds I've thrown down it for consistent fps so bought some ramshot magnum powder to try in it. Going to the range sometime this week with some new loads for it!

Mike

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

Update,
Just got back from the range after chrono'ing some new loads worked up with Ramshot Magnum. This powder is SWEET! Ran into 'shootable' pressure signs at 89.5 grains and 3182 fps (had one round go 3207).
Group at 89 grains was closer to 1/3 MOA than 1/2 MOA and was between 3153 and 3172 FPS which is where I'll stay. This is in 95* heat as well.

I also checked my two bottles of retumbo I'd been using and they were two different lot #'s which would explain the high ES I'd been getting with those loads... I think I'll be sticking with the Ramshot for now.

This is all off of virgin brass as well (full length sized and deburred/chamfered) so I expect my velocities to tighten up a bit more on once fired brass.

Loving this gun, recoil is very mild when shot properly (Seekins precision brake).

Mike

 

[ELR Shooting Range]

Is Ramshot considered a temperature stable powder? I have been running H1000 and have traded for some Ramshot. Just curious, I am sorry for changing the subject but was glad to see you were having luck with it.

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

Is Ramshot considered a temperature stable powder? I have been running H1000 and have traded for some Ramshot. Just curious, I am sorry for changing the subject but was glad to see you were having luck with it.

From what I've heard it's supposed to be about as temp stable as any other powder out there. Dave Kiff recommended V570 or Ramshot Magnum as the two best powders for the Norma Mags. H1000 as a close third and Retumbo IF you could get a good consistent lot number but said it had pressure spikes.

Mike

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

Anybody else having issues with Forster seating dies? I usually use Redding or RCBS but I'm getting between .003-.010" difference between each round on bullet seating depth measured from the Ogive... not happy with that at all.

Mike

 

[The Lawn Ranger]

Is it possible to build a 300 NM with a Surgeon 1086R action?

I think a custom bolt might be in order.

 

[WhiteHunter]

Is it possible to build a 300 NM with a Surgeon 1086R action?

I think a custom bolt might be in order.

Hi Lawn Ranger, provided their product line can accomodate the .338 Lapua (bolt face dia.) then that action could be used to build a rifle for the .300 Norma. Regards - Whitehunter.

 

[The Lawn Ranger]

Surgeon 1086 only goes up to a .550" boltface.

I will see if there is an aftermarket alternative with a .590” boltface.

 

[HellsCanyonArmory]

Just updating this. Ran some 210 Bergers over 89.5 grains of ramshot magnum. 3175 fps average. Rock creek 6 groove 1:10" twist cut barrel. Shooting in the .3's at 100 pretty easily.

Was shooting 185 Bergers for a bit with 93 grains and was getting 3360 but it was pretty hot.

Mike

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

 

[xdeano]

I've run a batch of ramshot mag through my 338NM and the bad thing about it, is that it's like Match Light charcoal when it's time to clean it. Super dirty in my mind. But it does give really nice velocitiy and low spreads. very consistent. Just wish it wasn't so dirty. couple more rounds and i'd have a diamond mine.

xdeano

 

[rem `06]

i have a 300 Norma Mag on a Rem700 action ,"sendaro clone" HS stock, 26" Rock 10.92tw fluted,Dave Bruno break (builder), running 208Amax@3080 and will be heading to Cameron county,Pa (mountain to Mountain) for Bear with it again soon.
86gr H1000 or 87gr retumbo as i recall? 6.5x20x50 Leuy LRT
i need to pay more attention to this thread.

i didnt like ramshot mag either,dirty,I can hear the graphite brushing sound when the rod pushes through? not so with "H"

 

[6Dasher]

300 Norma here as well. Just shot in the barrel. As I have not gotten my hands on the 230 Hybrids yet I am just forming the cases and breaking in using the Sierra 220SMK and doing some speed tests.

Barrel is a 30" Bartlein 1:10, 1.45-1.25" taper (heavy sucka)
Fed215GM primers
Vihta N570
220SMK just shy of the lands

I started at 89gr and worked up to 94gr in 1gr increments just to see where pressure would start. I get flat primer edges, but no cratering all the way up to 94gr. Speeds starts at 3150 and ends at 3320fps. Smokin' !!! The 3200fps seemed to show a good node as far as I could tell by just the first outing, so I will look for something there rather than on the high end. It being 10°C now could give problems next summer when temps go to 30°C. But overall it is looking very promising. The fed215 will be changed out to CCIs as the Feds seem very soft and flatten at moderate loads on my 7-270WSM as well.

Now to find some 230 Hybrids here...

 

[6XC]

Norma's new reloading manual contains load data for 300NM with 215 gr and 230 gr Berger Hybrid Target bullets. Norma uses a 1:9" barrel (which is the CIP standard twist for 300NM)

300 Norma Magnum drawing:
www.cip-bobp.org/homologation/uploads/tdcc/tab-i/300-norma-mag-en.pdf

 

[6XC]

300 Norma Magnum - Norma
Factory ammunition with 230 gr Berger hybrid target @ 910mps / 2985fps

 

[rem `06]

how do i subscribe to this thread? I am watching 136 scenars and get emails on new posts b ut not here?

also, do you think it is worth me trying the 215Hybrid or the 230Hybrid in a 10.92tw cut Rock at 26", will they stabalize?

210 Bergers shoot alot flatter than the 208Amax and i am thinking of "more"

 

[Swamplife]

also, do you think it is worth me trying the 215Hybrid or the 230Hybrid in a 10.92tw cut Rock at 26", will they stabalize?

All Rock barrels have a .5-.7 gain twist so your looking at 10.22-10.42 twist at the muzzle. At the speeds this cartridge is capable of, I think you'll be ok.


Darren

 

[MSTN]

McCourt Munitions loaded up some 230 Bergers for me with the following numbers:

Vel 2997

ES 7

SD 3

Very accurate load. Recoil is noticeably less than the previous Retumbo load - but just as fast - and more accurate. Easier on the brass, too. You would not believe what powder he's using.

 

[MSTN]

300 Norma Magnum - Norma
Factory ammunition with 230 gr Berger hybrid target @ 910mps / 2985fps

At least they finally admit to parenting the cartridge!

 

[The Lawn Ranger]

Do tell.

i am in the market for this caliber.

McCourt Munitions loaded up some 230 Bergers for me with the following numbers:

Vel 2997

ES 7

SD 3

Very accurate load. Recoil is noticeably less than the previous Retumbo load - but just as fast - and more accurate. Easier on the brass, too. You would not believe what powder he's using.

 

[260shooter]

Those are good numbers. My 208-A-MAX load with 1X fired brass is 3100 fps E/S 8 and SD 4. Seems to be a very consistent cartridge.

 

[jonthomps]

The more I read about this round the more I like it. Read the whole thread - thanks for all the info guys.

 

[The Lawn Ranger]

I am gathering parts currently for a 300 NM build.

SAC Alpha II long action
Manners T6 stock
Defiance DBM
Bartlein 1/9" bll. MTU contour finished at 26"
APA Fat Bastard break
Timney flat shoe trigger

 

[M77]

Following with interest

 

[Mj1995]

I am a young shooter interested in building a .300 norma mag off of a 700 action, is this able to be done? what caliber of 700 would I need to buy to be able to rebarrel for the .300 norma magnum?

 

[Blackbrush]

I am a young shooter interested in building a .300 norma mag off of a 700 action, is this able to be done? what caliber of 700 would I need to buy to be able to rebarrel for the .300 norma magnum?

There are other ways but as you describe, you'd need a 338 Lapua gun.

 

[338Norma]

You don't need a "Lapua gun" although that is one way. You can also buy a PTG bolt with the proper bolt face, or you can have your smith open up a Rem bolt face. If you go with the Rem a standard face is better so when they open it they can cut away the extractor clip groove without leaving any of the groove behind.

 

[Mj1995]

Ok. so I could get like a .300 win mag 700sps and then get an aftermarket bolt and barrel, or have the .300 magnum bolt opened up? and rebarreled or do you mean a non-magnum bolt face like a .308 win or the alike?

 

[338Norma]

Yes any long action Rem if you are getting a new bolt. I did my 338 Norma off a long action in 257 Roberts and used a PTG bolt with a tight fit. They will turn them to any diameter.
If you have yours opened it is easier for the smith to start with a non mag bolt face such as a 30-06 and open it up this lets them cut the extractor groove away and cleans up easier.

 

[Mj1995]

Awesome, thank you for the help!

 

[rem `06]

also, do you think it is worth me trying the 215Hybrid or the 230Hybrid in a 10.92tw cut Rock at 26", will they stabalize?

All Rock barrels have a .5-.7 gain twist so your looking at 10.22-10.42 twist at the muzzle. At the speeds this cartridge is capable of, I think you'll be ok.

Good enough. my order is in for 100/230 OTM's

I have H1000 to start with. I am thinking of setting up the crony and starting in the low 80gr area, in tune of 82gr and working up speed till it feels warm? Any new load data on this bullet to share?

 

[nutter89]

What contour is everyone running and whats the muzzle Diam. I know a couple guys running PacNor #7 I just ordered a PacNor Straight taper with 5" shank 1.200 to .875 at 28" I'll be building a 26" so I figure it will be close to .890-.900 at muzzle end just curious on what others are going with....The wait is killing me be throwing it in a Sentinel wish I could time travel for this build!

 

[260shooter]

I'd go with a #3 fluted at 22" to balance nicely. JK nutter.

 

[nutter89]

look like a toothpick sticking out... Im going more for the Horse cock! haha "I wish"

 

[Scotty22]

Went out to the ranch with a load of guns and 2 good friends last weekend. We decided to stretch the legs on the 300 Norma mag and the 338 lapua AI. We had second round hits at 1,920 yards with both guns. With the Norma we are running reloader 33 and 230 grain Berger hybrids, the 338 lapua AI we are using 300 grain Berger hybrids and retumbo.